"The Three" in 9:118
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Assalamualaikum Rahamatullahi Wabarakathahu , Mazhar Baih
my only doubt is "the known" in the word how you have arrived at "the known" threeYes , you are correct but i am asking about "known" .it should be the three not the "known" three
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9-118. And about the three who were left behind, until, when the earth became strait for them, for all its breadth, and their souls became strait for them, and they thought that there was no shelter from God except in Him, then He turned towards them, that they might also turn; surely God turns, and is All-compassionate.
The "known" three are not known until we are told about them in the aya, and what we know is what the aya itself says. That is, there are no "known" three till the aya itself explains to us what about them. We are not rquired to look for another explanation. There were three people to whom what is said in 9.118 refers.
Salaam
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9-118. And about the three who were left behind, until, when the earth became strait for them, for all its breadth, and their souls became strait for them, and they thought that there was no shelter from God except in Him, then He turned towards them, that they might also turn; surely God turns, and is All-compassionate.
The "known" three are not known until we are told about them in the aya, and what we know is what the aya itself says. That is, there are no "known" three till the aya itself explains to us what about them. We are not rquired to look for another explanation. There were three people to whom what is said in 9.118 refers.
Salaam
The agent of the bold sentence becomes some unknown person who left them behind. But the proxy subject of passive verb is plural relative pronoun. Verb is Form-II which is attributive. Definite article was for the first living readers who know specifically those three, for us they are specified by adjectival portrayal.
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The agent of the bold sentence becomes some unknown person who left them behind. But the proxy subject of passive verb is plural relative pronoun. Verb is Form-II which is attributive. Definite article was for the first living readers who know specifically those three, for us they are specified by adjectival portrayal.
yes you are correct ,mazhar bhai .it emphasises the "known" three but "Known" should be in brackets not as the translation for the word .again its a suggestion/request
9-118. And about the three who were left behind, until, when the earth became strait for them, for all its breadth, and their souls became strait for them, and they thought that there was no shelter from God except in Him, then He turned towards them, that they might also turn; surely God turns, and is All-compassionate.
The "known" three are not known until we are told about them in the aya, and what we know is what the aya itself says. That is, there are no "known" three till the aya itself explains to us what about them. We are not rquired to look for another explanation. There were three people to whom what is said in 9.118 refers.
Salaam
yep, we does not require another explanation about those "known" three as Quran says they were answered for their prayers .but look at the verse 9.117
Allah has already forgiven the Prophet and the Muhajireen and the Ansar who followed him in the hour of difficulty after the hearts of a party of them had almost inclined , and then He forgave them. Indeed, He was to them Kind and Merciful.
FM translation
God has pardoned the prophet and the emigrants and the supporters who had followed him in the darkest hour, even though the hearts of some of them nearly deviated, but then He pardoned them. He is towards them Compassionate, Merciful.here ALLAH subhanavatala is forgiving all ,
1.emigrants
2.supporters
3.and those hearts almost got deviatedi think this concludes the entire Muslims of those period .
but as a special case ,in the next verse ALLAH subhanavatala ,talks about those three people .can you say whyFM translation
9118 And also the three who were left behind, until the land, as vast as it is, became strained to them, and their very souls became strained, and they thought there was no shelter from God except to Him. Then He pardoned them that they may repent. God is the Redeemer, the Merciful.here are my questions to
1.what they left behind
2.why land became strained to them
3.why they thought the only shelter is ALLAH subhanvatalawhat was there sin so that they were left alone .Quran is the universal book ,why it is making a special announcement for those three .what is the moral we should get from this ayah .do you think Quran alone Muslim should not ask these questions .
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yes you are correct ,mazhar bhai .it emphasises the "known" three but "Known" should be in brackets not as the translation for the word .again its a suggestion/request
yep, we does not require another explanation about those "known" three as Quran says they were answered for their prayers .but look at the verse 9.117Allah has already forgiven the Prophet and the Muhajireen and the Ansar who followed him in the hour of difficulty after the hearts of a party of them had almost inclined , and then He forgave them. Indeed, He was to them Kind and Merciful.
FM translation
God has pardoned the prophet and the emigrants and the supporters who had followed him in the darkest hour, even though the hearts of some of them nearly deviated, but then He pardoned them. He is towards them Compassionate, Merciful.here ALLAH subhanavatala is forgiving all ,
1.emigrants
2.supporters
3.and those hearts almost got deviatedi think this concludes the entire Muslims of those period .
but as a special case ,in the next verse ALLAH subhanavatala ,talks about those three people .can you say whyFM translation
9118 And also the three who were left behind, until the land, as vast as it is, became strained to them, and their very souls became strained, and they thought there was no shelter from God except to Him. Then He pardoned them that they may repent. God is the Redeemer, the Merciful.here are my questions to
1.what they left behind
2.why land became strained to them
3.why they thought the only shelter is ALLAH subhanvatalawhat was there sin so that they were left alone .Quran is the universal book ,why it is making a special announcement for those three .what is the moral we should get from this ayah .do you think Quran alone Muslim should not ask these questions .
- Nothing was left behind, the three were got left behind
- As I understand the Arabic, they felt oppression in themselves, physical and animical, I guess because of the fact that they were left behind on their own and in uncertainty and they could not know what was God going to decree for them or for the rest and then saw that better address their worries to God himself instead of trying to avoid facing what might happe, so then God turned to them so that they might repent (for their errors) for God is the One who accepts repentance and the Most Merciful.
I guess we feel that we want to get more "narration" of the event so that we may feel reading it as if we were in a novel, but if we look at it soberly, in fact we do not need more than what is given, a statement of how God acts with people as people act.
I may seem boring saying the same thing again and again, but I fear readers of the Qur'an are too Biblicised, always expecting form Qur'an some kind of novelistic stories with arguments and plots, gripping events and so forth, like the Bible, but the Qur'an is no story nor a collection of them, but a spiritual and human knowledge book.
We are given enough humanity in this aya. Those three with the oppressive feeling form the sorroundings and from their own worries, who want to run away from it and finally realise they should turn to the source and seek shelter in Him. A not uncommon feeling, I think.
On the other hand, why make three lots of the people and expect that the three left behind should be part of any of those three lots? What difference does it make? If we are not told more, I think it is because it would be less effective than keeping it as it has been kept. That is we do not need more and if we got more we might get distracted from what we should get.
It is the same story as with the sacrificing of the heifer, in what way getting more date would make us more faithful or knowledgeable.
Salaam
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Peace,
Ayat 9/118 clearly instructs the believers to "TRUST" Allah.
Those who stayed behind deeply regretted doing so!
peace
I will never stop trusting Allah (SWTAY). I refuse to give up our beloved Divine Infinite Creator. I love you Allah/God(SWTAY) group group
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Peace,
Ayat 9/118 clearly instructs the believers to "TRUST" Allah.
Those who stayed behind deeply regretted doing so!
peace
From the text I do not get that they "stayed behind" but rather for whatever reason, were left behind. Might be inadvertent, and I do not get a sense of guilt on that count, but rather the feeling of helplessness when they found themselves alone and cut off from the whole.
Salaam
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Peace,
Ayat 9/118 clearly instructs the believers to "TRUST" Allah.
Those who stayed behind deeply regretted doing so!
peace
From the text I do not get that they "stayed behind" but rather for whatever reason, were left behind. Might be inadvertent, and I do not get a sense of guilt on that count, but rather the feeling of helplessness when they found themselves alone and cut off from the whole.
Salaam
yes you are correct ,huruf .it is left behind .that they were left behind which made them to turn towards ALLAH subhanavatala .this verse is mentioning the effect not the cause .
one more interesting thing i have found about this verse is the word is only of this kind .i mean ,a number coupled with definite article addressing humans . i have checked with all the numbers from two to ten .this is unique .in other words those people were so depressed everyone of those people knew them .probably ,this might be the reason why Mazhar Bhai has included "known" in his translation .so every one ,in those days knew the cause because of which they were left alone by the entire lot .and ALLAH subhanvatala is using a special verse with a special word to forgive them .
unless we know the reason ,we cannot figure out the moral of this ayah .traditionally ,it is easy to figure out the cause .what hawk has posted was the traditional moral that can be deduce from the ayah .
I don?t think is not proper to make research for the things which ALLAH subhanvatala has hinted us to do so .for example ,
Verse 18.83
And they ask you, , about Dhul-Qarnayn. Say, "I will recite to you about him a report."
Even traditional are not define about who was this king .Another example is
Verse 20.105
They will ask you about the mountains. Tell them "My Lord will uproot them from the base,
Moreover, Quran has used all three forms of and . I mean singular, dual as well as plural .i don?t think we should get content with what quran says .i don?t find a reason why we should not make a research on this to know the root reason for using all this forms
Likewise, I don?t find any reason why we should not look other source to get the core message of this ayah -
May be "certain" in place of "known" seem better, to translate the definite article.
i think it is only instance where ALLAH subhanvatala has used a number coupled with definite article to address humans .you know more than me ,Mazhar baih . am i correct
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From the text I do not get that they "stayed behind" but rather for whatever reason, were left behind. Might be inadvertent, and I do not get a sense of guilt on that count, but rather the feeling of helplessness when they found themselves alone and cut off from the whole.
Salaam
yes you are correct ,huruf .it is left behind .that they were left behind which made them to turn towards ALLAH subhanavatala .this verse is mentioning the effect not the cause .
one more interesting thing i have found about this verse is the word is only of this kind .i mean ,a number coupled with definite article addressing humans . i have checked with all the numbers from two to ten .this is unique .in other words those people were so depressed everyone of those people knew them .probably ,this might be the reason why Mazhar Bhai has included "known" in his translation .so every one ,in those days knew the cause because of which they were left alone by the entire lot .and ALLAH subhanvatala is using a special verse with a special word to forgive them .
unless we know the reason ,we cannot figure out the moral of this ayah .traditionally ,it is easy to figure out the cause .what hawk has posted was the traditional moral that can be deduce from the ayah .
I don?t think is not proper to make research for the things which ALLAH subhanvatala has hinted us to do so .for example ,
Verse 18.83
And they ask you, , about Dhul-Qarnayn. Say, "I will recite to you about him a report."
Even traditional are not define about who was this king .Another example is
Verse 20.105
They will ask you about the mountains. Tell them "My Lord will uproot them from the base,
Moreover, Quran has used all three forms of and . I mean singular, dual as well as plural .i don?t think we should get content with what quran says .i don?t find a reason why we should not make a research on this to know the root reason for using all this forms
Likewise, I don?t find any reason why we should not look other source to get the core message of this ayahe made.
Researching, studying conjecturing in order to explore, all that is legitimate and humanly most logical. Man is curious and avid for intelectual endeavours and for that it is also elgitimte that man should resort to any means of advancing knowledge, nothing wrong with that. But what I mean that we do not need to know more than what is said in the Qur'an is regarding the teachings that are proper to it. Those teachings are complete such as they are presented in the Qur'an. But it is not legitimate to use things that are not completely spelled out to say that the Qur'an has shortcomings, or that it fails to make its points. If the point is not made then the point is not wanted by God to be as far as spiritual and human teachings conveyed by the Qur'an are concerned.However, look at from the point of view of a writing, regardless of its purpose, we are entitled to use it to further any enquiry we may wish to make and we may find help or not, or we may find help at one time and may be not at another time or circumstance, but no reason not to try.
Dhul Qarnayn, we do nto need to match him with any known figure in history or legend in order to get the lessons of the Qur'an, but certainly we may try to do so for our own curiosity and advancement in the knowledge of history or whatever honest purpose, no problem there, equally with those three mentionned, we may look to find out who they were or why, or how, but we do not need all that to gain the lesson that is given to us by it in the human and spiritual sense.
And it is this confusion between what is necessary for what that leads muslims so many times to resort to the bible to get "true knowledge of history", where the bible itself is no guranty of true history (far from it), and thus getting us trapped in historical conundrums and problems that do not pertain to the Qur'an, which whatever says be it historical or otherwise is true. It may not give many details, because we do not need them for its purpose. But whatever is said is true. But it seems that "muslims" are always missing things int he Qur'an and they take the bible to "fill the gaps" and to "correct" it with the most dismal results.
Of course the Bible may be used, why not, but not to be taken as infallible absolute historical truth, but we should take ir for what it is. As spiritual teaching in which each one sees whatever is capable of seeing, and as historical recount, a compendium of mere self serving ethnic stories.
I hope I have made myself clear as to what I personally consider legitimate for a Qur'an believer depending on what is tried to be attained.
Salaam
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Peace,
Interesting thread, the question remains "why" did some stay behind?
9/120
It was not for the people of Madinah and those surrounding them of the
bedouins that they remain behind after the Messenger of Allah
or that they prefer themselves over his self. That is because they are not afflicted
by thirst or fatigue or hunger in the cause of Allah , nor do they tread on any
ground that enrages the disbelievers, nor do they inflict upon an enemy any
infliction but that is registered for them as a righteous deed. Indeed,
Allah does not allow to be lost the reward of the doers of good.It was personally easier for some to stay behind than to go on a very demanding journey!
peace
-
Peace,
Interesting thread, the question remains "why" did some stay behind?
9/120
It was not for the people of Madinah and those surrounding them of the
bedouins that they remain behind after the Messenger of Allah
or that they prefer themselves over his self. That is because they are not afflicted
by thirst or fatigue or hunger in the cause of Allah , nor do they tread on any
ground that enrages the disbelievers, nor do they inflict upon an enemy any
infliction but that is registered for them as a righteous deed. Indeed,
Allah does not allow to be lost the reward of the doers of good.It was personally easier for some to stay behind than to go on a very demanding journey!
peace
It is two different things.
Those three in 9.118 did not stay behind. They were left behind, it is something that was done to them. Verb II form, passive voice, completed action and a determined number, three. The preceeding aya and this one are speaking about something already done. Those three are anguished and worried about their plight and may be also about the plight of those who left them behind and the three in their anguish forget Allah not thinking of Him but only of their worry, but then realise that the only shelter is with God, so turned to Allah in their plight instead of living only for their anguish and God turns to them.
Those in 120 are mentionned in undetermined numbers as group or category of people, the verb is form V, active voice, action uncompleted and it is speaking generally referring to undetermined numbers (may be rather big numbers since it says the people of Madina and around them and the beduins, a completely different idea of the the isolatd three. And it speaks of what people may do or choose. And may be those three are mentionned so before, so those who are addressed now realise that staying behind is not as desirable a choice as they might think, and MAY BE the three are mentionned so that anybody may know that staying behind, no matter the reason, is not such a comfortable position as they might think.
Salaam
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i think it is only instance where ALLAH subhanvatala has used a number coupled with definite article to address humans .you know more than me ,Mazhar baih . am i correct
Count noun always refer to an object, that is why they have a gender. The definite count noun three refers three known men; known to speaker and the listener.
Ayahs 9117 and 9118 constitute a compound-complex sentence; and semantically declarative - informative.
The second independent clause of compound complex sentence starts with conjunct and prepositional phrase; it thus says, likewise Allah the Exalted paid attention upon the Three Men --- then these three men are specified as to who were they by Relative Pronoun and relative clause. The next preposition signifies the reason followed by time adverb of the mentioned action
The time-frame of overlooking their act of staying back is when they were feeling cutoff by the society. -
e made.
Researching, studying conjecturing in order to explore, all that is legitimate and humanly most logical. Man is curious and avid for intelectual endeavours and for that it is also elgitimte that man should resort to any means of advancing knowledge, nothing wrong with that. But what I mean that we do not need to know more than what is said in the Qur'an is regarding the teachings that are proper to it. Those teachings are complete such as they are presented in the Qur'an. But it is not legitimate to use things that are not completely spelled out to say that the Qur'an has shortcomings, or that it fails to make its points. If the point is not made then the point is not wanted by God to be as far as spiritual and human teachings conveyed by the Qur'an are concerned.However, look at from the point of view of a writing, regardless of its purpose, we are entitled to use it to further any enquiry we may wish to make and we may find help or not, or we may find help at one time and may be not at another time or circumstance, but no reason not to try.
Dhul Qarnayn, we do nto need to match him with any known figure in history or legend in order to get the lessons of the Qur'an, but certainly we may try to do so for our own curiosity and advancement in the knowledge of history or whatever honest purpose, no problem there, equally with those three mentionned, we may look to find out who they were or why, or how, but we do not need all that to gain the lesson that is given to us by it in the human and spiritual sense.
And it is this confusion between what is necessary for what that leads muslims so many times to resort to the bible to get "true knowledge of history", where the bible itself is no guranty of true history (far from it), and thus getting us trapped in historical conundrums and problems that do not pertain to the Qur'an, which whatever says be it historical or otherwise is true. It may not give many details, because we do not need them for its purpose. But whatever is said is true. But it seems that "muslims" are always missing things int he Qur'an and they take the bible to "fill the gaps" and to "correct" it with the most dismal results.
Of course the Bible may be used, why not, but not to be taken as infallible absolute historical truth, but we should take ir for what it is. As spiritual teaching in which each one sees whatever is capable of seeing, and as historical recount, a compendium of mere self serving ethnic stories.
I hope I have made myself clear as to what I personally consider legitimate for a Qur'an believer depending on what is tried to be attained.
Salaam
A really well balanced very good post ,huruf .i enjoyed reading it particularly the following quotes
But what I mean that we do not need to know more than what is said in the Qur'an is regarding the teachings that are proper to it. Those teachings are complete such as they are presented in the Qur'an. But it is not legitimate to use things that are not completely spelled out to say that the Qur'an has shortcomings, or that it fails to make its points. If the point is not made then the point is not wanted by God to be as far as spiritual and human teachings conveyed by the Qur'an are concerned.
interestingly , hawk brought another verse in her quote
Peace,
Interesting thread, the question remains "why" did some stay behind?
9/120
It was not for the people of Madinah and those surrounding them of the
bedouins that they remain behind after the Messenger of Allah
or that they prefer themselves over his self. That is because they are not afflicted
by thirst or fatigue or hunger in the cause of Allah , nor do they tread on any
ground that enrages the disbelievers, nor do they inflict upon an enemy any
infliction but that is registered for them as a righteous deed. Indeed,
Allah does not allow to be lost the reward of the doers of good.It was personally easier for some to stay behind than to go on a very demanding journey!
peace
and your answer was outstanding
It is two different things.
Those three in 9.118 did not stay behind. They were left behind, it is something that was done to them. Verb II form, passive voice, completed action and a determined number, three. The preceeding aya and this one are speaking about something already done. Those three are anguished and worried about their plight and may be also about the plight of those who left them behind and the three in their anguish forget Allah not thinking of Him but only of their worry, but then realise that the only shelter is with God, so turned to Allah in their plight instead of living only for their anguish and God turns to them.
Those in 120 are mentionned in undetermined numbers as group or category of people, the verb is form V, active voice, action uncompleted and it is speaking generally referring to undetermined numbers (may be rather big numbers since it says the people of Madina and around them and the beduins, a completely different idea of the the isolatd three. And it speaks of what people may do or choose. And may be those three are mentionned so before, so those who are addressed now realise that staying behind is not as desirable a choice as they might think, and MAY BE the three are mentionned so that anybody may know that staying behind, no matter the reason, is not such a comfortable position as they might think.
Salaam
a perfect Quran alone solution for the ayah 9.118. Here in verse 9.120 all are included,including those three .thus Quran gives a clear picture .however ,if reader wants to know more regrading those three ,he may look for the traditions which may be correct or might be wrong .
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e made.
................
Dhul Qarnayn, we do nto need to match him with any known figure in history or legend in order to get the lessons of the Qur'an, but certainly we may try to do so for our own curiosity and advancement in the knowledge of history or whatever honest purpose, no problem there, equally with those three mentionned, we may look to find out who they were or why, or how, but we do not need all that to gain the lesson that is given to us by it in the human and spiritual sense.
...
Salaam
i just want to make an add on .dhul qarnayn is not a historical figure but he the man of future ,he holds the key to the one of the much asked question in Quran .
Verse 79.42
They ask you, , about the Hour when is its arrival?suppose ,if some archeologist discovers our man ,dul qarnayn ,then the earth must starts its count for its final day
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@ brother mazhar
its mean these three were also known by all other people during the time of muhammad(pbuh) ?
i also read this ages ago and as per human nature i start thinking about these three and in side notes translator reffer it to the people by names during the era of prophet who refuse to give help something like that.
but i think this verse is very important and thought provoking everybody sometimes try to do things against the nature soon he realise he/she cant go against nature thats what author want to tell us
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Peace,
Interesting thread, the question remains "why" did some stay behind?
9/120
It was not for the people of Madinah and those surrounding them of the
bedouins that they remain behind after the Messenger of Allah
or that they prefer themselves over his self. That is because they are not afflicted
by thirst or fatigue or hunger in the cause of Allah , nor do they tread on any
ground that enrages the disbelievers, nor do they inflict upon an enemy any
infliction but that is registered for them as a righteous deed. Indeed,
Allah does not allow to be lost the reward of the doers of good.It was personally easier for some to stay behind than to go on a very demanding journey!
peace
peace brother hawk, hope you allright
its interesting i also think that way
it may b the people who once migrated and what make them stay/left behind because the tone of verses is saying they did something what they dnt suppose to do,so after they realise what they done ,they regret it and they did what they suppose to do.it could be anything like three of them were aware about the truth from their lord so they did not acknowledge at that time soon they realise they will not get peace at any cost they must have to face truth becoz people had fear of losing land and losing their life and only three left in town and they feel stress coz none can b dishonest with themselves so they realise its time to move
God knows best i like ur analysis
