Which 'Qiblah' do you face?
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Peace,
I would like to ask all those who perform a physical salat facing a Qiblah to participate in this thread and share the direction in which the face during salat and also the reasons for this. I would also like to ask people who are unure about the way in which they face to also share their views.
People who disagree with the concept of a physical salat, it would be appreciated if you don't pollute this thread with your arguments supporting your ideas, there are many other threads in which this can be done in. Or you can create your own topic.
Peace
Nural
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Salaam,
My qibla is towards Allah and It's pleasure. Since I believe salaat to be reaching out to Allah, which can be both physical and not, all my processions in reaching out to Allah, holding firm to alkitab, the dawn reading, and all things that are asked of me are my qibla.
Joe
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Peace be upon you Nural,
it would be appreciated if you don't pollute this thread
Pollute?
Well, reading is physical, so I guess I am included in this "pure" thread D
I "face", that is I align my character with the "masjid al haram" or the place of hearing and obeying the restrictions", as the God instructed us. This is a mental place, where one maintains there focus AT ALL TIMES. As Ayman stated, it is like "government", not a physical thing, an idea, a focus.
Any PHYSICAL qibla is ruled out by the fact that one cannot FACE a physical direction all of ones life, and that is what the God is clearly asking us to do, to FACE the "masjid al haram"
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Peace.
I don't think we even need logic for this issue, we could use the simplest laws of physics.
Hmm,
If we are supposed to face/turn towards/look at/observe a physical direction, then how do we do it once we are far enough from the physical location, past the point where the physical point of focus cannot be seen in the horizon. Will we not then be staring into outer space? We can't becuase the earth is a globe. Badum tish.
Any kind of criticism is welcome, I contine to search for the truth ) , regarding salat in particular.
Peace.
Natu on the line. -
Peace,People who disagree with the concept of a physical salat, it would be appreciated if you don't pollute this thread with your arguments supporting your ideas, there are many other threads in which this can be done in. Or you can create your own topic.
Peace
Nural
Peace Nural, I dont mean to be rude but I think you should note that every message board has a theme, this one being to follow Islam with only The One God alone, and one book. Of course people of all faiths can register and start debates, but to tell a specific group of people to not 'pollute' this thread with our beliefs is a bit rude, and also seemingly an attempt to create a corner at freeminds devoted soley to a non-God alone sect or something. There are many other message boards 'this can be done in' too.
Its like making a thread in the 'comments on Quran' forum dedicated to Jesus and only Christians would be allowed to post. Its not really fair is it?
I only say all this because I was under the impression the majority of people here would not agree with physical salat, i.e- 'wudu', prostating, doing rakas towards Mecca. Simply because this information isnt in the Quran, so therefore anyone who does do physical salat is not following the Quran alone. It just all appears like a defiant finger in the direction of most of the members of this forum to me. As you can see from the replies in this thread so far, you wont find many people who do physical salat, as it is popularly perceived, here. We're all willing to share our own methods though, isnt the point of posting here to gain more knowledge on a subject? Limiting replies to only people who believe in physical salat just doesnt strike me as fair.
Sorry, just had to get that off my chest. No harm or offence meant, I hope you'll understand my thoughts. Peace.
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Peace.
I'd just like to say that this thread is perhaps going off on a tangent. I know Nural Amin personally and I think that perhaps his choice of the word 'pollute' was not the best word to use. I understand his point actually to mean not to go off on the tangent of salaat, becuase this issuecan be dealt with in other sections of the forum, and so to maintain the organised structure of this forum, we should try to stick with the point. So lets all just carry on talking about the qibla. Apologies if I have offended anyone (Its always good to say this lol).
Peace.
Natu on the line. -
Yep I agree, I just felt like getting that off my chest, so I'll just cut to the chase and say no, I dont do a physical salat, unless you count doing what God tells us to do in relation to interacting with people and the land as physical salat. I agree with idolfree that the Qiblah is a non physical direction, its more of a concept. So I'm out!
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Peace,
My 'sallaa' is my commitments, obligations, duties on a day and night basis as per my Way of Life in GOD's System (Natural Laws), hence the 'qiblah' (direction) I 'ruku-us-sujjood' (submit in humility).
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Peace everyone,
It seems my post has caused exactly what I wanted not to happen. I apologise for any offence or if anybody feels left out. This was not my intention. My sole intention was just to know if someone faces towards a physical focal point, which way do they focus and why do they face it, what is their action based on. I just wanted to hear that rather than going in to a debate about whether or not we should face a specific direction or not. I respect other peoples' views about not facing or facing a physical point. To GOD belongs the East and the West. I only wanted this thread to be about that and other threads for the other discussions. That is what I meant by keeping it purely on this topic.
The PM translation of the Quran states
2142-143
The foolish from amongst the people will say "What has turned them away from the focal point that they were on?" Say "To God is the east and the west. He guides whomever He wished to a straight path. And as such, We have made you a balanced nation so that you may be witness over the people, and that the messenger may be witness over you. And We did not make the focal point that you became on except to know who follows the messenger from those who will turn on their heels. It was a great thing indeed except for those whom God has guided; God was not to waste your belief. God is Merciful and Compassionate over the people.Does this mean that a messenger will call people to face a direction and those who truly follow the messenger obey? Does it also mean that the whole purpose for a focal point is only for a period of the messenger's life and is irrelevant later?
Personally during a congregation I prefer a focal point that has been decreed so that people do not dispute and everyone is happy with the direction.
Peace
Nural
Nural
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Peace Beatnik,
Its like making a thread in the 'comments on Quran' forum dedicated to Jesus and only Christians would be allowed to post. Its not really fair is it?
I personally don't agree that people are divided like a muslim and a christian is just because of this Qiblah or salat issue. Most people in this forum I believe genuinely wish to follow God alone the best they can and I believe that that alone should unite believers.
As I said before I am sorry if I have offended and I just wanted to hear from people who face a physical direction and to make clear that I didn't intend on causing a debate on this issue and that there maybe other threads where Qiblah debates are already taking or have taken place.
If people face a mental direction that is fine with me but I just wanted to hear about the reasons people used about facing a physical focal point, ie Qiblah in Mecca or Jerusalem.
Peace
Nural
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Thanks Layth,
Do you face towards Jerusalem because the Quranic description of the Restricted temple best fits the one in Jerusalem? Or do you have other reasons which you could share?
Nural
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Salam All,
I live in the US (Central time zone which is 9 hours behind Mecca Time) and I face east. The reason for this is the way I undesrtand the word SHATR. This word is the derivative of the root SH-T-R and it means To divide/to cut in half and so on. SHATR is understood as a part of something/half of something or a direction to something. The way I reconcile the two meanings Part/half and direction is that the Direction really means Direction to that Half/part of something. So Shatr Al Masjid Al Haram is- to me- the direction to the half of the earth/part of the earth where Al MasJID ALHARAM is located. Since Al Masjid Alharam is closer if I direct to the east then I direct to the east.
Salam
Hussein
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Peace qsx,
Though this a very tolerant forum, please refrain from attacking other forum members in your posts (read forum rules) as the tolerance dissapears when that happens (you are free to argue, debate, and state your views as your see them - but in a mutually respectful manner).
As to your question regarding Mecca, my answer (and this is not the view of many people here) is that it would be wrong to goto Mecca for Pilgrimage as the Qibla has been restrored to the Masjid Al-Haram which is in Jerusalem (Ula Al-Qiblaain according to common teachings).
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Salam All, Layth,
I guess that I am a little confuse here, and this is why
1- In Layth's article, the Kaaba, which Lyth translates as Quadrangle, is the area of the mosque in Jerusalem
2- This is what Layth had written about the first QiblaThe original command is contained in the Quran
"God has made the Quadrangle to be the Restricted Sanctuary, to enforce for the people, and for the restricted month, and for the donations, and for regulation; that is so you know that God knows what is in heavens and what is in Earth, and that God is aware of all things." (597)
So, if the Quadrangle is in Jerusalem then the first Qibla is in Jerusalem.
3- Yet here, Layth is having Jerusalm as the Second Qibla, because it is his direction of Prayer.How can Jerusalem be the first and the second Qibla?
Salam
Hussein
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Peace all
I attend congregational prayers with sunni muslims and I face the same way they do as it keeps me in line with the requirement to be like a cemented structure and not to behave in a sectarian manner. So I guess I face 'Mecca' as that is in the general direction of facing South East from Manchester, UK.
I'd take some issue with beatnik's point about praying this way marking one as not properly 'god alone' in ones beliefs. Heres my understanding of the prayer issue bro by way of explaining how I feel that praying in the traditional manner does not imply my support of the hadith literature.
Firstly I don't believe Allah ever forbade traditional prayer! Indeed the exact details of how one prays he has been silent on. Which makes me think there is no exact way to pray - one way that alone is acceptable to Allah. We must bow, we must prostrate, it must be a regular daily activity. As long as we are true to these quranic injunctions I think we are within the scope of Allah's system, imo. Traditional prayer falls within that. Many other ways of prayer would as well.
My other reason for taking mecca as my qibla is I have not been able to satisfy myself that Becca and Mecca are different places. Right now I have a winter cold and when I say Mecca it actully sounds like Becca. I find the argument for Jeruselum to be somewhat persausive as well but thats the same direction as Mecca from where I am on the globe.
salaams
asdfjk -
Peace Hussein,
So, if the Quadrangle is in Jerusalem then the first Qibla is in Jerusalem.
Correct.
3- Yet here, Layth is having Jerusalm as the Second Qibla, because it is his direction of Prayer.
How can Jerusalem be the first and the second Qibla?
Because the Qibla change (which was directed away from Jerusalem) has already been retarected in the Quran in 2144 and we are now and forever settled back on the 1st Qibla.
- Jerusalem (the original)
- Away from Jerusalem (the test).
- Back to Jerusalem (the final decree).
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Peace all,
I am totally appalled with condescending thoughts to whether one faces Jerusalem (Petra) or Mecca (Kaba), a GOD's House or a focal point, what is the significance of a man-made stone structure and all the drama that goes around it in order to revere the Lord of the Worlds? Not to mention that these same pagan idolworshipping structures had been re-juvenated several times and lavisly administered. Besides, what's the point in mentioning "GOD is as close to your jugular veins". Can any sincere believer further elaborate?
