Another view on the polygamy issue
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I read, but he's missing the point.. ie. THE CONDITION PRECEDENT for that rule. ..
A condition precedent is an event or state of affairs that is required before something else will occur. In contract law, a condition precedent is an event which must occur, unless its non-occurrence is excused, before performance under a contract becomes due, i.e., before any contractual duty exists.
The condition precedent.. "BUT IF"
thus there are more to look into their numbers, it is misleading ..and vs.
http//quransmessage.com/forum/index.php?topic=346.0
In the above link he gave this responseHere he gave this response I have yet to receive convincing evidence from the Quran that shows me clearly that God only sanctioned 1 wife as a rule. The only place we find the stipulation of 1 wife is 'if we fear we cannot do justice'. (fa-in khif'tum alla ta'dilu). Note that 'khauf' (fear) can be a legitimate fear and an unfounded fear. That is why the Quran separates the term 'khashiya' (a legitimate fear) with 'khauf'. See related article.
http//quransmessage.com/articles/fear%20FM3.htm
http//quransmessage.com/forum/index.php?topic=1427.0
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I have yet to receive convincing evidence from the Quran that shows me clearly that God only sanctioned 1 wife as a rule.
Of course but in very exceptional cases.. .
and here it is, the rule for one wife. ...
no polygamy but only in a very exceptional cases..
• ..but IF you fear that ye shall not be able to deal justly, then only one, or that your right hands possess (43)
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And never will you be able to deal justly between women even if you desired . (4129) <-- Overriding rule
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O Prophet! Indeed, We have made lawful (vs unlawful / zina) to you your wives (to) whom you have given their bridal money and whom you rightfully possess from those (whom) Allah has given to you, and (the) daughters (of) your paternal uncles and (the) daughters (of) your paternal aunts and (the) daughters (of) your maternal uncles and (the) daughters (of) your maternal aunts who emigrated with you, and a woman believing if she gives herself to the Prophet if wishes the Prophet to marry her - only for you, excluding the believers. Certainly, We know what We have made obligatory upon them concerning their wives and whom they rightfully possess, that not should be on you any discomfort. And Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful (3350)
.• IF any of you do not have the means to marry free women who are muminun, you may marry slavegirls (425)
O Prophet! Indeed, We have made lawful (vs unlawful / zina) to you
• your wives (to) whom you have given their bridal money AND
• whom you rightfully possess from those (whom) Allah has given to you AND
• (the) daughters (of) your paternal uncles AND
• (the) daughters (of) your paternal aunts AND
• (the) daughters (of) your maternal uncles AND
• (the) daughters (of) your maternal aunts who emigrated with you AND
• a woman believing if she gives herself to the Prophet if wishes the Prophet to marry her
only for you, excluding the believers. (3350)
"Exceptional cases" = I did not do it of my own accord. (1882)
vs.
And they seek your ruling concerning the women (in 43). Say, "Allah gives you the ruling about them and what is recited to you in the Book concerning orphans girls whom you not give them what is ordained for them and you desire to marry them, and the ones who are weak of the children and to stand for orphans with justice. And whatever you do of good then indeed, Allah is about it All-Knowing. (4127)
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4127 and seeking decision your in the womenfolk say the god gives ruling you in them and what recited is upon you in the book in (concerning) yatm/bereaved l-nisi/the womenfolk the ones not thou gives them what written for them and thou hoping that thou marry ye them and those vulnerable from/among l-wil'dni/the youngsters ?
peace ? small sample of bereaved; obviously cannot separate mother from her underage children or marry underage girls. Therefore, if concerned then marry the bereaved mothers with underage children.
mother, daughter (age 17), daughter (age 7), son (age 9)
mother, daughter (age 17), daughter (age 7)
mother, daughter (age 17), son (age 9)
mother, daughter (age 7), son (age 9)mother, daughter (age 7)
mother, son (age 9)mother, daughter (age 17) ? not applicable
https//i.postimg.cc/VsTXKFb0/ch3v200-ch4v11.jpg
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4127... and then the overriding rule in 4129
And never will you be able to deal justly between women even if you desired . (4129) <-- THE GENERAL/OVERRIDING RULE
therefore
thus there are more to look into their numbers, it is misleading ..and vs.
or perhaps hand over the orphans for marriage to others.... if it is just, else.. just one or hand over for marriages from your right hand possess...
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Can someone please address this argument from the article
It can clearly be read, that the main focus of the verse is to prohibit any form of injustice occurring by compromising the 'orphans'. Verse 4127 seems to elaborate further by indicating that this was possibly due to men not giving the orphans prescribed portions due to desire of marriage.
The main 'draw' of verse 43 is not necessarily to stipulate a number of wives but rather, to keep men away from compromising the orphans.
We note the Arabic term "mathna wathulatha waruba'a" (Literally (by/in) twos and threes and fours) which seems to simply denote a multiplicity. The exact same phrase is used in 35.1 when describing the wings of angels and its multiplicity.
035001
"Praise be to God, the Creator of the heavens and the earth, Who makes the angels, messengers with wings, (by/in) twos, and threes and fours (Arabic mathna wathulatha waruba'a). He adds to Creation as He pleases for God has power over all things"
Hardly anyone would argue that verse 35.1 is stipulating an exact combination of the number of wings of angels, 2, 3 and 4. Quite apart from an angel having 3 wings or any number of wings for that matter, the phrase clearly seems to be denoting a multiplicity.
Therefore, if the phrase "mathna wathulatha waruba'a" ((by/in) twos and threes and fours) is examined with the phrase read in 35.1, one concludes that verse 43 is not advancing a 'limiting allowance' to marry up to 4 wives. Rather, its purport seems to be focused in to drawing away from any potential injustice to the orphans by asking the believers to marry other believing women in whatever numbers.
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Rather, its purport seems to be focused in to drawing away from any potential injustice to the orphans by asking the believers to marry other believing women in whatever numbers.
the read one explains everything about his argument..
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Salam/Peace dear sister, i found this article https//www.organisedquran.com/is-polygamy-allowed
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Salam/Peace dear sister, i found this article https//www.organisedquran.com/is-polygamy-allowed
Thanks, I've never heard of this website before. O
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the read one explains everything about his argument..
He believes that the expression simply implies multiple and not limited to 4. He also uses the verse 351 about angel wings.
Thank you for the replies! And to everyone else as well!
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Salam/Peace dear sister, i found this article https//www.organisedquran.com/is-polygamy-allowed
Salam & thank you, brother Sardar!
There is no 'widow' or 'mother' of orphans in surah 4.
Peace! -
He believes that the expression simply implies multiple and not limited to 4. He also uses the verse 351 about angel wings.
accordingly, he believes it can be "in whatever numbers"...
he should look further for valid argument..
O mankind! have taqwa of your Lord who created you from ONE SOUL. (41)
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Wa alaykum asalam,
There is a verse somewhere in the Qur'an which says to marry the single amongst you- something along those lines...this makes me wonder if polygamy is just for men who intend to marry mothers of orphans (or apparently also widowed, abandoned etc.) and for nobody else since it should be the single we should marry....so if a woman for example should marry someone single, she shouldn't in this case intend to marry an already married man. Besides, most women who are the '1st wife' wouldn't agree anyway so if the husband were to go against her wishes- this would show lack of empathy and kindness towards her which a loving husband would not want to do.
This is also definitely an interesting point.
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43 الىتمى l-yatāmā/the bereaved (mothers with underage children i.e. boys and/or girls)
Why in 46 you translated it as "orphaned" but here as mothers with underage children?
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Why in 46 you translated it as "orphaned" but here as mothers with underage children?
peace sleepy, the closer word is bereaved; don't mind the mindless suggesting pedophilia to marry orphans/underage girls.
English orphan is a child without parents
Arabic yatm/bereaved
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fatherless child (preceding puberty) no concept of 20 or 40-year-old orphans.
46 and test ye of l-yatm/the bereaved until when reach they of the marriage (age) ? -
fatherless child "prepubescent girls/boys" along with their mother falls in same category.
4127 yatm/bereaved the womenfolk the ones not thou gives them what written for them and thou hoping that thou marry ye them and those vulnerable from/among l-wil'dni/the youngsters ...
again, cannot detach mother from her children or marry underage girls (with/without their consent).
peace everyone!
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peace sleepy, the closer word is bereaved; don't mind the mindless suggesting pedophilia to marry orphans/underage girls.
English orphan is a child without parents
Arabic ىتمى yatāmā/bereaved
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fatherless child (preceding puberty) no concept of 20 or 40-year-old orphans.
46 وابتلوا and test ye of الىتمى l-yatāmā/the bereaved حتى until اذا when بلغوا reach they of النكاح the marriage (age) � -
fatherless child "prepubescent girls/boys" along with their mother falls in same category.
4127 ىتمى yatāmā/bereaved النسا the womenfolk التى the ones لا not توتونهن thou gives them ما what كتب written لهن for them وترغبون and thou hoping ان that تنكحوهن thou marry ye them والمستضعفىن and those vulnerable من from/among الولدن l-wil'dāni/the youngsters ...
again, cannot detach mother from her children or marry underage girls (with/without their consent).
peace everyone!
Oh okay thanks!
So your understanding is that multiple marriages are allowed in the case of widows with children? -
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Oh okay thanks!
So your understanding is that multiple marriages are allowed in the case of widows with children?peace sleepy, have a different understanding now
43 وان and if خفتم fear you (m/pl.) الا that not تقسطوا thou just ye of فى in الىتمى l-yatama/the orphans
فانكحوا so betroths ye of ما what طاب seem good لكم to you (m/pl.) من of النسا l-nisai/the womenfolk (f/pl.)
مثنى mathnā/twosome (m) وثلث wathulātha/and triplet (m) وربع warubāa/and quartette (m)
فان so if خفتم fear you (m/pl.) الا that not تعدلوا thou equitable ye of
فوحده fawahidatan/so single/communally (f)
او or ما what ملكت possess اىمنكم right hands (commits) yours
ذلك such ادنى lowermost الا that not تعولوا thou oppress ye ofbetroths ye of is similar to what father-in-law suggested to help out
2827 قال said انى indeed I ارىد want ان that انكحك betroths you (sing.) احدى one (f) ابنتى daughters two mine
mathnā (m) wathulātha (m) warubāa (m) can refer back to the community
fawahidatan/so communally (f) refers to community (groups are feminine)3446 قل say انما solely اعظكم I advise you (m/pl.) بوحده biwahidatin/in single (thought) (f)
ان that تقوموا thou stand ye of لله to God مثنى mathnā/twosome/twos (m) وفردى and individuallyother words to describe exactly two females
4176 فان so if كانتا be/are (feminine) dual اثنتىن ithnatayni/two (females)
2823 ووجد and found من from دونهم besides them امرتىن imra-atayni/women two
