Are there only Middle-Eastern and Indian Holy Scriptures? Where are the Books..
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Are there only Middle-Eastern and Indian Holy Scriptures?
Where are the Messengers of other nations such as the white Western nations Europe and Russia? Where are the Messengers of the black Africans? Where are the Messengers of the Asian nations?
Is religion something that came out of the Middle-East/India? Why are there basically only Books for the Middle-Eastern people, Indians and a minority of the Asian people?
Where are the Books of the white western people and where are the Books of the black African people? -
The entire notion of God(s) wrote a book only exist in the western hemisphere.
I mean the notion of there's such thing as book written by God vis-a-vis books that are NOT written by God.
Such SEPARATION is key to promote the SUPERIORITY of specific books as such that the other books are INFERIOR because it was not written by God.Such notion was started or invented in Mesopotamia by the Babylonian (today's Iraq).
And it's discussed in length here
Mesopotamia The Birthplace Of Military, Empire and Religion
https//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9610198.0Due to it's 'success' in terms of controlling the populace, it was then regarded as 'best practices' and then followed by subsequent empire / kingdom. Including Persian Empire, Egyptian Empire, Judean Kingdom, Roman Empire and Arab Caliphate to name a few.
PS In regards to "Indian Holy Scriptures" there are many scriptures in what's known today as India, but no one really promote a dogma that any of it was 'written by God' as such that the other books was 'NOT written by God'. For example the book titled Veda was initially compiled by Vyasa and so does the highly regarded scriptures such as the Gita which was part of an epic works titled Mahabharata supposedly also compiled by Vyasa.
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Salam musabxus,
Are there only Middle-Eastern and Indian Holy Scriptures?
Where are the Messengers of other nations such as the white Western nations Europe and Russia? Where are the Messengers of the black Africans? Where are the Messengers of the Asian nations?
Is religion something that came out of the Middle-East/India? Why are there basically only Books for the Middle-Eastern people, Indians and a minority of the Asian people?
Where are the Books of the white western people and where are the Books of the black African people?In my country, there are many beliefs that are recognized as local wisdom. Many of them have holy books. But there is nothing that can be associated with millata ibrahim, (Islam, Christianity, Judaism).
For example, one of the books called Lagaligo which consists of 6000 pages, believed to be the holy book of the local religion, named Tolotang.
Studying these books will certainly strengthen our insight about the messengers that are not told in the Quran, Injil and the Taurat.
I am one of those who believe that Allah is very fair, He will not punish someone if He will not warn them beforehand.
I used to be very enthusiastic to find traces of the almighty divinity in every teaching that exists on this earth, just to prove the truth of this verse,
1047 And for every ummat is a messenger; so when their messenger comes, the matter is decreed between them with justice, and they are not wronged.
But in the end I found that it was very difficult to find a common thread for those teachings except of the teachings about one God, doing good and the last day (which are should be enough ))
Right now I'm just trying to identify whether they perform the sacrifices in their beliefs,..
2234 And for every ummat We have established rites that they may mention the name of God for what He has provided for them of the animal livestock. Your god is One god; submit to Him and give good tidings to those who obey.
If so, it is one of the signs from Allah, traces of the teachings from the same God.
And then I realized that this has become God's scenario, where every ummah will be judged differently,
2217 Surely those who believe; and those who are Jewish, and the Sabians, and the Nazarenes, and the Magians; and those who were polytheists; God will separate between them on the Day of Resurrection. For God is witness over all things.
Of course we will be judged based on the type of warning we receive.
This separation made me realize that among the many teachings of faith, Allah asked me to focus on what is told in Abraham's teachings,
4164 And messengers whom We have narrated to you from before, and messengers whom We have not narrated to you...;
Indeed, on purpose, there are messenger that are not narrated,
11120 And all We narrate to you from the news of the messengers is to firm your heart. And in this has come to you the truth and a lesson and a reminder for the believers.
because these narrated messengers will strengthen our heart.
However, I believe that the composition of the earth's population today is indeed dominated by the descendants of the children of Israel, and it is very possible that all of us here are descendants of one of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel.
you can see my post regarding that in here called,
Tree of Life
https//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9610134.msg414805#msg414805
Peace
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Are there only Middle-Eastern and Indian Holy Scriptures?
Where are the Messengers of other nations such as the white Western nations Europe and Russia? Where are the Messengers of the black Africans? Where are the Messengers of the Asian nations?
Is religion something that came out of the Middle-East/India? Why are there basically only Books for the Middle-Eastern people, Indians and a minority of the Asian people?
Where are the Books of the white western people and where are the Books of the black African people?It is a concern for many a people.. But if we look into it deeply we may come to know that God never left people without being sending messengers with glad tidings abd warnings... As brother Tilihawa explained messengers were obviously sent to every umma...
One should pose to himself a question if people were one community once upon a time and in case that community was of Noah /Nuh people that means messengers were sent from the very inception...
People spread throughout the world.. Huge Archealogical evidences prove that in various parts of the world people did live with great empires as well. BTW world has only very few major languages... All other modern day languages are born through a major language... For me only hardly 10 major languages... And identical to it only few races... For these communities God would have definitely sent His messengers...
But the question is why world's leading faiths only the Middle East oriented?
Yes.. That's a relatively fair question... For that all I have to say is... God's messages ended in these areas... All were revealed message but with Jews, Christians and Arabs the prophetic message were ended... That's why in Quran it was fundamentally addressed about jews Christians and Arabs etc...If No messenger was sent to greater China, that's a huge mistake... If no messenger was sent to do it and central America that's another mistake... If no messenger was sent to Rome and Greek that's too.. If Africa has evidences of ancient cities, then don't discard the fact that Africa would have received Messengers...
Where ever township and their own major language God would have sent messengers.. God never neglected... That's why God reiterates that He sent messengers to all nations... -
Salam musabxus,
In my country, there are many beliefs that are recognized as local wisdom. Many of them have holy books. But there is nothing that can be associated with millata ibrahim, (Islam, Christianity, Judaism).
For example, one of the books called Lagaligo which consists of 6000 pages, believed to be the holy book of the local religion, named Tolotang.
Studying these books will certainly strengthen our insight about the messengers that are not told in the Quran, Injil and the Taurat.
I am one of those who believe that Allah is very fair, He will not punish someone if He will not warn them beforehand.
I used to be very enthusiastic to find traces of the almighty divinity in every teaching that exists on this earth, just to prove the truth of this verse,
1047 And for every ummat is a messenger; so when their messenger comes, the matter is decreed between them with justice, and they are not wronged.
But in the end I found that it was very difficult to find a common thread for those teachings except of the teachings about one God, doing good and the last day (which are should be enough ))
Right now I'm just trying to identify whether they perform the sacrifices in their beliefs,..
2234 And for every ummat We have established rites that they may mention the name of God for what He has provided for them of the animal livestock. Your god is One god; submit to Him and give good tidings to those who obey.
If so, it is one of the signs from Allah, traces of the teachings from the same God.
And then I realized that this has become God's scenario, where every ummah will be judged differently,
2217 Surely those who believe; and those who are Jewish, and the Sabians, and the Nazarenes, and the Magians; and those who were polytheists; God will separate between them on the Day of Resurrection. For God is witness over all things.
Of course we will be judged based on the type of warning we receive.
This separation made me realize that among the many teachings of faith, Allah asked me to focus on what is told in Abraham's teachings,
4164 And messengers whom We have narrated to you from before, and messengers whom We have not narrated to you...;
Indeed, on purpose, there are messenger that are not narrated,
11120 And all We narrate to you from the news of the messengers is to firm your heart. And in this has come to you the truth and a lesson and a reminder for the believers.
because these narrated messengers will strengthen our heart.
However, I believe that the composition of the earth's population today is indeed dominated by the descendants of the children of Israel, and it is very possible that all of us here are descendants of one of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel.
you can see my post regarding that in here called,
Tree of Life
https//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9610134.msg414805#msg414805
Peace
1047 And for every ummat is a messenger; so when their messenger comes, the matter is decreed between them with justice, and they are not wronged.
Do the white people have no ummat? Do the black African people have no ummat? What about the Asian people and their ummat?
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It is a concern for many a people.. But if we look into it deeply we may come to know that God never left people without being sending messengers with glad tidings abd warnings... As brother Tilihawa explained messengers were obviously sent to every umma...
One should pose to himself a question if people were one community once upon a time and in case that community was of Noah /Nuh people that means messengers were sent from the very inception...
People spread throughout the world.. Huge Archealogical evidences prove that in various parts of the world people did live with great empires as well. BTW world has only very few major languages... All other modern day languages are born through a major language... For me only hardly 10 major languages... And identical to it only few races... For these communities God would have definitely sent His messengers...
But the question is why world's leading faiths only the Middle East oriented?
Yes.. That's a relatively fair question... For that all I have to say is... God's messages ended in these areas... All were revealed message but with Jews, Christians and Arabs the prophetic message were ended... That's why in Quran it was fundamentally addressed about jews Christians and Arabs etc...If No messenger was sent to greater China, that's a huge mistake... If no messenger was sent to do it and central America that's another mistake... If no messenger was sent to Rome and Greek that's too.. If Africa has evidences of ancient cities, then don't discard the fact that Africa would have received Messengers...
Where ever township and their own major language God would have sent messengers.. God never neglected... That's why God reiterates that He sent messengers to all nations...But where are the Books of the modern Europeans and modern Russians? Where are the Books of the modern Africans? Where are the Books of the modern Asians? If messengers are send to every Ummah?
The white people are even more in number and they are the ones who reject God in general. So where are their messengers and Books? What about the Asian people, they are 2nd? What about African black people?
If i was born in Europe or Russia 2500 years ago, there wouldn't be a religion for me to follow? If i was born 2500 years ago in Asia, there wouldn't be a religion for me to follow? If i was born 2500 years ago in Africa there would be no religion for me to follow?
So i would have to travel like none before to go to the Middle-East or to India to find about God and overcome all traditionalism and nationalism? You know how people are. And to me it would sound strange that an Universal God would only send to a specific region on earth. -
But where are the Books of the modern Europeans and modern Russians? Where are the Books of the modern Africans? Where are the Books of the modern Asians? If messengers are send to every Ummah?
The white people are even more in number and they are the ones who reject God in general. So where are their messengers and Books? What about the Asian people, they are 2nd? What about African black people?
If i was born in Europe or Russia 2500 years ago, there wouldn't be a religion for me to follow? If i was born 2500 years ago in Asia, there wouldn't be a religion for me to follow? If i was born 2500 years ago in Africa there would be no religion for me to follow?
So i would have to travel like none before to go to the Middle-East or to India to find about God and overcome all traditionalism and nationalism? You know how people are. And to me it would sound strange that an Universal God would only send to a specific region on earth.Peace...
I think you got this completely wrong... Erroneous assumptions... It is like where are the houses for us? Why God didn't build houses for human being if He created the Earth and Heavens .. Lol..
Modern nations are irrelevant.. Coz everyone can reach for truth if they work hard for it... If interest is there the door is open... But ancient people were different.. They deseve messengers for every major nation in their own mother tongue... That God did... Preservation is not must... God knows whom to guide... Where is book of Ibrahim? No clue... But Jews Christians and Muslims all know about Ibrahim...
God says We destroyed a many nation for their rejection of messengers ..so are these only middle east, God refer to.. No.. Before Ibrahim world is very sparsly populated.. That's incontrovertible... So to which nation God sent messengers God knows... What is the population of central and southern Africa at the time of Musa? Don't forget Egypt and Ethiopia is in Africa.. Lol.. What's the population of Australia and North America at the time of Musa? What's the entire world population of Mongolian origin at the time of Musa? Wasnt there Arabs at the time of musa and then why was not there a prophet to Arabs at the time of musa?
God knows who deserves guidance and who deserves misguidance..
Messengers are not the only media for guiding people towards God.. God Himself is a Guide..
while Rome was mentioned in Quran, and how can we expect that God didn't send messengers to Rome..
If every part of ancient World had a belief or rather faith in One God and that could only be possible if there were messengers delivering God's message.. Otherwise people's only option is polytheistic approach or worshiping anything of their choice of ancestors.. -
You can believe what you want. But you dodged the question with a simple "i believe it" which is actually sad.
I didn't intend to sadden you, but I do believe that ayat 1047 true,
and I don't intend to cause you grief but I believe the entire book. handshakepeace
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If i was born in Europe or Russia 2500 years ago, there wouldn't be a religion for me to follow? If i was born 2500 years ago in Asia, there wouldn't be a religion for me to follow? If i was born 2500 years ago in Africa there would be no religion for me to follow?
So i would have to travel like none before to go to the Middle-East or to India to find about God and overcome all traditionalism and nationalism? You know how people are. And to me it would sound strange that an Universal God would only send to a specific region on earth.EUROPE
If you were born in Scandinavia 2500 years ago, you will be indoctrinized in the conception of Valhala and Hel, and the constant fight for the sake of Odin against his enemies. You will be indoctrinized not through books but through your environment as people around you have such belief. You will then probably think that the goal of this life is to fight fight fight for the glory of Odin and to die in a battle, as only those who died in the battle (martyred) will earn a seat besides Odin in Valhala.
Such religion is dead now, at least by name, but the 'concept' still lingers on isn't it?
Within religions that appears with new names.ASIA
If you were born in today's Iraq 3500 years ago, you will be indoctrinized in the conception of Marduk, Annunaki and a holy tablet supposedly written by a God, Marduk given to a human mediator named Hammurabi.
The tablet contains clauses which are imposed as law within society, obedience is mandatory as torture and death will await those who did not obey.
Even the act of 'questioning the validity and the reason' behind such law is a crime that is punishable by torturing death. As Marduk will be angry when a lowlife species such as human which is dirty, sinful and not-divine dare to question his instruction.
Just like Odin, Marduk also have enemies, which is another rivalling God(s), and fighting for the sake of Marduk and his Annunaki cohorts is mandatory otherwise he will be very angry and punishes you for it.
This mark the beginning of the conception that "God wrote a book", initiated by "Tablet containing divine laws supposedly written by Marduk through Hammurabi".
You can see and read the tablet as it's well stored and kept inside Louvre museum in France known as "Hammurabi Codex".Again such religion is dead now, at least by name, but the 'concept' still lingers on isn't it?
Within religions that appears with new names. -
Peace Jafar..
So brother, why are you existing as a human in this earth ? When did the human first appear on earth?
You talk 2500 years ago and so forth, what about a million or even a billion years ago? When did time start? Who started it?
Do you have knowledge of the origin of everything? Who initiated it?Why do humans have the ability to reason?i.e given the faculties to think ,choose a path and act with certain choices? Should we not be accountable for our choices and decisions? By what authority and whom? If all accountability is done in our life,then why do some evade justice ?
Why do we die?
Or is it all lottery, luck and lives lost?
The religion you describe is more complicated and very difficult to grasp than other man made ones.
Who made it up?And when?
GOD bless you.
Peace. -
Brother Jafar, it is fair to give you my take on purpose/religion... so you can also question it .
GOD created and planned everything that exist. GOD is the Origin of everything,
GOD created us as humans and created our universe/ and time and made the earth our habitation for a determined time for a very good reason. He also sent us instructions and information -scripture-to help us make sense of our life to make the right choices and decisionsWhat is the function of a religious scripture from God?
The primary role of all humans is to develop their souls on Earth for another life after they die.
To do this, they must accept God s authority and message that contains instructions of how to feed their soul and lead a righteous life in preparation for His kingdom
However, the hard reality is that most people will not make it to GOD s kingdom . They will fail in their responsibility to make it because they will not accept God alone,, His authority or message and will not lead a righteous life that pleases Him.The reason for this is the ego. The ego is inspired by Satan, man’s most ardent enemy, who wants all humans to fail and not succeed. He is constantly trying to mislead them by playing with their ego to prevent them from realizing and doing what they must do to succeed.
So to ensure that they are protected from being misled by Satan and instead do the things that will develop their souls to take them there, God has decreed for all humans a set of instructions they must follow. These “instructions” are what constitute a religion from God, while a “scripture” is the source that contains those instructions. Everything humans must to do on Earth to lead a happy life and prepare their souls for the Hereafter is detailed in God’s scriptures.
God has also placed a natural instinct about Him in every human being and given them complete freedom to choose their own spiritual path. But without God’s guidance, it is very easy for Satan to mislead people without their realizing it. Therefore, while everyone is free to choose their spiritual pursuit, the safest and surest way to achieve happiness in this life followed by success in the Hereafter, is to follow God’s guidance from His scriptures.
The humans good or bad consequences of their works in this life are irreversible in the Hereafter.
Best luck with your choices in your life.
GOD bless you.
Peace. -
Brother Jafar, it is fair to give you my take on purpose/religion... so you can also question it .
GOD created and planned everything that exist. GOD is the Origin of everything,
GOD created us as humans and created our universe/ and time and made the earth our habitation for a determined time for a very good reason. He also sent us instructions and information -scripture-to help us make sense of our life to make the right choices and decisionsWhat is the function of a religious scripture from God?
The primary role of all humans is to develop their souls on Earth for another life after they die.
To do this, they must accept God s authority and message that contains instructions of how to feed their soul and lead a righteous life in preparation for His kingdom
However, the hard reality is that most people will not make it to GOD s kingdom . They will fail in their responsibility to make it because they will not accept God alone,, His authority or message and will not lead a righteous life that pleases Him.The reason for this is the ego. The ego is inspired by Satan, man’s most ardent enemy, who wants all humans to fail and not succeed. He is constantly trying to mislead them by playing with their ego to prevent them from realizing and doing what they must do to succeed.
So to ensure that they are protected from being misled by Satan and instead do the things that will develop their souls to take them there, God has decreed for all humans a set of instructions they must follow. These “instructions” are what constitute a religion from God, while a “scripture” is the source that contains those instructions. Everything humans must to do on Earth to lead a happy life and prepare their souls for the Hereafter is detailed in God’s scriptures.
God has also placed a natural instinct about Him in every human being and given them complete freedom to choose their own spiritual path. But without God’s guidance, it is very easy for Satan to mislead people without their realizing it. Therefore, while everyone is free to choose their spiritual pursuit, the safest and surest way to achieve happiness in this life followed by success in the Hereafter, is to follow God’s guidance from His scriptures.
The humans good or bad consequences of their works in this life are irreversible in the Hereafter.
Best luck with your choices in your life.
GOD bless you.
Peace.Wasn't Adam born 6000 +/- years ago?
What about other nations. You know how people are. They have their own languages, own thoughts and own traditions.
What if you were born 3000 years ago in modern Russia? What kind of Scripture could that nation turn towards?
What if you were born 3000 years ago in South-Africa? What kind of Scripture would that nation have? -
You think GOD has left some without scripture in the past? Do you think there are people who have not heard of God?
Or do you mean today GOD should send a scripture to every race/nation?
For example empires that ruled the world all had some kind of religion .
Is Qoran not sent to all people now?
Internet and technology has made the world one nation.
Some messengers we were told about and some we were not according to Qoran. But GOD said messengers were sent to everyone.
Also if you have a scripture do not worry about others. They will have a good excuse if that is the case.
Have you got a scripture?
GOD bless you.
Peace. -
Wasn't Adam born 6000 +/- years ago?
What about other nations. You know how people are. They have their own languages, own thoughts and own traditions.
What if you were born 3000 years ago in modern Russia? What kind of Scripture could that nation turn towards?
What if you were born 3000 years ago in South-Africa? What kind of Scripture would that nation have?Peace...
Just ask yourself... Does every language has a word called God?
If no let me know... If yes.. Why and from where they got that word?
If yes.. Something has been known to them or they invented... Whatever.. People were and are aware of god naturally.. Every word originates from singular.. So does word god.. People can change.. Truth not -
Wasn't Adam born 6000 +/- years ago?
Didn't you know that the 'fall of man', the story about a man and woman who angered the Gods because they ate a fruit was originated in Babylonia?
https//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adam_and_Eve_cylinder_sealThat's the reason why such story ONLY exist in religion that was derived / evolved from Babylonian religion. Next is try to ponder about the objective of such story... in such religion..
I've mentioned above that even the notion of "Gods wrote a written material" was first invented by Babylonian religion. Ponder then about the objective on WHY they even invented such concept.
What if you were born 3000 years ago in South-Africa? What kind of Scripture would that nation have?
What if you were born when even the script was not yet invented?
What if you were born today within the society where they up until today don't recognize any form of script? -
Yeah Allah is omnipresent All over the creation.
And when your Lord took from the children of Adam - from their loins -
their descendants and made them testify of themselves, "Am I not your Lord?"
They said, "Yes, we have testified." lest you should say on the day of Resurrection,
"Indeed, we were of this unaware."And We did not send any messenger but with the language of his people, so
that he might explain to them clearly; then Allah makes whom He pleases err and
He guides whom He pleases and He is the Mighty, the Wise.Allah is sufficient
peace -
Peace Jafar.
You say ,quote
"What if you were born when even the script was not yet invented?
What if you were born today within the society where they up until today don't recognize any form of script?"How did the first humans learn anything? Who taught them?
GOD did not create humans without a good reason. He created for them a place to live and reproduce He created for them all they required for life . He shaped man to the capacity to reason, and taught him things he needs Then GOD sent them His guidance .GOD s guidance was available since the beginning. Man however deviated and innovated false religions.
Do you know a language or a tribe that do not have a word "GOD/creator" in their language?
Do you think the first humans did not need to learn like when you were born as a baby and you were taught what you know now? So who did this for them?How can you say this, quote
"I've mentioned above that even the notion of "Gods wrote a written material" was first invented by Babylonian religion. Ponder then about the objective on WHY they even invented such concept."You also ponder how man first walked this earth and where did the knowledge to do anything come from?
GOD bless you.
Pace. -
Peace Jafar.
You say ,quote
"What if you were born when even the script was not yet invented?
What if you were born today within the society where they up until today don't recognize any form of script?"How did the first humans learn anything? Who taught them?
GOD did not create humans without a good reason. He created for them a place to live and reproduce He created for them all they required for life . He shaped man to the capacity to reason, and taught him things he needs Then GOD sent them His guidance .GOD s guidance was available since the beginning. Man however deviated and innovated false religions.
Do you know a language or a tribe that do not have a word "GOD/creator" in their language?
Do you think the first humans did not need to learn like when you were born as a baby and you were taught what you know now? So who did this for them?How can you say this, quote
"I've mentioned above that even the notion of "Gods wrote a written material" was first invented by Babylonian religion. Ponder then about the objective on WHY they even invented such concept."You also ponder how man first walked this earth and where did the knowledge to do anything come from?
GOD bless you.
Pace.Adam first walked with God and did teach hes children the way of God. Have you ever read the Torah? Adam lived just 6000 +/- years ago.
I believe the universe was created in six periods (billions of years) and that the creatures on earth evolved from a bacteria and after millions of years the evolution brought what it brought us. But i believe that Adam was created out of nothing with water and earth, similarly Jesus was created like that as well and that we were put here on this earth after everything was ready for a habitat that suits us. God showed us that He can create human beings out of nothing.
How else do you think human beings started with the lifespan of 900+? Adam became 930 if we read the Torah, Noah became 950 if we read the Torah and the Quran. The first generation of human beings became 900+. But the generations after them started sinning more and more, so that's why their lifespans became shorter and shorted every generation. Read the Torah. Then God said that human beings will not become older then 120 years old in general. All because of us our sins.
You can't ignore this. Or you did not understand the Quran when it says that Noah was 950 years old. The Quran says the Torah and Injeel are a Guidance and Light for a reason. We can find the history of Adam in the Torah, which is being confirmed in the Injeel and the Quran.