What do y'all think of 42:16?, "And those who argue concerning Allah..."

LiberalGamer

Salam lads

@Jafar I don't think I'll go line by line on your comments, but I will say I do think your ideas are interesting, I do think your ideas might actually have some truth.
I will say a few things though...

with "humans" I meant souls, I do believe that humans aren't limited to just our bodies, as Adam pbuh was created with dirt, but had Ruh breathen into him.
with the 10 years ago yourself analogy I do get what you're going for but folks, including myself, do judge their old selves. Usually when they look back they see themselves as cringy, or naive, or a number of other things.
But I do get what you're going for, I do think that's a solid outlook to have, not looking down at other people due to their actions and/or beliefs, but looking at them as one looks at one's younger self, a naive person who still has the chance to grow.
The Qur'an does warn of arrogance (3118, 1075, 3215), and I do think that which you said is legit good advice.
So yeah, maybe I misunderstood, but I do think we agree here... more or less...
with the "arm going limp", I meant it moreso in a way where the arm acts against your needs, aka how some people treat other people poorly, if you look at other people as a part of YOU, and then that part of YOU harms you... what then?
and your final point, I don't think I'll judge the "10 years ago" me, and I won't punish him either, and I have made some mistakes.
But at the same time, that's different, for the mistakes I have regretted and repented and I hope not to make the same mistake again, if God wills.
How do I say this... I don't know everything yet and I probably never will, but for now at least I do still believe that, if the "10 years ago" me did something drastic, like murder, and then I haven't repented nor regretted and the reason why I still don't do murder isn't because I've changed but because I'm not able to... well then, I don't really know.
I don't really know...

I suppose the only problem I have with your theory is that it seems a bit too idealistic, if there was a basis for it, a basis for "if you believe others won't be punished you won't be punished" in the Holy Qur'an or even another Holy Book if that's what you believe in, but it seems to be formed on a personal experience basis... which tbh might be the strongest basis a person can have, but at the same time yeah... no real basis, I guess.

I'll just suggest that you live your life as if there will be judgement, as if there will be accountability, we'll see in the end.

But I do appreciate your ideas, as well as your willingness to respond, thank you for your response and thank you for your kindness.
This probably will be, for the time at least , my last response for now.

@good logic I think I agree with your points, one should reflect yeah.

Yeah well anyway that's about it, I will say if you good logic and jafar wanna continue the conversation I do think you should open up a new thread as this has gone a bit off-topic, not really related to 4216.
If anyone wants to say something on 4216 feel free to post.
But yeah anyway either way thank you guys for your responses, praise be to God, God bless you all , and peace!

good_logic

peace LiberalGamer, Jafar and all.

I apologise for the off topic. Forgive me brother Jafar if you think I argue about GOD or His scripture or you think I want you to do anything you do not want to do or believe what I believe. I have many things in common with you.
Similarly ,LiberalGamer and all the brothers and sisters. I also have many things in common with you all.

GOD decreed for ALL OF US HUMANS one single religion, the same decreed for Noah, Abraham, Moses, and Jesus "You shall uphold this one religion, and do not divide it."
GOD redeems to Himself whomever He wills; He guides to Himself only those who totally submit.

Ironically, WE HUMANS broke up into sects only after the knowledge had come to us due to ARGUMENTS and RESENTMENT among ourselves. GOD is the one who will judge us., the later generations who inherited the scripture are full of doubts./doing the same thing generations before us have done. Argue and resent each other.

GOD S message has always been the same and consistent. Submit to our creator. Steadfastly maintain what WE HUMANS are commanded to do by GOD, We should not DIVIDE/BREAK UP INTO SECTS. and believe in all the scriptures sent down by God.
GOD is our one and only Lord. There should be no argument between us. GOD will gather us all together; to Him is the ultimate destiny."

Once we receive/come across GOD S message, and decide to accept it, we should be united. Those who argue about God, after receiving His message, their argument is nullified at their Lord. (4216).
GOD bless you all brothers and sisters.
Peace.

hawk99

Salaam, what do you think of the following verse, 4216?

I am very confused, does this mean anyone who argues including arguing for the existence of God? Does this include arguing about God's Holy Book, The Qur'an?
very confused lads, let me know what you think.

First LiberalGamer I would like to welcome you to the free-minds forum welcome

Please read the context

He decreed for you the same religion decreed for Noah, and what we inspired
to you, and what we decreed for Abraham, Moses, and Jesus "You shall uphold
this one religion, and do not divide it."

Ironically, they broke up into sects only after the knowledge had come to them,
due to jealousy and resentment among themselves. (and gave their corrupted version of scripture)
If it were not for a predetermined decision from your Lord to respite them for a definite interim, they would
have been judged immediately. Indeed, the later generations who inherited the scripture are full of doubts.

This is what you shall preach, and steadfastly maintain what you are commanded
to do, and do not follow their wishes. And proclaim "I believe in all the scriptures sent
down by GOD. I was commanded to judge among you equitably. GOD is our Lord and
your Lord. We have our deeds and you have your deeds. There is no argument between
us and you. GOD will gather us all together; to Him is the ultimate destiny."

Those who argue about GOD, after receiving His message, their argument is nullified
at their Lord. They have incurred condemnation, and have deserved a severe retribution.

When 4216 is taken in context I get a better understanding of what Allah is conveying to us.

peace