So is it twice a day or three times for prayer?

[shukri]

peace shukri,

With regard to timings if you find a better article than this I will be very surprised
https//mypercept.co.uk/articles/salat-timings-Quran.html

I posted it on this forum and offered $$$ for every error/flaw found. One person found a spelling mistake, that's it so far
https//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9610977.0

Thanks brother Wakas for the link
I have a glance on it
And it looks very comprehensive analysis

Since there is a lot of cross reference
I need time to ponder on it
And i will respond, if any

Also i interested to study the link you provided such as

"The following are some typical examples of articles arguing for 5 daily salat from The Quran
A) Joseph Islam http//quransmessage.com/articles/the%20five%20prayers%20from%20the%20quran%20FM3.htm (accessed Feb 9th 2014)
B) Muhammad Shaikh http//muhammadshaikh.com/english_pdf/salah_prayer.pdf
C) Rashad Khalifa et al http//submission.org/Where_can_we_find_Salah.html (very brief content regarding the timings)
D) Dr Ahmad Subhy Mansour http//www.ahl-alquran.com/English/show_article.php?main_id=8297
etc."

Very useful indeed for me
And I think this is the time i should relook into this matter again
And win your $$$, ahem!

Salam.

[amin]

Nothing is plain ritual, except if understood its purpose, the original Salat is to unite people and do reading moral and other aspects of nature including science, its an age old practice of the ancient world, whose purpose is lost and become meaningless in the new world and the plain ritual is retained by some.
Quran do not talk about the ritual in detail, means its the reality, it can be done in multiple ways and to the people's needs. Now a days we have modern schools which are in a way are Salat establishments but many had become business centers. So reading, accepting/submitting and doing as per whats learnt is what is Salat all about. One two three doesnt matter and not an important aspect, this is my current understanding.

[shukri]

"Information Only"

Question What is a minimum number of salats per day based on mathematical analysis?
Two or three!

Note
This analysis is made based on the keyword "the middle the salat (الصَّلوٰةِ الوُسطىٰ)", which is contested by many as not a name of salat in the Quran!
The word and the spelling of each parameter used is based on written text by Rashad Khalifa ... https//submission.org/QI
On-line calculator determine arabic gv https//www.abjadcalc.com
The gematrical value for alone hamza "ء" is 1, equal to gv for alif "ا" AND The gematrical value of "ة" is 5 (These gv values normally used by Rashad Khalifa).

(A) The number of salats in verse 2238
2238 You shall consistently observe the Contact Prayers, especially the middle prayer (الصَّلوٰةِ الوُسطىٰ), and devote yourselves totally to God (Rashad Khalifa translation)
(حٰفِظوا عَلَى الصَّلَوٰتِ وَالصَّلوٰةِ الوُسطىٰ وَقوموا لِلَّهِ قٰنِتينَ)

Add-up digit of verse 2238
2238 --> 2+2+3+8 = 15

(Case 1) ... three salats
Total gv for "salat al-Fajr" (صَلوٰةِ الفَجرِ) = 445
Total gv for "salat al-Isha" (صَلوٰةِ العِشاءِ) = 534
Total gv for "al-salat al-Wustha" (الصَّلوٰةِ الوُسطىٰ) = 278

445+534+278 = 1257
1257 --> 1+2+5+7 = 15

(Indication Since the add-up digit of total gv for three selected salats equal to add-up digit for verse 2238, we can assume that there are three intrinsic salats in verse 2238)

(Case 2) ... two salats without "al-salat al-Wustha"
Total gv for "salat al-Fajr" (صَلوٰةِ الفَجرِ) = 445
Total gv for "salat al-Isha" (صَلوٰةِ العِشاءِ) = 534

445+534 = 979
979 --> 9+7+9 = 25 (Not a digit of 15)

(Indication Since the add-up digit of total gv for two selected salats not of the digit 15, we can assume that the intrinsic salats in verse 2238 is not count of two)

(Case 3) ... Total gv for phrase "حٰفِظوا عَلَى الصَّلَوٰتِ" of verse 2238
2238 You shall consistently observe the Contact Prayers, especially the middle prayer (الصَّلوٰةِ الوُسطىٰ), and devote yourselves totally to God (Rashad Khalifa translation)
(حٰفِظوا عَلَى الصَّلَوٰتِ وَالصَّلوٰةِ الوُسطىٰ وَقوموا لِلَّهِ قٰنِتينَ)

Total gv for phrase (حٰفِظوا عَلَى الصَّلَوٰتِ) = 1662
1662 --> 1+6+6+2 = 15

(Indication Since the add-up digit of phrase "حٰفِظوا عَلَى الصَّلَوٰتِ" equal to digit of 15, we can conclude that the number of salats (الصَّلَوٰتِ) in this phrase is three i.e. salat al-Fajr, al-salat al-Wustha and salat al-Isha)

(B) The salat meant by the first phrase of verse 1778
1778 You shall observe the Prayer when the sun declines from its highest point at noon as it moves towards sunset. You shall also observe (the recitation of) the Quran at dawn. (Reciting) the Quran at dawn is witnessed (Rashad Khalifa translation)
(أَقِمِ الصَّلوٰةَ لِدُلوكِ الشَّمسِ إِلىٰ غَسَقِ الَّيلِ وَقُرءانَ الفَجرِ إِنَّ قُرءانَ الفَجرِ كانَ مَشهودًا)

Total gv for phrase (أَقِمِ الصَّلوٰةَ لِدُلوكِ الشَّمسِ إِلىٰ غَسَقِ الَّيلِ) = 2096
2096 --> 2+0+9+6 = 17

Total gv for "the-salat the-Wustha" (الصَّلوٰةِ الوُسطىٰ) = 278
278 --> 2+7+8 =17

(Indication The phrase of "أَقِمِ الصَّلوٰةَ لِدُلوكِ الشَّمسِ إِلىٰ غَسَقِ الَّيلِ" is referring to "the-salat the- Wustha")

(C) The word the middle "الوسطى" in verse 2238
2238 You shall consistently observe the Contact Prayers, especially the middle (الوسطى) prayer, and devote yourselves totally to God (Rashad Khalifa translation)

Total gv for "the middle" (الوسطى) = 116
116 --> 1+1+6 = 8

Total gv for "the noon" (الظهيرة) =1151
1151 -->1+1+5+1 = 8

(Indication The word "the middle الوسطى" is inter-related to the word "the noon الظهيرة")

The findings
(1) Based on the above analysis, the minimum number of salats in verse 2238 is three NOT two i.e. salat al-Fajr, al-salat al-Wustha and salat al-Isha
(2) The middle salat's time is stipulated by phrase "أَقِمِ الصَّلوٰةَ لِدُلوكِ الشَّمسِ إِلىٰ غَسَقِ الَّيلِ" of verse 1778 as the word "الوسطى" itself is inter-related to time of "the noon (الظهيرة)"

Just my brief/quick analysis
Maybe right, maybe wrong!
Thank you.

[Wakas]

You can see some common errors here
https//mypercept.co.uk/articles/problems-5-salat-Quran.html

It can also be used to see some problems for "3 daily" view.

[shukri]

You can see some common errors here
https//mypercept.co.uk/articles/problems-5-salat-Quran.html

It can also be used to see some problems for "3 daily" view.

Yes, I have seen the link
Thank you.

Since i do not know arabic, i cannot give any input based on linguistic aspect
So, i try to analyse through mathematical digits based on keyword "the salat the-wustha" given in verse 2238
which stipulated on point "11) B, C, D" in your article.

In fact, my previous posting on Reply #11 was to give input to your link ... https//mypercept.co.uk/articles/salat-timings-Quran.html
which you stated "Overwhelming evidence from The Quran suggests the regular/timed salat of the mumineen/believers is a minimum of twice daily, with an optional night vigil"

AND my finding, the minimum regular/timed were not of twice daily but thrice daily i.e. salat al-Fajr, al-salat al-Wustha and salat al-Isha.
That's all sir!

God bless you!
Salam!

[Bajram_Hoxhaj]

Add-up digit of verse 2238
2238 --> 2+2+3+8 = 15

484 verses digits equal 15

2 4 9 = 15
2 5 8 = 15
2 6 7 = 15
2 7 6 = 15
2 8 5 = 15
2 9 4 = 15
2 1 3 9 = 15
2 1 4 8 = 15
2 1 5 7 = 15
2 1 6 6 = 15
2 1 7 5 = 15
2 1 8 4 = 15
2 1 9 3 = 15
2 2 2 9 = 15
2 2 3 8 = 15
2 2 4 7 = 15
2 2 5 6 = 15
2 2 6 5 = 15
2 2 7 4 = 15
2 2 8 3 = 15

3 3 9 = 15
3 4 8 = 15
3 5 7 = 15
3 6 6 = 15
3 7 5 = 15
3 8 4 = 15
3 9 3 = 15
3 1 2 9 = 15
3 1 3 8 = 15
3 1 4 7 = 15
3 1 5 6 = 15
3 1 6 5 = 15
3 1 7 4 = 15
3 1 8 3 = 15
3 1 9 2 = 15

4 2 9 = 15
4 3 8 = 15
4 4 7 = 15
4 5 6 = 15
4 6 5 = 15
4 7 4 = 15
4 8 3 = 15
4 9 2 = 15
4 1 1 9 = 15
4 1 2 8 = 15
4 1 3 7 = 15
4 1 4 6 = 15
4 1 5 5 = 15
4 1 6 4 = 15
4 1 7 3 = 15

5 1 9 = 15
5 2 8 = 15
5 3 7 = 15
5 4 6 = 15
5 5 5 = 15
5 6 4 = 15
5 7 3 = 15
5 8 2 = 15
5 9 1 = 15
5 1 0 9 = 15
5 1 1 8 = 15

6 9 = 15
6 1 8 = 15
6 2 7 = 15
6 3 6 = 15
6 4 5 = 15
6 5 4 = 15
6 6 3 = 15
6 7 2 = 15
6 8 1 = 15
6 9 0 = 15
6 1 0 8 = 15
6 1 1 7 = 15
6 1 2 6 = 15
6 1 3 5 = 15
6 1 4 4 = 15
6 1 5 3 = 15
6 1 6 2 = 15

7 8 = 15
7 1 7 = 15
7 2 6 = 15
7 3 5 = 15
7 4 4 = 15
7 5 3 = 15
7 6 2 = 15
7 7 1 = 15
7 8 0 = 15
7 1 0 7 = 15
7 1 1 6 = 15
7 1 2 5 = 15
7 1 3 4 = 15
7 1 4 3 = 15
7 1 5 2 = 15
7 1 6 1 = 15
7 1 7 0 = 15
7 2 0 6 = 15

8 7 = 15
8 1 6 = 15
8 2 5 = 15
8 3 4 = 15
8 4 3 = 15
8 5 2 = 15
8 6 1 = 15
8 7 0 = 15

9 6 = 15
9 1 5 = 15
9 2 4 = 15
9 3 3 = 15
9 4 2 = 15
9 5 1 = 15
9 6 0 = 15
9 1 0 5 = 15
9 1 1 4 = 15
9 1 2 3 = 15

1 0 5 9 = 15
1 0 6 8 = 15
1 0 7 7 = 15
1 0 8 6 = 15
1 0 9 5 = 15
1 1 4 9 = 15
1 1 5 8 = 15
1 1 6 7 = 15
1 1 7 6 = 15
1 1 8 5 = 15
1 1 9 4 = 15
1 2 3 9 = 15
1 2 4 8 = 15
1 2 5 7 = 15
1 2 6 6 = 15
1 2 7 5 = 15
1 2 8 4 = 15
1 2 9 3 = 15
1 3 2 9 = 15
1 3 3 8 = 15
1 4 1 9 = 15
1 4 2 8 = 15
1 4 3 7 = 15
1 4 4 6 = 15
1 5 9 = 15
1 5 1 8 = 15
1 5 2 7 = 15
1 5 3 6 = 15
1 5 4 5 = 15
1 5 5 4 = 15
1 5 6 3 = 15
1 5 7 2 = 15
1 5 8 1 = 15
1 5 9 0 = 15
1 6 8 = 15
1 6 1 7 = 15
1 6 2 6 = 15
1 6 3 5 = 15
1 6 4 4 = 15
1 6 5 3 = 15
1 6 6 2 = 15
1 6 7 1 = 15
1 6 8 0 = 15
1 6 1 0 7 = 15
1 6 1 1 6 = 15
1 6 1 2 5 = 15
1 7 7 = 15
1 7 1 6 = 15
1 7 2 5 = 15
1 7 3 4 = 15
1 7 4 3 = 15
1 7 5 2 = 15
1 7 6 1 = 15
1 7 7 0 = 15
1 7 1 0 6 = 15
1 8 6 = 15
1 8 1 5 = 15
1 8 2 4 = 15
1 8 3 3 = 15
1 8 4 2 = 15
1 8 5 1 = 15
1 8 6 0 = 15
1 8 1 0 5 = 15
1 9 5 = 15
1 9 1 4 = 15
1 9 2 3 = 15
1 9 3 2 = 15
1 9 4 1 = 15
1 9 5 0 = 15

2 0 4 9 = 15
2 0 5 8 = 15
2 0 6 7 = 15
2 0 7 6 = 15
2 0 8 5 = 15
2 0 9 4 = 15
2 1 3 9 = 15
2 1 4 8 = 15
2 1 5 7 = 15
2 1 6 6 = 15
2 1 7 5 = 15
2 1 8 4 = 15
2 1 9 3 = 15
2 2 2 9 = 15
2 2 3 8 = 15
2 2 4 7 = 15
2 2 5 6 = 15
2 2 6 5 = 15
2 2 7 4 = 15
2 3 1 9 = 15
2 3 2 8 = 15
2 3 3 7 = 15
2 3 4 6 = 15
2 3 5 5 = 15
2 3 6 4 = 15
2 3 7 3 = 15
2 3 8 2 = 15
2 3 9 1 = 15
2 3 1 0 9 = 15
2 3 1 1 8 = 15
2 4 9 = 15
2 4 1 8 = 15
2 4 2 7 = 15
2 4 3 6 = 15
2 4 4 5 = 15
2 4 5 4 = 15
2 4 6 3 = 15
2 5 8 = 15
2 5 1 7 = 15
2 5 2 6 = 15
2 5 3 5 = 15
2 5 4 4 = 15
2 5 5 3 = 15
2 5 6 2 = 15
2 5 7 1 = 15
2 6 7 = 15
2 6 1 6 = 15
2 6 2 5 = 15
2 6 3 4 = 15
2 6 4 3 = 15
2 6 5 2 = 15
2 6 6 1 = 15
2 6 7 0 = 15
2 6 1 0 6 = 15
2 6 1 1 5 = 15
2 6 1 2 4 = 15
2 6 1 3 3 = 15
2 6 1 4 2 = 15
2 6 1 5 1 = 15
2 6 1 6 0 = 15
2 6 2 0 5 = 15
2 6 2 1 4 = 15
2 6 2 2 3 = 15
2 7 6 = 15
2 7 1 5 = 15
2 7 2 4 = 15
2 7 3 3 = 15
2 7 4 2 = 15
2 7 5 1 = 15
2 7 6 0 = 15
2 8 5 = 15
2 8 1 4 = 15
2 8 2 3 = 15
2 8 3 2 = 15
2 8 4 1 = 15
2 8 5 0 = 15
2 9 4 = 15
2 9 1 3 = 15
2 9 2 2 = 15
2 9 3 1 = 15
2 9 4 0 = 15

3 0 3 9 = 15
3 0 4 8 = 15
3 0 5 7 = 15
3 1 2 9 = 15
3 2 1 9 = 15
3 2 2 8 = 15
3 3 9 = 15
3 3 1 8 = 15
3 3 2 7 = 15
3 3 3 6 = 15
3 3 4 5 = 15
3 3 5 4 = 15
3 3 6 3 = 15
3 3 7 2 = 15
3 4 8 = 15
3 4 1 7 = 15
3 4 2 6 = 15
3 4 3 5 = 15
3 4 4 4 = 15
3 4 5 3 = 15
3 5 7 = 15
3 5 1 6 = 15
3 5 2 5 = 15
3 5 3 4 = 15
3 5 4 3 = 15
3 6 6 = 15
3 6 1 5 = 15
3 6 2 4 = 15
3 6 3 3 = 15
3 6 4 2 = 15
3 6 5 1 = 15
3 6 6 0 = 15
3 7 5 = 15
3 7 1 4 = 15
3 7 2 3 = 15
3 7 3 2 = 15
3 7 4 1 = 15
3 7 5 0 = 15
3 7 1 0 4 = 15
3 7 1 1 3 = 15
3 7 1 2 2 = 15
3 7 1 3 1 = 15
3 7 1 4 0 = 15
3 8 4 = 15
3 8 1 3 = 15
3 8 2 2 = 15
3 8 3 1 = 15
3 8 4 0 = 15
3 9 3 = 15
3 9 1 2 = 15
3 9 2 1 = 15
3 9 3 0 = 15

4 0 2 9 = 15
4 0 3 8 = 15
4 0 4 7 = 15
4 0 5 6 = 15
4 0 6 5 = 15
4 0 7 4 = 15
4 0 8 3 = 15
4 1 1 9 = 15
4 1 2 8 = 15
4 1 3 7 = 15
4 1 4 6 = 15
4 2 9 = 15
4 2 1 8 = 15
4 2 2 7 = 15
4 2 3 6 = 15
4 2 4 5 = 15
4 3 8 = 15
4 3 1 7 = 15
4 3 2 6 = 15
4 3 3 5 = 15
4 3 4 4 = 15
4 3 5 3 = 15
4 3 6 2 = 15
4 3 7 1 = 15
4 3 8 0 = 15
4 4 7 = 15
4 4 1 6 = 15
4 4 2 5 = 15
4 4 3 4 = 15
4 4 4 3 = 15
4 4 5 2 = 15
4 5 6 = 15
4 5 1 5 = 15
4 5 2 4 = 15
4 5 3 3 = 15
4 6 5 = 15
4 6 1 4 = 15
4 6 2 3 = 15
4 6 3 2 = 15
4 7 4 = 15
4 7 1 3 = 15
4 7 2 2 = 15
4 7 3 1 = 15
4 8 3 = 15
4 8 1 2 = 15
4 8 2 1 = 15
4 9 2 = 15
4 9 1 1 = 15

5 0 1 9 = 15
5 0 2 8 = 15
5 0 3 7 = 15
5 1 9 = 15
5 1 1 8 = 15
5 1 2 7 = 15
5 1 3 6 = 15
5 1 4 5 = 15
5 1 5 4 = 15
5 2 8 = 15
5 2 1 7 = 15
5 2 2 6 = 15
5 2 3 5 = 15
5 2 4 4 = 15
5 3 7 = 15
5 3 1 6 = 15
5 3 2 5 = 15
5 3 3 4 = 15
5 3 4 3 = 15
5 3 5 2 = 15
5 3 6 1 = 15
5 4 6 = 15
5 4 1 5 = 15
5 4 2 4 = 15
5 4 3 3 = 15
5 4 4 2 = 15
5 4 5 1 = 15
5 5 5 = 15
5 5 1 4 = 15
5 5 2 3 = 15
5 5 3 2 = 15
5 5 4 1 = 15
5 5 5 0 = 15
5 6 4 = 15
5 6 1 3 = 15
5 6 2 2 = 15
5 6 3 1 = 15
5 6 4 0 = 15
5 7 3 = 15
5 7 1 2 = 15
5 7 2 1 = 15
5 8 2 = 15
5 8 1 1 = 15
5 8 2 0 = 15
5 9 1 = 15
5 9 1 0 = 15

6 0 9 = 15
6 1 8 = 15
6 2 7 = 15
6 3 6 = 15
6 4 5 = 15
6 4 1 4 = 15
6 5 4 = 15
6 6 3 = 15
6 6 1 2 = 15
6 7 2 = 15
6 7 1 1 = 15
6 7 2 0 = 15
6 8 1 = 15
6 8 1 0 = 15
6 9 0 = 15

7 0 8 = 15
7 0 1 7 = 15
7 0 2 6 = 15
7 0 3 5 = 15
7 0 4 4 = 15
7 1 7 = 15
7 1 1 6 = 15
7 1 2 5 = 15
7 2 6 = 15
7 2 1 5 = 15
7 2 2 4 = 15
7 3 5 = 15
7 3 1 4 = 15
7 4 4 = 15
7 4 1 3 = 15
7 4 2 2 = 15
7 4 3 1 = 15
7 4 4 0 = 15
7 5 3 = 15
7 5 1 2 = 15
7 5 2 1 = 15
7 5 3 0 = 15
7 6 2 = 15
7 6 1 1 = 15
7 6 2 0 = 15
7 7 1 = 15
7 7 1 0 = 15

8 0 7 = 15
8 0 1 6 = 15
8 0 2 5 = 15
8 0 3 4 = 15
8 1 6 = 15
8 1 1 5 = 15
8 1 2 4 = 15
8 2 5 = 15
8 2 1 4 = 15
8 3 4 = 15
8 3 1 3 = 15
8 3 2 2 = 15
8 3 3 1 = 15
8 4 3 = 15
8 4 1 2 = 15
8 4 2 1 = 15
8 5 2 = 15
8 5 1 1 = 15
8 5 2 0 = 15
8 6 1 = 15
8 6 1 0 = 15

9 0 6 = 15
9 0 1 5 = 15
9 1 5 = 15
9 1 1 4 = 15
9 2 4 = 15
9 2 1 3 = 15
9 3 3 = 15
9 4 2 = 15
9 5 1 = 15

1 0 7 7 = 15
1 0 9 5 = 15

21 الم alif lam meem (with next verse in oldest manuscripts)
such the writ not doubt therein guidance for the righteous

https//corpuscoranicum.de/en/verse-navigator/sura/2/verse/1/manuscripts/116/page/1v

https//i.postimg.cc/3JnJzDpP/ch2v1.jpg

[shukri]

Brother Wakas,

My posting on reply #13 was not meant to debunk your finding
But to give an input based on mathematical analysis as a comparison

AND the main purpose is just to prove to myself that the number of salat in the Quran is three times per day and my reference article below has merit.
https//www.quran-islam.org/main_topics/islam/pillars/number_of_salat_(P1200).html

Thanks.

[shukri]

484 verses digits equal 15

2 4 9 = 15
2 5 8 = 15
2 6 7 = 15
2 7 6 = 15
2 8 5 = 15
.
.

Except verse 2238, which one in the list or in the whole Quran has the words "the middle the salat (الصَّلوٰةِ الوُصطىٰ)"
The "the middle the salat (الصَّلوٰةِ الوُسطىٰ)" is my keyword in my analysis!

Thanks.

[Bajram_Hoxhaj]

Except verse 2238, which one in the list or in the whole Quran has the words "the middle the salat (الصَّلوٰةِ الوُصطىٰ)"
The "the middle the salat (الصَّلوٰةِ الوُسطىٰ)" is my keyword in my analysis!

Thanks.

So what? Since you're into 19

الصلوه gv 162 (1+6+2 = 9)
and occurs 64 (6+4 = 10) times

Therefore; 9 + 10 = 19

162 64 = 19 x 856 (8+5+6 = 19)

2458 (2+4+5+8 = 19) where "two" are mentioned

445 (4+4+5 = 13) Şalāati Al-Fajri (صَلوٰةِ الفَجرِ)
534 (5+3+4 = 12) Şalāati Al-`Ishā'i (صَلوٰةِ العِشاءِ)

445 534 13 12 = 19 x 234491648

979 (9+7+9 = 25)

25 979
25 445 534 = 19 x 136732918186

صَلوٰةِ الفَجرِ صَلوٰةِ العِشاءِ

19 letters!
1 90306400 2 130803200 3 90306400 4 1307030011 = 19 x ...
1 90306400 1234 2 130803200 12345 3 90306400 1234 4 1307030011 123456 = 19 x ...

Salaam

[shukri]

So what? Since you're into 19

الصلوه gv 162 (1+6+2 = 9)
and occurs 64 (6+4 = 10) times

Therefore; 9 + 10 = 19

162 64 = 19 x 856 (8+5+6 = 19)

bla bla bla

Show me where in my posting on Reply #11 i used Code 19?

Please sir don't make a comment just for the sake of provocation!
OR Are you a scammer in this forum?

Note
If you don't answer my question properly on Reply #16 i will not entertain you anymore!

[Bajram_Hoxhaj]

Show me where in my posting on Reply #11 i used Code 19?

Blah Blah Blah

That was to show same nonsense and digit flipping can be used for anything. You can run away like you did on that bismillah thread where I showed you how easy it is and the 1/19 probability. I don’t care if you respond or not although don’t come here post conjecture and call it analysis. nope

[shukri]

"Information Only"

I just want to respond to other link provided by Brother Wakas
http//submission.org/Where_can_we_find_Salah.html

In this link, "submission.org" said the salat's rakaat of 24434 was preserved by God and mathematically coded by Code-19
But this claim i think has no merit because the sequence of 43244 will give the same result

The counter-argument can be seen in this link
https//www.quran-islam.org/main_topics/islam/pillars/the_code_19_(P1203).html
It is very convincing I suppose, at least for me alone!

Note
This is my last post in this thread
Just sharing my current views and beliefs on the number of salat in the Quran
Sorry for any inconvenience, if any
Bye!

[Bajram_Hoxhaj]

"Information Only"

I just want to respond to other link provided by Brother Wakas
http//submission.org/Where_can_we_find_Salah.html

In this link, "submission.org" said the salat's rakaat of 24434 was preserved by God and mathematically coded by Code-19
But this claim i think has no merit because the sequence of 43244 will give the same result

Five daily, with 17 rakaat, are taken from hadith and tradition.

Fajr (Dawn prayer) 2 rak‘āt
Dhuhr (Midday prayer) 4 rak‘āt
Asr (Afternoon prayer) 4 rak‘āt
Maghrib (Evening prayer) 3 rak‘āt
Isha (Night prayer) 4 rak‘āt

Also, you forgot to mention the rest.
All digits add up to 17 and are multiples of 19.

11267 11438
11951 12293
12464 12635
13148 13319
13661 13832
14174 14345
14516 15371
15542 15713
16226 17252
17423 19133
21185 21356
21527 22382
22553 22724
23237 23921
24263 24434
25118 25631
26144 26315
27341 27512
29222 31274
31445 31616
32129 32471
32642 32813
33155 33326
34181 34352
34523 36233
38114 39311
41192 41363
41534 42218
42731 43244
43415 44441
44612 45125
46151 46322
51281 51452
51623 52136
53162 53333
55214 56411
58121 61541
61712 62225
63251 63422
65132 71117
72143 72314
73511 75221
82232 84113

The rest is all predictable flipping of digits by the infatuated.

Salaam

[shukri]

Hi Bajram,
If you are human and not a robot AI confused

Tell us if you observe salat or not
Is salat a ritual practice as sunni/shia did
How many rakaat for each salat you perform
Are you satisfied with your salat!

Thank you!

[shukri]

Hi Bajram,
If you are human and not a robot AI confused

Tell us if you observe salat or not
Is salat a ritual practice as sunni/shia did
How many rakaat for each salat you perform
Are you satisfied with your salat!

Thank you!

Hi Bajram,
Sorry for the above posting
I did that because I feel like I am having a conversation with a robot, not a human!

But anyway, I hope you don't mind answering all the questions I put forward
At least I know who you are ... quranist, sunni, etc. and your stance about salat
sun

Thanks in advance!

[Bajram_Hoxhaj]

Hi Bajram,
Sorry for the above posting
I did that because I feel like I am having a conversation with a robot, not a human!

But anyway, I hope you don't mind answering all the questions I put forward
At least I know who you are ... quranist, sunni, etc. and your stance about salat
sun

Thanks in advance!

I do salat about 50 times a day, and like Thomas Jefferson — “I am of a sect (robot) by myself, as far as I know.”

Salaam

[Wakas]

peace shukri,
When using numerology one has to be careful they are being objective thus checking corroborating Quranic evidence such as linguistic, timing coherence, practicality, logic etc is essential. Some of the points mentioned in the article have nothing to do with linguistic issues for example, but I guess it is much easier to paint them all under linguistic and ignore them

https//mypercept.co.uk/articles/problems-5-salat-Quran.html

e.g.
20) B, C, D.
It should be noted that according to the 5 salat daily view, a salat called "Dhuhr" and a salat called "Asr" are claimed to be due from noon onwards, however according to 2458 it was common practice for believers within their households to discard their clothes at/from noon (likely due to the heat*), and this period of undress is described as "private parts/times" (3awrat) for us. During these private times others are asked to seek our permission in order to mingle with us. Thus, questions arise when is salat meant to be offered in this private time of undress? Do believers uphold the alleged Dhuhr/Asr salat privately? Can they uphold them naked? Do they uphold Dhuhr, then undress, then re-dress and uphold Asr, then undress etc - is this what is being suggested?
It could be argued that we are meant to apply some sort of common sense, for example, when noon arrives, one would uphold both these salat immediately or soon after, then go to their homes (or if already in the home) and discard their garments, but unfortunately for such an explanation 2458 states at/from noon. Perhaps some might accept this explanation. Of course, some advocates of 5 salat daily argue for the alleged "Dhuhr" and "Asr" time periods to extend well into the afternoon and even until start of sunset.

If you wish to base your practice on numerology primarily that is of course up to you.

[shukri]

Salam Wakas

For your information
I observe 3 salat per day i.e. fajr, Al-Wustha and Isha
And the time is as follows ...
Fajr prayer starts when Fajr appear and ends at sunrise
Al-Wustha prayer begins when the sun starts to decline from its highest point in the sky which is at noon and ends at sunset.
Isha Prayer starts as soon as the sun has set and ends when all light has disappeared from the night sky.

Note
The name for Isha prayer in the Quran is equivalent to maghrib prayer in sunni practice
i.e. the timeframe for the Isha prayer is equivalent to maghrib prayer for sunni

My comment on private time in verse 2458
The time for the wustha prayer is quite long compared to the other two prayers
For example the time period is around 6 hours in my country
With this long flexible time, especially at noon time, people can do anything they like including discarding their clothes, etc.
And that's why I think the Quran instructs us to get permission during noon time a.k.a. at relaxing time after morning work.
Moreover we should know that verse 2458 just focused on private time NOT salat prayer itself
And the time for the middle the salat (al-salat al-Wustha) is not confined to "noon" time alone but including afternoon (asr) time stated in verse 1031!
And that is the reason i think why the middle the salat (al-salat al-Wustha) is not named as noon prayer!

My comment on "numerology"
I believe al-Quran is mathematically composed based on this verse
111 A.L.R. This is a scripture whose verses have been perfected/tightened, then elucidated. It comes from a Most Wise, Most Cognizant.

Where the digit of quranic verses can be used as a "tool" to solve any important issue such as the number of salat stated in verse 2238
This method is normally used by "messenger" Rashad Khalifa in many occasions such as ... http//quranix.org/appendix/final/37#~text=Contrary%20to%20common%20belief%2C%20the,to%205%2B38%20%3D%2043.

Since i believe Rashad Khalifa was a messenger of covenant in verse 381
And he instead believe in 5 daily prayer with rakaat 24434
I need very concrete evidence if i decide not to follow his teaching
And that is the main reason why I do mathematical analysis
Just to prove to myself that the number of salat in the Quran is merely three times per day, not five!

And if you refer to my posting #3
Rashad reminded us to follow the Quran alone, not him per se! ... Link https//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9606178.0
OR in other words, he is not infallible and on some occasions can make mistakes!
Furthermore, I should provide my concrete proof before God in the hereafter if i choose not to follow messenger teaching
That's a gross sin to deny God's messenger without solid reason/proof.

AND my stance will change accordingly if i come across new proof which is better than the proof i had now!
3918 They are the ones who examine all words, then follow the best. These are the ones whom God has guided; these are the ones who possess intelligence.

May my Lord forgive me if I'm wrong!
All Praise be to God

Important Note

Brother Wakas,

My posting on reply #13 was not meant to debunk your finding
But to give an input based on mathematical analysis as a comparison

AND the main purpose is just to prove to myself that the number of salat in the Quran is three times per day and my reference article below has merit.
https//www.quran-islam.org/main_topics/islam/pillars/number_of_salat_(P1200).html

Ends.

[JinnJinn]

Hey buddies,

Rituals are not amal/works for which you would gain recompense. Don't waste time in doing them be it salat or fasting etc., All these are inventions of ritualistic religions and not from Allah. You may think it is from Allah by looking at certain verses but they are not. That's how they got deviated and invented and don't follow them.

salah is interaction and salawath is interactions.

2458 Salat al Isha = Interaction of the Isha period/late twilight.
salat al Fajr = interaction of the dawn.

They are family interactions beginning time and end time, so take permission if you want to interact at times not normally interacting. So simple. It's all about interaction and connection. When it comes to interaction with Allah, it is salat with Al Quran.

[shukri]

They are family interactions beginning time and end time, so take permission if you want to interact at times not normally interacting. So simple. It's all about interaction and connection. When it comes to interaction with Allah, it is salat with Al Quran.

How interaction/salat is done with the Quran
I am quite new to this concept!

Thank you.