How the Qur'an Revived the Abandoned Practice of Salat and Restored its True Form
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A few months ago, I came across verses in the Qur'an that present an irrefutable argument for understanding Salat as a timeless spiritual practice, unchanged since the dawn (beginning) of humanity. Salat was central to all the prophets and their followers, as well as to the guided and chosen ones. The key message of Islam, reflected in what was revealed to them, unmistakably shows that Salat has always been the enduring foundation of devotion to God. From Noah to Muhammad, all prophets, together with their followers and the guided and chosen ones, were commanded to uphold Salat as part of their submission to God. The Qur'an confirms this continuity in several verses. Therefore, the Qur'an makes it unmistakably clear that Salat was not a new spiritual practice but the same act of submission required of all the prophets and the faithful throughout history. Lastly, as I will explain and show later, the Qur'an proves that all the prophets performed Salat in a similar way. Therefore, Salat is not only a timeless spiritual practice, but its form has remained unchanged throughout history.
The verses that I came across a few months ago reveal an inseparable connection between Salat, the recitation of God's revelations, sujud (submission and obedience), and dhikr (the remembrance of God). These verses make it clear that Salat itself is a form of "dhikr." Moreover, this connection shows that Salat is not just a physical act, but it is a profound, all-encompassing spiritual practice.
Furthermore, these verses reveal that Salat is not a new practice, but rather a timeless one that had been abandoned and was reintroduced for humanity during the time of Muhammad. This spiritual practice was as relevant to the Arabs at the time of the Qur'an's revelation as it is to all of humanity today.
I wrote an early draft of an article to explore my thoughts and findings on Salat in greater depth, but I never shared it. My aim was to create a comprehensive piece that not only analyzes the term Salat in every verse it appears, but also considers the context of those verses. I suppose I was hoping for the "biggest prize," or maybe the "biggest toy." Haha! Perhaps I was lurking in the shadow of the holy guru who misinterpreted verse 2:148. Lol. I also got busy with other Qur'anic topics, like Iblis and the Jinn, which delayed me from sharing my thoughts and findings on Salat.
I first came across the understanding that Salat is closely connected to the recitation of the Qur'an in Ayman's book "Quran for peace." It's important to acknowledge this influence, as it shaped my thinking on the matter, and I want to give credit where it's deserved. Yesterday, I read a post by ths, which suggests that Muhammad Shahrour believes that Salat is linked to God through "dhikr." Remarkably, this aligns with the realization I myself had a few months ago. While I might have arrived at this conclusion after Muhammad Shahrour, it only reinforces the notion that "there is nothing new under the sun."
In any case, ths's post inspired and encouraged me to share my thoughts and findings on Salat earlier than I had intended. Anyone who wishes to use these insights from the Qur'an for their own work is more than welcome to do so. After all, the spreading of the message matters far more than the recognition of any individual contributions. Because the cause of God surpasses any one person's work. That said, I do believe it's important to always give credit where it's due.
I didn't end up writing a comprehensive article that analyzes the term Salat in every verse it appears and fully considers the context of those verses. However, I have now completed an article on the Qur'anic notion of Salat, which is no longer in draft form. The article can be read in my next post. While I've edited it over the past few days, I acknowledge that it might still contain areas that need further clarification or explanation. It's not an exhaustive article, but I hope it contributes to a deeper understanding of this important topic. As always, I welcome any feedback.
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Salat has always been an essential part of submitting to God. The Qur'an is a self-explanatory scripture and clearly shows how the prophets and the faithful practiced Salat, while later generations that came after them followed their desires, abandoned Salat, and faced serious consequences for doing so. The following verses clearly show how Salat is connected to God's revelations as well as true submission and obedience.
19:58-60 Those are the ones whom God has blessed from among the prophets from the progeny of Adam, and those We carried with Noah, and from the progeny of Abraham and Israel, and from whom We have guided and chosen. When the revelations of the Almighty are recited to them, they fall down prostrating, and in tears. Then, generations came after them who lost the Al-Salat, and followed desires. They will find their consequences. Except for whoever repents and believes and does good works; they will be admitted to the Paradise, and they will not be wronged in the least.
These verses show a powerful contrast between earlier generations who performed Salat as ordained by God and later generations who abandoned it, followed their desires, practiced Salat in a different way (form) than ordained by God, and as a result experienced serious and significant consequences (such as stagnation, regression, or decline within the communities of believers). The prophets and the righteous men and women among earlier generations responded to God's revelations (words) with humility, devotion, submission and obedience. They established Salat, performed sujjud (submission and obedience), and even wept when God's revelations were recited to them. Verses 19:59-60 unmistakably establish a clear and direct connection between Salat, and the recitation of God's revelations and obedience to them, as expressed through the arabic term sujjud (submission and obedience). Furthermore, these verses illustrate how the prophets, their followers, and the guided ones responded to God's revelations with humility and submission, and performed Salat as an act of obedience to God's will. Therefore, these verses irrefutably prove that Salat is inseparable from the recitation of God's revelations and obedience to them, as expressed through sujjud.
Later generations, however, abandoned both the recitation God's revelations and obedience to them, followed their desires, practiced Salat in a different way (form) than ordained by God, and as a result experienced serious and significant consequences. The message of these verses is unmistakably clear and indisputable. Spiritual guidance is only beneficial when acted upon as commanded by God. Abandoning the Salat, recitation of God's revelations, and obedience to them leads to loss and decline, but those who repent and do righteous deeds are spared, as the Qur'an states in verse 19:60. As a final point, verses 19:59-60 make it unmistakably clear that the Qur'an explains the practice of Salat and what it truly involves.
17:106-110 And a revelation that We have separated, so that you may read it to the people over time; and We have brought it down gradually. Say: "Believe in it or do not believe in it. Those who have been given the knowledge before it, when it is recited to them, they fall to their chins prostrating." And they say: "Praise be to our Lord. Truly, the promise of our Lord was fulfilled. And they fall upon their chins crying, and it increases them in humility. Say: "Call on God or call on the Almighty; by whichever you call on, to Him are the best names." And do not be too loud in making your contact prayer, nor too quiet; but seek a path in between.
Just like verses 19:58-59, verses 17:106-110 unmistakably establish a direct connection between Salat, the recitation of God's revelations and obedience to them, as expressed through the Arabic term sujud (submission and obedience). In these verses, both Salat and sujud are mentioned together. These verses clearly show that when the revelations of God are recited to the believers, they respond with humility, devotion, submission, obedience, and even weep.
32:15 The only people who believe in Our revelations are those whom when they are reminded by them, they fall prostrating, and they glorify the praise of their Lord, and they are not arrogant. Their sides readily forsake their beds, to call on their Lord out of fear and hope, and from Our provisions to them they give. No person knows what is being hidden for them of joy, as a reward for what they used to do.
Just like in the previously mentioned verses, verse 32:15 establishes a clear and direct connection between the recitation of God's revelations and obedience to them, expressed through the term sujud (submission and obedience). Verse 32:15 describes how those who truly believe in God's revelations fall prostrating when reminded by them, glorify and praise their Lord, and remain humble, not arrogant.
The Qur'an consistently reinforces the link between Salat and the recitation of God's revelations. In verse 17:78, believers are instructed to recite the Qur'an during Salat at dawn (Fajr). In verse 29:45, the recitation of the Qur'an is linked to establishing Salat at its appointed times. In verse 73:20, a balanced recitation of the Qur'an is encouraged alongside Salat at night (Tahajjud) and doing good deeds. These verses clearly show that Salat has always been connected to engagement with God's revelations since the Qur'an was revealed. Furthermore, these verses reinforce the message of verses 19:58-59, which shows that the prophets and the guided and elected responded to God's revelations with humility and obedience and performed Salat in close connection with reciting God's revelations.
The Qur'an commands believers to establish Salat, which is a physical and spiritual practice that spans from dawn to dusk and continues into the night (see verses 17:78, 11:114, and 73:20). In addition, it describes Salat as occurring at fixed times (mawqatun) throughout the day (see verses 2:238, 4:103, and 29:45). This unmistakably shows that Salat is not just a series of isolated acts performed at specific moments, but rather a continuous connection with God throughout the entire day, which involves both the recitation of God's revelations at set times and obedience to them. Therefore, Salat is more than just a set of time-specific practices. It is a complete physical and spiritual practice. It's an ongoing act of spiritual submission, humble obedience, and sincere devotion that incorporates continuous remembrance of God throughout daily life.
In the story of Adam, the malaika performed sujud to Adam, even though formal prayer rituals had not yet been established (see verses 2:31-34). This makes it unmistakably clear that sujud is a timeless concept, and its true essence has always been humble obedience, submission, and alignment with God's will. During Adam's time among Iblis and the malaika in paradise, no prescribed devotional laws or ritual postures existed. Thus, the fasajudu (derived from the term sujud) in Adam's story was not a ritual act of prostration, but a deep expression of humility, obedience, and spiritual submission to God's will. When God told the malaika to perform sujud to Adam, they obeyed His command by humbly yielding to Adam and acknowledging his honor. When Iblis refused to do the same, he didn't refuse to physically prostrate to Adam. Instead, he refused to yield to Adam and acknowledge his honor. The story of Adam shows that sujud unites the individual with God and creation, and embodies humility, submission, and obedience to God's will. In essence, sujud goes beyond rituals and shows a deep spiritual connection and unity between all of creation and the Creator.
The significance of Sujud as a unifying act is further reinforced in the story of Joseph. In his dream, Joseph sees eleven stars, the sun, and the moon prostrating to him, which holds deep symbolic meaning (see verse 12:4). The eleven stars represent his brothers, and the sun and moon symbolize his parents. These celestial symbols reflect the divine order and authority that Joseph will come to embody, as they represent the harmony of creation and submission to God's will. The fulfillment of Joseph's dream transcends personal power and worldly success. Instead it reveals deeper themes of reconciliation and familial unity. When Joseph is reunited with his family, he realizes that the true meaning of his dream lies not in his individual rise to power, but in the reconciliation and collective success of his whole family (see verse 12:100).
In verse 12:100, the Qur'an states that Joseph's parents fell in Sajda to him. However, the Sajda (which is derived from the term sujud) in Joseph's story is not a ritual or physical prostration like the prayers in traditional Islam. Instead, it is a moment of mental and spiritual submission to God's will. When Joseph's parents and his brothers fell in sajda to him, they were not asserting Joseph's power but humbling themselves in obedience to God's plan. This act acknowledges Joseph's divinely ordained honor and fulfills the dream he had as a child (see verses 12:4-6). Furthermore, it signifies the restoration of family unity after years of separation, hardship, and regret.
Moreover, the act of Sujud in Joseph's story is about recognizing God's wisdom and purpose in Joseph’s life. When the family reunites, it is a humbling moment where they submit to God's plan. They acknowledge that Joseph's rise was not driven by worldly ambition, but by the divine purpose of healing rifts and bringing the family together. It is a moment of reconciliation, where God's will is realized, and familial harmony is restored. So, the act of Sujud here is a profound act of humility, obedience and submission to God's will, far beyond the physical rituals of prayer. The story of Joseph unmistakably shows that Sujud, mentally (with heart and mind), as well as spiritually and symbolically, unites the individual with God and brings harmony within creation. It insightfully illustrates the broader divine purpose of reconciliation and unity.
The Qur'an describes sujud not only for humans, who can physically prostrate, but also for celestial bodies and natural entities, such as the sun, moon, stars, shadows, mountains, and trees, all of which cannot perform human postures (see verses 22:18 and 13:15). Verses 13:15 and 24:41 further state that everything in the heavens and the earth prostrates to God, including all entities that cannot physically bow in human posture, which shows that sujud applies to all of creation. While the term sujud is associated with falling on faces in two verses of the Qur'an, specifically verses 17:109 and 38:24, this act is symbolic of profound humility, obedience, and submission rather than the mere physical act of prostration. Notably, in these verses, ruku (traditionally translated as bowing) is not mentioned, which further shows that falling on faces does not refer to a physical act of prostration in the ritual sense but rather to a spiritual submission and contrition before God. This irrefutable and indisputable fact proves that the meaning of sujud is humble obedience and submission to God's will, not the physical act of prostration. When all creation, including the sun, moon, stars, shadows, and trees, is said to perform sujud, it confirms and leaves absolutely no doubt that sujud inherently means humble obedience and submission to God's will, not literal human posturing.
As has been seen, the message of verses 17:106-110 powerfully mirrors that of 19:58-60, and shows that whenever God's revelations are recited, the faithful respond with prostration, tears, and humble obedience and submission to God's will. In addition, these verses mention Salat in the same context as the recitation of revelation (which is to be done in a moderate voice) and treat recitation together with sujud as inseparable from Salat. Verse 32:15 likewise establishes a clear and direct connection between the recitation of God's revelations and obedience to them, as expressed through the term sujud.
As has been shown, the Qur'an makes it abundantly clear that Salat is inseparably linked to the recitation of God's revelations and obedience to them. Salat is a continuous spiritual connection with God throughout the day, established at fixed times and sustained by the recitation of God's revelations at specific times during the day, along with obedience to them (17:78, 29:45, 73:20, 11:114, 2:238, 4:103, and 19:58–59).
Salat, as explained from the perspective of the Qur'an, reveals a clear difference between early generations who obeyed God's revelations upon recitation of its verses, which implies all its verses (they practiced Salat in the form ordained by God), and later generations who abandoned this practice, followed their desires, and practiced Salat in a different way (form) than ordained by God (19:58-60). Furthermore, the Qur'an shows sujud's true essence in Adam's and Joseph's stories, and across all creation. From these examples, it shows that sujud is humble obedience and submission to God's will (2:34; 12:4, 12:100; 13:15, and 22:18).
Ultimately, the significance of verses 19:58-60 cannot be overstated. These verses hold the master key that unlocks the true meaning of Salat from the perspective of the Qur'an. The context of these verses proves beyond any doubt that the recitation of God's revelations (such as the Qur'an for our faith and our era) and obedience to them form a unified practice directly tied to Salat (which is in essence a spiritual bond and connection with God). In this way, these verses resolve the mystery of Salat's true meaning and its irrefutable and undeniable link to the recitation of God's revelations once and for all.
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Salam Ronin,
I would appreciate to know how 4:102, with its detailed description of alternating groups and sujud in Salat, complements your broader understanding of Sujud.
Quran 4:102
“And when you are among them and lead them in Salat, let a group of them stand with you and let them take their arms. Then when they have performed sujud, let them be behind you, and let another group who has not yet prayed come forward and pray with you…”
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By the way, celestial bodies and trees also physically prostrate:
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The Qur'an tells all the details of the salaat.
The real Injil and the real Torah had this information. But in the fake Injils and Torah, this information was extracted and forgotten.
There's crumbs left.
Daniel 6;10
Now when Daniel learned that the decree had been published, he went home to his upstairs room where the windows opened toward Jerusalem. Three times a day he got down on his knees and prayed, giving thanks to his God, just as he had done before.
Bible Illustrations of Prophets Prostrating and PrayingIn the Bible, prophets are often described praying by falling on their faces (full prostration) or kneeling in deep humility and submission to God. Key examples: Abraham (Genesis 17:3)
Moses (Exodus 34:8)
Joshua (Joshua 5:14)
Daniel
Ezra
Jesus in the Garden of Gethsemane (Matthew 26:39 – “He fell with his face to the ground and prayed”)Below are classic Bible illustrations and paintings showing these scenes (mainly from Gustave Doré’s famous 19th-century Bible Gallery and traditional Christian art).1. Jesus Christ Praying in the Garden of Gethsemane (Matthew 26:39)The most iconic and powerful depiction of prostration
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Prophet Daniel Praying (Kneeling in devotion)Classic Gustave Doré-style engraving.
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Classic Biblical Prostration SceneA prophet or figure fully prostrating (face down) in prayer
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Gustave Doré Bible Illustrations – Prophets and People PrayingPowerful scenes of prostration and kneeling before
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Moses Praying SceneMoses and the people in humble prayer posture.
https://www.thetorah.com/article/prostration-to-god-and-humans-a-biblical-practice
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wqwkGnMSJAI
There are traces of physical Salat in all religions.
- Zoroastrianism (Mazdayasna)
According to the sacred texts of the Avesta, the discipline of Salat in Zoroastrianism bears a striking resemblance to the Islamic form.
Times: They perform Salat 5 times a day (known as Gahs).
Preparation: Before the Salat, they wash their hands and faces (an ablution similar to Wudu).
Form: They untie and retie a sacred belt called the "Kusti" while standing and facing a source of light or fire.
- Judaism
In the Old Testament (Torah) and the Talmud, falling to the ground (Hishtachavayah) is documented as the highest form of Salat before God.
Form: While the "Amidah" involves rhythmic bowing, the Samaritans and certain Yemenite Jewish groups still perform Salat with full Ruku and Sajda (Nefilat Apayim).
Times: Salat is performed three times a day: morning, afternoon, and evening.
- Christianity
While Christian worship has evolved over time, the earliest records emphasize the physical form of Salat.
Scriptural Basis: In the Gospel of Matthew (26:39), it is explicitly stated that Jesus performed Salat by "falling on his face."
Tradition: In Orthodox traditions, there is a practice called Metania. Believers perform Salat by touching their heads to the ground as a sign of repentance.
- Sabianism (Mandaeanism)
Mentioned in the Quran, this community maintains a form of Salat that is structurally very close to the Islamic tradition.
Times: They perform Salat 3 times a day (Dawn, Noon, and Sunset).
Preparation: They do not begin Salat without a ritual washing in running water.
Form: They perform a sequence of standing, bowing (Ruku), and prostrating (Sajda) facing the North Star.
- Hinduism
In Hinduism, Salat is a deeply rooted tradition of surrendering the body to the Divine.
Sashtanga Namaskara: This is a Salat where "eight limbs" touch the ground. The person lies flat so that the feet, knees, chest, hands, and forehead perform Sajda.
Surya Namaskar: Performed at dawn, this is a sequence of 12 postures that includes Ruku-like stretches and Sajda-like prostrations.
- Buddhism
In Buddhist traditions, the Salat of prostrating is the primary method for dissolving the ego.
108 Prostrations: In Tibetan and Zen traditions, performing 108 full-body Salat movements is a common practice for purifying the mind.
Form: The hands are joined before the practitioner extends their entire body flat on the ground in a complete Sajda.
- Zoroastrianism (Mazdayasna)
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Peace Emre,
Thank you for your reply.
We don't need the Bible or other scriptures to explain the Qur'an. Because the Qur'an is clear, complete, and perfectly sufficient to guide humanity in every aspect of life. Furthermore, the Qur'an confirms its role in validating, correcting, and completing previous revelations (see 2:41, 2:89, 2:91, 2:97, 2:101, 2:106, 2:213, 2:285, 3:2-4, 4:47, 4:136, 5:3, 5:15, 5:48-49, 5:77, 6:91-92, 9:111, 10:37, 10:94, 12:111, 16:44, 20:133, 25:1, 29:46, 35:31, 41:43, 42:13, 45:16-18, 46:12, 46:30, 48:28, 48:29).
We don't need the Bible or other scriptures to explain the Qur'an. Because the Qur'an offers clear, detailed and comprehensive guidance and provides all the essential rules, principles, and values needed to live justly, morally, meaningfully, and purposefully. As a preserved divine message, it is crafted with timeless wisdom that seamlessly unites belief with action. It guides individuals and communities toward both moral excellence and material prosperity (see 6:38, 6:114, 6:119, 6:126, 7:52, 10:37, 10:35, 11:1, 12:3, 12:111, 16:89, 17:12, 17:41, 17:89, 24:34, 30:58, 39:27, 41:3, 44:4).
I have asked the following question on the forum before. But I'd like to ask it again (in a modified form).
Haven't all of us, at one time or another, only paid lip service to the claim that "scripture interprets scripture," claiming that the Qur'an alone is sufficient and can explain itself, yet continue to rely heavily on tafsirs (commentaries), hadith, the Bible, Arabian mythology, folklore, inherited and ancestral traditions, and other sources that often cloud or distort its original message? If we truly trust the Qur'an's ability to interpret itself, shouldn't we question why we keep turning elsewhere to interpret the Qur'an?
Have we, as Muslims, truly reflected on the possibility that we might be falling into the same traps as some of those who received God's revelations before us? Could it be that, in our interpretation of the Qur'an, we might be misinterpreting its verses by taking them out of context, twisting their meanings, or fragmenting its unified message?
The Qur'an itself warns us against exactly this. It warns us against misinterpreting its verses, taking them out of context, or declaring what is lawful and unlawful without God's authority (see 3:7, 5:101-102, 6:91-92, 6:112-116, 15:90-93, 16:116, 42:21, 2:84-85, 2:101, 2:159-160, 2:174, 6:36-38, and 16:103).
When we look at the history of other faiths, we see a clear pattern. Some historians argue that followers of earlier scriptures have expanded upon their scriptures through textual interpolations (additional texts). Some historians argue that the followers of earlier revelations, such as the Jews and Christians, did not preserve their scriptures in their original form, and instead expanded upon their scriptures over time with new writings that were not part of the original revelation. Some historians argue that the Torah, for instance, was supplemented by the Mishnah and later the Talmud, scriptures that were not part of the divine revelation but rather the product of human interpretation and elaboration. Some historians argue that Christianity have incorporated apocryphal books into its canon long after the Hebrew Bible was established. Some historians argue that Hinduism's Vedas, considered to be the original scripture, were later supplemented by epics like the Mahabharata and Ramayana. Some historians argue that Zoroastrianism's core scripture, the Gathas, which stand as the oldest and most sacred text, was gradually expanded over time with additional texts like the Yasna, Visperad, Vendidad, and Khordeh Avesta. Lastly, some historians argue that Buddhism, starting with the Pali Canon, was expanded upon by later Mahayana sutras and tantric texts.
Now, the status of these aforementioned scriptures as direct divine revelations is debated. They are still regarded by their followers as containing ultimate truths. But here's the key question. Have we, as muslims, truly reflected on the possibility that we, too, might be making similar mistakes? Have we truly reflected on the possibility that we might distort the message of the Qur'an through misinterpretation or human interpolation?
It's important for us to consider the possibility that, like the communities before us, we might risk losing the weighty truth of God's message if we distort or fragment it. Isn't it time for us to approach the Qur'an with an understanding that is timeless, but sometimes forgotten, one that preserves its entirety, guards against distortion, and ensures that we interpret it with honesty and sincerity, without the human errors that have affected previous communities?
The Qur'an calls us to unity, not fragmentation. To understand it as a whole, not in pieces. Above all, to remember that its message is clear, complete, detailed and comprehensive, and must be protected from the errors that have plagued other faiths throughout history.
Let's stop relying on external sources to fill so-called gaps. The Qur'an is clear, complete, and sufficient for all that we need.
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Peace Ronin, I should be the one thanking you.
You didn’t understand what I said and you’ve now written pages of response for nothing. I am not presenting other sources here as evidence—on the contrary, in my studies I treat them as invalid, like hadith books. If you have been reading my writings, you should have known this.
My emphasis here, in response to your statements such as “all prophets were performing salat, they were practicing the true salat,” is to show traces of this salat both in other books and in the living practices of people in other religions. In other words, the purpose here is to answer the objection that “if physical salat has always existed, then there should be traces of it all around the world.”
Likewise, the reason I point to cube-shaped temples and structures in other books and religions regarding the Kaaba issue is the same. Just as, when the Quran is taken on its own, it is an explicit fact that Noah lived at least 950 years, in the same way, when the Quran is read on its own, physical salat is also one hundred percent real. Rest assured on this matter.
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Peace Ronin, I should be the one thanking you.
You didn’t understand what I said and you’ve now written pages of response for nothing. I am not presenting other sources here as evidence—on the contrary, in my studies I treat them as invalid, like hadith books. If you have been reading my writings, you should have known this.
My emphasis here, in response to your statements such as “all prophets were performing salat, they were practicing the true salat,” is to show traces of this salat both in other books and in the living practices of people in other religions. In other words, the purpose here is to answer the objection that “if physical salat has always existed, then there should be traces of it all around the world.”
Likewise, the reason I point to cube-shaped temples and structures in other books and religions regarding the Kaaba issue is the same. Just as, when the Quran is taken on its own, it is an explicit fact that Noah lived at least 950 years, in the same way, when the Quran is read on its own, physical salat is also one hundred percent real. Rest assured on this matter.
@Emre_1974tr said in How the Qur'an Revived the Abandoned Practice of Salat and Restored its True Form:
Peace Ronin, I should be the one thanking you.
You didn’t understand what I said and you’ve now written pages of response for nothing. I am not presenting other sources here as evidence—on the contrary, in my studies I treat them as invalid, like hadith books. If you have been reading my writings, you should have known this.
My emphasis here, in response to your statements such as “all prophets were performing salat, they were practicing the true salat,” is to show traces of this salat both in other books and in the living practices of people in other religions. In other words, the purpose here is to answer the objection that “if physical salat has always existed, then there should be traces of it all around the world.”
Likewise, the reason I point to cube-shaped temples and structures in other books and religions regarding the Kaaba issue is the same. Just as, when the Quran is taken on its own, it is an explicit fact that Noah lived at least 950 years, in the same way, when the Quran is read on its own, physical salat is also one hundred percent real. Rest assured on this matter.
Peace Emre and all!
Emre, I fully understand your point, but there seems to be a misunderstanding here. You're referring to other sources to support your argument about Salat, but the reality is the Qur'anic explanation of Salat is both explicit and self-evident. The Qur'an doesn't require external sources (especially those that have been distorted over time) to clarify the concept of Salat. The Qur'an itself provides a complete, clear, and unambiguous explanation. Therefore, is the ultimate authority on this matter. Salat is indeed both a spiritual and physical act, as I mentioned (without a shred of doubt) in the second paragraph of my first post in this forum. If you have been reading my Original post, you should have known this.
Moreover, your argument about finding traces of physical Salat in other religious texts doesn't challenge the Quran's position and explanation on Salat. The Qur'an supersedes all previous scriptures, as unmistakably shown in verse 5:48. This means whatever is found in earlier scriptures must be understood in light of the final and most complete revelation, which is the Qur'an. Therefore, searching for traces of physical Salat in other scriptures doesn't invalidate the Qur'anic explanation on Salat. It only distracts from the direct and clear guidance the Quran offers.
To be chrystal clear, Salat is indeed both a spiritual and physical act, and no one is denying that. But the focus here should be on the fact that the Qur'an explains the practice of Salat in precise and unambigious terms.
There is no confusion or uncertainty in the Qur'anic explanation on Salat, it is clearly defined, straightforward, and authoritative. The confusion and uncertainty only arise when other sources, aside from the Qur'an, are used to explain Salat. The Qur'an doesn't need to rely on external sources, especially those that may have been compromised, to define something as foundational as Salat. So, instead of trying to locate physical traces of Salat in other scriptures, we should focus on the clear and straightforward guidance within the Qur'an itself.
In understanding the essence of Salat, it's crucial to explore its deep connection to the recitation of God's revelations. Salat is more than just a ritual, it is a response to God's words, and reflects both physical and spiritual submission. This connection is not only implied but explicitly outlined in the Qur'an.
19:58-60 Those are the ones whom God has blessed from among the prophets from the progeny of Adam, and those We carried with Noah, and from the progeny of Abraham and Israel, and from whom We have guided and chosen. When the revelations of the Almighty are recited to them, they fall down prostrating, and in tears. Then, generations came after them who lost the Al-Salat, and followed desires. They will find their consequences. Except for whoever repents and believes and does good works; they will be admitted to the Paradise, and they will not be wronged in the least.
Notice the verses above. The following is a reflection on the connection between Salat and the recitation of God’s revelations, as illustrated by the verses 19:58-60, where the prophets and the faithful's response to God's words is shown.
- When God's revelations were recited, the prophets and the faithful responded with sujud, a sign of humility and reverence.
- Later generations, however, abandoned or forgot the practice of recititing God's revelations, which resulted in consequences (such as stagnation, regression, or decline within the community of believers in God's scriptures).
- Therefore, Salat as an essential practice is inherently connected to the recitation of God's revelations, where sujud serves as both a physical and spiritual response to the divine message, as well as symbolizes obedience and submission to God's will.
This aforementioned reflection shows that Salat is both a physical and spiritual act and that the essence of Salat is rooted in a humble response to God’s revelations, where the act of sujud symbolizes both a physical act of submission and a spiritual act of reverence. Salat is not just a ritual but a complete act of devotion grounded in God's revelations.
17:106-110 And a revelation that We have separated, so that you may read it to the people over time; and We have brought it down gradually. Say: "Believe in it or do not believe in it. Those who have been given the knowledge before it, when it is recited to them, they fall to their chins prostrating." And they say: "Praise be to our Lord. Truly, the promise of our Lord was fulfilled. And they fall upon their chins crying, and it increases them in humility. Say: "Call on God or call on the Almighty; by whichever you call on, to Him are the best names." And do not be too loud in making your contact prayer, nor too quiet; but seek a path in between.
Notice the verses above. The following is also reflection on the connection between Salat and the recitation of God's revelations, as illustrated by the verses 17:106-110, where the the faithful's response to God's words is shown.
- When God's revelations are recited, the faithful respond with sujud, reflecting their humility and reverence for God's words.
- The recitation of God's revelations should neither be too loud nor too quiet, indicating the need for balance and reflection, as shown in Surah 17:110.
- Therefore, Salat as an essential practice is inherently connected to the recitation of God's words, and sujud represents submission and obedience to God's will.
This aforementioned reflection shows that Salat is both a physical and spiritual act and is inseparably connected to the recitation of God's revelations. The faithful's sujud reflects their humility and reverence, which connects recitation directly to Salat. Surah 17:110 shows the need for balanced recitation, and encourages thoughtful reflection. Ultimately, sujud symbolizes submission and obedience to God, and shows that Salat is not just a ritual but a complete act of devotion grounded in God's words.
In conclusion, the Qur'an stands alone in its clarity on Salat, and makes any need for external validation obsolete. Salat is a practice that is both spiritual and physical, and the Qur'an's clear and definitive explanation of it is more than sufficient to grasp its true essence.
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Peace Ronin;
As I said, you completely misunderstood what I told you, and once again, you wrote a bunch of things for nothing.
1- I did not seek validation from any source other than the Quran; I merely showed the signs of your statement that "all prophets performed the true salat" in other religions and sources.
2- I said we will first believe in the clear, primary meaning. We will discuss its other meanings without denying the physical salat. I actually have many writings that offer deep analyses on the secondary and tertiary meanings. But the primary, clear meaning comes first. Besides, even the physical salat itself is a reflection of its spiritual unfolding.
3- By the way, prostration upon the chin was also practiced in ancient times: -
Peace all!
For hundreds of years, countless Muslims have recited Surah Al Fatiha (the first chapter of the Qur'an) in every prayer unit (rak'ah). It has become a deeply ingrained ritual, an unquestioned rule passed down from childhood. Why do so few of us stop to ask where this practice actually comes from? The Qur'an never mentions any fixed unit (rak’ah), nor does it explicitly command the recitation of Surah Al Fatiha in every prayer. Instead, it presents a flexible approach to reciting its verses during Salat, using a moderate voice, and doing Salat two times a day (Quran 73:20, 24:58, 11:114, 17:78, and 17:110).
In light of the Qur'an's silence on fixed units (rak'ah) and mandatory recitation of Surah Al-Fatiha, where do these rituals actually come from?
The concept of fixed units (rak'ah) comes solely from hadiths such as Sahih Bukhari 577, Sunan Abu Dawud 1260, and Sunan an-Nasa'i 1677.
The ritual and rule of reciting Surah Al Fatiha in every prayer also come solely from hadiths, such as Sahih Muslim 394, Sahih Bukhari 756, and Sunan Abu Dawud 823.
Should we recite Surah Al Fatiha in every prayer when this requirement comes from Hadith and is not stated explicitly in the Quran?
19:58-60 Those are the ones whom God has blessed from among the prophets from the progeny of Adam, and those We carried with Noah, and from the progeny of Abraham and Israel, and from whom We have guided and chosen. When the revelations of the Almighty are recited to them, they fall down prostrating, and in tears. Then, generations came after them who lost the Al-Salat, and followed desires. They will find their consequences. Except for whoever repents and believes and does good works; they will be admitted to the Paradise, and they will not be wronged in the least.
Don't verses 19:58-60 make it unmistakably clear that the prophets and the righteous men and women among early generations of faithful communities did not respond selectively to God's revelations, but embraced all of them with deep humility, devotion, submission, and obedience to God? Don't verses 19:58-60 show that later generations of faithful communities lost touch with this divine practice of Salat, forgot and abandoned the recitation of God's revelations, followed their desires instead, and therefore faced serious consequences? Lastly, don't verses 19:58-60 reveal a timeless and universal history lesson about the fate of communities who faithfully recited God's revelations versus those who abandoned this practice?
Why are only some verses of the Qur'an recited during Salat when the Qur'an contains more than 6,200 verses? Is it enough to limit our daily connection with God's guidance to such a small part of God's book? Will our understanding of God's guidance truly expand and deepen if we confine (limit) ourselves to such a small portion of God's book? The verses normally (typically) recited in every prayer (Surah Al Fatiha and a few others) are unquestionably precious, but can they alone convey the full depth of God's message to humanity? If Salat is meant to embody complete devotion, submission, and obedience to God, and the Qur'an is God's complete guidance, why is so much of it (filled with moral insight, divine law, stories, and wisdom) left largely untouched in our daily practice of Salat? Shouldn't we engage more deeply with God's revelations (words), which offer complete guidance for every area of our lives?
Don't verses 19:58-60 unmistakably show that the prophets and the righteous men and women responded to all of God's revelations with humility, obedience, submission, and even tears of devotion? If that's how the most faithful reacted to God's revelations, shouldn't we aspire to the same depth of engagement with God's revelations? If we confine (limit) ourselves to reciting only a handful of verses in our daily practice of Salat, aren't we missing the fullness of divine guidance found in God's revelations? Doesn't true devotion, submission and obedience to God require not only ritual observance, but continuous and regular reflection on God's revelations in the whole of God's book? Is it possible that by focusing on only a fraction of the Qur'anic text, we are shutting ourselves off from the full power of God's revelations in our own lives and in the spiritual and moral fabric of our communities and societies as a whole?
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Peace;
There is no such thing as reciting 141 verses during Salat. In fact, there is not even an obligation to recite a portion from the Quran:
https://forum.free-minds.org/topic/24115/in-the-quran-salaat-fasting-hac-and-zakat/4?_=1772590484375
https://forum.free-minds.org/topic/24115/in-the-quran-salaat-fasting-hac-and-zakat/5?_=1772590484377
https://forum.free-minds.org/topic/24115/in-the-quran-salaat-fasting-hac-and-zakat/6?_=1772590779966
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Peace Emre and all!
Emre, thank you for pointing out the factual error in my previous post. I appreciate it. I've changed the post and removed the factual error. I'm not concerned with being right, but with seeking the truth. So I welcome any criticisms, corrections, falsifications, challenges, and refutations. Lastly, I'd recommend rereading my previous post in its entirety, as I have changed it significantly and added some new information.
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Peace all!
The following verses reveal an inseparable connection between Salat, the recitation of God's revelations, and dhikr (the remembrance of God). Furthermore, they make it unmistakably clear that Salat itself is a form of dhikr.
20:14 "I am God, there is no god except Me, so serve Me and hold the contact prayer for My remembrance."
4:103 Then, if you have completed the contact prayer, remember God while standing, or sitting, or on your sides. Then, if you are secure, hold the contact prayer. Indeed, the contact prayer for the believers is a Book that is scheduled.
2:238-239 Maintain the contact prayers; and the middle contact prayer; and stand for God dutifully. But if you are fearful, then you may do so while walking or riding. If you become secure, then remember God as He has taught you what you did not know.
62:9-10 O you who believe, if the contact prayer is called to at the gathering day, then you shall hasten towards the remembrance of God, and cease all selling. This is better for you, if only you knew. Then, once the contact prayer is complete, you shall disperse through the land and seek the provisions of God, and remember God frequently that you may succeed.
5:91 The devil only wants to cause strife between you through alcohol and gambling, and to repel you away from remembering God and from the contact prayer. Will you be deterred?
24:37 By men not distracted by trade or sale from the remembrance of God and holding the contact prayer, and contributing towards purification. They fear a Day when the hearts and sight will be overturned.
29:45 CONVEY [unto others] whatever of this divine writ has been revealed unto thee, and be constant in prayer: for, behold, prayer restrains [man] from loathsome deeds and from all that runs counter to reason; and remembrance of God is indeed the greatest [good]. And God knows all that you do.
4:142 The hypocrites seek to deceive God, while He is deceiving them; and if they stand to make the contact prayer, they do so lazily, only to show the people; they do not remember God except very little.
25:29 "He has misguided me from the remembrance after it came to me, and the devil was always a betrayer of mankind!"
58:19 The devil has overtaken them, and has caused them to forget the remembrance of God. These are the party of the devil. Absolutely, the party of the devil are the losers.
43:36 And whoever turns away from the remembrance of the Almighty, We appoint a devil to be his associate.
21:50 And this is a blessed reminder which We have sent down. Will you be deniers of it?
7:2 A Book that has been sent down to you, so let there not be any burden in your chest from it, that you may warn with it; and a reminder to the believers.
38:1 S', and the Qur'an that contains the remembrance.
65:10 God has prepared for them a severe retribution. Therefore, you shall be aware of God, O you who possess intelligence and believed. God has sent down to you a remembrance.
38:8 "Has the remembrance been sent down to him, from between all of us!" Indeed, they are doubtful of My reminder. Indeed, they have not yet tasted My retribution.
57:16 Has not the time come for those who believed to open up their hearts for the remembrance of God, and the truth that is revealed herein? And they should not be like those who were given the Book before, and the waiting became long for them, so their hearts became hardened, and many of them were wicked.
63:9 O you who believe, do not be distracted by your money and your children from the remembrance of God. And those who do this, then they are the losers.
65:10 God has prepared for them a severe retribution. Therefore, you shall be aware of God, O you who possess intelligence and believed. God has sent down to you a remembrance.
39:23 God has sent down the best narrative, a Book that is similar, dual. The skins of those who are concerned towards their Lord shiver from it, then their skins and their hearts soften up to the remembrance of God. Such is the guidance of God; He guides with it whoever He wills. And for whoever God misguides, then none can guide him.
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Peace Ronin; thank you very much, well done.
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Salam all,
I may be misunderstanding, so I am asking to clarify.
From the Quran we see elements that seem to indicate a real, physical Salat: wudu (5:6), standing (2:238), sujud, and specific times (4:103, 17:78). So it does appear that the Quran is referring to an actual structured prayer practice.
At the same time, the Quran does not seem to prescribe any worldly punishment for someone who does not perform this ritual Salat.
So my question is simply this:
If ritual Salat is such a central obligation, why is there no explicit punishment mentioned in the Quran for abandoning it?
And what would be the position of a sincere believer who believes in God and the Quran, but whose interpretation leads him to conclude that the traditional five daily ritual prayers are not required?
Also, just to clarify your thinking (this might help you):
The Quran does criticize abandoning Salat, but it speaks about it more in moral / spiritual consequences, not legal punishment. For example:
19:59 – later generations lost the Salat and followed desires
74:42-43 – “What brought you to Hell? They say: we were not of those who prayed”
107:4-5 – woe to those who pray but are heedless of their prayer
So the Quran frames it as a sign of spiritual decline, not a crime with a fixed penalty like theft or murder.
Some would argue that the physical Salat was not transmitted through hadith literature but through the living Sunnah i.e. the continuous practice of the prophets and their communities. In other words, by the time of the Prophet, people already knew what Salat was and how it was performed, so the Quran did not need to detail its form (such as the number of rakas, etc.).
I am genuinely trying to understand how these perspectives are reconciled
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GOD has set up His system of reward and punishment as part of the test.
We are our own judge and jury by choosing and deciding what to follow.
"Kafa Binafsica Al yawma Alaika Hassiba" And "Waman Tazakka Fa Innama Yatazakka Linafsihi, Wa Man Dalla Fa Innama Yadillu Alaiha"
Salaat, Zakat,... are there for our own benefit to grow our soul- for/= "reward" or not bother and " loose /starve our soul"= Punishment.
Salaat was transmitted through Abraham,before the prophet , but people always corrupt some aspects of it- like dedicating it to GOD Alone- and follow other authorities for most of GOD s Deen.
The Salaat-Contact prayer- was passed down by learning the basics of it through seeing others do it.
If there is any corruption by any generations GOD s new message has been sent to correct the part added and confirming it through His words alone not by some other words of humans like sunnah or hadith or any other source.
I bet if the prophet was alive he will call out everything said on his behalf/or made up about him by disowning everything that opposes GOD s words.
He will clarify that GOD s Deen has only one source and one authority: GOD Alone.
GOD bless you all.
Peace. -
Continuing from my last post:
If Salat goes back to Abraham, then naturally the question is: how was that practice preserved? The most obvious answer is through continuous communal practice.Today if you go to mosques across the world Sunni, Shia, different cultures the core structure of the prayer is almost the same. That kind of consistency usually comes from a long-standing shared practice rather than something reconstructed later from texts.
That’s the sense in which I refer to the Sunnah of the prophets : the practice that people already knew and continued to perform.
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What I mean is how was Mohammed s name added into the Salaat when it existed way before him?
If anyone else is commemorated /mentioned with GOD in the Salaat, then it is not dedicated to GOD Alone!
Or is " Aquimi the Salaat " to remember/commemorate Me- GOD- alone?
So when did this change? With the wudu- Ablution-as well? ...etc
So things kept being changed by another authority ,since Qoran confirms these changes go against the instructions in it.
GOD bless you all.
Peace.
