MAN, DID U KNOW THIS!!! A 2000 YEAR OLD BATTERY WAS FOUND!
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So you're saying that God destroyed every single trace of Ancient Egyptian supercomputers, Babylonian electric devices, etc. along with every documentation of their existence (Ancient Egyptians and Babylonians write about themselves, you know) and spare their least sophisticated technology for archaeologists to find, so that they are deceived into thinking that the ancient peoples were less technologically advanced than us?
Along this line of face-saving argument, you have just called God a deceiver. Congrats. Then again, you do believe that God is an illusionist that plays tricks with our mind.
Khi- U actually quite misunderstood me. Comps, satellites, etc r not the only technology. Those ppl did NOT need those things, though they cld have had them as in the case of the battery, coz they were very skillful.
But we can make pyramids! Even with better material than those built by the fir'auns. I've shown you that casino owners in Las Vegas built pyramids.
Khi- I know we can make pyramid structures. Thts no big deal. One media store here in Germany is in the shape of a pyramid. Wht we cannot do is make them of the same material with the same internal structures n layout as the Egyptians did back then.
But they need slaves sweating under the sun pulling rocks while someone flogs them. Very sophisticated indeed.
Khi- Thts another pt altogether. Slaves might have been more efficient 4 them. This does not discredit the skill.
Strong enough? Skeletons of ancient Egyptians showed that malnutrition is common.
Khi- Again skeletons. I think most of the nonsense claimed by evolutionists is based on fossils. Based on fossils u can have anything u want. 2morrow someone will show some strong helathy fossils showing exacly the opposite. However both views wld not carry any weight.
Smart enough? What is the evidence?
Khi- The evidence is the deisgn.
You can believe anything you want, but do understand that the evidence for the history of technology says otherwise.
Khi- Says otherwise? U mean ppl nowadays r leading more healthy lives? Do u mean GOD did not care 4 those ppl back then coz they didnt have aspirine(which btw only removes pain n not the cause), anti biotica, intel pentium, telecom satellites, ultra sound, etc? If thts wht ur saying then uve been deeply misled by evolutinists coz thts exactly wht they claim n therefore they say tht there cant be any GOD n tht they r actually the ones who r improving in humans wht "GOD" failed 2 make right. Poor eye design in us humans is one such eg which evolutionists bring up. According 2 them the eyes of the octopus r much better. They miss the pt tht having our blood vessels infront of the retina is the last help 4 the eye against UV light 4 we live in the air which is a poor insulator 4 the UV. On the contrary the octopus live in the water n dont need them at the front.
Even now evolutionists briong up this claim of poor design n therefore zalk abt bottom up design n top down design. I ask u, do u support bottom up or top down design?Ignore the evidence at your own peril.
Khi- Fossils r not evidence 4 evolution. Period. GOD Bless!
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Khi- U actually quite misunderstood me. Comps, satellites, etc r not the only technology. Those ppl did NOT need those things, though they cld have had them as in the case of the battery, coz they were very skillful.
So you're saying these people are sophisticated, but they do not need to make sophisticated devices, and they only left low-tech items. Their writings do not show sophistication either... a lot of it are mythology and polytheism and worshipping kings, no science, no political theorizing, no elaborate lawmaking. What's the evidence that they are sophisticated then?
Khi- I know we can make pyramid structures. Thts no big deal. One media store here in Germany is in the shape of a pyramid. Wht we cannot do is make them of the same material with the same internal structures n layout as the Egyptians did back then.
Whats so special about the internal structures of the pyramids? Any building construction firm with sufficient funds and the design can build a new pyramid next to the old ones.
But they need slaves sweating under the sun pulling rocks while someone flogs them. Very sophisticated indeed.
Khi- Thts another pt altogether. Slaves might have been more efficient 4 them. This does not discredit the skill.
If they are so sophisticated, why do they even need slaves to pull heavy rocks? Can't they just build some machines or contraptions to lift those stones?
Strong enough? Skeletons of ancient Egyptians showed that malnutrition is common.
Khi- Again skeletons. I think most of the nonsense claimed by evolutionists is based on fossils. Based on fossils u can have anything u want. 2morrow someone will show some strong helathy fossils showing exacly the opposite. However both views wld not carry any weight.
You shy away from anything that has bones in it. People have been digging for the remains of ancient Egyptians for years and they showed that many commoners at that time suffer from malnutrition. Yet you prefer holding on to your thoughts without ever bothering to look at the evidence.
Smart enough? What is the evidence?
Khi- The evidence is the deisgn.
What makes you think the design showed that they are more sophisticated than us latecomers?
Khi- Says otherwise? U mean ppl nowadays r leading more healthy lives?
Well, given the recent breakthroughs in medical science, we've seen diseases eradicated, live expectancy raised, infant mortality dropped...
Besides, we know the history of technology. We know have computers, cars, airplanes. Past peoples only have the abacus and carts.
Do u mean GOD did not care 4 those ppl back then coz they didnt have aspirine(which btw only removes pain n not the cause), anti biotica, intel pentium, telecom satellites, ultra sound, etc? If thts wht ur saying then uve been deeply misled by evolutinists coz thts exactly wht they claim n therefore they say tht there cant be any GOD n tht they r actually the ones who r improving in humans wht "GOD" failed 2 make right.
Whether God cares about people back then is besides the point. The fact is, human life in the past is more harsh than it is today. A lot of kids die in childhood, people succumb to diseases and lived only to forty. They kill each other, enslave each other, destroying each other's achievements.
Poor eye design in us humans is one such eg which evolutionists bring up. According 2 them the eyes of the octopus r much better. They miss the pt tht having our blood vessels infront of the retina is the last help 4 the eye against UV light 4 we live in the air which is a poor insulator 4 the UV. On the contrary the octopus live in the water n dont need them at the front.
OOT. But I'll address this anyway. Fish also have blood vessels in front of the retina too. Don't they live in the water also?
Even now evolutionists briong up this claim of poor design n therefore zalk abt bottom up design n top down design. I ask u, do u support bottom up or top down design?
Describe what is bottom up or top down design.
Ignore the evidence at your own peril.
Khi- Fossils r not evidence 4 evolution. Period. GOD Bless!
We're not even talking evolution in this thread. You're now ignoring the bulk of evidence in archaeology. So that makes two huge blocks of evidence. What next? Geological evidence? Astronomical evidence?
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So you're saying these people are sophisticated, but they do not need to make sophisticated devices, and they only left low-tech items. Their writings do not show sophistication either... a lot of it are mythology and polytheism and worshipping kings, no science, no political theorizing, no elaborate lawmaking. What's the evidence that they are sophisticated then?
Khi- Ur only pting out the weak societies n not the strong powrful n skillful ones eg in Egypt n Rome. Those were very civilized. Mythology is still upto date n the theory of evolution is the greatest myth ever. It worships matter as god. Unbelievable!
Whats so special about the internal structures of the pyramids? Any building construction firm with sufficient funds and the design can build a new pyramid next to the old ones.
Khi- Then let us wait n see. They cant coz they dont have the technology using the same material ofcourse.
If they are so sophisticated, why do they even need slaves to pull heavy rocks? Can't they just build some machines or contraptions to lift those stones?
Khi- If u can get it the easy way y take the difficult one?
You shy away from anything that has bones in it. People have been digging for the remains of ancient Egyptians for years and they showed that many commoners at that time suffer from malnutrition. Yet you prefer holding on to your thoughts without ever bothering to look at the evidence.
Khi- If they suffered from malnutrition it was coz their masters treated them badly. Hitler treated ppl far worse than tht based on the theory of evolution. But then again maybe those egyptian masters believed in evolution too n therefore worshipped matter n material gods instead of the one true GOD.
What makes you think the design showed that they are more sophisticated than us latecomers?
Khi- Just look at the sophisticated structures n the labyrinths n even the substance they used 4 preserving bodies.
Well, given the recent breakthroughs in medical science, we've seen diseases eradicated, live expectancy raised, infant mortality dropped...
Khi- Yes n ill tell u y. After the industrial evolution abt 150 yrs ago it was we ppl who produced so much dirt n harmful chemicals which lead 2 such disasters. So now countering 4 a tiny part of our own destruction aint no big deal at all.
Besides, we know the history of technology. We know have computers, cars, airplanes. Past peoples only have the abacus and carts.
Khi- Ok but r these really beneficial on the long run or not? Plz think on tht. Having these we dont use our muscles anymore n hence many new disases arise. Then 2morrow some Jow is going 2 come up with some medicine countering tht disease n again voila evolutionists will proudly claim 'look we have fnd a cure'. Duh!
Whether God cares about people back then is besides the point. The fact is, human life in the past is more harsh than it is today. A lot of kids die in childhood, people succumb to diseases and lived only to forty. They kill each other, enslave each other, destroying each other's achievements.
Khi- This is no fact at all. Maybein the past 150 yrs after the ind evo, yes there i agree. Did u know pharaohs body was much longer than ours 2day. Ppl back then lived much longer.
OOT. But I'll address this anyway. Fish also have blood vessels in front of the retina too. Don't they live in the water also?
Khi- Tht wld have its reason n ill check on tht. Octopus cld be special creatures. However the pt is tht we humans having the blood vessels infront does not make us poorly designed. Did u know tht we have abt 150 million connections wired from our eyes 2 the brain in 1 sqr inch? Indeed the eye is an incredible design n no amount of evolutionist babble is going 2 change tht.
Describe what is bottom up or top down design.
Khi- Bottom up means from whtever material available n by chance. As evolutionists say 'Evolution never knows where it's going' copntrary 2 GOD Who has designed everything n calculated everything. Tht is top down design.
We're not even talking evolution in this thread. You're now ignoring the bulk of evidence in archaeology. So that makes two huge blocks of evidence. What next? Geological evidence? Astronomical evidence?
Khi- There is no evidence 4 evolution. If u still think there is some go ahead n collect ur US$ 250,000 prize. GOD Bless!
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Peace,
Certainly the previous people were far more advanced and sophisticated than we are today...You need only read the Scripture to see that Solomon had access to 'teleportation' (it was a human that moved Sheba's palace, not a Jinn)...Solomon also had access to the speech of birds and could control the winds. Infact, his very prayer was that he would have a kingdon never to be attained by anyone after him.
We also have evidence that Noah's time had communication devices (as evidenced by Noah speaking to his son who was somewhere else during waves as big as mountains)...Also, I would say that Noah could most possibly had dna samples of each pair of animals on Earth (hence requiring a ship less than the size of a zoo).
Lot's people were struck by objects which destroyed them and caused death to anyone who was looking at the projectile (some form of nuclear weapons?).
In conclusion, we are not all that we think we are...And we are certainly not the best or the most advanced
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Hello Layth,
Peace,
Certainly the previous people were far more advanced and sophisticated than we are today...You need only read the Scripture to see that Solomon had access to 'teleportation' (it was a human that moved Sheba's palace, not a Jinn)...Solomon also had access to the speech of birds and could control the winds. Infact, his very prayer was that he would have a kingdon never to be attained by anyone after him.
We also have evidence that Noah's time had communication devices (as evidenced by Noah speaking to his son who was somewhere else during waves as big as mountains)...Also, I would say that Noah could most possibly had dna samples of each pair of animals on Earth (hence requiring a ship less than the size of a zoo).
Lot's people were struck by objects which destroyed them and caused death to anyone who was looking at the projectile (some form of nuclear weapons?).
In conclusion, we are not all that we think we are...And we are certainly not the best or the most advanced
I am not sure if you are serious about the things you said above. As far as I know this view is not borne out by historical records...therefore these kind of stories should be looked as symbolic or metaphoric perhaps...
Regards,
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Peace,
Certainly the previous people were far more advanced and sophisticated than we are today...You need only read the Scripture to see that Solomon had access to 'teleportation' (it was a human that moved Sheba's palace, not a Jinn)...Solomon also had access to the speech of birds and could control the winds. Infact, his very prayer was that he would have a kingdon never to be attained by anyone after him.
We also have evidence that Noah's time had communication devices (as evidenced by Noah speaking to his son who was somewhere else during waves as big as mountains)...Also, I would say that Noah could most possibly had dna samples of each pair of animals on Earth (hence requiring a ship less than the size of a zoo).
Lot's people were struck by objects which destroyed them and caused death to anyone who was looking at the projectile (some form of nuclear weapons?).
In conclusion, we are not all that we think we are...And we are certainly not the best or the most advanced
Khi- Salam. Ur pts r remarkably interesting n i must admit i never looked at the Quranic incidences in tht way be4. N ur understanding of the teleport part i think now makes my understanding of these verses clear
One afrit from the jinns said, "I can bring it to you before you stand up. I am powerful enough to do this."
Here we see tht a Jinn(demon) wanted 2 do the job n most Quranic "scholars" n even myself understood tht a jinn was the one but i was always confused regarding the next verse
The one who possessed knowledge from the book said, "I can bring it to you in the blink of your eye." When he saw it settled in front of him, he said, "This is a blessing from my Lord, whereby He tests me, to show whether I am appreciative or unappreciative. Whoever is appreciative is appreciative for his own good, and if one turns unappreciative, then my Lord is in no need for him, Most Honorable."
Now here we see tht GOD doesnt talk abt any Jinn but ONE WHO HAS KNOWLEDGE OF THE SCRIPTURE. This always made me thing tht who cld be more powrful than a jinn. The logical answr wld be a scientist who has advanced technology n now i see bro LAyth making tht claim. Can this be a coincidence? GOD Bless! -
So you're saying these people are sophisticated, but they do not need to make sophisticated devices, and they only left low-tech items. Their writings do not show sophistication either... a lot of it are mythology and polytheism and worshipping kings, no science, no political theorizing, no elaborate lawmaking. What's the evidence that they are sophisticated then?
Khi- Ur only pting out the weak societies n not the strong powrful n skillful ones eg in Egypt n Rome. Those were very civilized. Mythology is still upto date n the theory of evolution is the greatest myth ever. It worships matter as god. Unbelievable!
Still, I consider ancient Egypt and Rome more technologically backward than us. I told you to go to your local archaeological museum. Could you find any sophisticated technology among the remains of Roman and Ancient Egyptian civilizations? Any cell phones? Computers? Internal combustion engines?
Very civilized? Ancient Egypt? As in worshipping kings and holy animals and building monuments using slaves?
Very civilized? Rome? As in staging gladiator shows putting man against man, man against beast? Also slavery?
If that is your perception of civilized then I prefer this uncivilized century.
And why, if people are supposed to be more sophisticated in the past, not every ancient human society attain the level of Ancient Egypt, Greece, and Rome? Ancient South East Asians, ancient Australians, ancient Germans and Britons, ancient Africans, none show a level of civilization equal to Egypt or Rome.
Khi- Then let us wait n see. They cant coz they dont have the technology using the same material ofcourse.
I don't see anything special about the material (rocks) or technology (slavery). Therefore I can't see why a modern building construction firm cannot build an exact copy of the pyramids. You're just saying they can't because if they can it will disprove your pet theory.
If they are so sophisticated, why do they even need slaves to pull heavy rocks? Can't they just build some machines or contraptions to lift those stones?
Khi- If u can get it the easy way y take the difficult one?
Sure they can. But the fact that they used slaves do not show anything about sophistication.
Khi- If they suffered from malnutrition it was coz their masters treated them badly. Hitler treated ppl far worse than tht based on the theory of evolution. But then again maybe those egyptian masters believed in evolution too n therefore worshipped matter n material gods instead of the one true GOD.
You are obsessed with evolution, aren't you? Study some history and you will see that Ancient Egyptians have no idea about evolution. They think that the world is created by their gods.
Egyptian creation myths
http//members.aol.com/egyptart/crea.htmlKhi- Just look at the sophisticated structures n the labyrinths n even the substance they used 4 preserving bodies.
Nothing special that can't be replicated today.
Khi- Ok but r these really beneficial on the long run or not? Plz think on tht. Having these we dont use our muscles anymore n hence many new disases arise. Then 2morrow some Jow is going 2 come up with some medicine countering tht disease n again voila evolutionists will proudly claim 'look we have fnd a cure'. Duh!
Whether these will be beneficial in the long run does not matter. The point is the new technologies I mentioned--cars, airplanes, etc. enable humans to travel greater distances than before, in shorter time. If you want to visit me here using your muscles, fine, I'll see you in maybe a week or two, provided you are able to walk all the way across Germany and Holland and then swim across the Channel. You know, you can cut the time of travel and see me today by using the Eurostar. Or by flying in a plane.
What's wrong with people discovering new diseases and medicines? Now you're not just an anti-evolutionist, but anti-technology and anti-science? I pity you, Khizar.
Whether God cares about people back then is besides the point. The fact is, human life in the past is more harsh than it is today. A lot of kids die in childhood, people succumb to diseases and lived only to forty. They kill each other, enslave each other, destroying each other's achievements.
Khi- This is no fact at all. Maybein the past 150 yrs after the ind evo, yes there i agree. Did u know pharaohs body was much longer than ours 2day. Ppl back then lived much longer.
No fact?
Average life expectancy in Ancient Egypt 40 years
A third of newborns die
Half the children die before their fifth birthday
Women frequently die in childbirth
http//nefertiti.iwebland.com/people/Average life expectancy in Roman Empire 46 years for men, 34 years for women
http//www.crystalinks.com/romanempire4.htmlI've just been to the British museum last week, there are Egyptian mummies and sarcophagi there. The mummies are not taller than me (My height is around 170cm), and even smaller from the average local. So you are wrong in saying the fir'aun is taller than us. Unless you're very vertically challenged, that is.
People back then live longer than us? If we die before 40, maybe they did. Then again, many people nowadays survive until 90 or 100. The sources I quoted indicated that Ancient Egyptians and Romans, the most civilized people of their time, on average expired after 40 years. Maybe life expectancy will be lower for my ancestors, ancient South East Asians, or the barbarian ancestors of Britons and Germans.
We're not even talking evolution in this thread. You're now ignoring the bulk of evidence in archaeology. So that makes two huge blocks of evidence. What next? Geological evidence? Astronomical evidence?
Khi- There is no evidence 4 evolution. If u still think there is some go ahead n collect ur US$ 250,000 prize. GOD Bless!
Again, we are talking archaeology here. Stick to it. Talk about evolution in other threads.
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Salam,
Ok ill check on the life expectancy in Egypt. But i can say 4 sure tht ppl lived much longer in preflood coditions. Plz visit
http//www.creationscience.com/onlinebook/FAQ312.html#wp1609808
GOD Bless!Read it...
Sources are Genesis. Oops, not credible.
'Pre-flood'?
Really, Khizar, have you become a Xtian or something?
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Well, let me disabuse you by saying that most Muslims, traditionalists, liberals think the flood is local. But we can start another thread on this if you want. Keep this one on topic.
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Well, let me disabuse you by saying that most Muslims, traditionalists, liberals think the flood is local. But we can start another thread on this if you want. Keep this one on topic.
Khi- Salam. I know tht but u shld know tht im not a traditionilists n do not care wht they say. I try 2 understand the Quran in my own logical n reasonable way n im ready 2 consult other Quran Alone bros also on different issues. Now from wht ive heard in Dr. Kent's debates i think it makes more sense 2 take the flood as a global n nt a local one. However Im yet open 2 tht. GOD Bless!
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Khi- Salam. I know tht but u shld know tht im not a traditionilists n do not care wht they say. I try 2 understand the Quran in my own logical n reasonable way n im ready 2 consult other Quran Alone bros also on different issues. Now from wht ive heard in Dr. Kent's debates i think it makes more sense 2 take the flood as a global n nt a local one. However Im yet open 2 tht. GOD Bless!
Well, your source is Dr. Dino again... ( Are you sure you are not just following his evangelical Xtian beliefs?
Again, from a geological point of view, there is no evidence that the Earth has experienced a global flood some time in the past. There are many evidence of local floods, including one that happened in the Black Sea region during ancient times which might be the flood that drowned Prophet Nuh's people (or not). Besides, the prophet Nuh was not sent to all humanity, just for his people, just like other prophets mentioned after him, Hud and Saleh. So the plausible interpretation of 'the flood' IMO is that it was local.
Do you want to continue this flood discussion? Open a new thread. Keep this one for ancient peoples and archaeology.
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Salam Andya,
I suggest u give Dr. Kent a phone call on the no i posted on the forum. Then u can ask him aynthing u want n hell answer u. Then u can come back on the forum n inform me wht u considr wrong in his arguments. GOD Bless!Most of his arguments are already destroyed anyway. Here
http//talkorigins.org/indexcc/index.html
But if you can actually contact him, tell me I want his money, and I will challenge him on an internet debate for it.
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Khi- Y dont u call him urself? R u afraid? GOD Bless!
It's not worth my time, considering that the page I quoted debunks pretty much every argument he has. Besides, the burden of proof is not on my side, because I'm not the one who dragged Kent Hovind's argument here.
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I am sure that Sameritan who made thegolden calf that made sound also knew how to make a battery and what could be called a "speaker"...i mean gold is a conductor right?
