Bad is from Allah or from ourselves ?

mmkhan

Salaamun alaikum brother mmkhan,

Wa Salaamun Alaik brother Tanveer,

Sorry for the very late reply.

They do so much bad that if Allah puts upon them for bad what they have done, they may not bear it. Or all the time Allah has bring them something bad as they always do so. So, the mercy of Allah is that He never brings them bad. But decides the time and date.

I did not understand what you meant here. Can you please explain and clarify it again. The underlined portion of your statement seems to imply that bad is not from Allah. However the ayat clearly says "kullun min 3aindi Allahi" and "kullun" includes bad.

Let me explain you brother what I understand.

For example A student wrote wrong answers in his exam and teacher failed him. Even though teacher got the option for his student to make him pass or fail, he honestly corrected the paper and fails the student. Is this the mistake of that teacher, even when he made him fail?

No way! We cannot say that because of that teacher or his correction, the student fail. But we should say that because of the student's knowledge, he got failed.

In such way we cannot blame Allah. It is true that everything (kullun) is from Allah, indeed only from Allah, but it happened only because of the mistake of one who do wrong.

IMO 478 and 479 have been mistranslated by the traditional translators, who do not translate "min 3aindi Allahi" in 478 properly. They translate it as "from Allah" whereas IMO it should be translated as "according to/because of presence/will of Allah" (because if it was "from Allah" the Arabic should be "min Allahi" and not "min 3aindi Allahi"). In 479 they translate "famin nafsika" as "from yourself" whereas IMO it should be "from your soul/ego".

I agree with you on this part that traditional translators had translated it wrong or they have not translated properly 'min 'aindi Allahi'.

Regards,

MMKhan

nur

Salam everybody,

Brother mmkhan I agree completely with you. Everything is from Allah but what we consider bad is because of ourselves. If we fail an exam we can consider it bad, get angry with the teacher or leave the school. WE will wrong ourselves.
But if we think the teacher did as he had to do, we can accept that, study harder and try to pass next time. We will consider this situation a good one and this will be closer to God.

Because it depends on which eyes will u use to see. You will understand that everything has a positive angle that Allah has given you from His Mercy. So everything comes from Allah, what you consider good is from Him and what you consider bad is because you think it is.

That's my understanding of these verses.

Salam all,

nur

unknownuser

Peace be upon you Nur,

Well said, everything that happens to us helps shape us to be vessels that the God can manifest through. It is only when we think we are seperate from the WHOLE that things are "against us" and that is from ourselves, incorrect beliefs and ideas. When we think and act WHOLISTICALLY, everything fits together in one big picture as continual lessons form the God guiding us, which is good.

FreedomStands

Explained prolifically here

http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9607626.msg371292#new

huruf

Salam everybody,

Brother mmkhan I agree completely with you. Everything is from Allah but what we consider bad is because of ourselves. If we fail an exam we can consider it bad, get angry with the teacher or leave the school. WE will wrong ourselves.
But if we think the teacher did as he had to do, we can accept that, study harder and try to pass next time. We will consider this situation a good one and this will be closer to God.

Because it depends on which eyes will u use to see. You will understand that everything has a positive angle that Allah has given you from His Mercy. So everything comes from Allah, what you consider good is from Him and what you consider bad is because you think it is.

That's my understanding of these verses.

Salam all,

nur

That, about failing an exam is an easy one. Whay anouy murdering someone. Does that help to shape us, to commit a murder?

The whole question of bad and good, or eveil and goodness is nothing to do with God because those are concepts just for people, for us. Muerder is bad for us, whether it comes fro God or from ourselves, that is the question. Of course it comes from God, via Iblees, via us. It is bad for us because it conplicates our way back to God. That is it. Failing an exam may ease our way back to God, it depends on how we react, and also with murder it could be so.

Salaam

FreedomStands

That, about failing an exam is an easy one. Whay anouy murdering someone. Does that help to shape us, to commit a murder?

The whole question of bad and good, or eveil and goodness is nothing to do with God because those are concepts just for people, for us. Muerder is bad for us, whether it comes fro God or from ourselves, that is the question. Of course it comes from God, via Iblees, via us. It is bad for us because it conplicates our way back to God. That is it. Failing an exam may ease our way back to God, it depends on how we react, and also with murder it could be so.

Salaam

When you mention murder helping shape, I thought of the story of Musa.

Not to say anyone should go fighting and killing, but in retrospect, every moment of experience seems to manifest what Allah is "shaping" just as you were shaped in the womb.

clashncruz

This is a question which I have noted every time I read through the Qur'an. I have also found it extremely interesting that only 4 verses later Allah states,

"Then do they not reflect upon the Qur'an? If it had been from other than Allah , they would have found within it much contradiction." (482)

(482)

This is so close in position to these two other verses, that seem at first glance to be contradictory, that I cannot help but posit that this is a challenge of sorts from Allah. After examining the two verses in question (78 & 79), I immediately hit on the same aspect that many others have mentioned here. The difference between "kullun minAAindi Allahi " in 78 and "Ma asabaka min hasanatinfamina Allahi wama asabaka min sayyi-atinfamin nafsika " is clearly in the condition of nafs. The nafs being created by Allah encompasses the "kullun" and the evil actions we decide to take of our own accord encompasses the "sayyi-atinfamin nafsika"; thus both aspects are recognized and explained.

Again, I draw our attention to the verses surrounding 78- 79. This exchange begins at 4 71 and only ends at 485. It is very important to put these verses in context for a more complete understanding. The full passage states (The Qur'an A Monotheist Translation)

471 "O you who believe, take your precaution by going out in clusters, or going out all together.
472 And from among you are those who would slow behind, so that if disaster befalls you he would say ?God has blessed me that I was not a martyr with them!?
473 And if grace from God benefits you, he will speak as if there had not been affection between you and him ?Oh, I wish I had been with them so I would have triumphed a great triumph.?
474 Let those who seek to purchase the Hereafter rather than this world fight in the cause of God. And whoever fights in the cause of God and is killed or attains victory, then We will grant him a great recompense.
475 And why do you not fight in the cause of God, when the oppressed among the men and women and children say ?Our Lord, bring us out of this town whose people are wicked, and grant us from Yourself a supporter, and grant us from Yourself a victor!?
476 Those who believe fight in the cause of God, while those who reject fight in the cause of evil; so fight the supporters of the devil, for the planning of the devil is weak.
Did you not see those who were told ?Cease your aggression, and hold the contact prayer, and contribute towards purification.? But when fighting was decreed for them, a group of them were concerned towards the people as they would have been concerned
towards God or even more so. And they said ?Our Lord, why did You decree fighting for us? If only You would delay for us until another time.? Say ?The enjoyment of this world is little, and the Hereafter is far better for those who are aware; you will not be wronged in the least.?
478 Wherever you may be, death will find you, even if you are in fortified towers. If any good befalls them, they say ?This is from God,? and if any evil befalls them, they say ?This is from you!? Say ?All is from God;? what is wrong with these people, they barely understand any narrative!
479 Any good that befalls you is from God, and any evil that befalls you is from your nafs. We have sent you as a messenger to the people and God is enough as a witness.
480 Whoever obeys the messenger has obeyed God; and whoever turns away, We have not sent you as a guardian over them. And they say ?Obedience? but when they come out from being with you a group of them prepares for other that what you have
said, and God records what they planned. So turn away from them and put your trust in God. God is enough for your trust.
482 Do they not reflect on the Qur?an? If it was from any other than God they would have found in it many a discrepancy.
483 And if any matter regarding security, or fear, comes to them they make it publicly known, but if they had referred it to the messenger and to those entrusted from them then it would have been known by those who studied it from them. And had it not
been for the grace of God upon you and His mercy, you would have followed the devil, except for a few.
484 So fight in the cause of God; you are not responsible except for yourself. And enjoin the believers ?Perhaps God will put a stop to the might of those who disbelieved.? And God is far Mightier and far more Punishing.
485 Whoever intercedes with a good intercession, he will have a reward of it; and whoever intercedes with an evil intercession, he will receive a share of it. And God has control over all things.

Clearly these verses are not just simply speaking about good and evil; they are speaking of good and evil specifically in the context of oppression, self-defense, fighting, and ultimately war; a reality all humans in all ages have had to face at one time or another. What does God explain to the Believers?

When the Believers are under threat of violence, go out in groups or all together (to protect against violence and intimidation) Think of the current situation in Burma with the terrible violent persecution of the Rohingya Muslims. (If you don't know about this please look it up).
There are among the Believers those who would shy away from supporting their fellows in this way (going out in groups or all together), and they would then ascertain the fact that they have not died with others who, presumably went out "in groups" and were physically harmed to the point of death for doing so, to the fact that they did not go.
This same person then tries to act like they are with the people who went out "in groups", when those groups are successful. This is a classic social phenomena where individuals want to be with the winners, and as soon as a win becomes eminent, many people simply join the winning side. This is a person with little conviction in what they believe of course.
Those that want Heaven instead of this world should "fight in the cause of God", and whether you suffer defeat or gain victory you will gain a "great recompense". What is the cause of God? God explains this to us in the next verse.
Fighting in the cause of God is a supporter and victor that defends the oppressed men, women, and children. There are oppressed men and women in every age, and more than enough in modern times to warrant the support of all good people. This comes in the form of boycotts, protests, alternative news, self-defense in areas of violent attack, and all those who fight the corrupt system and the individuals that comprise it. God asks "why would you not fight for them (the oppressed)?"
Believers fight for these causes. Non-believers fight in the cause of evil (ie. criminal governments, exploitative corporations, nature destroying industries, corrupt organizations, secret societies, etc.) Believers should fight these people as they are agents of Satan and their plans are weak. Look up the Bohemian Grove, Bilderberg Group, Trilateral Commission, Council on Foreign Relations, etc. if you do not know about who the global elite are. They are Moloch devil worshipers that sacrifice children through fire (As explicitly explained in Deuteronomy and Leviticus).
People are naturally recalcitrant about fighting, and many, especially in modern times and modern protest movements, are completely against self-defense of any sort. They ask "Why would God decree such a thing?" God tells us that this world has little enjoyment and the next is much better, and that you will not be wronged. In other words, don't be afraid of fighting the criminal elite of the world even though they have enormous power in this age, "you will not be wronged"
God then continues that no matter what you are going to die, this is guaranteed, even if you are in "fortified towers" to protect yourself; as many of the global elite are currently. ), so you may as well do the right thing. These same people, the believers who have not gone out to fight in the cause of God, then claim that the good that comes to them is from God and the bad is from you (possibly meaning Mohammad, or you yourself as an individual who is fighting in the cause of God and perhaps having this conversation with someone trying to explain these points). I have seen this in many activist circles, as soon as their is a setback, people turn on each other rather than realizing their collective errors. Additionally, this verse explains the lack of understanding that these people have, that all things are decreed by the Will of God, thus you must accept defeats as you accept victories; in humility and with an open-mind to learn more.
Good comes from God, and evil comes from your nafs, though God created your nafs, so all truly does come from God ultimately, though he has given us the esteemed distinction of freewill and the ability to choose what of God's destiny we decide to partake in; the good or the evil. I explained this at the top. Mohammad is a messenger, and God is a witness.
Mohammad is to be obeyed in the message he is delivering (Al-Qur'an) though he is not sent as guardian (or enforcer) over others. People must submit to Islam themselves, they cannot be forced to submit.
Some individuals are unfaithful or deceitful within the group and they plan other than what the messenger has decreed. Don't listen to them, and trust God. I have seen this also in many activist groups, where people are there not to help, but to cause strife. This is actually a tactic of the people that fight in the way of evil. It is called bad-jacketing, look it up, as it was a common COINTELPRO strategy used against the activists of the 50's, 60's and 70's in the United States. Now it is in widespread implementation across the world (think of ISIS).
Asking us to reflect on the Qur'an, particularly that there is no contradiction. In other words, think hard about verses 78-79 as it is a parable God has placed for us to understand our own nafs better.
These same individuals, those who don't go out in groups, or defend the oppressed, or fight in the way of God, often spread messages of fear amidst the community instead of referring it to the messenger or people of authority. Meaning, people simply spread rumors instead of understanding what is really happening, they don't refer to authorities (trustworthy, non-corrupted authorities), and thus cause dissension, wars, and strife in the community.

For example, many people believe the US government's official version of 9/11 even though the best authorities, non-compromised architects, engineers, pilots, defense analysts, and political and special operations analysts have concluded that the US government's story is full of more holes than Swiss cheese. Most agree that the attack was carried out by a collusion of Western intelligence agencies with Israeli and Saudi intelligence agencies. If you do not know about this information please look it up. Additionally, if it were not for the grace of God we would not have this information, and many more would have been lead astray by the lies of the US government and its paid news agencies.

Thus, by believing those who spread fear and worries of security the West has engaged in two outright wars killing millions, the wholesale rape of personal security of its citizens, and the initiation of decades, possibly centuries, of retaliatory bloodshed. What evil these lies have wrought!
14. Conclusion fight in the way of God (explained above), "you are not responsible except for yourself. Perhaps God will put a stop to the might of those who disbelieved". Maybe if we all fight dedicated enough for the good causes on this planet, (ending world hunger, fighting poverty, increasing education, punishing corruption, protecting nature and human life, etc. ) then maybe God will decrease the power of the global psychopathic elite who are hell-bent on global depopulation and planetary domination. If you do not know about this please watch the documentary EndGame by Alex Jones.
15. Finally we are reminded that any thing good we participate in we will have our share of its reward, and anything evil we participate in we will have our share of its punishment. "And God has control over all things". Again, "kulli shay-in", every thing; referring back to the question of whether this all comes from God or not, clearly stating that it does.

Here, I would remind ourselves of what is stated in chapter 67 verse 2 "The One who has created death and life, that He may test you,which of you will do better works? He is the Exalted in Might, the Forgiving."

Thus, life and death are only here to test us, you are guaranteed to die, why not fight for the cause of God by doing better works than others, and defending the oppressed?

As with most sections of the Qur'an I see God speaking of social-justice here first and foremost, and because within the topic of social-justice the question is often asked Why would God allow these evil people to rule us? The answer is so you can gain good works by defending the oppressed and attempting to defeat the evil around you.

This is only my humble, politically-biased, and fallible opinion. If you see any error in my reasoning, please bring it to my attention.

And God knows best!

Salaam,

Your Brother in Faith

FreedomStands

http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9607600.0