Migration - The 'KEY' To A GOD Alone Society???
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Salaam Wakas,
Do you take al-kitab to mean the same thing in both of the above referenced signs? And is this meaning al-quran?
Yeah man, I do. There's an 'al' there in 'al-kitaab' so yes, i take it to mean the same thing. And no, al-kitaab is NOT al-quraan. Al-quraan is the detailling of al-kitaab. Al-kitaab is the operating system, al-quraan is the manual. All nabiyeen brought al-kitaab but not al-quraan.
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peace mq,
I think you may have misunderstood me. Your point that al-hikmah has its "textual expression" in al-quran is one I agree with. Its in there.
What I'm saying is, I see hikmah as something deeper than the literal text. hikmah can be gained from the literal text but is more than the literal text. The meanings behind a story for example, and these meanings lead to adopting a certain mindset/character, or if you will 'hikmah / good judgement / wisdom'.Wakas
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Peace Wakas,
What I'm saying is, I see hikmah as something deeper than the literal text. hikmah can be gained from the literal text but is more than the literal text. The meanings behind a story for example, and these meanings lead to adopting a certain mindset/character, or if you will 'hikmah / good judgement / wisdom'.
I can't agree because al-kitaab is in detail (6/114) and obviously finds its detailed expression in al-quraan (since al-quran is tafseelul kitaab). Since al-kitaab is al-hikmaah, al-hikmaah must be fully detailed in al-quraan. 17/39 shows examples of al-hikmah.
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peace mq,
Firstly, I do not agree 'mufassalan' means detailed (see 7133). It means to clarify/distinguish, to make distinct.
But I'm not sure if this alters our discussion, because if I have understood you correctly, you are saying al-hikmah can only be extracted from the literal/actual text of al-quran. al-hikmah is nothing more than this.
This is where we disagree, I see al-hikmah in al-quran as a Gestalt concept, i.e. "the sum is greater than its parts". A tool that can be used for all situations, not just those explicitly mentioned in al-quran.For example, the story of Abraham (676-79) when he rejected a star/planet, moon and sun as his Lord. This is not just a story for those in the exact same situation as him, it is deeper, and potentially applicable to many situations (I'm sure you'll agree with that). That is what I mean.
Wakas
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Salaamun alaikum Wakas,
Firstly, I do not agree 'mufassalan' means detailed (see 7133). It means to clarify/distinguish, to make distinct
I disagree. 'Mubiin' means clarified or distinct.
But I'm not sure if this alters our discussion, because if I have understood you correctly, you are saying al-hikmah can only be extracted from the literal/actual text of al-quran. al-hikmah is nothing more than this.
This is where we disagree, I see al-hikmah in al-quran as a Gestalt concept, i.e. "the sum is greater than its parts". A tool that can be used for all situations, not just those explicitly mentioned in al-quran.Al-hikmah refers to the principles, Wakas. The principles are applicable in all situations but you cannot find anything which isn't already mentioned by al-quraan by way of principles.
For example, the story of Abraham (676-79) when he rejected a star/planet, moon and sun as his Lord. This is not just a story for those in the exact same situation as him, it is deeper, and potentially applicable to many situations (I'm sure you'll agree with that). That is what I mean.
Oh yes, but the sun, moon and planets are a constant archetypal symbolism. They must figure into the extrapolation into our realities.
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peace mq,
'mubiin' does not mean 'clarified' or 'distinct' (although stictly I said 'to make distinct').
mubiin means open/plain/clear/evident/manifest. This can be seen from its ~90 occurrences.
Al-hikmah refers to the principles, Wakas. The principles are applicable in all situations but you cannot find anything which isn't already mentioned by al-quraan by way of principles.
At the end of the day, what we are both saying boils down to the same approach.
Wakas
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Salaamun alaikum Wakas,
'mubiin' does not mean 'clarified' or 'distinct' (although stictly I said 'to make distinct').
mubiin means open/plain/clear/evident/manifest. This can be seen from its ~90 occurrences.
The problem with this exchange is, we're talking PAST one another ). Let me actually build the conceptual map of both. That way we can clearly see.
