What is the meaning of God alone Qur'an alone?

Omeiza

Eating food through the mouth is not explicitely stated in the Qur'an and it is good. There is no problem for me to read a book that talks about the proper way to use my mouth for eating...
Does anyone need a book to tell them to eat food "through their mouth"? No, seriously, I'm not just talking about eating.

Is it not true that a statement as simple as "Allah is one" might need extra explanation?
Does it? shock

While I do not rely on the collections known as al-Hadith, nonetheless, nothing will prevent me from accepting what is true regardless of where it is found and who has said it.
Good for you

If I read a book of science and it reinforces my understanding of a concept in the Qur'an, can't I say that the book of science has explained the concept?
What happens when the book of science claimed it made a mistake and changes it's position? Will you then revert or convert?

Allah could not have commanded a person who is not even aware of HIs existence.
7172 And your Lord took for the children of Adam from their backs, their progeny; and He made them witness over themselves ?Am I not your Lord?? They said ?Yes, we bear witness.? Thus you cannot say on the Day of Resurrection that you were unaware of this.
7173. Nor can you Say ?It was our fathers who set up partners before and we were simply a progeny who came after them. Would You destroy us for what the innovators did??

Peace

Peace zenje

If you will care to read the post you are replying to careful, you will notice that you have quoted me out of context.

I was only trying to bring out some issues for thought.

Is Allah one like I am one? Does this not warrant an explanation.

zenje! we constantly grow and replaces wrong ideas with the right ones. Meanwhile we hold onto what we know until we get what is more convincing.

mquran

Eating food through the mouth is not explicitely stated in the Qur'an and it is good. There is no problem for me to read a book that talks about the proper way to use my mouth for eating or that tells me about maintaining the mouth. I will consider such a book to be an explanation for the instruction to eat and to be clean.

How do you know that this instruction book on eating is correct ?

What is your criteria?

If you didn't have this instruction book, would you be eating through another orifice?

Somebody has said "I will accept a hadith that makes sense and it is in conformity with the Qur'an"

In reply, this person was told "If what is said in that hadith is in conformity to what is contained in the Qur'an then we do not need it as we already have it in the Qur'an. If it is against the Qur'an the case is even clearer

Sorry Im missing your point? Please explain your point?

Assuming I came across a hadith that says "The word of wisdom is the lost property of a Mumin, he takes it anywhere that it is found" What will be wrong for me to accept this statement even if it is from Iblis? Now, is there an explicit statement like this in the Qur'an?

Yes, it would be wrong because if the statement is true, why didn't Allah mention it? Was Allah constrained by his publishers or something?

Are we saying that during the life time of the prophet, he answered all questions and responded to people in all aspects of his life by just quoting the explicit statements of the Qur'an? Didn't he make some clarifications for those who needed it? Why are we here today making clarifications yet the Qur'an is there?

Whatever he explained that isn't in al-quraan isn't essential to us and even to say its beneficial is questionable.

The reason why we're seeking clarifications is because of the so-called clarifications and explanations which you're asking about. All those obfuscations has given us a gargantuan task in understanding al-quraan.

Is it not true that a statement as simple as "Allah is one" might need extra explanation?

It might, but I think you need to look at al-quraan more because the entire book hovers around that theme. So if you think al-quraan lacks explanation there, you clearly have done your reading.

While I do not rely on the collections known as al-Hadith, nonetheless, nothing will prevent me from accepting what is true regardless of where it is found and who has said it.

Good for you! How do you determine what is true ? What's your criteria?

If I read a book of science and it reinforces my understanding of a concept in the Qur'an, can't I say that the book of science has explained the concept?

Sorry , you said 'explain' , not 'reinforce' . They are not the same thing. Do you mean 'explain' or 'reinforce' ?

It makes no sense to say that Allah commands us to accept that He is one - Allah could only have appealed to our sense of reasoning to acknowledge that He is one.

The saying "There is no compulsion in the religion" is a statement of fact. Awareness is not by command but by explanation and reasoning.

In terms of belief, Allah appeals to our sense of reasoning but in legislation, He commands.

The command to submit to Allah completely without associating partner with Him is meant only for those who already believe that there is Allah. Allah could not have commanded a person who is not even aware of HIs existence.

A 'command' is a statement ordering you to do something. In Arabic, it's called 'feel amr'. All rusul went to thier people and said

Serve Allah. There is no god but he.

This is a command.

I don't know where you get your information from, but I would really appreciate if you show me some evidence.

mquran

mquran, did you really have to post it twice? caughsblwhrd

A blowhard is a person who (accidentally) posts something twice?Interesting.

just kidding bro

but most don't understand...

Kid away. That's all you're good for anyway ...jk, bro

unknownuser

salam mquran,
no, not intersting at all... it's actually too bad.. too sad... perhaps a 'blowhard' is just someone who can't laugh at themselves..

Is this word an American Slang? Never heard of it before!

But you are right its hard to take seriously people who take themselves so seriously -) wink

These serious people they just HUFF AND PUFF and TRY TO BLOW YOUR HOUSE DOWN... wink

Regards,

mquran

no, not intersting at all... it's actually too bad.. too sad... perhaps a 'blowhard' is just someone who can't laugh at themselves..

Really? Where did you study english? Next you'll be telling us that posting meaningless statement is defined as 'intelligent'.

as said... but most don't understand...

or in my case, cant be bothered.

mquran

LT Is this word an American Slang? Never heard of it before!

But you are right its hard to take seriously people who take themselves so seriously

These serious people they just HUFF AND PUFF and TRY TO BLOW YOUR HOUSE DOWN...

2 questions

What does it mean to be 'not serious enough' or 'too serious' ?
Why does your standard of seriousness apply here? You have a playground in the off-topic section. Do you need the entire forum for your horseplay and mockery?

unknownuser

Why does your standard of seriousness apply here? You have a playground in the off-topic section. Do you need the entire forum for your horseplay and mockery?

No horseplay or mockery meant. In fact I don't have a horse -)

I was responding the image of man blowing himself up. I found it very funny.... -)

Regards,

unknownuser

Hi all,

My fear however is that this reaction is not so overstretched as to reject anything good that can be found elsewhere.

What can we possibly reject that's not found in al-quraan? I read voraciously but the only thing my extra-quranic reading does is to stimulate questions. Marxism for example stimulated some powerful questions such as distribution of wealth etc. However , Al-quraan is the one which answered that question.

Eating food through the mouth is not explicitely stated in the Qur'an and it is good. There is no problem for me to read a book that talks about the proper way to use my mouth for eating or that tells me about maintaining the mouth. I will consider such a book to be an explanation for the instruction to eat and to be clean.

I would agree with omeiza. Some in the forum do claim anything not mentioned in the Quran is nonsense and false and vain talk. I wouldnt agree on that. Quran is God's direct message/guidance to mankind. But all other forms of goodness, knowledge, wisdom outside Quran is from Allah too. If Quran doesnt mention meditation is good, drinking 8 glasses of water a day is good, it doesnt make all these acts sinful. We need to use logic, reasoning and sense to understand reality and truth. We cant blindly refute anything not mentioned in the Quran as false.

Somebody has said "I will accept a hadith that makes sense and it is in conformity with the Qur'an"
In reply, this person was told "If what is said in that hadith is in conformity to what is contained in the Qur'an then we do not need it as we already have it in the Qur'an. If it is against the Qur'an the case is even clearer"
Assuming I came across a hadith that says "The word of wisdom is the lost property of a Mumin, he takes it anywhere that it is found" What will be wrong for me to accept this statement even if it is from Iblis? Now, is there an explicit statement like this in the Qur'an?

Yes, Wisdom and goodness from any source(Hadith or elsewhere) is from Allah. And Allah asks us to strive for wisdom and knowledge.

Is it not true that a statement as simple as "Allah is one" might need extra explanation?

The fact that ''Allah is one'' doesnt need extra explanation. Its very obvious and fits in all forms of logic and reasoning.

While I do not rely on the collections known as al-Hadith, nonetheless, nothing will prevent me from accepting what is true regardless of where it is found and who has said it.

Yeah. To refute something even if its good, merely becoz its in hadith is stupidity.
We need to use logic, reasoning and common sense and accept truth no matter where it comes from.

There is no compulsion in religion. But its very evident that God is one who has no form or shape and is above all. To submit to Allah would be to acknowledge that God is one and live a righteous life.

mquran

No horseplay or mockery meant. In fact I don't have a horse

I was responding the image of man blowing himself up. I found it very funny....

Ah good. Glad you were amused. Mehdi can be the new 'meri naam joker' guy.

mquran

I would agree with omeiza. Some in the forum do claim anything not mentioned in the Quran is nonsense and false and vain talk. I wouldnt agree on that. Quran is God's direct message/guidance to mankind. But all other forms of goodness, knowledge, wisdom outside Quran is from Allah too. If Quran doesnt mention meditation is good, drinking 8 glasses of water a day is good, it doesnt make all these acts sinful. We need to use logic, reasoning and sense to understand reality and truth. We cant blindly refute anything not mentioned in the Quran as false.

Question how do you determine a posit to be 'wisdom' or 'not wisdom' ? Or do you simply accept all statements as wise?

The fact that ''Allah is one'' doesnt need extra explanation. Its very obvious and fits in all forms of logic and reasoning

So the only statement needed is 'Huwa Allahu ahad'. The rest could be junked?

Yeah. To refute something even if its good, merely becoz its in hadith is stupidity.

Agreed.

We need to use logic, reasoning and common sense and accept truth no matter where it comes from.

What is 'truth' ? Please define how you would determine a 'truth' ?

unknownuser

Ah good. Glad you were amused. Mehdi can be the new 'meri naam joker' guy.

I thought you held that title for life?
Just kiddin -)

And I did not realise you spoke Hindi?

There are some good posts on this thread by some people. We must attend to it ...

So mquran are you saying all knowlege outside of quran has no relevancy? Please clarify...

Thanks...

Regards,

mquran

And I did not realise you spoke Hindi?

I don't. I have you to thank for opening my eyes to arty Indian Cinema. Very stimulating indeed.

So mquran are you saying all knowlege outside of quran has no relevancy? Please clarify...

For me to live in salaam/peacefulness/abundance/freedom from danger, yes. I need no other rules. My essence has been foretold by al-quraan.

unknownuser

And I did not realise you spoke Hindi?

I don't. I have you to thank for opening my eyes to arty Indian Cinema. Very stimulating indeed.

So you are enjoying it?
Thats very good... -)

Have you seen Apu Trilogy then?

For me to live in salaam/peacefulness/abundance/freedom from danger, yes. I need no other rules. My essence has been foretold by al-quraan.

But that does not exclude all other forms of knowledge does it? Like science and medicine? Maths and Logic?

Regards,

unknownuser

BTW, its 'mera naam joker' and not 'meri naam joker' )

unknownuser

Hi Mquran,

I would agree with omeiza. Some in the forum do claim anything not mentioned in the Quran is nonsense and false and vain talk. I wouldnt agree on that. Quran is God's direct message/guidance to mankind. But all other forms of goodness, knowledge, wisdom outside Quran is from Allah too. If Quran doesnt mention meditation is good, drinking 8 glasses of water a day is good, it doesnt make all these acts sinful. We need to use logic, reasoning and sense to understand reality and truth. We cant blindly refute anything not mentioned in the Quran as false.

Question how do you determine a posit to be 'wisdom' or 'not wisdom' ? Or do you simply accept all statements as wise?

Wisdom is something that can stand the test of reality and truth. And, no, Why would I accept all or any statement blindly as wise?

The fact that ''Allah is one'' doesnt need extra explanation. Its very obvious and fits in all forms of logic and reasoning

So the only statement needed is 'Huwa Allahu ahad'. The rest could be junked?

When did I say that?
Its very evident that God is one. It fits into all logic and reasoning. Why would one want explanation/clarification for the fact?

We need to use logic, reasoning and common sense and accept truth no matter where it comes from.

What is 'truth' ? Please define how you would determine a 'truth' ?

Truth is something that?s true and real, that fits into logic and reasoning, and again stands the test.

And like Mehdi rightly pointed out

And if all the trees on earth were pens and the ocean (were ink), with seven oceans behind it to add to its (supply), yet would not the words of Allah be exhausted (in the writing) for Allah is Exalted in Power, full of Wisdom.

So, wisdom and truth dont end with Quran.
Peace!

mquran

PM Wisdom is something that can stand the test of reality and truth. And, no, Why would I accept all or any statement blindly as wise?

Excellent. Test of reality and truth. Al-quraan is al-haqq, the ultimate truth. It's the detailing of the book of reality. So all 'wisdom' needs to agree with the book.

When did I say that?
Its very evident that God is one. It fits into all logic and reasoning. Why would one want explanation/clarification for the fact?

How does it 'fit into all logic and reasoning'? Please state your premise and deduction?

And if all the trees on earth were pens and the ocean (were ink), with seven oceans behind it to add to its (supply), yet would not the words of Allah be exhausted (in the writing) for Allah is Exalted in Power, full of Wisdom.

So, wisdom and truth dont end with Quran.

Funnily, the ayat says 'kalimah' and you say 'wisdom and truth'. Al-quraan should be understood by al-quraan

006.114 Say "Shall I seek for judge other than God? - when He it is Who hath sent unto you the Book, explained in detail." They know full well, to whom We have given the Book, that it hath been sent down from thy Lord in truth. Never be then of those who doubt.
006.115 The word of thy Lord doth find its fulfilment in truth and in justice None can change His words for He is the one who heareth and knoweth all

So 31/27 doesn't tell you to seek wisdom elsewhere. It just tells you the comprehensiveness of His Kalimah.

unknownuser

Hi Mquran,

Its very evident that God is one. It fits into all logic and reasoning. Why would one want explanation/clarification for the fact?

How does it 'fit into all logic and reasoning'? Please state your premise and deduction?

I?d understand ?God is one? with or without Quran. It makes sense to me. It fits into all those questions that one has about creation and creator. And I can see/sense God's signs all round me. So, Even if there was no Quran, I would have believed ??God is one??(btw, the idea was confirmed in previous scriptures as well). Quran is a good confirmation of the same. Quran is a confirmation of the truth that people failed to see. Quran is God?s message to people, spelling out truth.

And if all the trees on earth were pens and the ocean (were ink), with seven oceans behind it to add to its (supply), yet would not the words of Allah be exhausted (in the writing) for Allah is Exalted in Power, full of Wisdom.
So, wisdom and truth dont end with Quran.

Funnily, the ayat says 'kalimah' and you say 'wisdom and truth'. Al-quraan should be understood by al-quraan

I understand this verse as follows
Allah is the most wise and all-knowing and if He decided to pen down all that he knew (wisdom), He would have so much words that 3127 And if all the trees on earth were pens and the ocean (were ink), with seven oceans behind it to add to its (supply), yet would not the words of Allah be exhausted (in the writing) for Allah is Exalted in Power, full of Wisdom.
Would u say , my understanding of that verse is wrong?

unknownuser

Sister Peacfulmuslim

I accept your interpetation to 3127, sounds very reasonable when compared to the arabic words, my only note I believe Kalimat Allah in the verse meant to be general Kalimat, i.e. facts, stories, wisdom, etc etc

peace be with you

unknownuser

Sister Peacfulmuslim

I accept your interpetation to 3127, sounds very reasonable when compared to the arabic words, my only note I believe Kalimat Allah in the verse meant to be general Kalimat, i.e. facts, stories, wisdom, etc etc

By wisdom, I mean Truth, Knowledge and Reality of all times(that would include facts, stories(By stories, I guess u mean history))

unknownuser

Sister Peacfulmuslim

I accept your interpetation to 3127, sounds very reasonable when compared to the arabic words, my only note I believe Kalimat Allah in the verse meant to be general Kalimat, i.e. facts, stories, wisdom, etc etc

By wisdom, I mean Truth, Knowledge and Reality of all times(that would include facts, stories(By stories, I guess u mean history))

sure it includes all what you listed in addition to history and possibly many other topics

we have no disagreement sister, it was just an extra bit of info

peace