I'll be back with the Sun
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So how went your fast Kyle?
Yeah, I was wondering about that a few days ago when I completely lost my voice! Couldn't speak for about 24 hours. It was an interesting experience (especially for the wife! wink ). My son kept looking at me funny, so I whispered to him that I lost my voice. He then asked me where I'd left it last. lol
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Peace be upon you,
My fast was fantastic. It really lets one know how receptive the human spirit(nafs) is. It is an open garden for all planters. We must really protect what we allow to enter our garden. The only TV or Radio that I heard was a radio at my office where they were playing Christmas music. At home, or on the way home, I would find myself singing Christmas songs!
It allowed me to see how there is a part of the human where there are thoughts that are just thrown into our sphere of awareness that we did not ask to come there, we have no control over which thoughts and images come. What we do control is wether we let them remain and continue to grow in our garden or weed them out.
What I have been learning, which is the reason I did this fast during winter solstice, is that there are times in the MATHEMATICALLY CREATED WORLD, when the spirit of man (mind/nafs) is MOST receptive. It corresponds to 12 midnight daily, full moon monthly, and the winter solstice yearly. These are the times for planting into your SPIRIT (garden) the CHANGES you want to make, because that is what this is all about, changing behavior. As we move toward the spring, it is time to defend the seeds we planted against the weeds of our emotional nature trying to keep us in those bad habits. If we maintain this, by summer we should see the fruits of the planting. In Fall we begin the planning/reflecting phase so we know what to plant in winter.
The same "metaphor" works daily and monthly as stated.
All I can tell you know regarding my Winter Solstice fast is that I will let you know in summer how I did.
One last thing, on Dec 24th, starting at 8pm all the way through midnight, we meditated (taking mind to alpha state) in order to plant seeds then we took the mind to Gamma state with the African Drums and affirmations of truth.
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Peace be upon you TMK,
I thought that fasting was during the scorching heat in summer?
Yes, this is the OTHER solstice! D In the winter we plant, in the spring we protect the seed, in the SUMMER we reap the harvest, we have dominion D In the fall we reflect on what modifications need to be made so we can plant with wisdom. D
Also did you get the idea to fast during winter from the Quran or only from the ancient philosophies?
"quran" only means proclamation. If you are referring to THIS proclamation that has been collected into a book called "Koran", then no I did not get that from this "quran", at least not yet D
What I am searching for is God's proclamation, the best story(hadith). I know it is from God when it verifies itself, meaning it does not contradict life. Until I have the ability to intuit God's proclamation, I have to listen to all opinions and follow its best. Therefore I continue to watch the signs in the horizons and within the spirit/mind(nafs) until I KNOW it is the truth, not just believe(faith). I do not limit myself to this wonderful guide called "Koran", I trust in what was descended upon me and those before me.
I find it very interesting?
I cant begin to describe how interesting I find any speck of true wisdom, that which brings verifyable results.
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Peace be upon you TMK,
how do you verify the ancient philosophies?
isnt it subjective?We verify it the same way we should be verifying this "quran" called "Koran", we have to put it to the test of life to see if it is truth, if it works. Results are what we are looking for.
intuition is very personal/subjective? we can all intuit different conclusions!
Truth is clearly distinct from falsehood, because we will be TESTING all "intuitions". Only intuitions lead to peaceful solutions to life's problems, our own thoughts lead to emotional based troubles. That is a basic understanding, but I am still studying this aspect and will elaborate as I grow in knowledge.
hadith is a philosophy, why not use that?
hadith means "story", so you just said "story" is a philosophy.
But I know what you meant, you meant that the books called "hadith" that are taken alongside this "reading" are a philosophy. My answer is we listen to ALL OPINIONS, and we follow its best. No proclamation is off limits, we have to see all sides of the story to make an accurate judgement. Verify the info, thats how you distinguish.
plase clarify quran/proclamation?
That which we proclaim is "quran". One can proclaim anything, so we know the God's "quran" from others by checking for contradictions.
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Peace Kyle,
While I respect your desire to seek and find truth I want to give you the following allegorical things for contemplation.
Our desire is to become closer to the truth and not drift away from it. In order to stay close to it we need an anchor to keep us in the vicinity of the truth otherwise we run the risk of being taken far away from it.
I agree that it is legitimate to explore but one needs to be oriented about it. If you consider the truth as being the centre of a circle then each of us is a certain distance away in a particular direction. What you don't want is to drift away from the centre.
I believe the reading is like an anchor that is at the centre of that circle - it should prevent us from getting further away from the truth; and indeed it should help us to get closer if we explore towards it, rather than away from it.
My best wishes.
Peace be upon you TMK,
I thought that fasting was during the scorching heat in summer?
Yes, this is the OTHER solstice! D In the winter we plant, in the spring we protect the seed, in the SUMMER we reap the harvest, we have dominion D In the fall we reflect on what modifications need to be made so we can plant with wisdom. D
Also did you get the idea to fast during winter from the Quran or only from the ancient philosophies?
"quran" only means proclamation. If you are referring to THIS proclamation that has been collected into a book called "Koran", then no I did not get that from this "quran", at least not yet D
What I am searching for is God's proclamation, the best story(hadith). I know it is from God when it verifies itself, meaning it does not contradict life. Until I have the ability to intuit God's proclamation, I have to listen to all opinions and follow its best. Therefore I continue to watch the signs in the horizons and within the spirit/mind(nafs) until I KNOW it is the truth, not just believe(faith). I do not limit myself to this wonderful guide called "Koran", I trust in what was descended upon me and those before me.
I find it very interesting?
I cant begin to describe how interesting I find any speck of true wisdom, that which brings verifyable results.
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Peace be upon you Truth,
While I respect your desire to seek and find truth I want to give you the following allegorical things for contemplation.
Our desire is to become closer to the truth and not drift away from it. In order to stay close to it we need an anchor to keep us in the vicinity of the truth otherwise we run the risk of being taken far away from it.
What better anchor than verification. In fact, this is the criteria listed in this proclamation(quran) we are discussing. We know if information is from the God if it does not contradict, and one must verify in order to know that.
I agree that it is legitimate to explore but one needs to be oriented about it. If you consider the truth as being the centre of a circle then each of us is a certain distance away in a particular direction. What you don't want is to drift away from the centre.
I agree.
I believe the reading is like an anchor that is at the centre of that circle - it should prevent us from getting further away from the truth; and indeed it should help us to get closer if we explore towards it, rather than away from it.
Sure, but what do you understand from the statement that we should "trust in that which descended upon us and that which descended upon those before us?" How is it that people who dont listen to this proclamation(quran) still get thier reward from thier Lord if they follow certain guidelines?
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Peace Kyle,
It's good to have you back and I'm glad your journey was fruitful. When you mentioned, "We must really protect what we allow to enter our garden", it reminded me of Masaru Emoto's "Hidden Messages In Water", which I'm currently reading. Amazingly, the ice crystal exposed to the words, "Love & Gratitude", was the most beautiful, most symmetrical of the bunch. This book has really been a confirmation of thoughts past.
I highly recommend it.
Anyway, good to see you bro.
Peace,
Tay -
Sure, but what do you understand from the statement that we should "trust in that which descended upon us and that which descended upon those before us?" How is it that people who dont listen to this proclamation(quran) still get thier reward from thier Lord if they follow certain guidelines?
Peace be upon you Kyle,
4143 What is said to you is precisely what was said to the previous messengers....
What is descended is unchanging. It is the same message to those before, and to us. Also I might say that the anchor cannot be verification because verification is a process - one of your obligations.
It therefore must come down to the reading which proclaims it is verifiably from the God - if you have trust in it then you have to understand that its message is essentially the same as what was before. The book itself or title is irrelevant as you would agree - what is important is the message. The book, its name, its paper and writing are the 'wrapping' - the ideas and concepts are the 'food'.
Let me give you another analogy.
Say we are in search of gold. There is a variety of areas where there is varying concentration of gold. In some cases it is effortless, you only need to pick it up from the banks of a river. In other cases it is below the surface of the soil and needs a modest effort to recover. In other areas it is embedded in quartz and needs enormous effort to recover. In some areas it is not worth the effort for the small amount one can obtain.
The same is true of truth. In the reading we have a large reef of 'gold' and there is nugget after nugget - in other texts there may some, and in others the pickings are so slim that one is wasting one's time searching.
Perhaps your 'gold detector' is in need of tuning, to turn you back to where the 'gold' is more plentiful and more reliably found. I trust the analogy is understandable to you.
Regards.
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Peace be upon you M Mehdi,
What would you like to know brother?
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Peace Idolfree
Peace be upon you TMK,
Quote
how do you verify the ancient philosophies?
isnt it subjective?We verify it the same way we should be verifying this "quran" called "Koran", we have to put it to the test of life to see if it is truth, if it works. Results are what we are looking for.
We could spend all our lives verifing things for eternity, but maybe that is the what the straight path is all about! All about searching and cobstantly verifying the Gods universal laws (absoloute truths), and maybe it carries on after death for eternity
peace D
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Peace be upon you TMK,
We could spend all our lives verifing things for eternity, but maybe that is the what the straight path is all about! All about searching and cobstantly verifying the Gods universal laws (absoloute truths), and maybe it carries on after death for eternity
Yes, verification is definately a major piece.
My thoughts are that if we continue to verify and stay at peace(non emotional), then the universe moves you into the "right place at the right time" and things of ths nature. There is guidance always right there for those who live the truth they verify.
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Peace idolfree
what are your views on community social/bonding between the submitters, we dont seem to have the social interaction that traditional Islam provised i.e. 5 times salaat, Hajj, Eid Prayers,
It seems Your interpretation Of Gods path is more individual e.g. meditaion (i knpw you sometimes might be doing it in groups) and to do with indivudual reflection etc.
If we are using symbols from ancient egypt, we can surely also take them from traditonal islam too
i.e bowing, prostrating to God (very symbolic of humility)
Facing the same direction in Prayer (symbol of focus and direction in life)
Hajj ( symbil of unity, equality, journey and system of God. spinning around the stone cube = atom rotation , solar system rotation) all verifiable with observations of nature.
surely these things are valid or void based upon the meanings we give and derive from them?Can they be used as a part of the system of submitting to God?
And could it possibly be the intention of the personality of Muhamad ( i know u not interested in him as a human) to have allowed or brought these rituals for their symbolic power which can be understood by both literate and illiterate, Hajj, salaat are rich in syblism whether you observe or participate etc ?just some thoughts ( in process of verification/validation)
whaddya think?
peace
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Peace idolfree
D
what are your views on community social/bonding between the submitters, we dont seem to have the social interaction that traditional Islam provised i.e. 5 times salaat, Hajj, Eid Prayers,It seems Your interpretation Of Gods path is more individual e.g. meditaion (i knpw you sometimes might be doing it in groups) and to do with indivudual reflection etc.
If we are using symbols from ancient egypt, we can surely also take them from traditonal islam too
i.e bowing, prostrating to God (very symbolic of humility)
Facing the same direction in Prayer (symbol of focus and direction in life)
Hajj ( symbil of unity, equality, journey and system of God. spinning around the stone cube = atom rotation , solar system rotation) all verifiable with observations of nature.
surely these things are valid or void based upon the meanings we give and derive from them?Can they be used as a part of the system of submitting to God?
And could it possibly be the intention of the personality of Muhamad ( i know u not interested in him as a human) to have allowed or brought these rituals for their symbolic power which can be understood by both literate and illiterate, Hajj, salaat are rich in syblism whether you observe or participate etc ?just some thoughts ( in process of verification/validation)
whaddya think?
D
peace -
Peace be upon you TMK,
what are your views on community social/bonding between the submitters, we dont seem to have the social interaction that traditional Islam provised i.e. 5 times salaat, Hajj, Eid Prayers,
That social culture of traditional "Islam" was based on the wrong foundation, therefore it is an unhealthy social culture. I personally have found people who "bow" and I "bow" with them. It is not a social culture based on the religion "Islam", but it is a culture based on peacefulness and submission to the laws of God, which is what it is all about. Further, once we fully understand concepts like salaat, hajj, etc in an objective manner, then we can get behind it and promote it greatly, then we will have the social culture that many of us have had to give up in order to follow the God. Many of us have changed our QIBLA and passed the test. That is a great thing. Remember though, the examples we are given don't realy give the picture of a great social stucture, they were a minority.
It seems Your interpretation Of Gods path is more individual e.g. meditaion (i knpw you sometimes might be doing it in groups) and to do with indivudual reflection etc.
I hope to show objectively soon that meditation is what salaat is all about. It is common among many cultures and certainly WORKS, but the "Koran" says there was a generation who lost thier salaat. BUt I will reserve that for a time when I can give sufficeint evidence.
My point is that once we can prove the concepts objectively, then there should be no argument and we can unite under truth.
If we are using symbols from ancient egypt, we can surely also take them from traditonal islam too
i.e bowing, prostrating to God (very symbolic of humility)
Facing the same direction in Prayer (symbol of focus and direction in life)
Hajj ( symbil of unity, equality, journey and system of God. spinning around the stone cube = atom rotation , solar system rotation) all verifiable with observations of nature.
surely these things are valid or void based upon the meanings we give and derive from them?Lets take them one at a time.
bowing, prostrating to God (very symbolic of humility)
Bowing is humility, prostrating is hearng and obeying.
Facing the same direction in Prayer (symbol of focus and direction in life)
This is nowhere in Koran so I cannot agree with you here.
Hajj ( symbil of unity, equality, journey and system of God. spinning around the stone cube = atom rotation , solar system rotation) all verifiable with observations of nature.
This is also no where in "Koran". Hajj means debate, there is nothing to suggest a going to Mecca and walking around a stone. I cannot agree with you here.
Can they be used as a part of the system of submitting to God?
How so? What benefit would they have to changing behavior? For example, the ritual I took part in is a way of stimulating the brain to produce gamma waves which help you to get to a state of TRANCE, which is how we make something stick in our memory, in order to REMEMBER(key word).
How would walking around a stone cube, trying not to get trampled, or women trying not to get felt up be of benefit?
And could it possibly be the intention of the personality of Muhamad ( i know u not interested in him as a human) to have allowed or brought these rituals for their symbolic power which can be understood by both literate and illiterate, Hajj, salaat are rich in syblism whether you observe or participate etc ?
just some thoughts ( in process of verification/validation)
I respect your process of verification. To continue, the rituals of traditional "ISLAM" are no where to be found in the book called "KORAN", so we have to start there. Remember, the goal is behavior shaping, but we first have to identify what is being told to us, and agin, none of the traditional rituals are part of "Koran".