Why do so many Quran Aloners still use the term "Allah"
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Peace bro "AB",
also bro, did RK consider the two Alifs in every instance of Ilah word when he counted the Alifs?
peace
JK- You asked a very good question. The answer is theres a difference between real alifs and VOWEL alifs as is in the case with Rahman. That is NOT a real alif but a vowel mark so it is NOT counted. THIS RULE HAS BEEN APPLIED EVERYWHERE CONSISTENTLY. GOD Bless!
Thanks bro
but this does not make sense, because the Alif is recognised as a letter and not a vowel, the vowels are controled by the tashkil as far as i remember, as well I have seen images of old scripts that had the alif in these words I will try to find it though
Salam
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As Salaam Alaikum JK,
Salam "NP",
JK- I hope your didnt mean that four lettered F word.
I said exactly what I meant. fRuck.
JK- As i said before, NO PROBLEM. Thats your choice but i kindly ADVISE you to not do that.
JK- I do feel good but i also want people to understand and not just run away because i insist on using Arabic terms many have no idea of except associating it with terrorism.
But here is this thing-- Most of the people on this forum are MUSLIM. Actually I can't even think of a non-Muslim on this forum on the top of my head. So it's not as if we, the people, don't know what these terms mean.
I can understand your point if we were in a class room and discussing Islam with non-Muslims. BUT WE ARE NOT. We are discussing Islam, etc, etc among ourselves, and yes non-Muslims are welcomed to come but so far they haven't been particiapting on this forum in a significant number for us to discuss issues with them.
Even I can't stand it when a book, like my current Wolrd Hisotry one, says "Allah" instead of God. Becuase unlike non-Muslims I understand that they are both the same... but non-Muslims literally do believe that "Allah" is someone else other than "God". I don't like it when I read the newspapers saying "Allah" instead of "God". Don't like it all, because it puts us at a difference and it gives the idea that they are two different dieties, when they are the same (just different words).
BUT when I am among Muslims, I don't understand why it hurts. We udnerstand these words,and we understand that "God" and "Allah" are the same diety.
JK- As i said mixing languages is not good especially when crucial terms are considered.
Mixing languages is not good when people have no idea what words mean.
It's not as if we are discussing translations of the Quran and every other word is english ad the other is arabic. No. This is very basic. "Allah" "halaal" "haraam".
JK- NO not at all. Im talking about insisting on ARabic terms when talking in English. Seems like you didnt understand me.
So you eblieve that the Muslims among you are calling you a terrosit when you are speaking to them in using arabic terms?
JK- HOW MANY TIMES DO I HAVE TO TELL YOU THAT THIS WAS ONLY AN ADVISE?
saying "well fine, be called a terrosit..." (or whatever you said) is not advice, but just plain arrogance.
JK- First of all "Allah" is NOT a personal name since GOD can have no personal name, it makes no sense. 2ndly in my case you would have seen that i adjust my name according to culture. In Pakistan, Persia, etc i may be cammed "Khizar". For the western countries im "Jonny K.".
As a Black American of the USA, I would say that your actions reflect insecurity about who you are in terms of your culture.
It's similar to the classic case of immigrants coming to the USA and changing their "ethnic" names to blend in with White Christian America.
JK- No but you should give her a suitable feminine name which exists in that society which those people can easily pronounce like "Sarah" or "Cindy" for example. That is my oopinion. GOD Bless!
Wow. I can't believe this. Seriously. You are truly brainwashed. You are ashamed of your ethnicity and desire to not be it when around people who do not share your ethnic background. It's really sad.
salaam
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Peace, NonProgressive,
I understand the basic terms, and some of the not so basic terms though I am not Muslim, and when some participants of the forum use an unknown word, I ask. They have always answered -)
In the environement I am sorrounded by, partly Chatholic, partly, and mostly, Atheist, I'd say that everybody knows that Allah = God.Taking the word as a proper name is what puzzles me.
Regarding the change of the name when one moves to a place with a different culture or language, I find it strange too. I just know the case of some East-Asians in UK that change it to an English name.
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Peace bro "AB",
Thanks bro
but this does not make sense, because the Alif is recognised as a letter and not a vowel, the vowels are controled by the tashkil as far as i remember, as well I have seen images of old scripts that had the alif in these words I will try to find it though
Salam
JK- You mean like in "Rahman"? That would be very interesting. But let me remind you that the pattern of the mathematical already proved itself without this "alif" acting as a vowel mark. GOD Bless!
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Peace bro "AB",
Thanks bro
but this does not make sense, because the Alif is recognised as a letter and not a vowel, the vowels are controled by the tashkil as far as i remember, as well I have seen images of old scripts that had the alif in these words I will try to find it though
Salam
JK- You mean like in "Rahman"? That would be very interesting. But let me remind you that the pattern of the mathematical already proved itself without this "alif" acting as a vowel mark. GOD Bless!
Peace bro
You can't use the mathmatical pattern against others because many don't believe in it, it is like using the hadith to prove something
however bro, i'm not going to debate the whole 19 thingy with you, I will only choose one part of it with the criteria RK used and I will present you with an irrefutable arguemnt inshallah, i'm sure many already did as such, but you keep using it to quilify the Quran while most muslims don't believe in it due to the many flaws in it
Is the part about the name Rashad Khalifa in the Quran is ok with you? or how about the age of 40 concept by RK?
peace bro
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Peace "NP"
I said exactly what I meant. fRuck.
JK- I believe this is a censored forum. The usage of foul language is unacceptable here.
But here is this thing-- Most of the people on this forum are MUSLIM. Actually I can't even think of a non-Muslim on this forum on the top of my head. So it's not as if we, the people, don't know what these terms mean.
JK- Not necessarily. Atheists, Christians and others also come and go. This is a general forum for all, NOT just Quran Alone submitters.
I can understand your point if we were in a class room and discussing Islam with non-Muslims. BUT WE ARE NOT. We are discussing Islam, etc, etc among ourselves, and yes non-Muslims are welcomed to come but so far they haven't been particiapting on this forum in a significant number for us to discuss issues with them.
JK- But thats exactly what we want. More than just discussing things amongst ourselves we want the non-submitters to come, read and understand.
Even I can't stand it when a book, like my current Wolrd Hisotry one, says "Allah" instead of God. Becuase unlike non-Muslims I understand that they are both the same... but non-Muslims literally do believe that "Allah" is someone else other than "God". I don't like it when I read the newspapers saying "Allah" instead of "God". Don't like it all, because it puts us at a difference and it gives the idea that they are two different dieties, when they are the same (just different words).
JK- Exactly!
BUT when I am among Muslims, I don't understand why it hurts. We udnerstand these words,and we understand that "God" and "Allah" are the same diety.
JK- Like i said this is not a "submitters only" forum but there for all to see, read and understand.
Mixing languages is not good when people have no idea what words mean.
JK- See my reply above.
So you eblieve that the Muslims among you are calling you a terrosit when you are speaking to them in using arabic terms?
JK- See my reply above.
saying "well fine, be called a terrosit..." (or whatever you said) is not advice, but just plain arrogance.
JK- That too was my opinion because i see at as such and i hope you understand that this forum is not only meant for Quran Alone submitters.
As a Black American of the USA, I would say that your actions reflect insecurity about who you are in terms of your culture.
JK- I dont care about culture or my background. Im a submitter to GOD Alone and it is the righteousness of a person which counts be he black,white,red,etc. Im fedup of those people who cling towards their culture and boast about their traditions and names. I adjust my name to the society in which i live in and id prefer it if everyone did that.
It's similar to the classic case of immigrants coming to the USA and changing their "ethnic" names to blend in with White Christian America.
JK- That is very good and the US ought to do the same when they goto Middle Eastern or Arabic countries. In Arabia id like to call myself "Abdullah bin Munawwar(munawwar is my father's name)".
Wow. I can't believe this. Seriously. You are truly brainwashed. You are ashamed of your ethnicity and desire to not be it when around people who do not share your ethnic background. It's really sad.
JK- Im not ashmamed of anyhing. I simply adjust mself to the society in which i am. Is this too difficult to understand? GOD Bless!
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As Salaam Alaikum JK,
Okay Jk. I'm just going to disagree with you on this. I believe that what you are saying is useless becuase it is hopes to help a very SMALL minority on this forum.
salaam.
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Peace "NP",
As Salaam Alaikum JK,
Okay Jk. I'm just going to disagree with you on this. I believe that what you are saying is useless becuase it is hopes to help a very SMALL minority on this forum.
salaam.
JK- No problem. We can always disagree but we should do so peacefully ) . GOD Bless!
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Peace be upon you all,
Some very good arguments being put forth by JK and MQ in particular.
Someone stated that upholding "Culture" was not correct, or something to that effect. I would disagree, the cultures that revolved around THE spiritual principles should indeed be upheld. That is a culture designed to develop the spirits/minds(nafs) of its inhabitants. That is in contrast to western culture today that pollutes the spirit/mind(nafs) of its inhabitants.
Culture is VERY important.
(2133) Or were you witnesses when the death came to Jacob, when he said to his sons"What (do) you serve from after me?" They said "We serve your God(ilahaka) and God(ilaha) of your fathers; Abraham, and Ishmael, and Isaac. One God (ilahan wahidan), and we are to Him (lahu) vehicles of Peace."
Jacob wanted to make sure that his sons followed the culture/order (deen) of the righteous family, that of thier father and his fathers. It is the same culture/order(deen) given to Noah and all. It is the culture that we do not come to blindly. We do not follow the ways of our fathers blindly. It is a culture of research/study and reflection until we KNOW. It is the verifyable system of God.
Now, regarding the word "allah", some very deep comments have been made that have made me really dig deep. The goal is for truth, not to uphold any concept that I am emotionally tied to. I have to first get KNOWLEDGE, then I can allow emotions to follow that. In the above verse, there is no "allah" stated, but it is clearly tallking about "God". What is teh difference between "allah" and "ilah"?
Is it "allah" or "illah" used in the following verse?
(12) Alhamdu lillahi rabbi alAAalameena
(27) Khatama Allahu AAala quloobihim....
The above verse says that "The (al) to him(lahu) sealed upon thier hearts...."
We know that Al = The , and from the first verse above, 2133, we see that "lahu" is translated as "to him".
I need to understand the grammar going on here. What is teh difference between "lahu" and "lahi", as in the verse above, 12, where "lahi" is used with "al".
Lastly, what do you all make of the following statement;
- Have you considered Allaat and Al-'Uzzah?
- And Manaat, the third one?
notice the similar construction of what is being debated here
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These are but names/descriptions/definitions ("asma'a") that you named/dewcribed/defined, you and your forefathers. Never descended the "lahi" with it from authority. They follow conjecture and what the spirits/minds fantasize, while the guidance has come to them from their Lord.
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Those who don't have faith in the ending have named those given control/("mala'ika") feminine names.
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They had no knowledge about this; they only conjectured. Conjecture is no substitute for the truth.
All of the descriptions of the God are the "malaika", the proper thoughts that control Life, that define man's pattern of Creation based on God, whose pattern we resemble. (3030 Fitara)
(1773) They almost diverted you from the inspiriations we have given you. They wanted you to invent something else, in order to consider you a friend.
We have to get to the bottom of "lahu" and "lahi".
Please give feedback.
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Peace be upon you,
bumped to top
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Hi, I actually use both (God and Allah). I probably use Allah more, because I was raised Sunni and that's all we used to call God (I didn't even know that htere was another word for Allah (God) until I was 6). So, It's not that I intentionally use the Arabic, It's just that old habits (for me) die hard, is all. I don't think God mines if you use the English, Arabic, Russian, German or Japanese translation, they are all used to describe our Lord. ?
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Salam,
I have a suggestion (but remember I am just learning arabic so this is just a thought)....
maybe illah and Allah are the same just different pronounciations? As far as I can tell they are written the same but with different diacritical marks. The Quran (to the best of my knowledge) did not originally have diacritical marks. So maybe its just two different pronounciations?Please correct me if I'm wrong.
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Peace Arnaab
Ilah spelling is Alif ; Lam ; Alif ; Ha
Allah spelling is Alif, Lam ; Lam ; Ha
The third letter is different bro
Salam
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Peace all,
I just had to bring this topic back again as i can see not much has changed on the forum despite this long argument. I still suggest that you please, while addressing the public, avoid any Arabic terms like Allah, salam, Allahu Akbar, etc since new commers will be frightned by these and most assuredly take them in a -ve sense. It wont get us anywhere so please why cant you just write GOD instead of Allah, peace instead of Salam etc etc.? Thankyou. GOD Bless! -
There's an uncompromising difference between the "Allah of the Quran" and "GOD of Reality". The "Allah of the Quran" is a known man-made deity defined by its limited measures and attributes while the "GOD of Reality or Cosmological Realm" is unknown.
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Peace "Danish",
There's an uncompromising difference between the "Allah of the Quran" and "GOD of Reality". The "Allah of the Quran" is a known man-made deity defined by its limited measures and attributes while the "GOD of Reality or Cosmological Realm" is unknown.
JK- Did you never ponder upon the following Quranic verse
If all the trees on earth were made into pens, and the ocean supplied the ink, augmented by seven more oceans, the words of GOD would not run out. GOD is Almighty, Most Wise.
So the Quran contains all the words we need for our salvation but GOD makes it clear in this Book that He never runs out of words. Yes GOD can never be fully understood and the Quran approves of this. So what is the problem? GOD Bless! -
salam alaykum.
the arabic word for "god" is "ilah" . "Allah" cannot be translated into "god" or "the god", i think .your thinking is 100% right
peace
Allah is ma'rifah of ilah (the Only Ilah). Nothing to do with God.
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Peace sister "samia",
Salam all
JK, what would the English word God stand for, Allah or Rub?
JK- The Arabic word for the English word "God(with capital G)" or as id prefer "GOD(all caps)" would be "Allah". "Rub" translates to "lord/cherisher/sustainer". GOD Bless!