A Miraculous Conspiracy Theory about Mecca
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Salaams all,
could you give evidence to this please?
you said
"They had to use the old walls and they built it in a rush"
i spoke to a guy who goes there often and said its's a complete job head to toe! a mosque nothing old about it.
Gods Blessings.
The mosque was built in many stages. Initially the Arabs bought the cathedral from the Visigoths and shared it with them. You can still see the old Visigothic parts if you go there (as I did recently). When I said, 'built it in a rush', what I meant to say is they needed a place of worship in a rush. Hence they bought a cathedral, and didn't build it from scratch. In later years they added to new parts to it. Presumably one of the walls happened to be aligned in a roughly south-east direction so they used that as their direction. When the building was extended they had to stick to the old configurations. This is why it is probably not aligned to Mecca/wherever.
As for the proof of this I don't have original documents or anything like that. The Visigothic cathedral is self evident if you go there. But the rest is what I have picked up from books I have read about the place.
When I went there, I had thought these people may have been the true Muslims. However, now I do not think so. First of all they had been ejected from Syria, they were quite racist and not as tolerant as Quran instructs us to be. My hypothesis is that the Quran made Muslims so advancd that they propelled way above the Europeans. When they rejected it, they declined, but it took (a long) time before they sunk to the level of the Europeans which is why Moorish Spain was, for a time, the most highly civilised place in Europe.
That is just an opinion though.
Roshn
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Salaams Bro ? I think you?re a five timer and don?t want to diminish your concept of prayers! Or rather your qibla???
you said -
"You can still see the old Visigothic parts if you go there (as I did recently). When I said, 'built it in a rush', what I meant to say is they needed a place of worship in a rush. Hence they bought a cathedral, and didn't build it from scratch. In later years they added to new parts to it. Presumably one of the walls happened to be aligned in a roughly south-east direction so they used that as their direction. When the building was extended they had to stick to the old configurations. This is why it is probably not aligned to Mecca/wherever."
Now what actually happened with possible evidance/proofs/authenticity or what ever.
Mosque being built on the site of a church.
It dates back to 785 when Abd ar-Rahhman I founded the Mezquita on the site of an ancient Visigothic church which had originally been the site of a Roman temple
The Great Mosque of Cordoba was considered a wonder of the medieval world by both Muslims and Christians. Built on a Visigothic site, which was probably the site of an earlier Roman temple, the Great Mosque of Cordoba was begun between 784 and 786 during the reign of 'Abd al-Rahman I, who escaped from Syria to the Iberian Peninsula after his family was massacred by a rival political dynasty.
Mosque changing into a cathedral???
In the early 16th century the Bishop and Canons of the cathedral proposed the construction of a new cathedral, and proposed to demolish the mosque in order to build it. The opposition of the townspeople to the proposed destruction of the building led to the unprecedented decision, endorsed by the Holy Roman Emperor Charles V, to insert an entire Gothic "chapel" into the very heart of the former Great Mosque. The result is an uneasy and controversial juxtaposition the soaring forms of a Gothic cathedral rise from the very centre of the comparatively low, sprawling prayer hall whose architectural vocabulary is rooted in the forms of classical antiquity
THE CATHEDRAL
In the centre of the mosque squats a Renaissance cathedral which dates back to the early sixteenth century while, to the left is the Capilla de Villaviciosa built by Moorish craftsmen in 1371.
The Mosque was consecrated as a Christian Cathedral in the same year that Cordoba was re-conquered (1236). Alfonso X built the Villaviciosa Chapel with stunning multi lobed arches. The Capilla Real (Royal Chapel) was also built as a pantheon for Christian Kings.
In the 14th century Enrique II rebuilt the royal chapel in Mudejar style. In 1523 with the support of King Carlos V the church built a huge nave inside the mosque. The cathedral was elaborated on over the years by many of the country?s leading architects and artists. Architect Hern?n Ruiz continued working transforming the Cathedral into Gothic style.SO THE MOSQUE WAS CHANGED INTO A CATHEDRAL PARTIALLY AFTER IT WAS TAKEN OVER BY THE CHRISTIANS.
Its astonishing when people start to lie just to strengthen their points of view though.
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Salaams Bro ? I think you?re a five timer and don?t want to diminish your concept of prayers! Or rather your qibla???
you said -
"You can still see the old Visigothic parts if you go there (as I did recently). When I said, 'built it in a rush', what I meant to say is they needed a place of worship in a rush. Hence they bought a cathedral, and didn't build it from scratch. In later years they added to new parts to it. Presumably one of the walls happened to be aligned in a roughly south-east direction so they used that as their direction. When the building was extended they had to stick to the old configurations. This is why it is probably not aligned to Mecca/wherever."
Now what actually happened with possible evidance/proofs/authenticity or what ever.
Mosque being built on the site of a church.
It dates back to 785 when Abd ar-Rahhman I founded the Mezquita on the site of an ancient Visigothic church which had originally been the site of a Roman temple
The Great Mosque of Cordoba was considered a wonder of the medieval world by both Muslims and Christians. Built on a Visigothic site, which was probably the site of an earlier Roman temple, the Great Mosque of Cordoba was begun between 784 and 786 during the reign of 'Abd al-Rahman I, who escaped from Syria to the Iberian Peninsula after his family was massacred by a rival political dynasty.
Mosque changing into a cathedral???
In the early 16th century the Bishop and Canons of the cathedral proposed the construction of a new cathedral, and proposed to demolish the mosque in order to build it. The opposition of the townspeople to the proposed destruction of the building led to the unprecedented decision, endorsed by the Holy Roman Emperor Charles V, to insert an entire Gothic "chapel" into the very heart of the former Great Mosque. The result is an uneasy and controversial juxtaposition the soaring forms of a Gothic cathedral rise from the very centre of the comparatively low, sprawling prayer hall whose architectural vocabulary is rooted in the forms of classical antiquity
THE CATHEDRAL
In the centre of the mosque squats a Renaissance cathedral which dates back to the early sixteenth century while, to the left is the Capilla de Villaviciosa built by Moorish craftsmen in 1371.
The Mosque was consecrated as a Christian Cathedral in the same year that Cordoba was re-conquered (1236). Alfonso X built the Villaviciosa Chapel with stunning multi lobed arches. The Capilla Real (Royal Chapel) was also built as a pantheon for Christian Kings.
In the 14th century Enrique II rebuilt the royal chapel in Mudejar style. In 1523 with the support of King Carlos V the church built a huge nave inside the mosque. The cathedral was elaborated on over the years by many of the country?s leading architects and artists. Architect Hern?n Ruiz continued working transforming the Cathedral into Gothic style.SO THE MOSQUE WAS CHANGED INTO A CATHEDRAL PARTIALLY AFTER IT WAS TAKEN OVER BY THE CHRISTIANS.
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Sorry but my view of a physical qibla
According to Dr. Hawting, who teaches on the sources of Islam at the School of Oriental and African Studies (SOAS, a part of the University of London), new archaeological discoveries of mosques in Egypt from the early 700s also show that up till that time the Muslims (or Haggarenes) were indeed praying, not towards Mecca, but towards the north, and possibly Jerusalem. In fact, Dr. Hawting maintains, no mosques have been found from this period (the seventh century) which face towards Mecca (noted from his class lectures in 1995). Hawting cautions, however, that not all of the Qiblas face towards Jerusalem. Some Jordanian mosques have been uncovered which face north, while there are certain North African mosques which face south, implying that there was some confusion as to where the early sanctuary was placed.
There isn't a physical qibla in the quran - to my understanding and many others like me.
Gods Blessings on all.
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SO THE MOSQUE WAS CHANGED INTO A CATHEDRAL PARTIALLY AFTER IT WAS TAKEN OVER BY THE CHRISTIANS.
Church --> mosque --> cathedral. What is your point? The fact I said cathedral instead of church?
The Mezquita was not built on the site of a Visigothic church. It was a Visigothic church, in the same way that the Mezquita was once a mosque and is now a cathedral. This church was extended throughout the reigns of the different Moors.
The Mezquita is a huge building which mostly retains the original Moorish architecture. However, in the middle lies a cathedral. The minaret was changed to a bell tower. That is the mezquita.
Roshan
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Hey man,
show us something credible please thanks - as my words or your words are not that credible-I showed you things from other sources if you want there addresses I can oblige but you have not provided anything convincing -just your opiniated view.
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Hey man,
show us something credible please thanks - as my words or your words are not that credible-I showed you things from other sources if you want there addresses I can oblige but you have not provided anything convincing -just your opiniated view.
Church --> mosque --> cathedral. What is your point? The fact I said cathedral instead of church?
The Mezquita was not built on the site of a Visigothic church. It was a Visigothic church, in the same way that the Mezquita was once a mosque and is now a cathedral. This church was extended throughout the reigns of the different Moors.
The Mezquita is a huge building which mostly retains the original Moorish architecture. However, in the middle lies a cathedral. The minaret was changed to a bell tower. That is the mezquita.
Moorish Spain by Richard Fletcher.
Probably any other history book written on this.
Any guidebook, map of the complex.
Going there and seeing the old Visigothic parts and the new cathedral!
I don't have primary evidence to hand (and nor do you ), but this history is not disputed, nor is there any reason to dispute it.I dislike the impertinent tone of your messages. I don't think it achieves anything.
By replying to this message, I am giving you the benefit of the doubt. I hope you do not abuse it.
I don't even know what point you are trying to advance.
Roshan
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Church --> mosque --> cathedral.
I was merely refuting that .
The great mosque was built from head to toe as a mosque on the site of a church-it wasn?t a partial church as you suggested.
http//www.andalucia.com/cities/cordoba/mosque.htm
http//www.spanish-fiestas.com/cordoba/mezquita.htm
and the mosque was then changed to a a partial church after the moors were expelled .
Any body can check the links above and believe you me there are many more .
Beliefs created by a mind without facts/authenticity as such crumble ? and that is were you have stood on this your point.
God Be with you though.
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Church --> mosque --> cathedral.
I was merely refuting that .
The great mosque was built from head to toe as a mosque on the site of a church-it wasn?t a partial church as you suggested.
http//www.andalucia.com/cities/cordoba/mosque.htm
http//www.spanish-fiestas.com/cordoba/mezquita.htm
and the mosque was then changed to a a partial church after the moors were expelled .
Any body can check the links above and believe you me there are many more .
Beliefs created by a mind without facts/authenticity as such crumble ? and that is were you have stood on this your point.
God Be with you though.
Even according to your websites (which contradict each other by the way) you will read the following
It dates back to 785 when Abd ar-Rahhman I founded the Mezquita on the site of an ancient Visigothic church which had originally been the site of a Roman temple.
The Caliph of Cordoba actually bought the land for the Mezquita from the Christian community. Previous to this both faiths had shared the building.
If the building was not a church when the Christians owned it, what was it? Was it just a patch of empty land which the Moors bought, made into a mosque and then leased out to the Chrisitians even though they had just built a mosque (as well as the fact there, initially after the Moorish conquest, were hardly and Sunnis and far more Christans)?
If you consider 'tourist websites' a source of 'historical infomation', then so be it.
However, a better website for you would be
http//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mezquita,_C%C3%B3rdoba
Your arrogance is extremely irritating and misplaced. I advise you, especially as you have demonstrated your knowledge so well to refrain from it (as I said previously, but which you chose to ignore).
Roshan
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i think the addresses of the sites are there for people to see and judge for themselves.
but you need to check the link you have provided - i cant get access to it may its just me.
God Bless All.