Reincarnation

TAJ

Salam Ahmed,

The meanings I wrote for Mayt and Mayyit are known to anyone who knows good enough of Arabic.
I suggest that you speak to an Arabic language professor as well as an Islamic Studies 3allamah before you rush into judgment.
The following is the explanation of Al Qurdubiy

" " . " " ; . , ; . , . , ; . " " . ; . . . , . ;

Thanks Taj

but Al Qurtoby said that it is hassan to read it Ma'et " ", which is totally different to " "

and what he translated is the word he changed, this is funny indeed by him, lol

well i can't take that bro, but you can

peace be with you

I see that you cannot even read Arabic. Please read this again. It can be clearer than this. Al Hassan And Al Farra' and Al Kisaa'ey, three well known Arabic language masters

. , ;

unknownuser

Brother Taj

only means that every one is going to die, and mohammad will not be treated differently regarding death, this also apply on the ones that already dead, or do you think the past before that verse are not included?

Salam

unknownuser

I see that you cannot even read Arabic. Please read this again.

well, we have a change in tone, in here, fine if you think as such

It can be clearer than this. Al Hassan And Al Farra' and Al Kisaa'ey, three well known Arabic language masters

. , ;

absolutely wrong and never ever heard of such non sense, but i read it before you though but i threw it the rubbish bin as i do with the corupt hadith, but I accept many other things by Al Qurtoby if it make sense not to bloody prove incarnation, if you want to say someone will die in the future you have to say it as such

or

now i hope you can read arabic

Edit

you are also missing an important point, that timeline does not apply on Allah, i.e. past, present and future do not apply on Allah, that is why He siaid miracously as such to cover all humanity including the prophet without any discrimination in death

but what about you tell us how the Quran proves incarnation in your mind?

TAJ

The language masters are in your rubbish bin!!?? Who else is not there!!??

unknownuser

The language masters are in your rubbish bin!!?? Who else is not there!!??

The language masters shock

I swear by Allah i never heard of such people neither i'm sure if they existed for real

are you sure Taj that they existed? and if you are sure that they said as such? and if you are sure, why this thing they said was never taugh at schools?

now remember that this is depenedant on the tashkil which was added to the Quran by humans and is something not in the classic arabic lol

therefore you have no point indeed

salam

brook

Those are the ones who squandered their own selves to abide in hell for a long time -ulaaekellezeena haseruu anfusahum fee cehenneme haaleduun (23103)

the word haaleduun may have a different meaning than eternal in terms of one?s stay in the hell because its dwellers will be transferrred to heaven after they pay for their past sins or if God pardons them.

I was not aware of this. Could you please quote the ayah in support of your position.

Hell will lie in wait (78 21), a goal for those who transgress the bounds of what is right (22). In it shall they remain for a long time ?ahkaaba (23).

According to Muhammed Asad the word ahkaab, that is, for a long time means not for ever because the term hukb or hikbah (of which ahkaab is the plural) denotes no more than a period of time (Jawharee). Hukb is simply years (As?s, Q?m?s, Lisan al-?Arab, etc); it is obvious that it signifies a limited period of time, not eternity.

As for those who bring wretchedness upon themselves, (they shall live) in the fire, where they will have (nothing but) moans and sobs (to relieve their pain) (116), therein to abide as long as the heavens and the earth endure ? unless thy Sustainer wills it otherwise (107)

God shall say "The fire will be your abode, therein to abide ?unless God wills it otherwise." (6 12

It is clear from 11107 and 6128 that the duration of suffering in hell will be limited by God?s mercy because scorching a sinner there eternally for the sins he has committed in his life time of say only 60 years is unjust. Requiting an evil should be only an evil like itself (42 40). Otherwise, it won?t be fair but evil in itself. Evil does not fit God.

He has willed upon Himself the law of mercy (612).
He says My mercy overspreads everything (7156)

Peace,
Hasan Ak?ay

TAJ

Ok Ahmed,, read or better, write a Quran that does not have tashkil in it. Can you do that?

unknownuser

Ok Ahmed,, read or better, write a Quran that does not have tashkil in it. Can you do that?

LOL Taj

Ok, i can do that and i actually saw some online Qurans that have no tashkil, but hold on a sec, i think i have a surprise for you, i'm just qualifying it

talk to you soon

TAJ

Yes, and after you write it, don't forget to find me two people who can read it the same!

unknownuser

Yes, and after you write it, don't forget to find me two people who can read it the same!

what?

well, don't consider it for you then, it will be for the public, i think the Quran got you red handed and i will show the public this very soon

have a nice day and don't be upset that the satanic concept of reincarnation has been refuted fair and square

unknownuser

Hello Public

This is a comment to show that the argument presented by Taj regarding the Tashkil on the word is flawed, he is basing his finding on a testimony by three unknown humans that he calls Arabic language masters, also he is basing his argument on the Tashkil which was not part of the Quran when it was revealed, but let?s assume for argument sake that the Tashkil was part of the Quran

He thinks that if there is a Shadda on the second letter ?Ya? in the word will make the word means ?Dead in the future? instead of just ?Dead with no association to time?, I never heard of such rule in arabic to be honest.

Well, here is the Quran with its Tashkil responding to him, we will see the same word with the same Tashkil and we should work out if it means ?Dead in the future? or just ?Dead?

It is Allah Who causeth the seed-grain and the date-stone to split and sprout. He causeth the living to issue from the dead, and He is the one to cause the dead to issue from the living. That is Allah then how are ye deluded away from the truth?

(95)

Clear from the above, the same Tashkil but it does not talk about any timeline associated with the word Mayyet, and as you can see all translators translated it ?Dead?, the verse can't have a timeline on it

Some may still argue that it is talking about the future when it happens to humans, well, while Allah already did it to humans (Uzair and others), it does not really mean humans only it means anything that is dead and Allah make it alive or vice versa, here is an example of a dead land that is already DEAD "not in the future" and was made alive, it happens every day everywhere around the world indeed, and you will see the same word with the same Tashkil used

It is He Who sendeth the winds like heralds of glad tidings, going before His mercy when they have carried the heavy-laden clouds, We drive them to a land that is dead, make rain to descend thereon, and produce every kind of harvest therewith thus shall We raise up the dead perchance ye may remember.

(57)

now the wind is driven to a land that is already DEAD

It is ironic that Taj is using the hadith to support his claim, while I?m not a hadith rejector, I never post any hadith to support an argument that I have, I only let the Arabic Quran speaks

See, in the above two verses can't mean Dead in te future

Salam

TAJ

See, in the above two verses can't mean Dead in te future

Dead in the future!?

He thinks that if there is a Shadda on the second letter ?Ya? in the word will make the word means ?Dead in the future? instead of just ?Dead with no association to time?, I never heard of such rule in arabic to be honest.

I am sure nobody has heard of this rule because you have just invented it. roll

Ask an Arabic language professor about the word 'Mayyit'. He/she will tell you that it does not mean dead.
All The ayat that you brought have the word Mayyit, which does not mean dead. Mayyit means either dying or death is written on it.
When Allah speaks to Muhammad saying "You are Mayyit.." Do you think it means "You are dead"!!!???

The word 'Mayt' does mean 'Dead'.
Do yo think there are not in the Quran any ayat with the word 'Mayt'?

jonny_k

Peace "LT",

To explore LIFE and the Infinite Possibility of Existence.

JK- We could do this without ever having to get sick or other troubles also eg in paradise.

They are indeed innocent Jonny. Make no mistake on that.

JK- As i said they are innocent ONLY FROM OUR RELATIVE PERSPECTIVE. Please try to understand this.

No child comes out of the womb and steals his or her dad's gold watch! Children don't have the concept of ownership at birth. These concepts are learned behaviour.

Regards,

JK- Ego is an inherited feature. It is NOT a learned behaviour. Children dont need to learn or be told to be greedy. You dont have to teach your child to love or hate either. These are all their in the gene pool. Many children are raised with high moral ethics etc, yet they tend towards getting their benefit. Even evolutionists believe that the brain is very egotistical. Do some research on that. GOD Bless!

phoenix1

peace Idolfree1

Peace be upon you,

I havent gotten caught up but I read the last few posts. I just wanted to add my understanding of the topic

I have "ruh" as Divine Energy and Nafs as "Spirit"

Basically the polarity of energy/matter, keeping in mind that even thoughts are matter.

The matter side will lose form but the energy will always remain.

the energy will remain, but wouldn't it get transferred to other beings like the worms and insects who will feast on the body?

unknownuser

See, in the above two verses can't mean Dead in te future

Dead in the future!?

good morning

excuse my english bro, i mean to die in the future, is that what yuo mean by Mayyet?

He thinks that if there is a Shadda on the second letter ?Ya? in the word will make the word means ?Dead in the future? instead of just ?Dead with no association to time?, I never heard of such rule in arabic to be honest.

I am sure nobody has heard of this rule because you have just invented it. roll

Ask an Arabic language professor about the word 'Mayyit'. He/she will tell you that it does not mean dead.

ask an arabic professor?

well, i don't need to for this very simple word that was explained clearly by the Quran itself

and that is why you need a professor hey, because that professor is a human who is from the humans who invented Tashkil, LOL

can you gurantee to me first that the tashkil in the Quran as it is now has no errors?

All The ayat that you brought have the word Mayyit, which does not mean dead. Mayyit means either dying or death is written on it.
When Allah speaks to Muhammad saying "You are Mayyit.." Do you think it means "You are dead"!!!???

with Allah, there is no time limit, he can use the past to indicate future, don't you know that?

how about the people who died before mohammad then, are they included in that verse "You are Mayyit and they are Mayytoon"?

The word 'Mayt' does mean 'Dead'.

and the word mayyit 100% means dead, not to die

the flaw is evident because you are trying to use a noun to express a timed verb lol

Do yo think there are not in the Quran any ayat with the word 'Mayt'?

of course it is mentioned many times and I think it will refute you too becaus you will see that in these verses it does not mean already dead

but honestly bro, i don't have time to waste any more on this subject

if you think that using Tashkil which is nothing but sort of vowls in english is a strong evidence to prove your incarnation over the tens of crystal clear and direct verses others and myself posted that deny it, then fine go for it

as if, if i don't believe in it i will be punished if incarnation is true

while on the other hand if you believe in it and it was not true i guess you will have a big surprise in the JD, not sure what will be the way out then

Salam

TAJ

Good morning to you too, Ahmed,

and that is why you need a professor hey, because that professor is a human who is from the humans who invented Tashkil, LOL

Since you are so above the tashkil and you don't need it in order to read the Quran correctly, to differentiate between the similarly written words, let me then ask you about this veeery simple Arabic word '' from the root Ba-Ya'-Nun. Can you tell me how many ways this word can be pronounced, and what every pronunciation mean? And also I would like you to write each pronunciation in Arabic and in English so that those who don't know Arabic can see the difference. Thank you.

can you gurantee to me first that the tashkil in the Quran as it is now has no errors?
Since you believe that there are errors in tashkil Al Quran then, please, bring out those errors!

with Allah, there is no time limit, he can use the past to indicate future, don't you know that?
Are you comparing us with Allah!? And of course, Allah can use past tense to indicate the future. Did you see me or anybody else here say anything, let alone object, about that!? roll

how about the people who died before mohammad then, are they included in that verse "You are Mayyit and they are Mayytoon"?
The Quran was a revelation to Muhammad. The ayah means "Death is written on you (Muhammad) and on them"
You ask about the people who died before Muhammad. What about those people!? Of course death was written on them too! What is your point?
Was there a Quran revealed to the people before the time of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh)? Can you answer that?

the flaw is evident because you are trying to use a noun to express a timed verb
A timed verb!!!??? Another new rule of your invetion roll
Mayyit is not even a noun. Mayyit is an ADJECTIVE = SSIFAH Dying/death is written on it/him/them.

Do yo think there are not in the Quran any ayat with the word 'Mayt'?
of course it is mentioned many times and I think it will refute you too becaus you will see that in these verses it does not mean already dead
Since you know that there are ayat in the Quran containing the word 'Mayt', why then YOU AVOIDED them? Show us that you know the difference, that 'Mayt' is not 'Mayyit' and bring those ayat!

if you think that using Tashkil which is nothing but sort of vowls in english is a strong evidence to prove your incarnation over the tens of crystal clear and direct verses others and myself posted that deny it, then fine go for it
OMG! You wrote "Which is nothing but sort of vowels in English"!!! So vowels are no big deal to you!!! roll Try to speak or write one English word without a vowel!

The ayat that you brought in your previous posts do not deny the possibility of reincarnation. As a matter of fact the Ayat + speak about the position of AL KUFFAR who believe that it is just ONE MOWTAH = ONE DEATH EXPERIENCE.

That ONE DEATH EXPERIENCE is just GRANTED ONLY to AL MUTTAQEEN but not to DENIERS.

Nor will they there taste Death, except the first death; and He will preserve them from the Penalty of the Blazing Fire, -

I don't know why you are so happy with your denial when deniel is only the postion of Al KUFFAR! They insist that it is only one death

"There is nothing beyond our first death, and we shall not be raised again."

"Except our first death, and that we shall not be punished"

unknownuser

Good morning to you too, Ahmed,

cheers taj

and that is why you need a professor hey, because that professor is a human who is from the humans who invented Tashkil, LOL

Since you are so above the tashkil and you don't need it in order to read the Quran correctly, to differentiate between the similarly written words, let me then ask you about this veeery simple Arabic word '' from the root Ba-Ya'-Nun. Can you tell me how many ways this word can be pronounced, and what every pronunciation mean? And also I would like you to write each pronunciation in Arabic and in English so that those who don't know Arabic can see the difference. Thank you.

I?m sooooorry bro, I?m not sitting an Arabic language test in here, I respond using the Quran according to the questions raised regarding the Quran, I don?t have time to waste with this type of silly questions

But if you put the question in conjunction with a Quran verse, I may look at it

can you gurantee to me first that the tashkil in the Quran as it is now has no errors?

Since you believe that there are errors in tashkil Al Quran then, please, bring out those errors!

wrong answer

my question was like this

can you guarantee to me first that the tashkil in the Quran as it is now has no errors?

This is a simple YES/NO answer, not to blabber that I believe that there is errors, I didn?t say there is errors as I don?t really know because I have not qualified the tashkil in it neither I?m interested to do as such, it is not like I will sit and count multiple of 19 LOL

But what I?m sure about is this

the tashkil is man made and was added to the Quran
there is a possibility of mistakes in any man made thingy, like the hadith and the bible exactly

with Allah, there is no time limit, he can use the past to indicate future, don't you know that?

Are you comparing us with Allah!?

What sort of question is that?

What in my comment made you think as such non sense?

But if we talk Rahmah ?Mercy? yes I can compare Allah with humans regarding the subject of Rahmah, and I will end up saying ?Allah is Arham Al Rahmeen?, in fact Mohammad was classified as Rahim in the Quran

And of course, Allah can use past tense to indicate the future.

that is the answer I was expecting

Did you see me or anybody else here say anything, let alone object, about that!? roll

I don?t know, I didn?t have my web cam on to see you or see anyone else.

Who is objecting exactly?

how about the people who died before mohammad then, are they included in that verse "You are Mayyit and they are Mayytoon"?

The Quran was a revelation to Muhammad. The ayah means "Death is written on you (Muhammad) and on them"

fine, I accept that interpretation, and ?them? are the ones who already dead as well in addition to the present and future ones

You ask about the people who died before Muhammad. What about those people!? Of course death was written on them too! What is your point?

what is your point using this verse?,

yes I know that death is written on everyone, what a heck of confusion you are making exactly?

I can see your non confidence indeed, you are dodging to tell us how do you think that the Quran approves reincarnation, just cut it short and we will see if you have a point

I want to know if you think that the people who died before Mohammad are dead and their souls are held somewhere until the JD or do you think the souls of those dead people are reincarnated in other humans?

Please cut it short taj and explain the Quran verses you think it support your incarnation.

Was there a Quran revealed to the people before the time of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh)? Can you answer that?

there was no Quran then, but there was Zaboor, Injil, and Torah, possibly many other messages sent that we don?t know of and was not told about in the Quran

Now let me ask you, where my answer of this silly question will take you exactly?, what are you building on? LOL

the flaw is evident because you are trying to use a noun to express a timed verb )

A timed verb!!!??? Another new rule of your invetion roll

yeh that is right I invented the followings

Past tense
Present Tense
Future Tense

Mayyit is not even a noun. Mayyit is an ADJECTIVE = SSIFAH Dying/death is written on it/him/them.

Haha

Yokhrig Al Mayyit Min Al Hai

Haha again indeed, look again above and you will see that this is a name not an adjective, and sure in the verse Inak Mayyit, the word is also a noun and is called ?Khabar Ina? in that verse, this is something that is hard for you indeed to comprehend.

But I agree that it can be an adjective

You need some serious Arabic lessons, I can do it free for you LOL

At least, I concluded what level you have in the Arabic language if you have any, thanks for letting me know

Please don?t think that Arabic is as easy as English or Spanish

Do yo think there are not in the Quran any ayat with the word 'Mayt'?
of course it is mentioned many times and I think it will refute you too becaus you will see that in these verses it does not mean already dead

Since you know that there are ayat in the Quran containing the word 'Mayt', Show us that you know the difference, that 'Mayt' is not 'Mayyit' and bring those ayat!

I guess that was an assumption by you ?that I avoided it?, LOL, you like conjectures, don?t you?, but let me tell you that was the wrong conjecture

Look mister Taj, I don?t dodge or fear anyone on this planet,

I was refuting your false claim about Mayyit , that is why I brought the verses that included the same exact words with the same tashkil to expose your fatal mistake.

Now, it is my turn assume, why didn?t you bring these verses with the same tashkil first to support your argument?

why then YOU AVOIDED them?

let me ask you the same question

why then YOU AVOIDED the two verses I posted when you brought in ?Inak Mayyit verse??

Show us that you know the difference, that 'Mayt' is not 'Mayyit' and bring those ayat!

Haha

I?m not saying they are different, where you got this from?

Come on taj, don?t loose concentration, I said all the way that they mean the same and the tashkil has no effect on their meanings, they are one word, not two, look at the letters and compare again

You may have some rest first taj, your comments sound very tired, after the rest then compare the letters again and tell me if they look the same

if you think that using Tashkil which is nothing but sort of vowls in english is a strong evidence to prove your incarnation over the tens of crystal clear and direct verses others and myself posted that deny it, then fine go for it

OMG! You wrote "Which is nothing but sort of vowels in English"!!! So vowels are no big deal to you!!! roll Try to speak or write one English word without a vowel!

wow, you think back to front for sure, but I will excuse you due to my lack of English

what I meant mister, that it is nothing IN ARABIC because they are not letters, I didn?t mean they are nothing in English because I understand that vowels in English ARE BLOODY REAL LETTERS UNLIKE ARABIC

this discussion is really boring and I?m going to knock it of soon if you insist on this BS instead of discussing the Quran

please don?t waste my time brother taj, try to find a reincarnation advocate and get together in the chat chat

The ayat that you brought in your previous posts do not deny the possibility of reincarnation. As a matter of fact the Ayat + speak about the position of AL KUFFAR who believe that it is just ONE MOWTAH = ONE DEATH EXPERIENCE.

that is logically right, it is one taste of death, this is the only death that humans will feel ?Taste?, despite Allah told us about two death and two lifes, we only taste one death and 4456 confirmed that.

That ONE DEATH EXPERIENCE is just GRANTED ONLY to AL MUTTAQEEN but not to DENIERS.

Nor will they there taste Death, except the first death; and He will preserve them from the Penalty of the Blazing Fire, -

Yep, that is right, IT IS ONLY ONE TASTE OF DEATH FOR ALL OF US, the other death is a metaphor

This verse actually refute the satanic reincarnation concept, because it confirms resurrection on the JD after that only one taste of death.

I don't know why you are so happy with your denial when deniel is only the postion of Al KUFFAR! They insist that it is only one death

what a manipulation that was, it is you that are in denial by injecting non sense to Allah clear message and in the way misleading hundreds, I?m sure you will be held responsible by Allah in the JD for this non sense you are trying to promote using His words after twisting and manipulating it very bad indeed while you lack the language from the first place

"There is nothing beyond our first death, and we shall not be raised again."

That is right, they are denying the resurrection mister smart, a child who is a true believer will understand this verse with ease

"Except our first death, and that we shall not be punished"

I guess you didn?t read ? we shall not be punished?, LOL

See they are denying the resurrection

My respect to you and your intelligence just went down the drain, and it is time to knock it off

C u and enjoy your next lives when you will be reincarnated many times

unknownuser

Peace Ahmed, Taj, all,

First of all, brother Ahmed, sister Taj is a she not a he and she already tried telling you that.

Also, I am a sister, in case you have forgotten. Salam

Can you kindly address her as sister or sis, and not bro or mister ?

I am joining this discussion not to take any sides but to find the truth. My current understanding is that there is no reincarnation, meaning another life on this current earth. I do however believe in resurrection, meaning other life not on the current earth but somewhere else.

Having said that, I believe that eventually we will have a total of two resurrections, and thus a total of three lives.

The first life was before our current life, and that life was not on the current earth but somewhere else. Before that first life, we were nothing. So first we were created, then our first life began, not on earth but somewhere else. Then we died and were resurrected on this earth, so our current life is the second life. Then we will die again and will be resurrected again somewhere else, other than the current earth, when we will be rewarded or punished for our deeds, and that will be our third and final life. There will be no death after that.

The evidence from al-qur'aan supporting this is the following

228 How can you reject God when you were dead and He brought you to life? Then He makes you die, then He brings you to life, then to Him you return.

The word "maut" is derived from the root "mat". According to Dictionary of the Holy Quran by Abdul Mannan Omar

MAATA To die, die away (fire), be burn out, become still (wind)

As you will notice, the meanings of "maata" imply a pre-existing stage. "To die" implies that it was "alive" before. "Die away (fire)" implies that the fire was burning or present before. "Become still (wind)" implies that the wind was moving before.

One has to be alive to die. Life does not imply a preceding death, but death implies a preceding life.

The words used in 228 are "wakuntum amwatan" and "thumma yumeetukum", both forms of the same word derived from the same root. So they cannot have different meaning. So it cannot mean "when you were NON-EXISTENT/NOTHING" in the first part and "then He makes you DIE" in the second part. Both parts mean death.

"Wakuntum amwatan" meaning "when you were dead" automatically implies that one was alive before. Allah could easily have said "you were nothing" in 228 but He does not say that. The arabic would be "wa-lam yaku shay-an" as in the following ayat

1968 Does man not remember that We created him before that and he was nothing (wa-lam yaku shay-an) at all ?

The God could easily have used the same words in 228, but He did not.

So putting 228 and 1968 together, the stages are as follows

Creation of mankind ---> first life (before this earthly life) ---> first death (wakuntum amwatan) ----> second life (on earth) ---> second death (thumma yumeetukum) ---> third life (hereafter) ---> return to Him.

So there are 3 lives and two deaths according to 228

One can be brought to life THEN return to Him (The God). There is no "death" in between these two last stages.

4011 They will Say "Our Lord, You have made us die twice, and You have brought us back to life twice. Now we have confessed our sins. Is there any way out of this path?"

The word used is "amattana" which is a form of the same word "maut" derived from the same root as in 228, and means "made us die". The people will remember everything when they are brought to life in the hereafter and they will remember 2 deaths and then being brought back to life twice, i.e. after each death. "Is there any way out of this path" means there will be no further deaths or lives.

Having said that, there is still no contradiction between 228 and 4011. 4011 also implies 3 lives and 2 deaths. "You have made us die twice" automatically implies that they were alive before each death. "You have brought us back to life twice" implies that they were brought back to life after each death. So combining the two parts implies 3 lives and 2 deaths.

Please note that 4011 is a statement being made by the people on the judgment day, and Allah is just quoting the statement made by people. It is possible by the people to make an imprecise statement. However 4011 still implies 3 lives and 2 deaths. The people mention two deaths, which automatically IMPLIES 3 lives. Then they talk ONLY about the two times they were BROUGHT BACK to life AFTER the two deaths, not the TOTAL number of lives. The first life after our creation was NOT BRINGING US BACK to life. Bringing back to life can happen only after death.

2 lives would imply only one death

Life ---> death ---> life
1------------------------2

However both 228 and 4011 clearly tell us about 2 deaths, therefore implying 3 total lives

Life ---> death ---> life ---> death ---> life
1-----------------------2-----------------------3

We will eventually have a total of not 2 lives but 3 lives, and a total of 2 deaths.

7172 And your Lord took for the children of Adam from their backs, their progeny; and He made them witness over themselves "Am I not your Lord?" They said "Yes, we bear witness." Thus you cannot say on the Day of Resurrection that you were unaware of this.

All mankind was made to bear witness by Allah in our first life that He is our Lord and we all agreed. That must have happened in our previous life elsewhere, not on this earth. This conversation between Allah and children of Adam took place in the life preceding the earthly life.

Now it would seem that the following verses talk about one death only

3759 "Except for our first death, and we will not be punished?"
4435 "There is nothing but our first death; and we will never be resurrected!"

Firstly, The word "first" automatically implies more deaths. If there was only one death then the verses would have said "death" only and not "first death".

Secondly, both verses are quotation of statement made by people while they were on earth, and people can make mistakes and what they said while being on earth might not be the absolute truth. While they were on earth, the people did not remember their ACTUAL FIRST DEATH preceding the life on earth, so they mistakenly think that the death after their life on earth is their first death and that is why they are addressing their death after their life on earth as their first death.

Now I can see that brother Ahmed will pounce on me here, and will have a "surprise" for me by quoting 4456

4456 They do not taste death therein except for the first death, and He has spared them the retribution of Hell.

One might think that 4456 implies that there is no death after the "first death", so there is only one death. However 228 and 4011 clearly mention two deaths, so is that a contradiction ? Brother Ahmed tries to resolve this by saying that the first death was just a metaphor but that cannot be true because 4011 says "you have made us die twice", so both deaths are referred to at the same time and therefore, the first death CANNOT be a metaphor.

This had me stumped for a while but then alhamdulillah I discovered what Allah is saying in 4456.

Let us take a closer look at this verse and the verses before and after

4455 They enjoy in it all kinds of fruits, in perfect peace.
4456 They do not taste death therein except for the first death, and He has spared them the retribution of Hell.
4457 As a blessing from your Lord. Such is the great triumph.

As we can see that the context of these verses is heaven. In 4456 Allah is saying that the inhabitants of heaven will not taste death THEREIN (in heaven), except for the first death. So obviously He is talking about their death in heaven and not on earth. This solves the mystery where we were before our first death mentioned in 228 and 4011.

WE WERE IN HEAVEN BEFORE OUR FIRST DEATH !!! so we died while we were in heaven and then we were resurrected on earth. So we did die THEREIN (in heaven), and that was our first and only death in heaven, and 4456 is ONLY mentioning our death THEREIN (in heaven).

Mystery solved, no contradiction, and NO REINCARNATION.

unknownuser

Peace Ahmed, Taj, all,

First of all, brother Ahmed, sister Taj is a she not a he and she already tried telling you that.

Also, I am a sister, in case you have forgotten. Salam

Can you kindly address her as sister or sis, and not bro or mister ?

Sorry, the name sounds male for me

but sure will address her as a she, i was not trying to insult her or somethin

salam

Tay

Peace Hasan,

Thanks for the detailed reply. You've certainly provided some food for thought.