Following the religion of Abraham
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I grew up in Sunni Islam, and because of my cultural heritage this also included lots of superstitious BS that we followed and never questioned. In my teens I went in head-deep and did everything I was told and everything I read, I prayed five times a day in Arabic, often without a feeling in my heart or real understanding to the purpose of prayer, I even glued my face to the floor whenever a woman was around. Looking back at this, I was na?ve and idealistic about my faith and really didn?t understand anything, I was really just staying in formation with what the majority did. I held onto my faith and wherever I went I was renowned as ?the Muslim guy?, I continued to pray five times a day and follow the majority. However, I have always felt different to the people at the Mosque and didn?t really have any Muslim friends, in fact I have always felt quite intimidated by some Muslims. I never really cared for the insane things I heard in the hadith, but I dared not to question any of it and just continued being a ?Muslim?.
Then one day my friend who had converted to Islam encouraged me to read Free Minds, I was upset at what I read on Free Minds and told him off. How could he think he knew better and go against hundreds of years of traditions of the fastest growing religion in the world? After the initial upset wore off after a year or so, I started to read into Free Minds and started studying Islam more than before and pondering into life, and I began to see how much of my commitment to faith was not based on intelligence. The more I researched, the more I felt that I had to categorically denounce the hadith as a source of divine law. Does God really care about my beard and that I?ve folded my trousers above my ankles? In the greater scope of life, aren?t good deeds much more important than arbitrary iconic practices?
I?ve always felt that God?s truth is easy and is staring us in the face, and one day I brought it down to this ? ?If I follow the Quran alone, can I go wrong?? I asked this question to someone at the Mosque, and without hesitating he said ?Yes? and then preached more hadith to me. I can?t believe he said that, can you imagine telling God that on Judgement day? I?ve even heard an Imam at a Mosque give a sermon and say ?the Quran is not enough?, he then went on about the sunnah/hadith and why ?music is haraam?. I couldn?t believe what I was hearing, I was upset and felt that I didn?t belong there.
The last few years have been spiritually difficult for me, plenty of things in my life went wrong and I became very depressed. I went to the Mosque sometimes an hour before prayers just to ponder about God, life, religion and only then started to read the Quran as a way of finding God, but still no answer came and so the stress increased. My belief in the Quran was still part assumption based on emotional baggage and not intelligence. I noticed that my five daily prayers were not actions of offering humility, asking for forgiveness and giving praise, they were more like motions I was going through due to a force of habit. As I ?prayed? my mind was elsewhere thinking about other things, and because of this I stopped praying because I refused to do it out of insincerity. I was in a void and I felt that I couldn?t do anything about it, that God wasn?t there, and along with the personal problems I was up against I became really depressed. Life is still difficult because I feel ostracised from the majority, I?ve questioned everything and now I feel quite numb. I?ve prayed to God for help, but when no answer came I?ve been left in a void. However, I have ascertained for myself that even if this feeling lasted for the rest of my life, I have conceded to the intelligent design of the universe around me that there must be a God, and that the virtues of all that is good and true are his blessings for us to hold onto, and that when all is said is done that we will face our judgement, the punishment for our sins and the reward for our good deeds.
Whatever happens next, at least I know that when I face God, I can tell him that although this is the way I felt, that at least I was honest with myself and did not follow what everyone else did just because they were the majority. And if honesty is a true virtue from God, then at least I will have had that to my name. I often think that perhaps God has made this difficult for me on purpose so that I could purge myself of doubt and become a true believer.
For now, I am going to focus on increasing my efforts in good deeds and reading the Quran until I am good enough to rehearse its message to others for a beneficial purpose. I pray and hope that God will see my efforts and put me at ease soon. -
peace be upon you truthseeker,
welcome to the forum,
did you say that you used to be forced to pray five times?
what is opinion on the issue of salat?
i gave up salat(the traditional prayer) because
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if i do i support the 'miraj' story, if i support the miraj story then i follow outside quranic sources.
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i completely gave up the hadith. part of the salat is based on the hadith, at this web-site i was informed that the salat means "contact with allah" which compromises the sunni meaning but they interpret it literally to physically bow down facing mecca.
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the "focal point" god mentioned in the quran, from my interpretations, it has to do with what part of life do you support not a specific point... "to god belongs the east and the west".
peace, rifat
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Peace be upon you Stitch
Welcome to the forums!
I know how you feel about that individual in the mosque stating "the Qu'ran is not enough." Seriously, would they even think about telling that to GOD during their judgment? Would they even dare tell GOD that His own message for us is incomplete and that we have to depend on the writings of scholars? That should be logical that the poison these speakers give out to many people is quite blasphemous.
One time I was chatting with a man who speaks at a mosque about being Qu'ran alone and he treated me like worthless trash. I simply told him that I only follow the Qu'ran and he said so many things that really upset me. He told me that I was saying every other Muslim is an idiot and that I think I'm the best Muslim to ever exist. He went on and on about how the writings of the scholars are reliable and straight from the prophet himself. I gave him verses from the Qu'ran that support our view of Islam and he acted like a vampire seeing a cross.
Last night I was reading though the forums and I stumbled upon a Sunni who actually admitted that he loves Muhammad more than Allah and he even used hadiths to support it.
I'm glad you made it here and that your eyes are open.
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Peace "AbdulMajid",
Last night I was reading though the forums and I stumbled upon a Sunni who actually admitted that he loves Muhammad more than Allah and he even used hadiths to support it.
JK- Really? Please post the site hear. I want to read his views and those hadith which he quotes. GOD Bless!
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Salaam Stitch,
welcome to the forum
Your story is a very good read. I really like it when people are being honest and sincere in seeking the truth. God works in mysterious ways indeed. Just be glad at least God has shown you a path to something that you feel will bring you closer to the truth that you've been seeking all this time.
=adley=
PS Where's Lilo?
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peace stitch,
Welcome to the forum. I am also from the UK, and there are quite a few of us now. D
On the surface, your story reads like a spiritual & emotional decline, with comments like
I was in a void and I felt that I couldn?t do anything about it, that God wasn?t there, and along with the personal problems I was up against I became really depressed.
But that is not the way I see your journey. I see it like the sculptor who strips away the inessentials to reveal the true form of a thing. Now that, is a beautiful process... and I believe that is what you were referring to with the following comment
I often think that perhaps God has made this difficult for me on purpose so that I could purge myself of doubt and become a true believer.
God bless.
Wakas
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peace be upon you truthseeker,
welcome to the forum,
did you say that you used to be forced to pray five times?
what is opinion on the issue of salat?
i gave up salat(the traditional prayer) because
-
if i do i support the 'miraj' story, if i support the miraj story then i follow outside quranic sources.
-
i completely gave up the hadith. part of the salat is based on the hadith, at this web-site i was informed that the salat means "contact with allah" which compromises the sunni meaning but they interpret it literally to physically bow down facing mecca.
-
the "focal point" god mentioned in the quran, from my interpretations, it has to do with what part of life do you support not a specific point... "to god belongs the east and the west".
peace, rifat
Hi,
You could never be out of Quranic sources by not prayer for the Qur'an teaches us to pray.Why don't you believe in hadith? Without hadith there is no Sunnah oif Muhammad(saw).
The Qur'an does say that it doesn't matter where you face East or West because both belongs to Allah(swt) only if you're not sure of the direction. If you are sure of the direction and you are able to face East then East you must face.
I hope this was helpful.
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salah-ad-din wrote
mr. humble wrote
peace be upon you truthseeker,to the forum,
did you say that you used to be forced to pray five times?
what is opinion on the issue of salat?
i gave up salat(the traditional prayer) because
-
if i do i support the 'miraj' story, if i support the miraj story then i follow outside quranic sources.
-
i completely gave up the hadith. part of the salat is based on the hadith, at this web-site i was informed that the salat means "contact with allah" which compromises the sunni meaning but they interpret it literally to physically bow down facing mecca.
-
the "focal point" god mentioned in the quran, from my interpretations, it has to do with what part of life do you support not a specific point... "to god belongs the east and the west".
peace, rifat
Hi,
You could never be out of Quranic sources by not prayer for the Qur'an teaches us to pray.Why don't you believe in hadith? Without hadith there is no Sunnah oif Muhammad(saw).
The Qur'an does say that it doesn't matter where you face East or West because both belongs to Allah(swt) only if you're not sure of the direction. If you are sure of the direction and you are able to face East then East you must face.
I hope this was helpful.it doesn't help me unfortunately because i am confused whether if there is a verse in the quran telling us to perform salat ffacing 'the sanctuary'...
it does say to seek help through the salat but however, in the quran i did not find specific evidence which supports the sunni style of prayer...peace, rifat
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Peace stitch. I wish you well on the journey. Remember what has got you to this point.......Your free-thinking mind.....we should all try to keep our minds open whilst doing genuine good deeds...
Peace all. -
Thank you all for your replies of support and kind words, it is a comfort to know that there are others who through individual ascertainment of intelligence have come to similar conclusions as myself.
Mr Humble -
I wasn't physically forced by others to pray five times a day, but that was the standard by which "Muslims" measured themselves by and I just assumed it was a directive from the Quran. Nowadays, I consider my prayer to be whenever I choose to reflect upon life and seek God, but I also make time to sit, face Mecca as a focal point and pray to God too.AbdulMajid -
It seems like we have both encountered the same type of cultural sycophant at the Mosque (all tradition, no intelligence). As much disdain as I feel for those who are like that, I understand that it is because of their inability to challenge the norm of what the majority do even if they are blatantly wrong.Adley -
Thank you for recognising my journey as being honest and sincere. As for Lilo, she does exist in the form of a supportive big Sister.Wakas -
Thank you for your metaphorical analogy of my journey in the form of a sculptor and his sculpture. It is very apt and I found it very helpful.Enquirer -
Indeed, it is important to retain a free thinking mind whilst investing in genuine good deeds, as faith must be a consistent quantity of belief and action of the best quality.Thank you all again, I strongly urge others who have yet to post on this forum to come forward and join the gang. I had been reading Free Minds for years before I decided to post my story, but inshallah this is a good step in my personal journey where the like-minded company of the individuals on this forum may help all of us to betterment.
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Yes Mr. Humble.
There are verses telling us to face the East and West. -
peace, salah-ad-din,
i know this fact. i have read them myself. but does allah tell us to PERFORM SALAT facing east and west specifically? you did not understand my question... i am not the type of person who assumes without any specificness...
peace, rifat
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Peace and welcome, Stitch,
Thanks for sharing your story with such articulation. You stated
Life is still difficult because I feel ostracised from the majority, I?ve questioned everything and now I feel quite numb.
This will surely pass, as long as you realize that you are in control of this feeling of ostracism. For me, becoming aware of the truth brought me closer to people, because it allowed me to understand exactly why the blind were still blind. It is what it is. As the saying/prayer goes
God, I pray for the strength to change what I can change,
the patience to accept what I cannot change,
and the wisdom to recognize the difference.
(or something like that wink )May peace be upon you,
Tay -
Peace mr humble and all. I believe the verses that you remarked on concerning east and west can be interpreted as;
'Wherever you turn your face reality is present.'
In other words you cant get away from reality(morality.) wherever you are...Hope this helps.
Peace all. -
Salam Mr Humble,
Just because Sunni way of prayer doesnt exist in Al Quran, doesnt mean it must be wrong. So long as the ritual is meant solely to worship God and nothing in it goes against God's rules (As mentioned in Al Quran) I think there should be no problem.
As we know doing household chores is not directly mentioned in Al Quran. Does it mean it is wrong? No. Instead, by doing so indirecly we are implementing God's command because He likes us to be clean.
The same thing with ritual prayer. If it can help you feel closer to God (Making contact with Him) then it is not a problem. If you want you can change the way of prayer a lil bit just like what I do. I maintain Sunni way of prayer 3X a day with a lil change by taking out the part where we are supposed to mention Abraham and Muhammad.
Anyway, this is just my opinion. Personally, I cannot give up ritual prayer. If I dont do it I always feel there is something missing and makes me feel bad toward God. But, it is up to you if you feel giving up ritual prayer altogether makes you feel better. wink
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Peace jankren,i agree with some of your post. I dont pray in the sunni way any more,but my wife does. I think its fine as long as you feel it helps you to remember god and do good deeds. And as long as you dont do it just as a ritual,or insist there is no other way to connect to god. Different people have different methods that work for them,and some people can find 'physical' salat good for them at various stages in their life or spiritual development. I dont agree or appreciate peole calling people who pray 'physically' as idolators...
Intention,the persons spiritual level,individuality and whether the salat leads to peaceful behaviour are the main factors in the 'sucess' of a particular type of salat.
Peace all. -
Salaam to all,
I agree with what is being mentioned here; it is after all "why" you pray and not "how" you pray that matters. I used to pray the Sunni way, going through the motions and reciting Arabic which I didn't really understand. Once I really started researching Islam and became honest with myself, I understood that I was really just doing what everyone else was doing and following the majority. When I pray nowadays, I still face Mecca as a focal point, kneel and speak to God in English. I ask for forgiveness, I give praise and thanks and I ask that God strengthens my faith. Not that I have justify this to anyone, but this is what I do because I feel that it is right for me.
I know people who pray the traditional five times a day, every day, on time, in Arabic, they sport the beard or hijab etc, yet when I ask them if they have read the Quran for themselves in English (the language they understand) they gloss over in shame and I can hear in their voice as they squeak "No" that they have conceded a part of their faith to their very own hypocrisy. I can identify with this, because I used to be just like that.
God knows the truth of what is in our hearts, yet a lot of people continue to lie to themselves to fit in with what everyone else is doing. It's never been about the numbers; Noah was outnumbered, Abraham was outnumbered, Moses was outnumbered, Jesus was outnumbered, and Muhammad was outnumbered - yet their legends are held in truth centuries after them.
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Peace jankren,i agree with some of your post. I dont pray in the sunni way any more,but my wife does. I think its fine as long as you feel it helps you to remember god and do good deeds. And as long as you dont do it just as a ritual,or insist there is no other way to connect to god. Different people have different methods that work for them,and some people can find 'physical' salat good for them at various stages in their life or spiritual development. I dont agree or appreciate peole calling people who pray 'physically' as idolators...
Intention,the persons spiritual level,individuality and whether the salat leads to peaceful behaviour are the main factors in the 'sucess' of a particular type of salat.
Peace all.Peace enquirer,
Just curious ...What does your wife say regarding that (your not praying the sunny way any more)? -
Peace Andy. I dont pray in the sunni way generally,but that doesnt mean i wont pray in the sunni way at all. I believe that sometimes it might be beneficial to pray together as a family in order to grow together spiritually.
I believe any from of prayer can be beneficial as long as it is not harmful or totally illogical. I dont believe in hajj in the traditional way,but my wife does. I dont feel the need to go on hajj,but i would go with my wife because she wants to,and i feel its her freedom of conscience/belief to do so. She might get a beneficial spiritual experience from it,and i can help look after her while having a travel experience and a holiday. I believe many of us get too wrapped up or dogmatic on a particular way of practising religion,rather than the purpose of religion which is to achieve peace. I am a believer in letting people find peace by methods which work for them individually.(though we can all help each other with ideas,knowledge and suggestions.) I feel many friendships and marriages are put under unnecessary strain,or break-up because of close-mindedness or stubbourness in religious,or other matters...Compromise is not a dirty word...it helps to make the world go around. It helps immensely that i have an understanding and open-minded wife.
Peace all. -
peace jankren, enquirer, stitch and andy,
so your input basically means that the sunni style of salat is not correct (since not in the quran) but not wrong either if it 'serves its perpose' according to the quran. the reason why i brought this salat issue is because i approach this concept from a different perspective
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i feel that LEARNING about my surroundings and obtaining knowledge is mentioned more than 82 times(the sunni claim of salat mentioned in the quran) in the quran... when i learn about science i feel like i am learning about god... since it is firm evidence which reveals some of the characteristics about god because the creation is the art of god and what better way to learn about the artist from the example he has portrayed... so i feel closer to god learning about science(although learning is part of my life, it is not performed everyday at specific times ) because as i learn i guide myself closer to the truth which i found as a substitute for the salat).
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according ot this website, they claim that the history is DOUBTFUL. i do not mean to offend anyone but they are claiming that you shouldn't face mecca and pray towards the cubic structure... which is part of the hadith rejection movement as well as claiming that the prophet was literate(which is indirectly saying that the history is FALSE)... so, as you can see i have read a verse in the quran which says "clarity has come to you... so do not be of those who doubt"( sorry, i think it is the 2nd surah) and god repeatedly in the quran emphasised the importance of knowledge and clarity to support the truth.
since this website's claims and the sunni style of prayer is dubious, therefore, with knowledge and going further to learn about god is my substitution for salat but my message simply doesn't mean the fact that the sunni style is wrong; it simply means that
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people find out about themselves through constant meditation and for the muslims "salat". therefore, i constantly question myself to learn about myself clearly serving the purpose of salat.
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my mother asks me, then why don't i thank god by offering salat. my reply was that simply living up the task of understanding the quran and life is telling god that i am thankful enough to be his loyal servant. i am pleased for who i am and the situations god has put me through so i put my best effort towards life is simply thanking god to preach the message of peace.
D
peace, rifat
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