Why no record of prophets in europe,australasia and america?
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well, mister bukhari told us in his books that mister Mohammad said to his people to compare any hadith with the Quran to find out if he said it or not, if the Quran does not qualify it then the muslims should not uphold that hadith, again this is not what i said, it was mister bukhari in his books claiming that mister Mohammad said so, and I took that hadith by mister bukhari as a very truthful one indeed, and that is what I do, very simple
Peace Ahmed,
I didn't mean to say that that's what you said. I was just pointing out something people do in general that i don't like.I got you from the first time bro
but I also agree with your second comment
Cheers
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Peace kestrel. I think there are a significant number of 'brits' on this forum...And many of them believe in the quran.....And even recognise some of the hadith....Are these 'hell' creatures?
Peace all. ps;what about the sunni brits...Any news on where they are heading? -
Peace soul2squeeze, peace all
What people fail to see is the difference between a general use of knowledge and a knowledge relevant in the d?n.
This is what Ahmed lacked to see and made him start mocking my position again.
I do use historical knowledge, it has its place.
But it does not change my d?n in any way.
What if history is revised?
That happens all the time.Scienes are just a useful social convention. I do use the convention that the earth travels around the sun.
But I only believe that because clever people told me so. I haven?t done the experiments of Kepler, Galilei, Kopernikus myself. I haven?t travelled to the outer space.
And maybe in some centuries some scientist will claim the opposit again, we don?t know. In the Middle Ages people also thought their social conventions were true, just like we do now.So, one has to make a distinction
A is just a social convention, useful knowledge a times but not relevant to the d?n,
B is al-qur'?n, 100% relevant to the d?n.I refer to social conventions about the man Muhammad when it is not relevant for my conviction and practice in the d?n.
When it is relevant to the d?n I only refer to what is found in al-qur'?n.Regards,
Leyla
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Peace Leyla Peace Everyone,
Leyla, excellent last post! I think you hit it right on the money D
I do believe that scientific facts are laced in throughout the quran.. but if science changes, that makes science wrong not the quran (i.e. if scientists all of a sudden decided the earth was square LOL). So basically quran is the anchor to which anything else related to it must fit into and not the other way around. Be it science or hadith or the rig veda. Whatever strays from the meaning of the quran is disqualified from being true knowledge, as related to din, like you said before.
If the hadith tells me the Prophet Mohamed (p.b.u.h) liked to eat 3 dates, that's nice. It has nothing to do with din though. What if I'm allergic to dates or I'm a hog and ate 10 by accident -X lol
If the hadith tells me a monkey, a woman, a dog, or a donkey crossing in front of you while you pray nullifies your salat - that's weird and incredibly chauvinistic. I know that Allah gives a noble position to women and wouldn't degrade her as to put her in the same category as animals. I know that Allah provided all the laws in His book and never once did He mention women, monkeys, dogs and donkeys in the same verse. Therefore, the quran isn't all of a sudden incomplete or wrong - its the hadith that's funky.
In fact, if we all agree that the quran is clear, complete, and God does not forget to mention something, then we wouldn't really need to refer to hadith for our way of life to begin with! It doesn't mean we can't read it though. I can read any book in the world! It's the changing of God's words that becomes problematic.
As for the real topic of discussion, God specifically states in the quran that there were many many prophets and a billion stories but He only mentions to us that which is relevant and important to our lives. He also tells us that to every umma (peoples) and to every karyaten (town) God will send a monthir (warner) to be shahid (witness) against what they do. That may or may not equate prophethood. Plus, we're only guessing where the prophets in the quran are from. I read somewhere that Prophet Nuh (p.b.u.h) might have been from sub-Saharan Africa. But your guess is as good as mine.. God only knows.
Salam
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Enquirer Yes,they are all human,and so have the potential for mistakes,contradictions,incomplete understandings etc...I think we can get ideas off these guys,and then ascertain/verify if the ideas are practically beneficial or not,even if we have to modify,or reject some of their ideas...
That's indeed why I try to do. Besides, it's fun, bashing ideas around.
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Phoenix we can't include everyone in the Prophet's list.
There are some near greats but the prophet's should be only the few on top.
I won't anyone in the list except those mentioned in al-quraan and 'live' nabiyeen i've met in my life. All rest are heresay.
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Leyla However, the quranic nab? has a different function. He does indeed also warn of future events but of those of a higher order.
He is one who has news (naba) of al-akhirat and who warns and brings good news to humans, if I recall the relevant verses right.
At the same time, even the word ras?l is quite often translated as "prophet".
Ras?l, though, is just simply one who brings the ris?lah of God, no matter how, I?d say.
He is the one who practices tilaw?t-ul-qur'?n, close following of al-qur'?n.
There are also other related terms, like e.g. mursal.Further, 'AR-rasool' are certainly different from mere 'rusul'.
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Kestrel If britons were believers then we would have to go on putting up with them in the nextworld, but they are hell creatures... Thank God!
If you're not joking, then I must consider you an ignoramous. I know several Britons who outclass most 'muslims' i've known in terms of belief and goodness. How sad for you if you think this.
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Ahmednice one sister, no development here, i'm using the Quran aloners flawed logic, you and Mquran call him Moahammad Ibn Abd Allah, now I can prove to myself where this name came from, i want you to enlighten me in how you managed to call him Mohammad Ibn Abd Allah using the Quran alone please?
if you resorted to the hadith then sorry this is double standards, confusion and non sensible by you
if you believed the sunni when they called him Mohammad Ibn Abd allah, then how come you did that?, it still sounds double standards, confusion and non sensible by you
I used 'mohamed ibn Abdullah' for ease of discussion. Mohamed ibn Abdullah is simply the person who is historically known to recieve al-quraan. I could call him 'bob', 'joe', 'mr x' or whatever you like when im discussing with you. Don't get so hooked up on it, AB.
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Salaams all,
a prophet to every nation/all peoples is what it says so there are dozens who we havn't been able to recognise as such.
Has anybody done or has a list of the features or qualities of the Lords messenger ?
God Bless.
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Further, 'AR-rasool' are certainly different from mere 'rusul'.
Two question Mquran
- Why you write it "AR-rasool" and not "Al-rasool"?
- what is the difference between Al-rasool and rusl?
thanks
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I used 'mohamed ibn Abdullah' for ease of discussion.
bro, this is not going to make it easy because if you will call him mohammad ibn Abduallh, you have to tell me how you verified it to call him as such
Mohamed ibn Abdullah is simply the person who is historically known to recieve al-quraan.
so you acceot the history records?, well, can you please tell me how the history proved that Mohammad father is named Abd Allah
I could call him 'bob', 'joe', 'mr x' or whatever you like when im discussing with you.
thanks, i prefer Mohammad then
Don't get so hooked up on it, AB.
bro, there is no hooking here, my question to you and leyla stands, how did you verify that Mohammad father is named Abd Allah?
thanks
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Peace all,
I believe there's a fine line between a prophet (nabi) and messenger (rasool). With respect to Allah=Reality (as rightfully prophessed by enquirer) is THE TRUTH, NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH. A prophet can be anyone who initiates, propagates and adjudicates a message conforming to reality (the truth of events/circumstances as witnessed at any given time to be accurate, be that of past, present or present-continuous participle form). All those who agree with the prophet's (nabi's) message and expounds to further expanding/conveying the very message where it first originated from (i.e. the nabi) become messengers (rasool), keeping in mind that "THE GOD" IS REALITY.
Anyone knowing who or what GOD is 100% in CERTAINTY must come out and claim so??? Else don't make a FOOL out of yourselves and others at the same time. Once anyone knows who or what GOD IS, then let me know what Quran is all about?
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I used 'mohamed ibn Abdullah' for ease of discussion.
bro, this is not going to make it easy because if you will call him mohammad ibn Abduallh, you have to tell me how you verified it to call him as such
Mohamed ibn Abdullah is simply the person who is historically known to recieve al-quraan.
so you acceot the history records?, well, can you please tell me how the history proved that Mohammad father is named Abd Allah
I could call him 'bob', 'joe', 'mr x' or whatever you like when im discussing with you.
thanks, i prefer Mohammad then
Don't get so hooked up on it, AB.
bro, there is no hooking here, my question to you and leyla stands, how did you verify that Mohammad father is named Abd Allah?
thanks
The Leyla/Majnu relentless orthodoxical corroborations continues. A failed and debased partnership.
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Is it Muhammad ibne Abd Allah or Muhammad ibne Abdullah as per historical analysis? What's the difference?
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AB 1) Why you write it "AR-rasool" and not "Al-rasool"?
2) what is the difference between Al-rasool and rusl?-
Just writing it phonetically. Once again, its a personal choice.
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Ar-rasool is , in my reading, one who has allowed the office of risaalat take over his entire life. He is the leader of al-mumineen.
bro, this is not going to make it easy because if you will call him mohammad ibn Abduallh, you have to tell me how you verified it to call him as such
I didn't verify it and that's why i'm not standing by it. I use it to differentiate him from Muhammad as used in al-quraan.
so you acceot the history records?, well, can you please tell me how the history proved that Mohammad father is named Abd Allah
Once again, I do not. I'm using it for convenience, ease of communication. If you don't agree with this, fine with me.
thanks, i prefer Mohammad then
fine. I'll try to remember that.
bro, there is no hooking here, my question to you and leyla stands, how did you verify that Mohammad father is named Abd Allah?
There was a guy who recieved al-quraan for the first time. This is due to the fact that we're relying on linnear time and that al-quraan has the concept of people of before. This guy I call 'muhammad ibn abdullah' because when I talk to people about him, they're usually from the Sunni side. This makes it easier for me. If you disagree with this, no problem. I really couldn't care less
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Peace all,
I believe there's a fine line between a prophet (nabi) and messenger (rasool). With respect to Allah=Reality (as rightfully prophessed by enquirer) is THE TRUTH, NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH. A prophet can be anyone who initiates, propagates and adjudicates a message conforming to reality (the truth of events/circumstances as witnessed at any given time to be accurate, be that of past, present or present-continuous participle form). All those who agree with the prophet's (nabi's) message and expounds to further expanding/conveying the very message where it first originated from (i.e. the nabi) become messengers (rasool), keeping in mind that "THE GOD" IS REALITY.
Anyone knowing who or what GOD is 100% in CERTAINTY must come out and claim so??? Else don't make a FOOL out of yourselves and others at the same time. Once anyone knows who or what GOD IS, then let me know what Quran is all about?
Bro
Leyla explanation of Nabi, was spot on, it is anyone who "Yunabi" "sort of to say" about Allah and news raegarding prosperity in this life the JD (the news may be Good or Bad or both)
Rasool on the other hand is anyone who is sent by someone to a person ir a group of persons to deliver something (verbally or in writing)
therefore EVERY RASOOL IS A NABI, but not EVERY NABI IS A RASOOL
because the Rasool will also Yunabi about Allah and the future in addition to the other delivery task given to him as a Rasool
Peace
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Is it Muhammad ibne Abd Allah or Muhammad ibne Abdullah as per historical analysis? What's the difference?
I tend to write the arabic in eneglish letters without the tashkil to avoide confusion
Abd Allah "no tashkil"
Abdu Allah "with a dumma on both" oooo
Abdi Allah "with a kassarah" eeee
Abda Allah "with a fatiha" aaaa
some join the two words together in english but in arabic they are two separate words
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AB 1) Why you write it "AR-rasool" and not "Al-rasool"?
2) what is the difference between Al-rasool and rusl?-
Just writing it phonetically. Once again, its a personal choice.
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Ar-rasool is , in my reading, one who has allowed the office of risaalat take over his entire life. He is the leader of al-mumineen.
bro, this is not going to make it easy because if you will call him mohammad ibn Abduallh, you have to tell me how you verified it to call him as such
I didn't verify it and that's why i'm not standing by it. I use it to differentiate him from Muhammad as used in al-quraan.
so you acceot the history records?, well, can you please tell me how the history proved that Mohammad father is named Abd Allah
Once again, I do not. I'm using it for convenience, ease of communication. If you don't agree with this, fine with me.
thanks, i prefer Mohammad then
fine. I'll try to remember that.
bro, there is no hooking here, my question to you and leyla stands, how did you verify that Mohammad father is named Abd Allah?
There was a guy who recieved al-quraan for the first time. This is due to the fact that we're relying on linnear time and that al-quraan has the concept of people of before. This guy I call 'muhammad ibn abdullah' because when I talk to people about him, they're usually from the Sunni side. This makes it easier for me. If you disagree with this, no problem. I really couldn't care less )
cheers mquran
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