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  4. kill innocent pagans or guilty pagans?

kill innocent pagans or guilty pagans?

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  • U Offline
    U Offline
    unknownuser
    wrote on last edited by
    #1

    Salaams all,

    Can't figure this out! confused

    Do these forbidden months accur every year?

    Is this ayah about the pagans the treaty has been dissolved with?then why wait till the months have passed if the treaty has been dissolved?

    If its about those with whome the treaty hasn?t been dissolved with then why kill them after the months for simply being pagans ? as they aren?t breaking the treaty in any way?

    93
    And an announcement from Allah and His Messenger, to the people (assembled) on the day of the Great Pilgrimage,- that Allah and His Messenger dissolve (treaty) obligations with the Pagans. If then, ye repent, it were best for you; but if ye turn away, know ye that ye cannot frustrate Allah. And proclaim a grievous penalty to those who reject Faith.

    94
    (But the treaties are) not dissolved with those Pagans with whom ye have entered into alliance and who have not subsequently failed you in aught, nor aided any one against you. So fulfil your engagements with them to the end of their term for Allah loveth the righteous.

    Fa-itha insalakha al-ashhuru alhurumufaoqtuloo almushrikeena haythu wajadtumoohum wakhuthoohumwaohsuroohum waoqAAudoo lahum kulla marsadinfa-in taboo waaqamoo alssalatawaatawoo alzzakata fakhalloo sabeelahum innaAllaha ghafoorun raheemun

    But WHEN THE FORBIDDEN MONTHS ARE PAST, then fight and slay the Pagans wherever ye find them, an seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem (of war); but if they repent, and establish regular prayers and practise regular charity, then open the way for them for Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful.

    God Bless all.

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    • U Offline
      U Offline
      unknownuser
      wrote on last edited by
      #2

      Peace simple. This is a no-brainer...Never should innocents be harmed...

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      • A Offline
        A Offline
        Alen
        wrote on last edited by
        #3

        Salaam.

        Simple, Allah Knows Best, but it is possible that the pagans attacked those muslims AFTER the sacred months passed. Because we are told that we must not start the war/conflict but the sacred months are, at least this is my theory, for the people to cool off.

        Let's say tomorrow will be the first day of the four sacred months. The North Korea says it will attack us. Now, we can't fight them because sacred months are here but we are allowed to fight back. Now, we will protect ourselves but as soon as sacred months are over, mark my words, they will be waiting to strike at us because they will wait for a reason to fight.

        Sacred months are a period for us so that we cool off, but if some people love war, well, war shall they have. We must not start the war, we must not harm the innocent, we must not kill unarmed people, we must not kill someone who doesn't want to fight, we must not pull someone into the battle, but we are allowed to return fire.

        Allah Most High knows best.
        Salaam.

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        • T Offline
          T Offline
          TheNabi
          wrote on last edited by
          #4

          Peace

          Never should innocents be harmed...

          Contrary to the connotation made above, injustice to innocent people is not encouraged in those passages.

          Joe

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          • U Offline
            U Offline
            unknownuser
            wrote on last edited by
            #5

            Hello all

            The verses posted are related to a very well known incident regarding the Kaaba, , it was a place for all to come to worship the God and also for trading, even the Kafiroon used to go there and do whatever, mostly going around the kaaba as Salat, the Kafiroon also used to do a very indecent act, they used to do the Tawaf (going around the Kaaba) NAKED, exactly like the filthy scenes we see in the Mardi Gras and this is when these verses in Sura 9 was revealed (this is the last sura that was revealed which means was at the last days of Mohammad, you will also notice that it does not have the Bismillah (in the name of Allah??.)?, some say that it does not have the Bismillah because it is full of threats to those Kafiroon and their filthy act around the Kaaba, but somehow I can?t buy this, anyway the objective and the message is clear and was to reclaim the Kaaba ?the house of Allah?, looking at all the verses that I brought in here we will see the picture crystal clear, I will list the verses in English then the original language in Arabic, and my walkthrough will follow

            1- (This is a declaration of) immunity by Allah and His Messenger towards those of the idolaters with whom you made an agreement.

            2- So go about in the land for four months and know that you cannot weaken Allah and that Allah will bring disgrace to the unbelievers.

            3- And an announcement from Allah and His Messenger to the people on the day of the greater pilgrimage that Allah and His Messenger are free from liability to the idolaters; therefore if you repent, it will be better for you, and if you turn back, then know that you will not weaken Allah; and announce painful punishment to those who disbelieve.

            4- Except those of the idolaters with whom you made an agreement, then they have not failed you in anything and have not backed up any one against you, so fulfill their agreement to the end of their term; surely Allah loves those who are careful (of their duty).

            5- So when the sacred months have passed away, then slay the idolaters wherever you find them, and take them captives and besiege them and lie in wait for them in every ambush, then if they repent and keep up prayer and pay the poor-rate, leave their way free to them; surely Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.
            6- And if anyone of the idolaters seeketh thy protection (O Muhammad), then protect him so that he may hear the Word of Allah, and afterward convey him to his place of safety. That is because they are a folk who know not.

            7- How can there be an agreement for the idolaters with Allah and with His Messenger; except those with whom you made an agreement at the Sacred Mosque? So as long as they are true to you, be true to them; surely Allah loves those who are careful (of their duty).

            (1)
            (2)
            (3)
            (4)
            (5)
            (6)
            (7)

            -> Verse 1, when the incident happened Allah wanted Mohammad to make an agreement with those crazy kafiroon, by telling them that they should stop their mardi gras non sense and act properly around the Kaaba and they will have immunity (This is a declaration of) immunity by Allah and His Messenger towards those of the idolaters with whom you made an agreement. , the fact about the kaaba mardi gras is known from the history records

            -> Verse 2, - There is 4 scared months in the lunar year, humans used to come to the Kaaba in these 4 months, one month of these 4 is the one when the great hajj is performed, it is like, in the other 3 months they used to do a minor version of hajj, during this time also the Muslims are not allowed to fight the enemy ?UNLESS IT IS A MUST?, the verse is just mentioning these moths and also issued a warning to the Kafiroon regarding those 4 sacred months, ?So go about in the land for four months and know that you cannot weaken Allah and that Allah will bring disgrace to the unbelievers.,

            -> Verse 3, this is where I believe the warning was given to the Kafiroon not to do Tawaf naked around the Kaaba on the day of the Great hajj ? And an announcement from Allah and His Messenger to the people on the day of the greater pilgrimage that Allah and His Messenger are free from liability to the idolaters;, we can see straight after the warning that repenting from this evil act was on the offer for them, ?therefore if you repent, it will be better for you?, but of they insist of this evil act ? and if you turn back, then know that you will not weaken Allah; and announce painful punishment to those who disbelieve. ? similar warning to the one in 92

            -> Verse 4, here is things will become a bit clearer, sure some Kafiroon are intelligent enough to understand what they were doing is crazy, especially after the great warning was given accompanied with an offer to repent,- ?Except those of the idolaters with whom you made an agreement, then they have not failed you in anything and have not backed up any one against you, so fulfill their agreement to the end of their term; surely Allah loves those who are careful (of their duty). , see how clear it is, you have to also know that the words ? fulfill their agreement to the end of their term? means that no Muslim should fight during these 4 months, but if they want to fight us to take the Kaaba ?for example to do the naked Tawaf? then the agreement is to wait after the end of these 4 months and then bring it on Kafiroon

            -> Verse 5, and if the 4 sacred months finished and the kafiroon want to bring it on and fight and kill us then we should fight and kill them ?So when the sacred months have passed away, then slay the idolaters wherever you find them, and take them captives and besiege them and lie in wait for them in every ambush,?, then if they repent and stop fighting us, ?then if they repent and keep up prayer and pay the poor-rate, leave their way free to them; surely Allah is Forgiving, Merciful. , you have to know that salat and zakat mentioned in here does not really mean the Islamic salat and the Islamic zakat, in fact these practises were known to Noah and Abraham people, that is why the kafiroon were coming to the Kaaba anyway, to make salat to their Idols and pay zakat (sort of tax) that will be used to help the poor, therefore the enemy of Islam took it as they must be Muslims otherwise they should be killed, THIS IS 100% WRONG, because the Quran word for anyone to be a Muslim is ?Aslam? or ?Aslamo?, so the above warning is only for the kafiroon to comply with the new laws set by Allah after the reclaim of the Kaaba and the establishment of the strong Islam nation at the end of the prophet days.

            -> Verse 6, will confirm what I said about verse 5, you will see that Allah is still referring to them as idolaters but is telling the believers that they MUST PROTECT THEM if they seek protection BUT THEY MUST HAVE COMPLIED WITH THE AGREEMENT ABOVE IN VERSE 5, ?And if anyone of the idolaters seeketh thy protection (O Muhammad), then protect him?, the main reason to protect that peaceful Kafir is simply he/she may listen to the last message of our God? so that he may hear the Word of Allah,?, Mohammad must also convey him/her to his place of safety and afterward convey him to his place of safety. simply Allah want us to help these peaceful kafiroon because they lack the knowledge of Allah That is because they are a folk who know not.?

            -> Verse 7, We see Allah is summing it up beautifully How can there be an agreement for the idolaters with Allah and with His Messenger; except those with whom you made an agreement at the Sacred Mosque? So as long as they are true to you, be true to them; surely Allah loves those who are careful (of their duty)., WHAT ELSE I CAN SAY BRO?, ? So as long as they are true to you, be true to them; surely Allah loves those who are careful (of their duty)?

            Cheers

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