Is hell forever?
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Peace and greetings,
Dear guest,
The God is The Eternal means He was always Eternal, is always Eternal and will always be Eternal. The God is The First and The Last . These are His exclusive attributes and no one can have them. Other creations like jinns, human souls, angels and the spirit had a begining when they began so they cannot have the attribute "The First".
Eternity of these entities is dependent on the "Be" command of the God. He created them with "be" command so their eternity is also dependent on the "be" command of the God. When something has a begining even if it lasts for eternity it cannot be The Eternal because there was a time before the begining of those things.
The God is The Eternal, The First, The Last. Nothing can ever have these attributes. -
Peace abrar, you say ?hell will be the lowest pit out of bounds of pardise?. I recall a verse that says people of paradise will talk to the people of hell and the hell people will ask the people of paradise let some of your food flow down to hell. How does "out of bound" fit in? I know of a boundry of seperation but not out of bound.
You also say ?The God is The Eternal means He was always Eternal?. Are you equating The Eternal = Eternal? What is your definition.
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Peace TheNabi, by your definition, I am assuming your answer to my question is a ?No?. This implies that hell, men, and anything else cannot possess the eternal attribute. Then the question is how long will hell last? Is it from creation to forever? How is forever related to al-Aakhir (the Last)?
I do not have any problem with the length of punishment simply because The God tells us upfront that such is the punishment for such crime.
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Peace and greetings,
Dear Guest,
Yes I have also read the verse about people of hell talking to people of paradise for the flow of food. Remember people of paradise will have full access to everything, even to people of hell even though they will be out of bounds of paradise in lowest pit. Hell according to Quran seem to be a prison of enclosure by barriers to keep it isolated from the universe of paradise.
Chapter 7 verse 41
"They will have Hell as an abode, and from above them will be barriers. It is thus We recompense the wicked."
The Eternal cannot be defined by counting mathematically. But just eternal can always be defined because from first day of paradise you can keep on counting to eternity which will always remain finite no matter how long you live. You would be able to have a calender for life in paradise even if it continues forever so it remains finite and mathematically calculated. You begin counting from first day of paradise and keep counting, it would always be a number. The Eternal cannot be defined by counting.
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Anyone see the Robin Williams movie "What Dreams May Come"????
Me personally, this is what I believe Hell to be.
A self-inflicted punishment, knowing that you spent your years rejecting God, rejecting your provider, rejecting your protector.
And there really is no way out of this, the rejectors will lament on this mistake forever. For me this punishment is much more severe than burning.
Think about it, when you realise you've made a grave mistake you have a burning sensation inside, like drinking hot water.
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Wow! Thanks for all the replies. A lot of different opinions out there. Phoenix also seems to have a problem with eternal hell like I do. I haven't got around to reading all the recommended articles but I certainly will soon.
I understand that the concept of eternity is not something humans can understand, us being finite beings with finite minds and not infinite beings able to grasp the concept of infinity and eternity. I believe the descriptions of heaven, hell, angels, jinn etc in the Quran to be metaphorical for we cannot understand those concepts in this life because we haven't experienced anything that comes remotely close to them.
But to quote TheNabi,
By "eternal" I take it that there has been no beginning. In other words God has had to always been .
How can hell be eternal? It had to have a beginning, right? It couldn't have existed forever. Only God exists eternally.
I know the Quran talks about people being in hell forever but this still doesn't jibe with me for the reasons I stated in my first post. God also says somewhere in the Quran (I don't know where) that He rewards with more than what a person is due but punishes with only what a person deserves and not more than that.
Am I right?So existing forevermore in a state of hell seems contradictory. At some point or the other, a person would have "paid for his sins" (so to speak) and then remaining in a state of hell would become "unfair", don't you think?
And I do know that only God knows what absolute and correct justice is and we don't, but I can't get my head round this eternal hell business...
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This is where Satan likes to exploit those who want to believe in God and follow His words, Satan tries hard to make those doubt Allah words, or sort of it makes no sense to them, therefore those believers need to watch for themselves
What I found ironic that human dispute the laws of Allah while they submit to the humans laws regardless they like it or not
in this world many humans apply the eternal punishment (from the human perspective) and we all accept, it is called capital punishment,
Now the capital punishment for the crime of shirk or kufr is eternity in hell, very simple to understand because this is what Allah wanted exactly as what the humans wanted regarding capital punishment for specific crimes
Remember the Quran verse
Allah can't be questioned concerning what He does but we will be questioned
Salam
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Peace and greetings,
I agree with ahmedbaghat. In the hereafter no one will have any free will, chance to repent or make amends. The hereafter will be the result of fruits earned in this life and no human can figure out who is going to hell or paradise. The decision is sole authority of the God and no one has any reason to tell God what's right. This is what satan was trying to explain when he disobeyed the God over yielding to Adam. No one in mankind has ever been told whether he/she is going to hell or paradise in this world, not even the prophets. On judgement day the secrets would be revealed. No one can amend the God's words just if he/she feels uneasy. Zehra's experience is normal and this was even felt by prophet Muhammad.
Following verses describe the experience of prophet muhammad,
Chapter 9 verse 128.
"A messenger has come to you from yourselves, concerned over your suffering, anxious over you, towards the believers he is compassionate, merciful."
Chapter 16 verse 125-128
"Invite to the path of your Lord with wisdom and good advice, and argue with them in that which is better. Your Lord is fully aware of who is misguided from His path, and He is fully aware of the guided ones.And if you punish, then punish with equivalence to that which you were punished. And if you are patient then it is better for the patient ones.
And be patient, for your patience is on none but God. And do not grieve for them, and do not be depressed by what they scheme.
God is with those who are aware and are good doers."Only the God knows who is guided or misguided and we can hope but cannot say with 100% surity if we are going to paradise. You never know if a seemingly bad person might go to paradise. Ignorant people will be asked according to their level of knowledge and justice. A bushman of africa who has never read Quran or any book would not have same accountabilty as president Bush. The God will not decide according to humanly percieved wisdom or knowledge but in accordance with his perfection over knowledge and wisdom.
Chapter 15 verse 24 to 25
"And We have known those who came early amongst you, and We have known those who came late. And it is your Lord that will gather them. He is the Wise, the Knowledgeable."
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Peace abrar, you say ?Only the God knows who is guided or misguided and we can hope but cannot say with 100% surity if we are going to paradise?. I disagree. If one follows the Quran then Heaven is guaranteed (100%) because The God never breaks His promise. When a baby dies he/she is guaranteed Heaven (for sure).
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11.And when the sky is unvieled("Kusheitat" means "unvieled" and not "removed" as in the progressive muslim translation)
http//members.cox.net/deleyd/religion/solarmyth/daynight.gif12.And when Hell is ignited.
9.His destiny is the lowest.
10.And how would you know what it is?
11.A blazing Fire."
http//members.cox.net/deleyd/religion/solarmyth/heavenhell.gifHell is hot and on fire, because the sun is hot and on fire and the sun goes down there every night, setting everything ablaze.
7.While he(muhammad) was at the highest horizon
http//members.cox.net/deleyd/religion/solarmyth/highnoon.gif8.Then he drew nearer by moving down.
http//members.cox.net/deleyd/religion/solarmyth/day.gifetc..etc...etc
"The Day the Earth is replaced with another Earth, as are the heavens, and they will appear before God, the One, the Irresistible."
....HAPPY NEW YEAR!!! The cycle of life has taken yet another turn.
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Peace and Greetings,
Dear Guest,
Not even prophet Abraham was 100% sure to go to paradise so how can you be 100% sure.
In Chapter 26 verse 69 to 82 the God says,
"69.And recite to them the news of Abraham.
70.When he said to his father and his people ?What do you worship??
71.They said ?We worship statues, thus we remain devoted to them.?
72.He said ?Do they hear you when you pray to them??
73.?Or do they benefit you or harm you??
74.They said ?No, but we found our fathers doing the same.?
75.He said ?Do you see that which you have been worshipping.?
76.?You and your fathers of old.?
77.?They are enemies to me, except for the Lord of the worlds.?
78.?The One who created me, He will guide me.?
79.?And He is the One who feeds me and gives me to drink.?
80.?And if I am sick, He is the One who cures me.?
81.?And the One who will make me die and then bring me to life.?82.?And the One whom I hope will forgive my faults on the Day of Judgment.?" -
Peace Abarar
does it really say anything about Abrahams expectations of a heaven, or does it merely state that he hope to be forgiven his err, as we all do?
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Peace AhmedBahgat, are the attributes ?The First? and ?The Last? separate attributes? If your answer is a yes then the hell people will also have ?The Last? attribute. How would you reconcile this? This is not a challenge to you, only interested in your view point.
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Peace Magi,
The God states forgiveness on judgement day leading to paradise. No one in this world is 100% perfect till death to reach paradise even if he has tried his best in this world. Forgiveness on Judgement day from other sins not paid attention to till the time of death would be necessary to get paradise.
Chapter 3 verse 157 to 158
"And if you are killed in the cause of God or die, then forgiveness from God and mercy is far greater than all they can put together.
And if you die or are killed, then to God you will be gathered.'Chapter 47 verse 15
"s the example of Paradise; that the righteous have been promised with rivers of pure water, and rivers of milk whose taste does not change, and rivers of wine that are delicious for the drinkers, and rivers of strained honey, and for them in it are all kinds of fruits, and a forgiveness from their Lord; like that of those who abide in the Fire, and are given to drink boiling water that cuts-up their intestines? "
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Peace AhmedBahgat, are the attributes ?The First? and ?The Last? separate attributes? If your answer is a yes then the hell people will also have ?The Last? attribute. How would you reconcile this? This is not a challenge to you, only interested in your view point.
Peace bro
that it depends on what you mean by the Last?
do you mean "Al Akhar" in Arabic which means the Last or do you mean the Eternal which means the Last?
Salam
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Peace abrar, you say ?Not even prophet Abraham was 100% sure to go to paradise so how can you be 100% sure.? I was not talking about myself but about the one who follow the Quran the way The God has ordered. I believe every human has that potential. I don?t want to negate that possibility unless you can cite a verse that goes contrary to this thought. The conduct of Prophet Ibrahim, Prophet Muhammad and other prophets were exemplary indeed. In the Quran we evidence of some having higher rank of righteousness than other. There is nothing prohibiting someone else achieving even higher rank.
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Peace and Greetings,
The Last is absolute attribute and unique which no one other than the God can possess. The God is The Living and the existance of hell, paradise and their inhabitants will be dependent on the "Be" command of the God which could be destroyed out of existance at any time if the God issues "Be" command anytime. So nothing can be The Last except the God.
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Peace Abrar, the following verse changes the situation. I need to rethink.
35-45
Khalifa
If GOD punished the people for their sins, He would not leave a single creature on earth. But He respites them for a predetermined interim. Once their interim is fulfilled, then GOD is Seer of His servants.Yusuf Ali
If God were to punish men according to what they deserve. He would not leave on the back of the (earth) a single living creature but He gives them respite for a stated Term when their Term expires, verily God has in His sight all His Servants.Pickthal
If Allah took mankind to task by that which they deserve, He would not leave a living creature on the surface of the earth; but He reprieveth them unto an appointed term, and when their term cometh - then verily (they will know that) Allah is ever Seer of His slaves."Progressive Muslims"
And if God were to punish the people for what they have earned, He would not leave a single creature standing. But He delays them to a predetermined time. Then, when their time comes, then God is Seer of His servants.