Praise Be to Muhammad rasool Allah
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exactly! and in another 50-100 years people will be worshipping Muhammed as god in the flesh and his spirit will be 'within us' just like Jesus! halleluja!
Stop and correct it NOW before it is too late!
So in the presumptive fear, stop following the instructions to honour and revere. One should first worry for oneself and his household, then bother what people may do 100 years later.
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his position is of higher rank to most men i agree, see my post above, dont elevate him to a higher position as GOD. he was a messenger, no more than that. To imply that those who dont worship and revere a prophet means we dont have respect or love for him is wrong, of course we have respect and love for ALL prophets of God, they were the bearers of His message to us and it is the message that is important, not who brought it.
Quota a single instance where I have elevated him to that extent as you are presuming? And red marked is a qualified statement; not most but all. Not a single woman is like the wives of him, as pronounced by Allah, and that is only because they happen to be in his Nikah; what hinders you then to say, of all men. Reverence and worship have no inter relationship.
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Quota a single instance where I have elevated him to that extent as you are presuming? And red marked is a qualified statement; not most but all.
All for his time, not all as in ever. Same can be said about Mary, Moses Jesus etc, for their time. You have not elevated him to that extent YET Mazhar but its easy done as you are literally fighting here and now to have him elevated above all, thats how it starts, but nowhere is it ever said to bow to him, prostrate to Allah alone. Maybe its the language thing between u but to me it sounds like you are wanting him to be worshipped and praised, all praise, in this resepct, is for Allah alone 28.70. Praise i can give someone for a job well done is another thing and not what you and Raj are advocating here.Not a single woman is like the wives of him, as pronounced by Allah, and that is only because they happen to be in his Nikah; what hinders you then to say, of all men. Reverence and worship have no inter relationship.
Again, for their time.
Reverance and worship have no inter relationship but they DO and thats what i'm saying. People revered Jesus for who he was and his message, then reverance becomes distorted into worship and it doesnt take many people or many years for that to happen. I can read the Bible and see that Jesus never agreed he was son of God, he called himself son of man, yet any Christian will see in the same verses that he is the son of God and will fight tooth and nail to convince you the same. Only recently I had this woman telling me Jesus has saved her, she is drunk with his blood and the Holy Spirit and she SEES him etc etc, it was quite scary to be honest -\ telling me muslims are guided by the devil and the best of all that to get to heaven one has only to believe in Jesus, this is not much difference to what you have said about Muhammed and that scares me because I see the same happening in Islam as did in Christianity. Early followers of Jesus didnt worship him and early followers of Muhammed didnt worship him either, he was among them, they loved him yes, but many loved him before his prophethood as he as a good kind honest and trustworthy wise man, which is why he was chosen as the bearer of the message of God.
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All for his time, not all as in ever. Same can be said about Mary, Moses Jesus etc, for their time. You have not elevated him to that extent YET Mazhar but its easy done as you are literally fighting here and now to have him elevated above all, thats how it starts, but nowhere is it ever said to bow to him, prostrate to Allah alone. Maybe its the language thing between u but to me it sounds like you are wanting him to be worshipped and praised, all praise, in this resepct, is for Allah alone 28.70. Praise i can give someone for a job well done is another thing and not what you and Raj are advocating here.
Again, for their time.
Reverance and worship have no inter relationship but they DO and thats what i'm saying. People revered Jesus for who he was and his message, then reverance becomes distorted into worship and it doesnt take many people or many years for that to happen. I can read the Bible and see that Jesus never agreed he was son of God, he called himself son of man, yet any Christian will see in the same verses that he is the son of God and will fight tooth and nail to convince you the same. Only recently I had this woman telling me Jesus has saved her, she is drunk with his blood and the Holy Spirit and she SEES him etc etc, it was quite scary to be honest -\ telling me muslims are guided by the devil and the best of all that to get to heaven one has only to believe in Jesus, this is not much difference to what you have said about Muhammed and that scares me because I see the same happening in Islam as did in Christianity. Early followers of Jesus didnt worship him and early followers of Muhammed didnt worship him either, he was among them, they loved him yes, but many loved him before his prophethood as he as a good kind honest and trustworthy wise man, which is why he was chosen as the bearer of the message of God.
Too many words, too many hypothetical assumptions, and unnecessarily equating vastly different words as synonymous or leading to the same.
None "worshipped" the Messenger and none will ever do it, rest assured. Every one very lodudly pronounces the difference, by proclaiming that Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah. What to say of him, after the departure of his companions who migrated, fought and spent in the cause of Allah in those days, none will be born to have a status/position greater than them. Try to read Qur'aan and find that it covers all the time to come, not the period/duration of that limited period. Accept their greatness, it will help elevate our own selves, since we will be accepting the will and pronouncement of Allah.
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@ Mazhar
you wrote
<<<None "worshipped" the Messenger and none will ever do it, rest assured. Every one very lodudly pronounces the difference, by proclaiming that Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah.>>>
What would you call it when you testify to the unity of God in your prayer? Would you call it worshipping God or Not?
Please answer in simple way with yes or no.
peace
Asana
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Princess
allah and muhammad cozily right next to each other, hanging on the wall. if one didn't know any better one could say they're equals (at least that's how they're depicted).
That is only your preception, of those, who have disease in their hearts against Rasool Allah.
No one in balanced mind could say the creater, and creation are equal.For Ayisha I would like to quote MAzhar, as it summarizes the best about her posts
MazharToo many words, too many hypothetical assumptions, and unnecessarily equating vastly different words as synonymous or leading to the same
mazhar
None "worshipped" the Messenger and none will ever do it, rest assured. Every one very lodudly pronounces the difference, by proclaiming that Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah.
Mazhar
Quote a single instance where I have elevated him to that extent as you are presuming?
Same for me
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<<<None "worshipped" the Messenger and none will ever do it, rest assured. Every one very lodudly pronounces the difference, by proclaiming that Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah.>>>
What would you call it when you testify to the unity of God in your prayer? Would you call it worshipping God or Not?
Please answer in simple way with yes or no.
I do no use word "worship" in my translations for any one including Allah. Only pagans worship, not we. We express our sincere allegiance and servitutde to Allah, and express our thanks to Him for the obliging favour of sending Muhammad for us.
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From what I've gathered, you seem to think that Prophet Muhammed is the most honorable messenger because he was the only prophet sent to the whole humanity. And you back this up with the quranic verse saying that some messengers were more blessed than others, right? These would have been good arguments if there wouldn't have been a verse telling us clearly to not differentiate between them. A quick glance through the thread shows that you have yet to answer this verse directly. Since we know that the Quran doesn't itself... I would love it if you would explain how we can elevate Muhammed over. Other prophets without differentiating.
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<<<<do no use word "worship" in my translations for any one including Allah.>>>
Sorry Mazhar, either you misunderstood me or intentionally evaded in answering my question. Therefore I would ask you again; when you testify to unity of God in your Prayer/Al-Salat what would you call/consider it, worshiping or not?
Peace
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when you testify to unity of God in your Prayer/Al-Salat what would you call/consider it, worshiping or not?
We do not testify to Him, we testify it for people and everyone we see or don't see.
This is not worshipping, it is stating a fact. I don't know why people consider stating and admitting facts as worshipping someone.
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I do no use word "worship" in my translations for any one including Allah. Only pagans worship, not we. We express our sincere allegiance and servitutde to Allah, and express our thanks to Him for the obliging favour of sending Muhammad for us.
You may have not used the word 'worship' Mazhar but that is exactly what you are doing in elevating him above others.
Hadithists follow every detail they think the prophet did, thats worship, idol worship, because they elevate him to be higher than any other prophet.
There is absolutely nothing wrong in thanking God for sending His message as that is what God intended us to have and live by. There were many messengers who brought parts of that message, the message is more than Quran, Quran is a reminder of the previous parts of the message and a completion of it. It makes no sense, and is against what Quran tells you in many verses, to elevate one more than another.
we make no distinction among messengers
4152 To those who believe in Allah and His messengers and make no distinction between any of the messengers, we shall soon give their (due) rewards for Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful2285 The Messenger believeth in what hath been revealed to him from his Lord, as do the men of faith. Each one (of them) believeth in Allah, His angels, His books, and His messengers. "We make no distinction (they say) between one and another of His messengers." And they say "We hear, and we obey (We seek) Thy forgiveness, our Lord, and to Thee is the end of all journeys."
we make no distinction among the messages
3.84 Say "We believe in Allah, and in what has been revealed to us and what was revealed to Abraham, Isma'il, Isaac, Jacob, and the Tribes, and in (the Books) given to Moses, Jesus, and the prophets, from their Lord We make no distinction between one and another among them, and to Allah do we bow our will (in Islam)."2136 Say ye "We believe in Allah, and the revelation given to us, and to Abraham, Isma'il, Isaac, Jacob, and the Tribes, and that given to Moses and Jesus, and that given to (all) prophets from their Lord We make no difference between one and another of them And we bow to Allah (in Islam)."
God and the Angels send blessings on the prophet and He also sends His blessings on us too, (3343) His blessings come in many forms. He sent the rain with blessings (509). He sent blessings on the people of the house (1173) Respecting the prophet can also take the form of following his lead, following the message he brought. I fully respect him for who he was but adding his name to the call to worship God is wrong IMHO.
Asalamu aliakum warahamatullahi wa barakatu, may the peace and blessings of God be upon you, right? Address him respectfully with this greeting/salutation. sallalahu alaihi wa salam, peace and blessings upon him, right? as opposed to alaihi wasalam, on him be peace for all other prophets IS distinguishing him among the others, it IS raising him to a higher level and it IS a form of idol worship, you make him an idol whether you agree you are doing it or not and you are trying to justify this by one verse where there are many against this.
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We do not testify to Him, we testify it for people and everyone we see or don't see.
This is not worshipping, it is stating a fact. I don't know why people consider stating and admitting facts as worshipping someone.
I bear witness there is no God but God and I bear witness that Muhammed is the messenger of God.
4152 To those who believe in Allah and His messengers and make no distinction between any of the messengers, we shall soon give their (due) rewards for Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful
2285 The Messenger believeth in what hath been revealed to him from his Lord, as do the men of faith. Each one (of them) believeth in Allah, His angels, His books, and His messengers. "We make no distinction (they say) between one and another of His messengers." And they say "We hear, and we obey (We seek) Thy forgiveness, our Lord, and to Thee is the end of all journeys."
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From what I've gathered, you seem to think that Prophet Muhammed is the most honorable messenger because he was the only prophet sent to the whole humanity. And you back this up with the quranic verse saying that some messengers were more blessed than others, right? These would have been good arguments if there wouldn't have been a verse telling us clearly to not differentiate between them. A quick glance through the thread shows that you have yet to answer this verse directly. Since we know that the Quran doesn't itself... I would love it if you would explain how we can elevate Muhammed over. Other prophets without differentiating.
It seems this quote is for Rajaaah since I don't translate like that;
http//www.haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/temp%2002%20%202.253b.gif
They were Messengers, amongst whom We gave distinction/peculiarity/individuality upon one another,Every Messenger of Allah has his own individuality and peculiarity.
Without denying the aforementioned fact, we also admit and state
http//www.haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/2.136r.gif
We make no difference/distinction between one and another of them.But at the same time we reconize and admit this fact
http//www.haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/temp%2002%20%202.253c.gif
and He/Allah raised/elevated some of them in ranks.
Except Muhammad , none of the Messengers of Allah, those whose names we know and those whose names and nations have not been told to us, is or was a Messenger towards us. Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah towards us and he told and affirmed to us through the Book of Allah that there were Messengers of Allah before him and asked us to believe in all of them irrespective of the fact whether we know their names or not.
This is the distinction and individuality of him that he is the affirmer of all the Messengers of Allah, who were in time and place sent to individual communities. A fact of past gets certified and sanctified and attains legality and force of truth and fact only when it is affirmed by an authority.
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Except Muhammad , none of the Messengers of Allah, those whose names we know and those whose names and nations have not been told to us, is or was a Messenger towards us. Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah towards us and he told and affirmed to us through the Book of Allah that there were Messengers of Allah before him and asked us to believe in all of them irrespective of the fact whether we know their names or not.
I strongly disagree Mazhar. You are saying this is Muhammed's message, that he affirmed though the Book of Allah. ALLAH told us this and ALLAH affirmed the previous Books and messengers through Muhammed.This is the distinction and individuality of him that he is the affirmer of all the Messengers of Allah, who were in time and place sent to individual communities. A fact of past gets certified and sanctified and attains legality and force of truth and fact only when it is affirmed by an authority.
The authority doing the affirmation is Allah, Muhammed is a vessel for that message. Jesus also confirmed what was sent before him and so did all other prophets, this is a condition of all prophets, not just Muhammed.
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uote from Mazhar on Today at 041042 PM
Except Muhammad , none of the Messengers of Allah, those whose names we know and those whose names and nations have not been told to us, is or was a Messenger towards us. Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah towards us and he told and affirmed to us through the Book of Allah that there were Messengers of Allah before him and asked us to believe in all of them irrespective of the fact whether we know their names or not.
I strongly disagree Mazhar. You are saying this is Muhammed's message, that he affirmed though the Book of Allah. ALLAH told us this and ALLAH affirmed the previous Books and messengers through Muhammed.
This is because that you wish not to listen to Qur'aan but to your own biases and prejudices against the elevated stature granted by Allah to some.
I am not saying this it is the message of Muhammad . Allah does not certify to us. It is the Messenger who certifies and affirms for us. It is the will of Allah that He will not communicate with us directly but through the chosen and elevated allegiant of Him. We have to listen to him and accept his word which is nothing but accepting the word of Allah. Allah says he, Muhammad has affirmed the Messengers, but you do not wish to accept the simple and plains words of Allah
http//www.haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/037.%20As%20Safaat/37.37.gif
No, they falsely slander, he is neither possessed nor a poet, the fact of the matter is that he has come with a Statement of Proven/Absolute Fact
http//www.haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/037.%20As%20Safaat/37.37b.gif
and he/Muhammad has affirmed/sanctified The MessengersAs-Safaat
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This is because that you wish not to listen to Qur'aan but to your own biases and prejudices against the elevated stature granted by Allah to some.
Please Mazhar do not lower yourself from the status higher than that of Raj that I have granted you and accuse me of bias, prejudice, blindness or hypocrisy. I am neither biased or prejudiced and why should I be? You think I have something against Muhammed specifically? If you do then you cannot be more wrong as I am against Christians also doing the same with Jesus, another prophet of God and that one I was raised with!I could of course say exactly the same to you, that you also don't listen to Quran but to your own biases and prejudices for the elevated status granted by Allah, according to you, when there are numerous verses against US doing this. Maybe this is a left over bit of sunni-ism that you cant let go of.
Allah says HE has given some higher rank, he also says the same about some people too. He does not say that WE should see them as any different though.
I am not saying this it is the message of Muhammad . Allah does not certify to us. It is the Messenger who certifies and affirms for us. It is the will of Allah that He will not communicate with us directly but through the chosen and elevated allegiant of Him. We have to listen to him and accept his word which is nothing but accepting the word of Allah. Allah says he, Muhammad has affirmed the Messengers, but you do not wish to accept the simple and plains words of Allah
You have said it again.
You have the same arguement the hadithists have in accepting Muhammeds word, calling it Muhammeds words, Quran is the word of Allah and no one else, Muhammed is speaking the words of Allah not his own, he is confirming things with Allahs words, Allah is speaking through him, Allah says Muhammed has affirmed the messengers because Allah is telling you HE (Allah) is affirming the messengers through Muhammed, its not from the mind of Muhammed it is Allah speaking through him and that is where this problem lies in those who think that Muhammeds words are in there OR that everything he said in his life was from Allah. Muhammed said nothing from himself that is in Quran, not one single word, every word in it is from Allah just like a ventriloquist uses a doll, its not the doll speaking its the ventriloquist making the doll appear to speak.Look at verses with his name in them
Muhammad is not the father of any of your men, but (he is) the Messenger of Allah, and the Seal of the Prophets and Allah has full knowledge of all things
Did muhammed change this and say 'I am not the father of any of you' and change the grammar to first person? NO because its Allah speaking.
But those who believe and work deeds of righteousness, and believe in the (Revelation) sent down to Muhammad - for it is the Truth from their Lord,- He will remove from them their ills and improve their condition.
Did he change this to say 'send down to me'? No because its Allah speaking.
even those verses that start with 'Say oh Muhammed' he didnt even miss out the 'say oh Muhammed' and just say it
NONE of Quran is from Muhammed it is from Allah only. Allah confirms previous Books, Allah confirms previous prophets, Allah confirms THIS prophet is speaking the words of Allah.
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Please Mazhar do not lower yourself from the status higher than that of Raj that I have granted you and accuse me of bias, prejudice, blindness or hypocrisy. I am neither biased or prejudiced and why should I be? You think I have something against Muhammed specifically? If you do then you cannot be more wrong as I am against Christians also doing the same with Jesus, another prophet of God and that one I was raised with!
I could of course say exactly the same to you, that you also don't listen to Quran but to your own biases and prejudices for the elevated status granted by Allah, according to you, when there are numerous verses against US doing this. Maybe this is a left over bit of sunni-ism that you cant let go of.
Allah says HE has given some higher rank, he also says the same about some people too. He does not say that WE should see them as any different though.
I will give you, despite knowing you are an English lady, meanings of bias and prejuidice, but firt please tell me which was the thread where you had given your reservations and past experience about the christian days. I have checked this thread, it is not there, but I had glanced that somewhere.
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This is because that you wish not to listen to Qur'aan but to your own biases and prejudices against the elevated stature granted by Allah to some.
Please Mazhar do not lower yourself from the status higher than that of Raj that I have granted you and accuse me of bias, prejudice, blindness or hypocrisy. I am neither biased or prejudiced and why should I be?Do you think both red parts are/mean one and the same thing?
"Prejudice"- A performed opinion based on insufficient knowledge-Noun- earlier qualified by not to listen to Qur'aan that gives the complete knowlege.
Prejudiced-transitive verb-
"Bias"-an unfair preference.-Noun
as verb_to influence someone unfairly.
In my quote both are used as nouns, for reason of having glanced some post of you about past experience of christians.