Praise Be to Muhammad rasool Allah

Raj-ah

Mr.Tanveer I guess we are entering a stage when arguments are over and sentiments come in, and that is the best time one backs up. Your post is a prove for that.

Thirdly, "Muhammad" meaning "praised one" does not mean that is an order from Allah to believers to praise Prophet Muhammad. An order to praise Prophet Muhammad would be something like "O believers, praise Muhammad morning and evening".

So Muhammad means "praised one" thanks God you agreed.
Well my friend you Cannot dictate Allah; but infact you (if you recite Quran), me, and all of us who recite Quran PRAISE MUHAMMAD day and NIGHT.

If we can't see it than it is we who should open our eyes and minds.

Rajah wrote

Quran says about the messanger in the above verses

He is Wise
He is honorable
He is good Judge
He is truth ful
He should be dearer to us more than of our relatives and finances.

What else do you call a Praise?

You have not yet shed light on this question niether Zenje has.

If Allah says my Prophet is "Praise worthy", "honorable" "good Judge" "truth ful" "Full of wisdom" "nur" etc. and we recite the Quran daily and praise the Prophet daily weather you or any one likes it or not.
That is for the one who recites Quran.

Now for example if I say

O prophet, the truth ful, your the wise one and not we
Allah has praised you and so do we
You are honorable and praise worthy, and good judge
No one can deny it no matter how strong he has a grudge

What is wrong in this PRAISE of Prophet did I said any thing against Quran.

Raj-ah

Mr. Tanveer, Mr. Zenje all the wise one's, burnouts please pay attention to following verses

Progressive Muslims"
Such messengers, We have preferred some over others; some of them talked to God, and He raised some of them in rank, and We gave Jesus the son of Mary the proofs and We supported him with the holy spirit. And had God wished, the people after them would not have fought after the proofs had come to them, but they disputed, some of them believed and some of them disbelieved. Had God wished they would not have fought, but God does whatever He wishes. 2253

These messengers; we blessed some of them more than others. For example, GOD spoke to one, and we raised some of them to higher ranks. And we gave Jesus, son of Mary, profound miracles and supported him with the Holy Spirit. Had GOD willed, their followers would not have fought with each other, after the clear proofs had come to them. Instead, they disputed among themselves; some of them believed, and some disbelieved. Had GOD willed, they would not have fought. Everything is in accordance with GOD's will.

The entire Prophets, blessing and salute to Them; are equivalent in Prophet-Hood, each of them has been given this award permanently. But, among all the personalities, Almighty Allah caused some Prophets to excel upon others and near Almighty Allah their Degrees are higher than others.

Allah please Guide us to the straight path!

Please take away confusion from us!

unknownuser

Peace Rajah,

I see that you still have not posted a SINGLE verse in which believers or muslims are asked by Allah to PRAISE Prophet Muhammad.

And you still have not given any verse that mentions that if a messenger is also a prophet, he becomes higher than only messenger or only prophet, thus proving that you disobeyed 2285, thus disrespecting Prophet Muhammad by disobeying his teaching. That is very hypocritical to disrespect and disobey the Prophet on one hand and then praising him, don't you think ?

And you still have not answered the following question posed to you

1649 And to God prostrate all those in the heavens and all those on the Earth, from the creatures as well as the angels, and they are not arrogant.
1650 They fear their Lord from above them, and they do what they are commanded.

Prostrating to God is a good quality
Being not arrogant is a good quality
Doing what Allah commands is a good quality

Thus Allah is PRAISING the creatures of the earth, does this mean it is an order for us to praise the creatures too ?

Finally, if I say "X says Y is very good", am I praising Y or just quoting X's statement ?
Reversing it, if I say "X says Y is very bad", am I condemning Y or just quoting X's statement ?

Let us look at it in another way. If I write a book in which while referring to Y, one of the statements is "you are very good". Someone else reads that book aloud and quotes that statement by saying "you are very good", is that praising Y or just reading a book ?

Mr. Tanveer, Mr. Zenje all the wise one's, burnouts please pay attention to following verses

Progressive Muslims"
Such messengers, We have preferred some over others; some of them talked to God, and He raised some of them in rank, and We gave Jesus the son of Mary the proofs and We supported him with the holy spirit. And had God wished, the people after them would not have fought after the proofs had come to them, but they disputed, some of them believed and some of them disbelieved. Had God wished they would not have fought, but God does whatever He wishes. 2253

These messengers; we blessed some of them more than others. For example, GOD spoke to one, and we raised some of them to higher ranks. And we gave Jesus, son of Mary, profound miracles and supported him with the Holy Spirit. Had GOD willed, their followers would not have fought with each other, after the clear proofs had come to them. Instead, they disputed among themselves; some of them believed, and some disbelieved. Had GOD willed, they would not have fought. Everything is in accordance with GOD's will.

The entire Prophets, blessing and salute to Them; are equivalent in Prophet-Hood, each of them has been given this award permanently. But, among all the personalities, Almighty Allah caused some Prophets to excel upon others and near Almighty Allah their Degrees are higher than others.

Firstly, this actually is proof that if Allah does something, it does not automatically mean we can also do it, unless Allah clearly allows us to do it too.

Secondly, WHICH messengers did Allah prefer over others or bless more than others ?

Raj-ah

Tanveer

I see that you still have not posted a SINGLE verse in which believers or muslims are asked by Allah to PRAISE Prophet Muhammad.

Well done Mr. Tanveer bravo after all that stuff I posted.

Secondly, WHICH messengers did Allah prefer over others or bless more than others ?

brickwall brickwall

Oh Tanveer!

Don't be like Jews who asked what color of the calf should be?, how old should it be? etc etc.

Come to Allah
and
Love his messangers & Prophets.

unknownuser

Peace Raj-ah,

He is Prophet and Messenger that makes him higher than those who are only messengers or only Prophets and than he is the Last Prophetic messenger among those who were both Prophets and messengers.

Waothkur fee alkitabi moosa innahu kana mukhlasan wakana rasoolan nabiyyan
019.051
YUSUFALI Also mention in the Book (the story of) Moses for he was specially chosen, and he was a messenger (and) a prophet.

What's the difference first middle last?

003.144
YUSUFALI Muhammad is no more than a messenger many Were the messenger that passed away before him. If he died or were slain, will ye then Turn back on your heels? If any did turn back on his heels, not the least harm will he do to Allah; but Allah (on the other hand) will swiftly reward those who (serve Him) with gratitude.

unknownuser

Peace be upon you,

The word "muhammadun" comes from "hamd". When we look at all of the occurences of this root in this book, we see the common thread of "exaltation" or "elevation" (but you must let go of the pre concieved idea of "praise" first).

Our journey throughout this message is one of ASCENDING, one of climbing the mountain. Our journey is to the God. All elevation (hamd) is to the God. The God is the Most High. We elevate ourselves by becoming more and more God-Like through purifying our subconcious(nafs).

The God is hameed (elevated/exalted)...and one who elevates thierself to God is "muhammad" (one who is elevated).

There is no one historical figure named "Muhammad" whom we must praise..."muhammad" is a concept for us to emulate..we all must strive to be "muhammad", not look for a historical figure to idolize.

Our highest potential is God, our lowest is animalistic (like apes and swine)...

(12) Elevate to The God, Lord of the Worlds

This is what we are asked to do. Transcend the animal and elevate to the God...We are God's and to God we must return. Let us stop looking to objects outside of our own Being to idolize and praise, instead let us continue to be more and more God-like in character.

zenje

Peace Ra-jah,
English is such a tough language sometimes, I asked for a simple exercise I got a composition, not one sentence being what I asked for, but that's okay, in a way you answered my question, i.e. - You CANNOT come up with ONE VERSE where GOD asks the believers to PRAISE prophet Muhammad. handshake

Instead... )

Quran says about the messanger in the above verses

He is Wise
He is honorable
He is good Judge
He is truth ful
He should be dearer to us more than of our relatives and finances.

What else do you call a Praise?
This...

Praise be to God who created the heavens and the Earth, and Who made darkness and light...

Simple and beautiful isn't it? )

How about this, I'll make the exercise a little easier for you, since you found such difficulty in the first one...

Please post ONE verse where God asks the believers to PRAISE ANY messenger.

Lets see how much "reciting" you've done to get this one. Here's a hint, if you can't come up with one, just admit it, we'll understand... really, we will. group

Raj-ah

Nun de plume

Peace Raj-ah,

Quote from Raj-ah on February 17, 2007, 023734 AM
He is Prophet and Messenger that makes him higher than those who are only messengers or only Prophets and than he is the Last Prophetic messenger among those who were both Prophets and messengers.

Waothkur fee alkitabi moosa innahu kana mukhlasan wakana rasoolan nabiyyan
019.051
YUSUFALI Also mention in the Book (the story of) Moses for he was specially chosen, and he was a messenger (and) a prophet.

You have quoted me and I have based my quote on following verse
These messengers; we blessed some of them more than others. For example, GOD spoke to one, and we raised some of them to higher ranks. And we gave Jesus, son of Mary, profound miracles and supported him with the Holy Spirit. Had GOD willed, their followers would not have fought with each other, after the clear proofs had come to them. Instead, they disputed among themselves; some of them believed, and some disbelieved. Had GOD willed, they would not have fought. Everything is in accordance with GOD's will.

Do you understand dear? or like the Wise one's you have some other translation for the above verse??
It is Allah who is saying that he has blessed some more than others and raised some of them to higher ranks.
Will you not believe then??

YUSUFALI Muhammad is no more than a messenger many Were the messenger that passed away before him. If he died or were slain, will ye then Turn back on your heels? If any did turn back on his heels, not the least harm will he do to Allah; but Allah (on the other hand) will swiftly reward those who (serve Him) with gratitude

No doubt Muhammad is no more than a messenger in the eyes of Allah.
But Muhammad should be respected and loved as Allah has commanded.

Raj-ah

Idol free wrote

The God is hameed (elevated/exalted)...and one who elevates thierself to God is "muhammad" (one who is elevated).

There is no one historical figure named "Muhammad" whom we must praise..."muhammad" is a concept for us to emulate..we all must strive to be "muhammad", not look for a historical figure to idolize

Muhammad is a fact You cannot deny!
Muhammad is Praised by Allah in different verses and I have pointed out those verses, no matter what ever we say, when reciting those verses we automatically praise Muhammad!
and those who praise Muhammad do nothing against Quran, however if one calls Muhammad for help besides God is going against Quran, if one prays to Muhammad is going against Quran.

I will like to have detail conversation with you on this later on.

Raj-ah

Zenje
Please post ONE verse where God asks the believers to PRAISE ANY messenger.

Please post ONE verse where God asks believers not to PRAISE MUhammad by Name

zeljko67

Maybe the second time is a charm...

Anyone....

469

And whoever obeys God and the messenger will be among those whom God has blessed, from the prophets and the truthful and the martyrs and the upright. What an excellent companionship!

How does "Prophet Muhammad" obey the "Messenger Muhammad" and fall into the category of all those blessed by The God?

honor

Salam everyone~

Hmmm, I've been reading this and have some food for the thoughts...

381 And God took a covenant from the prophets "For what I have given you of the Scripture and wisdom, then a messenger will come to you authenticating what is with you. You will believe in him and support him." He said "Do you testify, and agree to this burden?", they said "We testify." He said "Then bear witness, and I am with you bearing witness."

384 Say "We believe in God and what was sent down to us and what was sent down to Abraham and Ishmael and Isaac and Jacob and the Patriarchs, and what was given to Moses and Jesus and the prophets from their Lord. We do not make any distinction between them, and to Him we submit."

386 How can God guide a people who have rejected after believing, and they witnessed that the messenger is true, and the clarity had come to them? God does not guide the wicked people.

Maybe....just a thought, maybe we testify in our hearts and maybe shahada, that the messenger is true and the prophet for this quran, but we do not bare witness and pray or hold him above any other prophet by including him in prayers etc...

Just a thought

Honor

Dion

These messengers; we blessed some of them more than others. For example, GOD spoke to one, and we raised some of them to higher ranks. And we gave Jesus, son of Mary, profound miracles and supported him with the Holy Spirit. Had GOD willed, their followers would not have fought with each other, after the clear proofs had come to them. Instead, they disputed among themselves; some of them believed, and some disbelieved. Had GOD willed, they would not have fought. Everything is in accordance with GOD's will.

Where does it say here that Muhamad is one of the messengers raised higher??
We are all Gods subjects and we will be judged in accordance with our deeds, including messengers.
The verse above clearly states that it is God and only God to differentiate between messengers.

2285 The messenger believes in what was sent down to him from his Lord. And the believers, all who believe in God, and His angels, and His Scriptures, and His messengers "We do not differentiate between ANY of His messengers;" and they said "We hear and obey, forgive us O Lord, and to you is our destiny."

What is so unclear in this verse???

The first verse talks about God. When it says "We have blessed some more..." it doesn't mean God and Raj-ah.
The second verse is directed to people.

Can't you really make a distinction between God and youself????

Raj-ah

Dion

The verse above clearly states that it is God and only God to differentiate between messengers.

Yes; Yes ; Yes my brother there you got it Bingooo! at least you got it! God differeniates between messangers and he does. That is what I pointed out so what is all the fuss about? Some are blessed more and some are on higher ranks and the reason I think Muhammad is on higher rank is obvious, he is messanger with a book and he is the LAst one.

What is expected from Us is to respect them and not compare them with ordinary mail men.

Quote
2285 The messenger believes in what was sent down to him from his Lord. And the believers, all who believe in God, and His angels, and His Scriptures, and His messengers "We do not differentiate between ANY of His messengers;" and they said "We hear and obey, forgive us O Lord, and to you is our destiny."

What is so unclear in this verse???

Nothing unclear about it, infact very clear, I do not differeniate between any of his messengers, It is Allah who says some have higher ranks, so you getting angry with me makes no sense. )

Dion

The first verse talks about God. When it says "We have blessed some more..." it doesn't mean God and Raj-ah.

hmmmm, Oh it did not mean Rajah and God!

but it means God differeniates between them, so some one is higher than the others, is it some maths unsolvable problem?

Dion

Can't you really make a distinction between God and youself?

I was trying to... until I read the following

Idol free

......., instead let us continue to be more and more God-like in character.

Dion

and the reason I think Muhammad is on higher ...

Obviously God told you not to think about this. Unless you differentiate between verses too.
Remember the verse not to differentiate between messengers.

So dont do it, smart boy.

savage_carrot

Obviously God told you not to think about this. Unless you differentiate between verses too.
Remember the verse not to differentiate between messengers.

Good one! ;D

Interesting posts Dion, I think I'm reading them for the first time, belated welcome ).

zenje

Peace Ra-jah,

Zenje
Please post ONE verse where God asks the believers to PRAISE ANY messenger.

Please post ONE verse where God asks believers not to PRAISE MUhammad by Name

Am I the one who claimed that the prophet is to be praised?... ummm, no, therefore = burden of proof = you.

If there's no verse asking us to praise the messenger, but there IS a verse saying...

And He is GOD, there is no god but He. To HIM belongs all praise in the first and in the last, and judgment belongs with Him, and to Him you will be returned.

I would have thought it was obvious, but I guess not. )

zeljko, you have a valid point. However, you're beating a dead horse. And that's why this is my last post on this thread.

Peace be with you. )

unknownuser

Peace sis Honor,

Salam everyone~

Hmmm, I've been reading this and have some food for the thoughts...

381 And God took a covenant from the prophets "For what I have given you of the Scripture and wisdom, then a messenger will come to you authenticating what is with you. You will believe in him and support him." He said "Do you testify, and agree to this burden?", they said "We testify." He said "Then bear witness, and I am with you bearing witness."

384 Say "We believe in God and what was sent down to us and what was sent down to Abraham and Ishmael and Isaac and Jacob and the Patriarchs, and what was given to Moses and Jesus and the prophets from their Lord. We do not make any distinction between them, and to Him we submit."

386 How can God guide a people who have rejected after believing, and they witnessed that the messenger is true, and the clarity had come to them? God does not guide the wicked people.

Maybe....just a thought, maybe we testify in our hearts and maybe shahada, that the messenger is true and the prophet for this quran, but we do not bare witness and pray or hold him above any other prophet by including him in prayers etc...

Just a thought

Honor

In 381 God is asking the prophets to testify and bear witness to the COVENANT, and not the messengership of a particular messenger. Note that in 381, the prophets are being asked to BELIEVE and SUPPORT the messenger, not testify the messengership. For an explanation as to which messenger is being referred to in this verse, please see the following post for an interesting understanding which makes total sense

http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=10190.0

386 is not referring to witnessing messengership itself but witnessing whether a messenger is true or not, and how can we do that ? .... By witnessing for ourselves (verifying) the truth of the message brought by the messenger.

As to the messengership itself, we have not directly witnessed it and The God alone is enough as a witness of the messengership

4828 He is the One who sent His messenger with the guidance and the system of truth, so that it would expose all other systems. And God is sufficient as a witness.

479 Any good that befalls you is from God, and any bad that befalls you is from yourself. We have sent you as a messenger to the people and God is enough as a witness.

1343 And those who reject say "You are not a messenger." Say "God is sufficient as a witness between me and you, the One who has the knowledge of the Scripture."

If people testify or witness the messengership itself without having witnessed/seen it themselves, then they are giving a false testimony and thus become liars/hypocrites

631 When the hypocrites come to you they say "We bear witness that you are the messenger of God." And God knows that you are His messenger, and God bears witness that the hypocrites are liars.

honor

Salam Tanaveer,

Thank you for your interpretation. It is neccessary to show those ayats you listed to give clarification as to what the ayats I listed mean, as well as to show that it is not neccessary for us to bear witness to muhammad when believing in the words of the quran, the wisdom of the Quran,and the truth of Islam. I agree with you. I do believe its neccessary however to believe in Muhammad, his journey, his prophethood, and to not underestimate his importance. I do believe in him, and bear witness to god, that I do, in my heart and soul. Just as I bear witness to god, that I believe in him, as the one and only god, and that the Quran is our truth.

Honor

Raj-ah

honor wrote

I do believe its neccessary however to believe in Muhammad, his journey, his prophethood, and to not underestimate his importance. I do believe in him, and bear witness to god, that I do, in my heart and soul. Just as I bear witness to god, that I believe in him, as the one and only god, and that the Quran is our truth.

May God Bless You.