Praise Be to Muhammad rasool Allah
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Princess
allah and muhammad cozily right next to each other, hanging on the wall. if one didn't know any better one could say they're equals (at least that's how they're depicted).
That is only your preception, of those, who have disease in their hearts against Rasool Allah.
No one in balanced mind could say the creater, and creation are equal.For Ayisha I would like to quote MAzhar, as it summarizes the best about her posts
MazharToo many words, too many hypothetical assumptions, and unnecessarily equating vastly different words as synonymous or leading to the same
mazhar
None "worshipped" the Messenger and none will ever do it, rest assured. Every one very lodudly pronounces the difference, by proclaiming that Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah.
Mazhar
Quote a single instance where I have elevated him to that extent as you are presuming?
Same for me
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<<<None "worshipped" the Messenger and none will ever do it, rest assured. Every one very lodudly pronounces the difference, by proclaiming that Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah.>>>
What would you call it when you testify to the unity of God in your prayer? Would you call it worshipping God or Not?
Please answer in simple way with yes or no.
I do no use word "worship" in my translations for any one including Allah. Only pagans worship, not we. We express our sincere allegiance and servitutde to Allah, and express our thanks to Him for the obliging favour of sending Muhammad for us.
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From what I've gathered, you seem to think that Prophet Muhammed is the most honorable messenger because he was the only prophet sent to the whole humanity. And you back this up with the quranic verse saying that some messengers were more blessed than others, right? These would have been good arguments if there wouldn't have been a verse telling us clearly to not differentiate between them. A quick glance through the thread shows that you have yet to answer this verse directly. Since we know that the Quran doesn't itself... I would love it if you would explain how we can elevate Muhammed over. Other prophets without differentiating.
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<<<<do no use word "worship" in my translations for any one including Allah.>>>
Sorry Mazhar, either you misunderstood me or intentionally evaded in answering my question. Therefore I would ask you again; when you testify to unity of God in your Prayer/Al-Salat what would you call/consider it, worshiping or not?
Peace
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when you testify to unity of God in your Prayer/Al-Salat what would you call/consider it, worshiping or not?
We do not testify to Him, we testify it for people and everyone we see or don't see.
This is not worshipping, it is stating a fact. I don't know why people consider stating and admitting facts as worshipping someone.
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I do no use word "worship" in my translations for any one including Allah. Only pagans worship, not we. We express our sincere allegiance and servitutde to Allah, and express our thanks to Him for the obliging favour of sending Muhammad for us.
You may have not used the word 'worship' Mazhar but that is exactly what you are doing in elevating him above others.
Hadithists follow every detail they think the prophet did, thats worship, idol worship, because they elevate him to be higher than any other prophet.
There is absolutely nothing wrong in thanking God for sending His message as that is what God intended us to have and live by. There were many messengers who brought parts of that message, the message is more than Quran, Quran is a reminder of the previous parts of the message and a completion of it. It makes no sense, and is against what Quran tells you in many verses, to elevate one more than another.
we make no distinction among messengers
4152 To those who believe in Allah and His messengers and make no distinction between any of the messengers, we shall soon give their (due) rewards for Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful2285 The Messenger believeth in what hath been revealed to him from his Lord, as do the men of faith. Each one (of them) believeth in Allah, His angels, His books, and His messengers. "We make no distinction (they say) between one and another of His messengers." And they say "We hear, and we obey (We seek) Thy forgiveness, our Lord, and to Thee is the end of all journeys."
we make no distinction among the messages
3.84 Say "We believe in Allah, and in what has been revealed to us and what was revealed to Abraham, Isma'il, Isaac, Jacob, and the Tribes, and in (the Books) given to Moses, Jesus, and the prophets, from their Lord We make no distinction between one and another among them, and to Allah do we bow our will (in Islam)."2136 Say ye "We believe in Allah, and the revelation given to us, and to Abraham, Isma'il, Isaac, Jacob, and the Tribes, and that given to Moses and Jesus, and that given to (all) prophets from their Lord We make no difference between one and another of them And we bow to Allah (in Islam)."
God and the Angels send blessings on the prophet and He also sends His blessings on us too, (3343) His blessings come in many forms. He sent the rain with blessings (509). He sent blessings on the people of the house (1173) Respecting the prophet can also take the form of following his lead, following the message he brought. I fully respect him for who he was but adding his name to the call to worship God is wrong IMHO.
Asalamu aliakum warahamatullahi wa barakatu, may the peace and blessings of God be upon you, right? Address him respectfully with this greeting/salutation. sallalahu alaihi wa salam, peace and blessings upon him, right? as opposed to alaihi wasalam, on him be peace for all other prophets IS distinguishing him among the others, it IS raising him to a higher level and it IS a form of idol worship, you make him an idol whether you agree you are doing it or not and you are trying to justify this by one verse where there are many against this.
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We do not testify to Him, we testify it for people and everyone we see or don't see.
This is not worshipping, it is stating a fact. I don't know why people consider stating and admitting facts as worshipping someone.
I bear witness there is no God but God and I bear witness that Muhammed is the messenger of God.
4152 To those who believe in Allah and His messengers and make no distinction between any of the messengers, we shall soon give their (due) rewards for Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful
2285 The Messenger believeth in what hath been revealed to him from his Lord, as do the men of faith. Each one (of them) believeth in Allah, His angels, His books, and His messengers. "We make no distinction (they say) between one and another of His messengers." And they say "We hear, and we obey (We seek) Thy forgiveness, our Lord, and to Thee is the end of all journeys."
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From what I've gathered, you seem to think that Prophet Muhammed is the most honorable messenger because he was the only prophet sent to the whole humanity. And you back this up with the quranic verse saying that some messengers were more blessed than others, right? These would have been good arguments if there wouldn't have been a verse telling us clearly to not differentiate between them. A quick glance through the thread shows that you have yet to answer this verse directly. Since we know that the Quran doesn't itself... I would love it if you would explain how we can elevate Muhammed over. Other prophets without differentiating.
It seems this quote is for Rajaaah since I don't translate like that;
http//www.haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/temp%2002%20%202.253b.gif
They were Messengers, amongst whom We gave distinction/peculiarity/individuality upon one another,Every Messenger of Allah has his own individuality and peculiarity.
Without denying the aforementioned fact, we also admit and state
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We make no difference/distinction between one and another of them.But at the same time we reconize and admit this fact
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and He/Allah raised/elevated some of them in ranks.
Except Muhammad , none of the Messengers of Allah, those whose names we know and those whose names and nations have not been told to us, is or was a Messenger towards us. Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah towards us and he told and affirmed to us through the Book of Allah that there were Messengers of Allah before him and asked us to believe in all of them irrespective of the fact whether we know their names or not.
This is the distinction and individuality of him that he is the affirmer of all the Messengers of Allah, who were in time and place sent to individual communities. A fact of past gets certified and sanctified and attains legality and force of truth and fact only when it is affirmed by an authority.
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Except Muhammad , none of the Messengers of Allah, those whose names we know and those whose names and nations have not been told to us, is or was a Messenger towards us. Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah towards us and he told and affirmed to us through the Book of Allah that there were Messengers of Allah before him and asked us to believe in all of them irrespective of the fact whether we know their names or not.
I strongly disagree Mazhar. You are saying this is Muhammed's message, that he affirmed though the Book of Allah. ALLAH told us this and ALLAH affirmed the previous Books and messengers through Muhammed.This is the distinction and individuality of him that he is the affirmer of all the Messengers of Allah, who were in time and place sent to individual communities. A fact of past gets certified and sanctified and attains legality and force of truth and fact only when it is affirmed by an authority.
The authority doing the affirmation is Allah, Muhammed is a vessel for that message. Jesus also confirmed what was sent before him and so did all other prophets, this is a condition of all prophets, not just Muhammed.
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uote from Mazhar on Today at 041042 PM
Except Muhammad , none of the Messengers of Allah, those whose names we know and those whose names and nations have not been told to us, is or was a Messenger towards us. Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah towards us and he told and affirmed to us through the Book of Allah that there were Messengers of Allah before him and asked us to believe in all of them irrespective of the fact whether we know their names or not.
I strongly disagree Mazhar. You are saying this is Muhammed's message, that he affirmed though the Book of Allah. ALLAH told us this and ALLAH affirmed the previous Books and messengers through Muhammed.
This is because that you wish not to listen to Qur'aan but to your own biases and prejudices against the elevated stature granted by Allah to some.
I am not saying this it is the message of Muhammad . Allah does not certify to us. It is the Messenger who certifies and affirms for us. It is the will of Allah that He will not communicate with us directly but through the chosen and elevated allegiant of Him. We have to listen to him and accept his word which is nothing but accepting the word of Allah. Allah says he, Muhammad has affirmed the Messengers, but you do not wish to accept the simple and plains words of Allah
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No, they falsely slander, he is neither possessed nor a poet, the fact of the matter is that he has come with a Statement of Proven/Absolute Fact
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and he/Muhammad has affirmed/sanctified The MessengersAs-Safaat
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This is because that you wish not to listen to Qur'aan but to your own biases and prejudices against the elevated stature granted by Allah to some.
Please Mazhar do not lower yourself from the status higher than that of Raj that I have granted you and accuse me of bias, prejudice, blindness or hypocrisy. I am neither biased or prejudiced and why should I be? You think I have something against Muhammed specifically? If you do then you cannot be more wrong as I am against Christians also doing the same with Jesus, another prophet of God and that one I was raised with!I could of course say exactly the same to you, that you also don't listen to Quran but to your own biases and prejudices for the elevated status granted by Allah, according to you, when there are numerous verses against US doing this. Maybe this is a left over bit of sunni-ism that you cant let go of.
Allah says HE has given some higher rank, he also says the same about some people too. He does not say that WE should see them as any different though.
I am not saying this it is the message of Muhammad . Allah does not certify to us. It is the Messenger who certifies and affirms for us. It is the will of Allah that He will not communicate with us directly but through the chosen and elevated allegiant of Him. We have to listen to him and accept his word which is nothing but accepting the word of Allah. Allah says he, Muhammad has affirmed the Messengers, but you do not wish to accept the simple and plains words of Allah
You have said it again.
You have the same arguement the hadithists have in accepting Muhammeds word, calling it Muhammeds words, Quran is the word of Allah and no one else, Muhammed is speaking the words of Allah not his own, he is confirming things with Allahs words, Allah is speaking through him, Allah says Muhammed has affirmed the messengers because Allah is telling you HE (Allah) is affirming the messengers through Muhammed, its not from the mind of Muhammed it is Allah speaking through him and that is where this problem lies in those who think that Muhammeds words are in there OR that everything he said in his life was from Allah. Muhammed said nothing from himself that is in Quran, not one single word, every word in it is from Allah just like a ventriloquist uses a doll, its not the doll speaking its the ventriloquist making the doll appear to speak.Look at verses with his name in them
Muhammad is not the father of any of your men, but (he is) the Messenger of Allah, and the Seal of the Prophets and Allah has full knowledge of all things
Did muhammed change this and say 'I am not the father of any of you' and change the grammar to first person? NO because its Allah speaking.
But those who believe and work deeds of righteousness, and believe in the (Revelation) sent down to Muhammad - for it is the Truth from their Lord,- He will remove from them their ills and improve their condition.
Did he change this to say 'send down to me'? No because its Allah speaking.
even those verses that start with 'Say oh Muhammed' he didnt even miss out the 'say oh Muhammed' and just say it
NONE of Quran is from Muhammed it is from Allah only. Allah confirms previous Books, Allah confirms previous prophets, Allah confirms THIS prophet is speaking the words of Allah.
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Please Mazhar do not lower yourself from the status higher than that of Raj that I have granted you and accuse me of bias, prejudice, blindness or hypocrisy. I am neither biased or prejudiced and why should I be? You think I have something against Muhammed specifically? If you do then you cannot be more wrong as I am against Christians also doing the same with Jesus, another prophet of God and that one I was raised with!
I could of course say exactly the same to you, that you also don't listen to Quran but to your own biases and prejudices for the elevated status granted by Allah, according to you, when there are numerous verses against US doing this. Maybe this is a left over bit of sunni-ism that you cant let go of.
Allah says HE has given some higher rank, he also says the same about some people too. He does not say that WE should see them as any different though.
I will give you, despite knowing you are an English lady, meanings of bias and prejuidice, but firt please tell me which was the thread where you had given your reservations and past experience about the christian days. I have checked this thread, it is not there, but I had glanced that somewhere.
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This is because that you wish not to listen to Qur'aan but to your own biases and prejudices against the elevated stature granted by Allah to some.
Please Mazhar do not lower yourself from the status higher than that of Raj that I have granted you and accuse me of bias, prejudice, blindness or hypocrisy. I am neither biased or prejudiced and why should I be?Do you think both red parts are/mean one and the same thing?
"Prejudice"- A performed opinion based on insufficient knowledge-Noun- earlier qualified by not to listen to Qur'aan that gives the complete knowlege.
Prejudiced-transitive verb-
"Bias"-an unfair preference.-Noun
as verb_to influence someone unfairly.
In my quote both are used as nouns, for reason of having glanced some post of you about past experience of christians.
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I will give you, despite knowing you are an English lady, meanings of bias and prejuidice, but firt please tell me which was the thread where you had given your reservations and past experience about the christian days. I have checked this thread, it is not there, but I had glanced that somewhere.
glanced it somewhere? you should have read it not glanced at it, it was directed at you.
its in the Azhan thread the recent one if thats the post you mean.
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However let me know that do really the English people equate bias and prejudice with blindness or hypocrisy?
No but you have mentioned munafiq and that you are following quran to not be one of them in reference to one of these threads which implied to me that I was, blindness was possibly raj. To say please do not do something doesnt necessary mean that you have done it.
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I will give you, despite knowing you are an English lady, meanings of bias and prejuidice, but firt please tell me which was the thread where you had given your reservations and past experience about the christian days. I have checked this thread, it is not there, but I had glanced that somewhere.
isn't that prejudice in itself to ASSUME that an english lady SHOULD HAVE some certain biases and prejudices based on her background?
well, i was never christian, and i second everything ayisha has said in this thread. do you want to examine my background now too, just in case? peace -
You have said it again.
You have the same arguement the hadithists have in accepting Muhammeds word, calling it Muhammeds words, Quran is the word of Allah and no one else, Muhammed is speaking the words of Allah not his own, he is confirming things with Allahs words, Allah is speaking through him, Allah says Muhammed has affirmed the messengers because Allah is telling you HE (Allah) is affirming the messengers through Muhammed, its not from the mind of Muhammed it is Allah speaking through him and that is where this problem lies in those who think that Muhammeds words are in there OR that everything he said in his life was from Allah. Muhammed said nothing from himself that is in Quran, not one single word, every word in it is from Allah just like a ventriloquist uses a doll, its not the doll speaking its the ventriloquist making the doll appear to speak.Red part will make traditionalists rejoice.
Allah is not speaking to us through him. He/Muhammad is speaking to us conveying the Kalam/Hadith of Allah, communicated to him. When someone speaks to others communicating some statement it is called his "". When people call the stories compiled by Hadith writers as "" of the Messenger, I say, that is not his "". His "" is Grand Qur'aan. And this is what Allah says not me I just conveyed His words;
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that undoubtedly that/Grand Qur'aan is certainly the Oral and written word/narration by the Exalted Messenger;Even a little change in describing something causes lot of difference in the perception that one may build in his mind. Without worrying much what traditionalists keep thinking and doing, we must not deviate from the straight words spoken by the Messenger of Allah. What he said, and is quoted in the Qur'aan, is that his life and death, i.e. every moment of his life, is for Allah-the Sustainer Lord of Worlds and that it is in line with what is stated in Qur'aan since he said I follow nothing but Qur'aan.
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isn't that prejudice in itself to ASSUME that an english lady SHOULD HAVE some certain biases and prejudices based on her background?
well, i was never christian, and i second everything ayisha has said in this thread. do you want to examine my background now too, just in case? peaceMadam,
Biases and prejudices are not something which could be injected into blood through a syringe. There is always a background-expereience which develops it.
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Red part will make traditionalists rejoice.
why? its saying the opposite of what they believe.Allah is not speaking to us through him. He/Muhammad is speaking to us conveying the Kalam/Hadith of Allah, communicated to him. When someone speaks to others communicating some statement it is called his "". When people call the stories compiled by Hadith writers as "" of the Messenger, I say, that is not his "". His "" is Grand Qur'aan. And this is what Allah says not me I just conveyed His words;
http//www.haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/069.%20Al%20Haqata/69.40a.gif
that undoubtedly that/Grand Qur'aan is certainly the Oral and written word/narration by the Exalted Messenger;Even a little change in describing something causes lot of difference in the perception that one may build in his mind. Without worrying much what traditionalists keep thinking and doing, we must not deviate from the straight words spoken by the Messenger of Allah. What he said, and is quoted in the Qur'aan, is that his life and death, i.e. every moment of his life, is for Allah-the Sustainer Lord of Worlds and that it is in line with what is stated in Qur'aan since he said I follow nothing but Qur'aan.
brickwall
Then please read and explain this
Look at verses with his name in them
Muhammad is not the father of any of your men, but (he is) the Messenger of Allah, and the Seal of the Prophets and Allah has full knowledge of all things
Did muhammed change this and say 'I am not the father of any of you' and change the grammar to first person? NO because its Allah speaking.
But those who believe and work deeds of righteousness, and believe in the (Revelation) sent down to Muhammad - for it is the Truth from their Lord,- He will remove from them their ills and improve their condition.
Did he change this to say 'send down to me'? No because its Allah speaking.
even those verses that start with 'Say oh Muhammed' he didnt even miss out the 'say oh Muhammed' and just say it
NONE of Quran is from Muhammed it is from Allah only. Allah confirms previous Books, Allah confirms previous prophets, Allah confirms THIS prophet is speaking the words of Allah.