Why muslim is not a proper noun
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Could "muslim" be considered and translated as "submitter" in the first instance?
sub?mit
(past and past participle sub?mit?ted, present participle sub?mit?ting, 3rd person present singular sub?mits)
verb-
vt propose or hand in something to hand something in or put something forward for consideration, approval, or judgment
Applications must be submitted in triplicate. -
vi yield to accept somebody else's authority or will, especially reluctantly or under pressure
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vi agree to agree to undergo something
had to submit to intensive questioning -
vi defer to defer to another's knowledge, judgment, or experience
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vt argue point to state or argue that something is the case (formal)
-sub?mit?ta?ble, , adjective
-sub?mit?tal, , noun
-sub?mit?ter, , noun
Word Key SynonymsSee yield
Microsoft? Encarta? 2006. ? 1993-2005 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved. -
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Good post. Clearly so. The contemporary definition of "muslim" usually means "Sunni with a hint of Shia and Wahhabi" - just another religion.
As for the translation, "submitting" is valid, it does not necessarily mean "relucantly or under pressure". A better definition would be "one who pledges allegiance".
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As for the translation, "submitting" is valid, it does not necessarily mean "relucantly or under pressure". A better definition would be "one who pledges allegiance".{OPF}
But Brother OPF, people do not perceive things from a word as you or me like them to think or understand. What to say of "it does not necessarily mean" the fact on ground is that this word especially conveys this perception as is evident from a renowned dictionary, Encarta.
"one who pledges allegiance" would become self contradictory as Islam is a Deen and Deen means practicing/following a course/path/system/code/law and it denotes something physical not mere "pledge of allegiance". The antonym of Muslimeen is Mujremeen, according to Quran. Both indicate "doers/performers" of something.
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Ah, but pledging allegiance gives the intended perception of "submitting" without the idea of "reluctance". Owing allegiance? Submitting (with full freedom) is the best term, but as you say, it carries negative connotations (I've seen this brought up by atheists when someone puts forward the common misnomer that "Islam" means "peace".
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I beg to differ, because the Holy Quran itself says we are NAMED Muslims. If the contention of this thread is that Muslim is not a name (but rather a description) than I think it is dead wrong
It is He Who has named you Muslims (227
The word sammakumu clearly implies name, just like we say Bismillah (In the name of Allah), or the Asma ul Husna (The Most Excellent Names of Allah). So clearly, just as Allah is the Name of God (and not a mere description), likewise the name of this ummah is Muslim.
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^ I hope nobody is denying the obvious as above.
Can you clarify, does it mean THE name, or does it mean a title, i.e. does it specifically mean "NAMED" or does it mean "called"? What if you substituted that for some other word - say hypocrites/munafiqun?
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jesus's followers, noah, jacob, pharoh (he 'submitted' at the last moment), joseph, etc... are 'muslims'. Tell me how this is possible?
What do you mean? Of course they were Muslims.
However, regarding Pharaoh, he believed at a time when his faith could not benefit him. Therefore he was not a true Muslim. Like on the day of judgment, when people will finally have no excuse to disbelieve, yet it will be too late for them then.
But when they saw Our Punishment, they said "We believe in Allah, the one Allah and we reject the partners we used to join with Him." But their professing the Faith when they (actually) saw Our Punishment was not going to profit them. (Such has been) Allah's Way of dealing with His Servants (from the most ancient times). And even thus did the Rejecters of Allah perish (utterly)! (4084-85)
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did they follow a religion called islam created in the 7th century AD, millions of years later?
The religion known as Islam (submission), which is the only true relationship between man and his Lord, has been in existence since the time of Adam (alaihi salaam). Islam was there way before the 7th century ad, the Holy Prophet Muhammad (alaihi salaatu wa salaam) is not the "founder" of a new religion, he only completed and revitalized the teachings of Islam.
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4213 clearly shows he followed the same deen as every other prophet
That is what I am trying to say DArgento. The Holy Prophet (alaihi salaatu wa salaam) followed the same deen (Islam) as every other prophet that came before him. Deen means religion, the only religion which the prophets followed and preached was Islam. Yet you were the one who said Islam began in the 7th century AD. 4213 in fact refutes you, not me.