Apathy for the scriptures
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I'm not going to bore everyone with the sad tale of my 'journeys' through the scriptures (Bible/Quran). That said, )
I believe in the creator of the universe. hail
I believe in all that is good, that is, the innate/God-given understanding of the righteous values we should uphold. temptBut sadly, I have recently found it difficult to accept the Quran as THE perfect and complete scripture it claims to be--DESPITE my agreement with most of what it contains. I used to though, in much the same way as I accepted the Bible. hypno
I am fearful, because I feel that God has perhaps "flipped the switch" of disbelief on me. & I can not see my views concerning the Quran changing much, and my beliefs concerning faith are becoming increasingly simpler (Believe in God and live a righteous life and that will do) and am apathetic towards detailed accounts including Satan and the angels for example.
whateverHas anyone got any thoughts on this? Anyone feeling the same?
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Peace to all,
No worries Naz, you still believe exactly what the Quran says to believe, in one God and to do good deeds, thats pretty much the entire message of the bible and the Quran, if you live according to these basics then you will by default live according to the scriptures, I dont think you need to believe specifically that the Quran is the perfect revelation of God,( though I do) as long as you believe and live as it says you should, regardless of where you find this guidance. I do not think God is going to give us an exam on the unimportant details about angels and satan as you mention, so live as you believe God wants you to, and worship one other than God and repel evil with good deeds, you will be ok brother, God willing.
Kurt
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peace nazz,
Verification of 'al quran' is an ongoing process in my opinion.
Secondly, trust takes time to build up and enter your heart. You said you agree with most of what 'al quran' says, and more importantly believe in its core message. That is good. Stick with that and continue to verify 'al quran' and build up your trust level.
There is a difference between a muslimeen and a mumineen.
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Peace Nazz,
Remember Quran is just a guide. A guide pushes you in the right direction, it won't hold your hand for you. That'd defeat the purpose of this life. Ultimately, who cares what satan, angels etc.. are. Is that going to make a difference in us doing good deeds? and/or avoiding evil?
Realize perhaps God wanted diversity among us.
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Thankyou all for your feedback.
Secondly, trust takes time to build up and enter your heart. You said you agree with most of what 'al quran' says, and more importantly believe in its core message. That is good. Stick with that and continue to verify 'al quran' and build up your trust level.
The thing with this is, I've already been here. I mean, when I first discovered the Quran it took a little time to accept it all, but I did. Though what Im saying now is, is that I am on the way down - going the other way, losing trust in it.
I dont think you need to believe specifically that the Quran is the perfect revelation of God
That sounds marvellous, but I feel it conflicts with what is written in the Quran
As for those who disbelieve and reject our revelations, they will be dwellers of Hell, wherein they abide forever. 239
Do you believe in part of the scripture and disbelieve in part? What should be the retribution for those among you who do this, except humiliation in this life? 285So I hope you can see my dilemma.
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Peace to all,
yes Nazz , but you dont disbelieve and reject Gods revelations, you said you believe, your just doubting that the Quran is the perfect revelation,, maybe you see other signs and revelations of God and strengthen your faith, like a sunflower in the summer or other sign, and I dont hink you believe in part of the Quran and reject others do you, you either believe in it all or none of it,, which do you believe?
Kurt
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The thing with this is, I've already been here. I mean, when I first discovered the Quran it took a little time to accept it all, but I did. Though what Im saying now is, is that I am on the way down - going the other way, losing trust in it.
For me, and from what I've understood from my reading of AQ, belief/trust is not a static entity, it is dynamic and can change/fluctuate, be tested etc. This is natural.
belief/trust is one element of the big picture. For example chapter 107 discusses what one can do to show they are acknowledging/accepting in the deen/obligation, and it does not mention trust/belief in a scripture.
My advice, keep the channel to God open, and if you still believe in the core message, continue to walk the path.... sometimes we dont know where the path will lead, but if you walk it, your footsteps will count.
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Greetings once again,
yes Nazz , but you dont disbelieve and reject Gods revelations, you said you believe, your just doubting that the Quran is the perfect revelation,, maybe you see other signs and revelations of God and strengthen your faith, like a sunflower in the summer or other sign, and I dont think you believe in part of the Quran and reject others do you, you either believe in it all or none of it,, which do you believe?
I said I believe in God the creator and leading a righteous life. I used to believe the Quran was the final perfect revelation from God, but now I am not sure at all. And yes, I agree with you; If one can not accept the Quran in its entireity as complete and perfect, then one should not accept it at all.
The bible is thought by many to be the final perfect revelation, but it really is clear that it is man-made and error-ridden despite the presence of some truths within it. Yet, even though it contains some truth, --- on the basis of those truths, one can not accept them as having come from God.
And so for example, if I do not believe in a particular verse in the Quran, then the authenticity of other verses wanes. Indeed, the authenticity of the entire Quran. hypno
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There are many things in the Quran that slide by me in the sense that what it talks about is not a problem for me. So I do not enter into it nor go into its analysis. There are other things that have shocked me at first and then, on studying and looking at them and analysing and doing away with translations and interpretations in fact have turned out to be gems fo meaning, concision... marvels. Other things just keep me asking myself what it means and I think that probably I will not know in my whole life, because I am missing the key.
I say, nazz, that if you tell us some of those parts of the Quran which don't come true to you, we might all profit by sharing.
Salaam
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G'day!
nazz, that if you tell us some of those parts of the Quran which don't come true to you, we might all profit by sharing.
I don't have any particular problems with anything in the Quran. My issue is one of accepting the things I agree with on the basis that it is from God. I just haven't seen any proof that the book is any more authentic than the bible, for instance. -\
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nazz
i echo Kurt and DArgento.
the Quran is a guide, a reminder, a sign. it is not God, nor is it the sum of God's Words.
3127
as for the Quran being "sent from God"... i believe that it is.
but remember, Abraham never had the Quran. through his reasoning and the guidance of God he was a hanif. God took him for a friend (!), and he was one of the righteous. as Muslims, we claim to follow the faith of Abraham, submission.
675-79 and 4125
may God bless you and guide you, Nazz.
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peace!
I find my situation very similar to yours nazz! I can see if you feel some fear... since the quran "says" that we should not believe in just part of the quran, and we should not first believe and then disbelieve. There is so much we don't know. What is God? Maybe our doubts and fears stem from an incorrect image of God... maybe we shouldn't have an image at all of God? Is it ok to doubt the quran? Is it extra bad if one used to believe in the quran? But WHY did we blieve in the quran in the first place? Did we earn the belief in the quran, or did we just adopt it? I also struggle with questions like these. And often I feel I just have to leave them... for the future, for some other time.
If you believe in a Power which we could call God... then I find it simplest, when all is confusing and difficult, to just FEEL and DESIRE to live in truth and goodness. Just desire to move closer and closer to the truth, whatever it is. Desire/pray for truth.
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I don't have any particular problems with anything in the Quran. My issue is one of accepting the things I agree with on the basis that it is from God. I just haven't seen any proof that the book is any more authentic than the bible, for instance.
that's an excellent point.... what makes the Quran "authentic", for me, is the truth of its central message - there is One God, master of the universe, and remembering Him and worshipfully connecting to Him is our life's goal. the social advice, as inseparable from the spiritual advice, also strikes me as both sensible and inspired.
my approach to world faiths tends to be pretty universalist- the truth that one finds in the Quran may also be sought in the Gita, the Torah, the Avestas, and in the meditations of one's heart, as Ibrahim first looked to. and again, i really believe that if you honor and remember God, and seek to do good for His sake, and reflect upon your life in relation to Him, you will be well guided, as God wills. peace
sorry to type so much! that's a lot. but i hope it helps.
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Have you ever prayed for the Holy Spirit to enter your life and be a guide and comfort to you? If you are truly earnest in your prayer you will immediately feel His presence.
GOD does not turn off and on belief in HIM. HE wants all of us to be in HIS fold. HE loves each of us.
There is an excellant book called - "The Pursuit of Holiness"
http//www.amazon.com/Pursuit-Holiness-Jerry-Bridges/dp/0891099409 -
hey p ~
there is a word in hebrew Ruh Kodesh, the Spirit of God. it is understood not as a prson of the trinity but as God's breath, inspiration, and peace. a similar word is in the Quran. yes, i do pray for God's spirit to help and enlighten me, and make me more grateful. it is a good feeling. i remember once when small in church, thinking that it made the most sense to worship the 'holy spirit', if He is the One who gives life and inspires us.
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Seven Fold Spirit of God
Giving us The Mind of Christ (Isaiah 112)Spirit of the Lord is the supernatural power source that creates God's Thoughts in our hearts.
Spirit of Wisdom is all of God's supernatural Thoughts themselves.
Spirit of Understanding is God's personal illumination of those thoughts.
Spirit of Counsel is God's personal instructions for Godly choices.
Spirit of Strength is God's supernatural ability to perform those Thoughts in our lives.
Spirit of Knowledge is seeing God's Thoughts manifested in our life actions.
Fear of the Lord is walking in God's Love and Truth, fleeing anything that would quench His Spirit. -
Quranically speaking, 'worshipping' the holy spirit would be worshipping Jibreel/Gabriel NOT God.
It has been used in the Quran three times, (2/97-98, and 66/4). It refers to that heavenly force which brought the Quran towards Muhammad (2/97). It has also been called Ruhul-Qudus (16/102) and Ruhul-Ameen (26/193).
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Peace nazz,
i just discovered this thread.
I have recently found it difficult to accept the Quran as THE perfect and complete scripture it claims to be--DESPITE my agreement with most of what it contains.
Well you've already seen that you are not alone. I had somewhat the same story, being a firm believer in God and the quran as being 'the' authentic word of god. Often had troubles with that too, as said huruf, things sometimes terribly shocked me at first, but research made me come to other understandings. And finally, even though i still believe quran to be "inspired by god" and the "best there is", it is imo a scripture written by humans searching for god .
Completely agree with wakas when he says that "belief/trust is not a static entity, it is dynamic and can change/fluctuate, be tested etc." and zulf "If you believe in a Power which we could call God... then I find it simplest, when all is confusing and difficult, to just FEEL and DESIRE to live in truth and goodness. Just desire to move closer and closer to the truth, whatever it is. Desire/pray for truth."
The important point is to try to live a righteous life, not to make others suffer, to do good. I'm not even sure anymore that believe in God is so important for someone to be accepted by god as a "muslim" (even though this is stated in quran) as long as the person really strives to make the best of his life in a non egoistical manner.
Let go the fear and trust in god.
elke
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Quranically speaking, 'worshipping' the holy spirit would be worshipping Jibreel/Gabriel NOT God.
It has been used in the Quran three times, (2/97-98, and 66/4). It refers to that heavenly force which brought the Quran towards Muhammad (2/97). It has also been called Ruhul-Qudus (16/102) and Ruhul-Ameen (26/193).
true. but from the point of view of a small Christian, the "person" of the holy spirit seemed more like who i understood God to be than the "father" or "son".
