thank you
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Salam DC2,
Your post is very uplifting to me, Thanks for taking the time to write it and welcome
I too was a "skeptic". Truly even those who despise religion can submit to the truth if God Wills. Yet I know many people who do not believe there is no way to Guide, no matter how much you try and reason with them. -
peace dc2,
Thanks for sharing your story and welcome.
The power of al quran is pretty amazing, and being drawn to it/islam after reading it is very common amongst reverts. Also being unsettled when introduced to traditional hadiths is also common.
it seems to me that over the last 1400 years, islam has not been any less suceptible to the modifications than muslims are so quick to accuse its spiritual predecessors of amassing
Exactly. In the early days of my journey I often used to ask myself how did I know I had the right version of Islam, and how illogical it was for me to think that Islam/Muslims were somehow immune to the distortions that happened to previous faiths. I simply couldn't fathom how that was possible, yet no Muslim I knew had asked themselves this.
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salam guys, and thanks for the warm welcomes. aalmakto, you raise an important point, none of us would be here save for god as god guides who he pleases. there is no use in trying to guide someone if god has not already decided to guide them also..its another reason i initially liked islam. we are not enjoined to compell anyone to come to islam. anyone who comes it is for their own good. if mohammed as his critics propose invented a religion merely as a means for personal gain then he must have been a master of reverse psychology as i think he would have laid out some easier tenets as in regards to prayer/fasting etc. also the religion would be laden with cult like obligations aka mormonism/catholicism.
rahila, sorry you had to leave somewhere you were attached to. happened to me too...and wakas you are spot on..mainstream musims need some a dose of some serious introspection and quit falling into the "it was what we found our fore-fathers were doing" trap. that or hire some really good PR.
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I do not know if I posted an introduction, but in case I have not here goes. I said my shahada a few years ago. Right after saying it (being drawn by the beauty of the Quran) I was taken aside. The men of the mosque explained to me tons of rules-no silk, gold etc. They kept adding more and more that I instantly regretted joining Islam. Yet I keep coming back to the Quran. So here I am. I guess I can say I have never trusted the hadith, and more and more I am understanding why. I feel lost as I am not sure how to pray now. If anyone has a step by step guide to prayer please email it to me. I read some on here, but the commentary distracts me and is not very user friendly when trying to learn/relearn prayers. Also are there any Quran Only Mosques/study groups?
Peace,
Icarus -
I do not know if I posted an introduction, but in case I have not here goes. I said my shahada a few years ago. Right after saying it (being drawn by the beauty of the Quran) I was taken aside. The men of the mosque explained to me tons of rules-no silk, gold etc. They kept adding more and more that I instantly regretted joining Islam. Yet I keep coming back to the Quran. So here I am. I guess I can say I have never trusted the hadith, and more and more I am understanding why. I feel lost as I am not sure how to pray now. If anyone has a step by step guide to prayer please email it to me. I read some on here, but the commentary distracts me and is not very user friendly when trying to learn/relearn prayers. Also are there any Quran Only Mosques/study groups?
Peace,
IcarusI don't think there is a step by step guide in the Quran. Im not sure about mosques though. I know there is a 19er mosque. Im sorry that you feel lost about prayer. God Willing just be sincere in prayer and that is the most important thing. Because if there was a way God wanted us to pray I am certain it would have been in the Quran as the Quran is 100% complete.
Peace and welcome
Al -
welcome dc2 Thanks for sharing your story!
I do not know if I posted an introduction, but in case I have not here goes. I said my shahada a few years ago. Right after saying it (being drawn by the beauty of the Quran) I was taken aside. The men of the mosque explained to me tons of rules-no silk, gold etc. They kept adding more and more that I instantly regretted joining Islam. Yet I keep coming back to the Quran. So here I am. I guess I can say I have never trusted the hadith, and more and more I am understanding why. I feel lost as I am not sure how to pray now. If anyone has a step by step guide to prayer please email it to me. I read some on here, but the commentary distracts me and is not very user friendly when trying to learn/relearn prayers. Also are there any Quran Only Mosques/study groups?
Peace,
IcarusPeace Icarus,
That's because salat doesn't mean 'prayer'.
Please see
http//mypercept.co.uk/articles/slw.
http//mypercept.co.uk/articles/disproved_traditional_salat.htm
http//free-minds.org/articles/quranic/salat_wakas.htm
Also, the purpose of salat is much more important than it's method (please see chapter 29 verse 45)
If you still feel it means prayer, there are couple of articles on the main site on it.
http//free-minds.org/articles/quranic/salat.htm
http//free-minds.org/articles/quranic/salat_edip.htm
Feel free to PM me, if you have any questions.
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salam ayani....good to meet you too. i was wondering what 'wa ilahi al-masir' means. and you are right i also feel better to omit these parts that seek to honour or pledge allegience mohammed. also the abu huraira hadeeth about the whole slipper thing is simply ridiculous. interesting that your roots are corkonian...if you ever come over i'ld be happy to show you round though alot of cork would be new to me too so we would both be lost which is always a thrill.
brother / sister ~
the last part of the shahada means "and to God we are returned". very true, and it's a phrase that comes up often in the Quran. i would rather follow the Quran than the desires or traditions of men...
yay for getting lost together! i would love to see Ireland someday... insha'allah. yay shall we plan for summer of 2012? can we find some small donkeys and ride them around the hills? that would rock.
i agree, it's not always easy following Quran alone with regards to the larger ummah, but so far as our closeness to God and day to day, it's wonderful. and so worth it. have you seen / read the Mohammed Asad translation / commentary? really beutiful and well-explained.
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Although I'm bound to get strung up high for this; I tend to be of the Hanafi school of thought; as long as you're sincerely trying your best and you believe that you're doing what is expect of you, you honestly can't be held accountable for those ideas you have taken with good faith that might have been perversions.
As long as those innovations don't threaten the core value of Islam, the oneness of God, then it is nothing to worry about.
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If anyone has a step by step guide to prayer please email it to me. I read some on here, but the commentary distracts me and is not very user friendly when trying to learn/relearn prayers.
salam icarus, i think in this forum, there are many different interpetations of how to preform salat and what it means etc. i have wondered myself how a submitter or quran-aloner preforms it. i havent found an exact step by step guide. i guess i would have to go to a submitter mosque to see how they exactly do it and i think there is only one in tuscon az. for me i think the intention to submit snd worship is greater than the actions preformed. i make salat the way i first read how to preform it, the sunni way, though i generally leave out the very last dua asking allah to bless the prophet just like abraham and his family. right now i am praying 3 times a day, dawn, evening and night but i may switch back to five if i can find the evidence to support it.
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shall we plan for summer of 2012? can we find some small donkeys and ride them around the hills?
have you seen / read the Mohammed Asad translation / commentary? really beutiful and well-explained.2012?? is that when you're getting released? havent seen an irish donkey in 20 years. they've been replaced by yuppies stuck in traffic. i did read parts of the asad translation once i think. i must check it out again though after you reccomending it. i do want to check out the new reformist one too.
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2012?? is that when you're getting released? havent seen an irish donkey in 20 years. they've been replaced by yuppies stuck in traffic. i did read parts of the asad translation once i think. i must check it out again though after you reccomending it. i do want to check out the new reformist one too.
D my uncle went to Ireland a summer back, said there were some lovely fuzzy donkeys and sheep. yuppies are a weak, weak substitute.
the Asad translation is good, but his commentary is what's really wonderful. incredibly well-read, thoughtful, insightful. extensive, too.
http//www.alibris.com/booksearch?author=asad&title=message+quran
i would like to read the reformist translation, too, insha'allah. i actually found the RK translation at my local public library, which really surprised me. we're in the middle of no where, among the corn and the Mennonites.
aysha ~ salam! good to meet you, too. i remember being bowled over when i found this forum, and very very grateful, too.
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i make salat the way i first read how to preform it, the sunni way, though i generally leave out the very last dua asking allah to bless the prophet just like abraham and his family. right now i am praying 3 times a day, dawn, evening and night but i may switch back to five if i can find the evidence to support it.
Welcome bro,
People think salat is something mysterious and only they can unravel it's correct way to us dumbos. They forget that God tells to do salat as he as already taught us, just like speach, walking and other things we do - BUT with some conditions, primarly wudu, timings and devoted to God alone.
God places conditions on our diet, but nobody says hey, how do I eat, how many units do I eat, it's not in the quran - but when you mention salat .... they start sweating.
In the desire to the learn something new lets not forget the old.
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Welcome bro,
People think salat is something mysterious and only they can unravel it's correct way to us dumbos. They forget that God tells to do salat as he as already taught us, just like speach, walking and other things we do - BUT with some conditions, primarly wudu, timings and devoted to God alone.
God places conditions on our diet, but nobody says hey, how do I eat, how many units do I eat, it's not in the quran - but when you mention salat .... they start sweating.
In the desire to the learn something new lets not forget the old.
not sure if i get you, are you saying you think salat should be left to personal interpetation with some conditions?
what do you mean when you say 'They forget that God tells to do salat as he as already taught us like speach, walking and other things we do' ?...that it is natural or coded into our design?
'In the desire to the learn something new lets not forget the old'.....do you mean we should make salat as traditional muslims do?
peace.
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not sure if i get you, are you saying you think salat should be left to personal interpetation with some conditions?
There is nothing to interperate. Thats whole problem. It's not in the Quran. We know Mohammed didn't bring a new salat, all he did was tell people what they were doing wrong with the one they had. All we have are the conditions which are as clear day.
what do you mean when you say 'They forget that God tells to do salat as he as already taught us like speach, walking and other things we do' ?...that it is natural or coded into our design?
I would imagine it's alot more complex than that. You must agree that God has ways other than the Quran to guide us.
'In the desire to the learn something new lets not forget the old'.....do you mean we should make salat as traditional muslims do?
Yes if that was your way. If you were hindu before I'd expect you carry on with that way but applying the Quranic conditions.
You'd be surprised how similiar salat is among different cultures and religions. And if everyone devoted their salaat to God alone, there wouldn't be any issues at all.
God makes no difference between Salaat of Noah and Mohammad.
peace.
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Greetings & Welcome!
welcome
The "Salat Prayer" issue would continue to be one of the most confusing puzzle if it is really a "prayer".
Very well said by House M.D.
That's because salat doesn't mean 'prayer'.
Please see
http//mypercept.co.uk/articles/slw.
http//mypercept.co.uk/articles/disproved_traditional_salat.htm
http//free-minds.org/articles/quranic/salat_wakas.htm
(I Don't want to go off topic here but I just want to share it the sincere & natural way.)
I know it's quite hard to reject the "ritual" at first when you see most translations refer to it as "salat". But just try to consider why this word "salat" pops up all over the quran in many many context which are completely unrelated to "prayer" - but it is fully related to uphold the "bond" of God's laws since "aqemous-salat" occurs many times immediately near the commandments God tells the messengers or believers with him or believers in general.
I used to ask myself
Why is it such a great puzzle to figure out the rituals if the quran is God's preserved revelation and complete, fully detailed?
Is it this ritual stuff or rather upholding God's laws (believe/worship/glorify God alone, be kind to parents, tell the truth, speak in good manners, stay away from adultery, etc... etc, etc.) that can make us far from evil as in 2945? Which one is more Natural? Do I have to be more "Arab" or traditional to be a good man?
I see all the messengers are telling the same Natural message to glorify the One God and do good.
Also ,the world bend, prostrate, stand, many times are allegorical but it would be confusing if we see it literal... Chapter 37 shows that there are both clear and allegorical verses but if people take the allegorical as literal then it would cause lots of confusion, etc. (Yes, not all translations are the same, this is from having read "QXP"... which I don't agree on all points but is truly a very very good rendition (not translation) that shows the harmony of the quran excellently!)
Therefore, believe/understand/praise the One God and do good is the way. God explains in his book how to do so complete, fully detailed.
Then I ask myself, what if I'm wrong? My friend said something like, we do our best to be most sincere to God Alone as he clarified - we want to stay away from the human-added falsehood. God gave us this much means and knowledge and we did our best most sincere way. Would God punish us for us not solving the great "salat prayer" puzzle when He didn't clarify it? Also, as we tested/verified for ourselves that the quran is indeed God's preserved revelation, and it is complete & fully detailed - then such a repeated/important issue like salat can't be a puzzle like this.
May God Guide & Bless!
Glory to God, the Creator of all things!
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salam,
Respectfully.welcome and hope you find many friends here.
Read the Qur'an and always rely on The God.Remember God The Most Powewrful hears you all the time so whatever you ask, ask God and know that God is The Most powerful, He can do anything and everything.
Glory be to God, The Most Wise.
Glory be to God The Most Just.Peace.
