I agree to nearly everything you said. There is just one part that caught my attention.
Like, for example add_effect light 255 add_voice God "O Moses. Here I am, but you cannot see me..."
I don't think God adds anything into the system at times because he is also the creator of time and is not contricted by it. He doesn't need to add anything "at time".
Nice post! I agree with you. A lot of the problems rise from people oversimplifying things. An argument I use against creationists who refuse to acknowledge evolution is also about gravity. The existence of gravity is undisputed. But God could also have made a universe where gravity did not exist, and he could make it work. Then why does gravity exist? Because it's the better, smarter solution. Same goes for the evolution. It's a magnificent system that preserves life and the balance between ecosystems.
Indeed.
Thank you. )
Humans can "create" (2917, 349) i.e, make or produce (things).
However, - GOD is the Best of (all) creatorS (2314; 37125)
Humans cannot "originate" (something out of nothing)
The Best of (all) creators is the sole Originator (1751, 351).
Just my 2? worth.
That's pretty much what I tried to say, no?
That is not wrong but my main message was different. A lot of the time, both believers and non-believers tend to think that creating means making things appear out of thin air. That's part the reason why so many refuse to believe evolution exists. I believe God doesn't have to create everything directly to be called creator.
Hello everyone, I have been following the forums for a couple of days and decided to join as my beliefs are similar to those discussed here.
I want to discuss a point. Not something that many would consider important as it's completely hypothetical but I think a discussion of such nature could help us ponder about the creation.
Let's think of AI's, Artificial Intelligences, as seen in a lot of science fiction novels, films etc. It could be a computer intelligence or one with a body (preferably non-remote). Let's hypothesise that these AI's are incredibly complex, they are self aware and they are able to modify their code in order to improve themselves in a desired way. In other words, pretty much like us, humans. Now it should be obvious that such a creature is more than a machine as it is able to feel and believe; to ignore logic and to act with emotion.
Now, who created such a thing, as it could perhaps be considered even alive? Did we create it? We certainly made it, but in a certain way. Then how in the world did it become able to modify itself?
From this hypothesis, I would like to share my concept of creation. We made these AI's, but with tools. We made the tools but with different, less complex ones. And at the start, we used raw materials. That is where the distinction between making and creating lies. When making something, you use something which you did make yourself but when creating, everything you make must be made using what you made. So of course, humans are not capable of creating.
So, we made these AI's. The materials that were used to make these things were created by God. We were also created by God. So, it was actually God who created these things and we were just a tool of this creation.
Now a possible argument against this notion could be this "God gave us free will, so he does not affect our actions therefore he cannot have used us."
Yes, we have free will. We have the ability to decide our actions but only our actions. God puts us into situations, by using his creation and we decide what action we will take in the context that we are in. And as he is unbound by time, he already knows what actions we will take, it would be easy for him to nudge the reality in a way he desires by putting key people in key situations.
So to counclude my disoriented thoughts, I believe God's creation is not simply making things appear out of thin air. He uses methods so subtle that it is hard to notice that he indeed was involved. I think this is a good counter-argument against non-believers who try to disprove God and his creation by oversimplifying these ideas. I cannot claim this is true as I have no evidence based on neither Quran nor research but I also couldn't find any fundamental errors in my logic.
I'd like to hear your thoughts. If you could find any evidence supporting or disproving this, I'd be grateful.