Meteors chase things?
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The word
is wrongly translated as to follow. It means to "guard it of".
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Is that word in either 1518 or 3710? Are you trying to be irrelevant on purpose?
It's the same word in both verses.
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So what? The point is that only the jinn who snatch a hearing by stealth are pursued. Are you purposefully trying to confuse the subject?
No, they are payed attention to/taken care of.
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OK, whatever.
So, it's settled.
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It is? Have you been reading any of my responses?
OK, whatever.
Chloroform? Or maybe even it's pigment? Why don't you just say it? I'm not responding to a time wasting little game. Why do you do this? you're not being clever in the least, so stop trying so hard and just say it in plain, simple terms.Now us and the jinn are deterministic machines? My God, you are all over the map. I'm losing patience with the conversation.
This conversation is simply going into outer space. Go right a science fiction novel. By the way, as far as the Jinn being alive, go read sura 72 Al-Jinn, okay? What's you're point?
So what? What's your point?
Are radio waves bright for us to see as per 1518? What are you on?
OMG WTF
What are your responses? All I see is a barrage of questions that have been answered. Point them out, it would be easier.
Chloroform? Or maybe even it's pigment? Why don't you just say it? I'm not responding to a time wasting little game. Why do you do this? you're not being clever in the least, so stop trying so hard and just say it in plain, simple terms.
Anything to avoid thinking, and hence, having to compare a Quranic statement to reality, instead of your own preconception, eh? There is no "being clever" or "trying hard", I'm asking you a simple question.
Now us and the jinn are deterministic machines? My God, you are all over the map. I'm losing patience with the conversation.
I said "IF". Also, you addressed the wrong part of the paragraph. That was pure nitpicking.
This conversation is simply going into outer space. Go right a science fiction novel. By the way, as far as the Jinn being alive, go read sura 72 Al-Jinn, okay? What's you're point?
The point is to show that it is physically possible that only a "jinn" that "steals a hearing" will be chased, and nothing more. As for the jinn being alive, surah al-jinn has nothing that I can see that points to it. Personification is a common theme in the Quran, for instance, the universe is said to perform sujood to Allah, willingly and unwillingly, and God "speaks" to inanimate objects, and so on. The Quran indirectly and directly states humans are alive (as in actively, not passively - 2554, 228, 2266, 3926), maybe I'm being oblivious, but I haven't seen one which links it to jinn as well. One possible reference is 6130 but that could also be otherwise.
So what? What's your point?
To demonstrate that it is physically possible.
Are radio waves bright for us to see as per 1518? What are you on?
After a bit of doppler shifting, yes ;D
But I threw that out there randomly.
OMG WTF
Let's rephrase the last sentence; My understanding is that there is a rational explanation for the Quran's description of jinn. Simple as that.
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What are your responses? All I see is a barrage of questions that have been answered. Point them out, it would be easier.
I said, OMG WTF because you were all over the cosmic map and no longer making sense. Oh jeez, I think I'm getting ill.
Anything to avoid thinking, and hence, having to compare a Quranic statement to reality, instead of your own preconception, eh? There is no "being clever" or "trying hard", I'm asking you a simple question.
Look, I have to admit, that in my past experience with people that speak like you, they usually turn out to be bright teenagers. Which is OK, I suppose. But there is always this non realistic sense where if they can invent it or if it's possible, then it's legitimate. It's only experience that prevents people from inventing implausible things. Younger people do it all of the time, and if there is 5% chance that it can be, then it's legit. Older people become a little more conservative with time.
The point is to show that it is physically possible that only a "jinn" that "steals a hearing" will be chased, and nothing more.
But wait a second, it actually says that all Jinn are repelled (by whatever means you wish, doesn't matter), but that occasionally, one might snatch a hearing by stealth, and if THAT particular one does, then a clear flame pursues. So this contradicts your chemical attraction theory. So do I need to read the rest of your post or is science fiction class over?
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I said, OMG WTF because you were all over the cosmic map and no longer making sense. Oh jeez, I think I'm getting ill.
Look, I have to admit, that in my past experience with people that speak like you, they usually turn out to be bright teenagers. Which is OK, I suppose. But there is always this non realistic sense where if they can invent it or if it's possible, then it's legitimate. It's only experience that prevents people from inventing implausible things. Younger people do it all of the time, and if there is 5% chance that it can be, then it's legit. Older people become a little more conservative with time.
But wait a second, it actually says that all Jinn are repelled (by whatever means you wish, doesn't matter), but that occasionally, one might snatch a hearing by stealth, and if THAT particular one does, then a clear flame pursues. So this contradicts your chemical attraction theory. So do I need to read the rest of your post or is science fiction class over?
You are already ill
Look, I have to admit, that in my past experience with people that speak like you, they usually turn out to be bright teenagers. Which is OK, I suppose. But there is always this non realistic sense where if they can invent it or if it's possible, then it's legitimate. It's only experience that prevents people from inventing implausible things. Younger people do it all of the time, and if there is 5% chance that it can be, then it's legit. Older people become a little more conservative with time.
I never said "if it can be invented, it's legitimate", I said "if it's rationally explainable, then it's possible". It gets no simpler than that. You may wish to recheck the "implausible things" part of your post, still waiting for that definition/concept of "jinn"
But wait a second, it actually says that all Jinn are repelled (by whatever means you wish, doesn't matter), but that occasionally, one might snatch a hearing by stealth, and if THAT particular one does, then a clear flame pursues. So this contradicts your chemical attraction theory. So do I need to read the rest of your post or is science fiction class over?
No it does not. It says that it is guarded against them, not "repelled". Then, if one of them stealthily snatches a hearing it is followed. So it doesn't contradict my theory, and if it does, then my theory is wrong
Which brings us back to
Let's rephrase the last sentence; My understanding is that there is a rational explanation for the Quran's description of jinn. Simple as that.
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You are already ill
I never said "if it can be invented, it's legitimate", I said "if it's rationally explainable, then it's possible".
Well it's rationally explainable that Klingons might just circle Uranus as well. So where does plausibilty fit into the creative, invention factory mind of yours?
It gets no simpler than that. You may wish to recheck the "implausible things" part of your post, still waiting for that definition/concept of "jinn"
I told you that already. I said the word jinn comes from "to conceal or to hide". That was a bona fide correct answer that perhaps even you weren't aware of yourself.
No it does not. It says that it is guarded against them, not "repelled". Then, if one of them stealthily snatches a hearing it is followed. So it doesn't contradict my theory, and if it does, then my theory is wrong
Yes it does, because not all of them are pursued, which would be the case of a physical attraction, but rather, only the one's that snatch a hearing by stealth, meaning they weren't detected, are the ones pursued. And when they are detected, a flame shoots off and chases them. So this does indeed invalidate your entire weird science fiction angle of plasma and flame attracting, because they would be attracted to any of them, and not just the ones who stole a hearing. When it comes to only singling out the ones who stole a hearing, we are looking at detection and action, which means "active", to coin your overly used term. Like I said, go write a science fiction book like "Muslims in Space" or something.
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Yes, you've been stumped to the point of resorting to stonewalling, which is always a clear sign of being stumped.
Do not throw your baseless accusations at me. That's a clear sign of when a discussion ends.
So in other words, you have no reply.
Fine. -
Do not throw your baseless accusations at me. That's a clear sign of when a discussion ends.
So in other words, you have no reply.
Fine.Reply to what? All you did was stand up out of nowhere and just arbitrarily claim the issue is settled and that you are right. So I did reply. I said you were stumped. You didn't solve anything. What question of yours did you think I didn't answer? Quote it. I'm sick and tired of Muslims always playing this stand up out of nowhere and declare victory for no reason nonsense game. Why do you guys all consistently, no matter what forum, always attempt to pull this stuff? There's a consistency with this stunt, as if the same person is teaching all of you to try this. Who told you that this is supposed to work? It doesn't, so I hope you didn't pay the guy any money.
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Reply to what? All you did was stand up out of nowhere and just arbitrarily claim the issue is settled and that you are right. So I did reply. I said you were stumped. You didn't solve anything. What question of yours did you think I didn't answer? Quote it. I'm sick and tired of Muslims always playing this stand up out of nowhere and declare victory for no reason nonsense game. Why do you guys all consistently, no matter what forum, always attempt to pull this stuff? There's a consistency with this stunt, as if the same person is teaching all of you to try this. Who told you that this is supposed to work? It doesn't, so I hope you didn't pay the guy any money.
I explained to you the verse and you replied with
"OK, whatever".
I understood as settling the issue. You replied with your usual bla bla...
We are mature people here. We do not play the victory game. It's people like you who think with few imaginations can prove that the Quran was written according to 7th century concepts. -
Well it's rationally explainable that Klingons might just circle Uranus as well. So where does plausibilty fit into the creative, invention factory mind of yours?
I told you that already. I said the word jinn comes from "to conceal or to hide". That was a bona fide correct answer that perhaps even you weren't aware of yourself.
Yes it does, because not all of them are pursued, which would be the case of a physical attraction, but rather, only the one's that snatch a hearing by stealth, meaning they weren't detected, are the ones pursued. And when they are detected, a flame shoots off and chases them. So this does indeed invalidate your entire weird science fiction angle of plasma and flame attracting, because they would be attracted to any of them, and not just the ones who stole a hearing. When it comes to only singling out the ones who stole a hearing, we are looking at detection and action, which means "active", to coin your overly used term. Like I said, go write a science fiction book like "Muslims in Space" or something.
I said, if it's possible, it's possible, and nothing more.
I told you that already. I said the word jinn comes from "to conceal or to hide". That was a bona fide correct answer that perhaps even you weren't aware of yourself.
Correction. You said "the word "jinn" means entities that have the ability to conceal themselves". What are these "entities"? So much for bona fide, when you can't even post the unadulterated meaning.
Yes it does, because not all of them are pursued, which would be the case of a physical attraction, but rather, only the one's that snatch a hearing by stealth, meaning they weren't detected, are the ones pursued. And when they are detected, a flame shoots off and chases them. So this does indeed invalidate your entire weird science fiction angle of plasma and flame attracting, because they would be attracted to any of them, and not just the ones who stole a hearing. When it comes to only singling out the ones who stole a hearing, we are looking at detection and action, which means "active", to coin your overly used term. Like I said, go write a science fiction book like "Muslims in Space" or something.
So, if it is possible for one human to be struck by lightning repeatedly, it should happen to ALL humans? They wouldn't be attracted to any of them, simply those that used stealth, and those that stole a hearing. Either the stealth or the theft could cause it.
When it comes to only singling out the ones who stole a hearing, we are looking at detection and action, which means "active",
No it doesn't. Singling them out can automatically happen if the process of stealing, or becoming stealthy, causes them to be attracted.
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I said, if it's possible, it's possible, and nothing more.
But the chemical attraction should work all across the board, and not just on the specific jinn who happen to steal a hearing. So this one goes out the window, but I know you have many more in store, as I was sincere when I said you should be a science fiction writer. Nobody is as creative as Muslims when it comes to religion.
Correction. You said "the word "jinn" means entities that have the ability to conceal themselves". What are these "entities"? So much for bona fide, when you can't even post the unadulterated meaning.
Didn't I say the word Jinn means "to conceal"? Isn't that what I said? That IS the unadulterated meaning. I was taught this by Muslims that apparently know more than you do.
So, if it is possible for one human to be struck by lightning repeatedly, it should happen to ALL humans? They wouldn't be attracted to any of them, simply those that used stealth, and those that stole a hearing. Either the stealth or the theft could cause it.
Oh please, that's enough of the reaching, OK? I think you are a bright teenager. Do you know why I think so? Because in my experiences, teenagers have unlimited creativity, but they have a poor sense of plausibility. That sense only comes with age and experience. An adult would know not to reach as far as you are attempting to reach. But you're crazy if you think I'm going to continually entertain any sort of idea you can invent until you've exhausted your imagination, because it would take a very very long time to exhaust your imagination. So sorry, but "possible" is not good enough. I'm looking for "plausible", if you understand the difference between the two.
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But the chemical attraction should work all across the board, and not just on the specific jinn who happen to steal a hearing. So this one goes out the window, but I know you have many more in store, as I was sincere when I said you should be a science fiction writer. Nobody is as creative as Muslims when it comes to religion.
Where did you get that? The process of stealth or the process of theft or both, or whatever, could easily cause it.
Didn't I say the word Jinn means "to conceal"? Isn't that what I said? That IS the unadulterated meaning. I was taught this by Muslims that apparently know more than you do.
You said entities that have the ability to cloak themselves, implying living beings, I want to know what these entities are ;D.
That IS the unadulterated meaning.
Good to see you caught on and are now using unadulterated meanings instead of Arnold's Lexicon and Tafsir Ibn Arnold ;D
I'm looking for "plausible", if you understand the difference between the two.
It's implausible if "jinn" are living beings. Now show me where "jinn" are living beings. By your admission, jinn means "to conceal" or "concealed".
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Where did you get that? The process of stealth or the process of theft or both, or whatever, could easily cause it.
If you hear something, then this sets off a chemical reaction? Oh come on. I told you, I'm not entertaining your imagination forever. Plausible, not possible. Possible is stupid to bring up. Plausible is relevant.
You said entities that have the ability to cloak themselves, implying living beings, I want to know what these entities are ;D.
Ask the Quran and the Hadiths. I don't know why you're asking me. Here, here's a good article all about the Jinn from a very respected Muslim website.
http//thetruereligion.org/modules/wfsection/article.php?articleid=55
Good to see you caught on and are now using unadulterated meanings instead of Arnold's Lexicon and Tafsir Ibn Arnold ;D
Caught on to what? I'm merely trying to play it from your angle. Most other Muslims I've talked to would consider you to be a blithering apostate, so don't go around thinking you have the correct standard and that people should finally catch on. Look, I'll tell you this very simply. You're not particularly bright and the jargon you hide behind does not particularly impress me, and people do not usually speak in the most complex fashion they can unless they want to show people they are smart, and the people that usually do this are actually hiding the fact that they really aren't particularly smart when it come down to it. So I have no idea why you keep thinking you're being clever, when all you are doing is inventing less than plausible "possibilities". Start giving me something plausible, rather than the bounds of your imagination, OK?
It's implausible if "jinn" are living beings. Now show me where "jinn" are living beings. By your admission, jinn means "to conceal" or "concealed".
Sura 72 Al-Jinn. Seems like living beings to me. In fact, some even become Muslims. Dude, you are way off. I don't even think most Muslims would agree with you either. Am I having a conversation with a whack job? I hope not.
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If you hear something, then this sets off a chemical reaction? Oh come on. I told you, I'm not entertaining your imagination forever. Plausible, not possible. Possible is stupid to bring up. Plausible is relevant.
Ask the Quran and the Hadiths. I don't know why you're asking me. Here, here's a good article all about the Jinn from a very respected Muslim website.
http//thetruereligion.org/modules/wfsection/article.php?articleid=55
Caught on to what? I'm merely trying to play it from your angle. Most other Muslims I've talked to would consider you to be a blithering apostate, so don't go around thinking you have the correct standard and that people should finally catch on. Look, I'll tell you this very simply. You're not particularly bright and the jargon you hide behind does not particularly impress me, and people do not usually speak in the most complex fashion they can unless they want to show people they are smart, and the people that usually do this are actually hiding the fact that they really aren't particularly smart when it come down to it. So I have no idea why you keep thinking you're being clever, when all you are doing is inventing less than plausible "possibilities". Start giving me something plausible, rather than the bounds of your imagination, OK?
Sura 72 Al-Jinn. Seems like living beings to me. In fact, some even become Muslims. Dude, you are way off. I don't even think most Muslims would agree with you either. Am I having a conversation with a whack job? I hope not.
It isn't "if you hear something", it is "if you steal a hearing".
Ask the Quran and the Hadiths. I don't know why you're asking me. Here, here's a good article all about the Jinn from a very respected Muslim website.
But you're the one trying to say "jinn are chased by meteors", not the Quran...
1529, 329, and other verses clearly show humans are special, living entities, where is this for jinn? Nothing in that article.
Caught on to what? I'm merely trying to play it from your angle. Most other Muslims I've talked to would consider you to be a blithering apostate, so don't go around thinking you have the correct standard and that people should finally catch on. Look, I'll tell you this very simply. You're not particularly bright and the jargon you hide behind does not particularly impress me, and people do not usually speak in the most complex fashion they can unless they want to show people they are smart, and the people that usually do this are actually hiding the fact that they really aren't particularly smart when it come down to it. So I have no idea why you keep thinking you're being clever, when all you are doing is inventing less than plausible "possibilities". Start giving me something plausible, rather than the bounds of your imagination, OK?
Blithering apostate, ;D. It isn't "complex language", it's the easiest way to get to the point. Somehow I get the feeling I struck a nerve somewhere. Not my problem if you can't be bothered to think what the word "passive" or whatever means in context.
Sura 72 Al-Jinn. Seems like living beings to me. In fact, some even become Muslims. Dude, you are way off. I don't even think most Muslims would agree with you either. Am I having a conversation with a whack job? I hope not.
That's already been addressed. I don't care whether "most Muslims would agree" either. All you've said is "waah, no fair" and "waah, that's off" and "waaha, you nutjob", show me where jinn are directly said to be alive. Put up, or shut up. As for your conversation with a whack job, it depends, do you talk to yourself?
Regardless, the original topic, that "jinn" are chased by "meteors" is pure horses***. This is just a diversion on your part. The fact of the matter is that the word cannot be tied specifically to "meteor", or even worse, "shooting stars", because it refers to the lowest heaven adorned with planets, last I checked, the sky isn't adorned with planets.