Question regarding Zina
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Zina is Zina ,no matter how it is
-secret or open
-married or unmarried
-with witnesses or without witnesses.
Can you tell me which word in arabic is used for "Adultery"?? where Quran has used that word ?You are correct but realistically, "zina" cannot be prosecuted for unless it is public (where 4 witnesses constitutes it being public). Ref 4912.
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Show me presence of four persons Please highlight those words and put them back
49121249
I pity you.
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Peace,
2+2=4
In 4912 we are told NOT to spy on one another and to avoid suspicion, now tell me what situations will produce 4 witnesses
a) public sex
b) the person has had sex with at least 4 different partners (most likely more than that) and they all come forward as witnesses...I say more because not all (if any) would come forward.
c)porn, which usually has more than 4 witnesses present
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Zina is Zina ,no matter how it is
-secret or open
-married or unmarried
-with witnesses or without witnesses.
Can you tell me which word in arabic is used for "Adultery"?? where Quran has used that word ?Peace,
I can only tell you my own understandings and hopefully sis Samia or someone else with arabic knowledge can give you exactly the translation you look for and where it is.
I guess Adultery and fornications are the same and they fall in the category of zina but only the public one the ones that are witnessed are the ones that can be put infront of the judge and there can be a penalty.
I don't think it's more difficult than that, really. God doesn't want to put too much on our shoulders to bear and He likes the repenters and the good-doers.
Peace
Maria -
Peace,
I can only tell you my own understandings and hopefully sis Samia or someone else with arabic knowledge can give you exactly the translation you look for and where it is.
I guess Adultery and fornications are the same and they fall in the category of zina but only the public one the ones that are witnessed are the ones that can be put infront of the judge and there can be a penalty.
I don't think it's more difficult than that, really. God doesn't want to put too much on our shoulders to bear and He likes the repenters and the good-doers.
Peace
MariaDear Maria;
It is the question of Punishment.One should be crystal clear
-what is the difference between Zina and Adultery.
-Public act ?? ,show me the pre-requisite of four Witnesses for proving of Zina imentioned in the Quran . -
Dear Maria;
It is the question of Punishment.One should be crystal clear
-what is the difference between Zina and Adultery.
-Public act ?? ,show me the pre-requisite of four Witnesses for proving of Zina imentioned in the Quran .A - Adultery is a subset of "zina".
B - 244, 246, 2413, 415
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A - Adultery is a subset of "zina".
B - 244, 246, 2413, 415
Please put the actual ayas (arabic text) and their translation here .Thanks
Along with please put the definition of Adultery and Zina and their respective Arabic equivalents used in the holy Quran.Thanks again -
Please put the actual ayas (arabic text) and their translation here .Thanks
Along with please put the definition of Adultery and Zina and their respective Arabic equivalents used in the holy Quran.Thanks againBrother Allen
what better explanation do you want than what Samia has already given you?
According to Koran a person is called a Zani , if there are 4 evidences to it (to make sure) and only then the punishment as such can be applied.
if you read , 24-2 ,3 the word Zani and punishment is used only in conjunction with 4 witness, and once you read further on 24-4,5,6, you will find that 4 witnesses requirement is not fulfilled, so the word Zina is not used , but only accusation is used, It does not say accusation of Zina.
A "fahisha" when not witnessed by 4, can only be termed as an accusation, and, becomes Zina, only when there are 4 witnesses.
siki
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Brother Allen
what better explanation do you want than what Samia has already given you?
According to Koran a person is called a Zani , if there are 4 evidences to it (to make sure) and only then the punishment as such can be applied.
if you read , 24-2 ,3 the word Zani and punishment is used only in conjunction with 4 witness, and once you read further on 24-4,5,6, you will find that 4 witnesses requirement is not fulfilled, so the word Zina is not used , but only accusation is used, It does not say accusation of Zina.
A "fahisha" when not witnessed by 4, can only be termed as an accusation, and, becomes Zina, only when there are 4 witnesses.
siki
This is what Samia said
What's your definition of adultery?
I use the word "zina" not adultrey. I understand adultrey as a sexual act outside wedlock. If so, this is not the definition of zina. Unmarried people can also commit zina.
Honestly , ,my small brain could not catch.
Show what definition did she put for Zina ??
You say what better definition ?
Please I request you to
-- Precisely define the Zina and Adultery
--What is the arabic word for adultery
-- Where it is used in the Quran
---Where in the Quran it is said that to prove the act of Zina four witnesses are needed.
Kindly I request you to put the Arabic Ayaats + their translations .Only references are just to deceive the readers.
Thanks in advance -
Friends , we have a problem here
4.15-17 If any of your women are guilty of lewdness, Take the evidence of four (Reliable) witnesses from amongst you against them; and if they testify, confine them to houses until death do claim them, or God ordain for them some (other) way,If two men among you are guilty of lewdness, punish them both. If they repent and amend, Leave them alone; for God is Oft-returning, Most Merciful,God accept the repentance of those who do evil in ignorance and repent soon afterwards; to them will God turn in mercy For God is full of knowledge and wisdom.
Can somebody explain above?
we have fornication/adultry/being committed , and we have 4 witnesses too, yet these women are not being labeled as Zanias, and even the punishement is different
I think brother Alen has a point.
siki
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Friends , we have a problem here
4.15-17 If any of your women are guilty of lewdness, Take the evidence of four (Reliable) witnesses from amongst you against them; and if they testify, confine them to houses until death do claim them, or God ordain for them some (other) way,If two men among you are guilty of lewdness, punish them both. If they repent and amend, Leave them alone; for God is Oft-returning, Most Merciful,God accept the repentance of those who do evil in ignorance and repent soon afterwards; to them will God turn in mercy For God is full of knowledge and wisdom.
Can somebody explain above?
we have fornication/adultry/being committed , and we have 4 witnesses too, yet these women are not being labeled as Zanias, and even the punishement is different
I think brother Alen has a point.
siki
hmm What if a women accused some one that so and so person raped me does she need to produce four wetness's??????
peace
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hmm What if a women accused some one that so and so person raped me does she need to produce four wetness's??????
peace
Self testimony?
It seems more concerned with testimonies as opposed to physical witnesses, but in one case, four witnesses are required.
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Self testimony?
It seems more concerned with testimonies as opposed to physical witnesses, but in one case, four witnesses are required.
Yes that is what the sunni clergy men are saying but on earth will rap a lady in Asian are middle Eastern countries they will get kill that is not possible and asking a girl to produce 4 witnesses is not fair.
Or in other words men are allowed to rap girls if they are Alon?????
Then let me say this is not justice.
peace
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Yes that is what the sunni clergy men are saying but on earth will rap a lady in Asian are middle Eastern countries they will get kill that is not possible and asking a girl to produce 4 witnesses is not fair.
Or in other words men are allowed to rap girls if they are Alon?????
Then let me say this is not justice.
peace
All these confusions arise due to lack of precise definition of
1Zina
2Adultery
3Rape
If these are defined precisely then their ways of proving the act and punishments can be ascertained.Otherwise ignore ignore ignore ignore
How does Quran define them ?? -
Peace all,
I don't know why so many thinks that Quran should answer all questions you can possible have!?
Quran is fully detailed and it covers all subjects that is important for our morals and ethics. It gives us straight answers sometimes but also clues for further studies and pondering by its many tales and examples.
So why say that Quran lack something?
It's better to say that we lack in understanding of the common sense that God seems to point out, that we shall use, when He often says "of people who do understands" or "people who take heed" and "people who use their minds" etc.
It's not logic sense to claim that Quran shall cover all different kind of lets say crimes and also define their penalties. That's where a court is to be involved and they cannot sentence someone harder than the Quran advises. So to stone someone to death when actually Quran says 100 lashes is totally wrong. You can always judge milder but not harder.
Peace Maria
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Peace all,
I don't know why so many thinks that Quran should answer all questions you can possible have!?
Quran is fully detailed and it covers all subjects that is important for our morals and ethics. It gives us straight answers sometimes but also clues for further studies and pondering by its many tales and examples.
So why say that Quran lack something?
It's better to say that we lack in understanding of the common sense that God seems to point out, that we shall use, when He often says "of people who do understands" or "people who take heed" and "people who use their minds" etc.
It's not logic sense to claim that Quran shall cover all different kind of lets say crimes and also define their penalties. That's where a court is to be involved and they cannot sentence someone harder than the Quran advises. So to stone someone to death when actually Quran says 100 lashes is totally wrong. You can always judge milder but not harder.
Peace Maria
Then why to differentiate between Zina and Adultery when there is no such distinction ??
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Peace,
Well don't accuse me for doing that.
Maria
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Peace,
Well don't accuse me for doing that.
Maria
Dear
Look at in post what Samia saidSalaam Hadi
Welcome aboard the forum
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Those who had sex with a prostitute are not sound witnesses and their testimony is not accepted.
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Admission by her, yes. There is a procedure for that in front of an authority (a judge, for example).
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Are we now talking about adultery or zina? The punishment is for zina (public sex) and the case in number 2 above.
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No single person, other than the spouse, has the right to accuse another, otherwise they will be lashed 80 lashes (accusation without bringing 4 witnesses). Again, adultery is not zina as long as it is not witnessed by the spouse. Because it is nobody's business (other than the spouse) to report it and it does not affect them as it does the spouse. Of course he/she has the choice to keep quiet and solve the problem. If he/she does not want to continue in the marriage, he/she has to go to the judge and do the procedure. The accused also can deny the charge, but in either case they will be divorced.
Is she not trying to differentiate between adultery and Zina ??
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Peace siki,
Friends , we have a problem here
4.15-17 If any of your women are guilty of lewdness, Take the evidence of four (Reliable) witnesses from amongst you against them; and if they testify, confine them to houses until death do claim them, or God ordain for them some (other) way,If two men among you are guilty of lewdness, punish them both. If they repent and amend, Leave them alone; for God is Oft-returning, Most Merciful,God accept the repentance of those who do evil in ignorance and repent soon afterwards; to them will God turn in mercy For God is full of knowledge and wisdom.
Can somebody explain above?
we have fornication/adultry/being committed , and we have 4 witnesses too, yet these women are not being labeled as Zanias, and even the punishement is different
This is about homosexuality ? confine them to house arrest until death or God finds another way/means and likewise the same punishment for two men so if they repent leave them be which includes the same for women in prior verse.
Keep in mind that Qur?an verse numbers were a later addition to assist recitation so the sequence 415-17 should be read as one continuous paragraph?
(٥
(٦
(٧
an-Nisa' (Women) 415-17
Literal
And those who came/do/commit (F) with the enormous deed/atrocious deed/ugly deed/saying/adultery/fornication/homosexuality from your women, so call a witness on them (F), four from you, so if they witnessed, so hold them (F) in the houses/homes until the death makes them (F) die, or God makes/manipulates for them (F) a way/means.And those who (B/M), they both come/do/commit it from you, so harm them (B), so if they (B) repented, and they (B) corrected, so turn away from them, that God was/is forgiving, merciful.
But the repentance (is) at God to those (who) make/do the bad/evil with ignorance/foolishness, then they repent from near/close, so those God forgives on them, and God was/is knowledgeable, wise/judicious.