How could Muslims be so deceived?
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Peace ILisa Maria, all...
Hmm..... hmm ....so what criteria is there to let us know who is on the right path??? Additionally, let's consider what would happen if we didn't have either the Qur'an or the hadith.....how would we (humanity) ever find the way? ?
I think Jean Rousseau put it well when he mentioned that we humans have learned our ethics and morality from our capacity for empathy.
But the message has certainly not reach all or it has been taken wrong because why then after so long time since the first humans we still suffer and can't win!?
Maria, nice post! Maybe we can look at it as it has reached.. and we can understand that it reaches... in ways that at times we may not agree with or think it aught to be understood... so we think it hasn't reached or it has been taken wrong. It comes back to our own forms of subject reality.. instead of the objective... so then it becomes a fight for instating realities.. but the unfortunate part is it merely seems to only become a form of pushing our own subjective realities onto others... so we call ourselves by our club names.. sunni.. shia.. quran alone.. progressive... etc. etc... etc... while we do this.. we loose sight of God... The Only Reality... as one might say...
God does not need us just as Reality does not need us to observe it.
peace
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Greetings M_Mehdi,
I think Jean Rousseau put it well when he mentioned that we humans have learned our ethics and morality from our capacity for empathy.
Empathy certainly plays a part, but have to disagree with you. It appears that you've overlooked my point on the need to look at, to read, and to observe the book of creation -- which, by the way, God has told to us to do in the Qur'an.
You will never get at the right answers via empathy alone -- that's for certain. Just think of all the parents who spoil their kids rotten by having too much empathy.
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Greetings Maria,
Gee, I know what you mean... I have sunnis close to me who have accused me of ****ing being a 'muslim' for all the years that I was practicing sunnism. They think I've just gone backward... their mind cannot grasp that my understanding has grown and improved. I told them that their assumption was wrong and that if they really wanted to understand how I think now, that we coudl discuss the issues in depth. They turned me down - refused my offer. ....Their fear and ignorance at this time for them is bliss. hypno
Peace Lisa,
I really can imagine how you feel of being the only one in your closest surroundings having different views of islam and how to be a muslim.
Therefore I'm so happy that I struggle to get my divorce so I could start live and practise that life I want to live. But this path has not been easy but after the pain it slowly has come enlightments and happiness into my life again because I have found more clues about the truths from God(The higher power).I'm not surprised that they turned you down, they are afraid of changes, they are comfortable and happy how they live and practise their religion.
Well I hope more people will realize what the real meanings are and that we must back to the inner worlds. It's not an coincident that yoga, meditations etc has spread and become popular in different kind of countries throughout the world, it's the voice of the time who has call on us and beg us to wake up and face the reality and listen to our needs from inside.
Many so called muslims think they can heal themselves by reading Quran and face Makka and bow down 5 times a day on a rug. But this is not healing, it not take you anywhere. Real healings you get when you ask yourself , how you feel today! And you remind yourself of how beautiful you are and that you love yourself. You begin with yourself and then you can love your fellow brothers and sisters as a result of yourself love.
The reasons why it exists so much hate and violence is that people use too much energy to face those awful things, if they instead could break this ugly trend and practise love and kindness.
I have stop reading the newspaper because it's only filled with bad news and I don't want to be filled with that crap.
Now finally I have realized what Jesus really did, he spread the love and kindness the compassionments and it effected people and they become well and happy again.
So the goal is to spread as much love and kindness you can, everything good will return to you in a stronger dose so please start smiling and be kind and helpful where ever you go.
All the prophets and philosophers have been knowing this, they have been practising the "Law of Attraction" and therefore they could be so big and famous for their times. The message has been there all the times in all the great readings, but only a few people have been using it.
In other words, the sixth sense have woke up in us or our third eye
Peace
Maria -
Peace ILisa Maria, all...
I think Jean Rousseau put it well when he mentioned that we humans have learned our ethics and morality from our capacity for empathy.
Maria, nice post! Maybe we can look at it as it has reached.. and we can understand that it reaches... in ways that at times we may not agree with or think it aught to be understood... so we think it hasn't reached or it has been taken wrong. It comes back to our own forms of subject reality.. instead of the objective... so then it becomes a fight for instating realities.. but the unfortunate part is it merely seems to only become a form of pushing our own subjective realities onto others... so we call ourselves by our club names.. sunni.. shia.. quran alone.. progressive... etc. etc... etc... while we do this.. we loose sight of God... The Only Reality... as one might say...
God does not need us just as Reality does not need us to observe it.
Peace Mehdi,
Yes, all this titles sunni, shia etc only drive people more astray from the truth. And exactly God the higher power does'nt need anything from us, but it's we who need the feedback of our thoughts and beggings or else we are lost and left to die here on earth. There is a great deal of being thankful for who knows when this power will not support us anymore.
A good explanation can be that the higher power is like a genie in a bottle, it gives you what you ask for, so ask for things that is important and start to visualize that you already having it in your belongings.
I hope you enjoy the ride!?, I do, it's so exiting group
Peace Maria
peace
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Greetings Maria,
Thanks for the sweet words. So few people really understand what we're going through....
Well I hope more people will realize what the real meanings are and that we must back to the inner worlds
Many so called muslims think they can heal themselves by reading Quran and face Makka and bow down 5 times a day on a rug. But this is not healing, it not take you anywhere. Real healings you get when you ask yourself , how you feel today! And you remind yourself of how beautiful you are and that you love yourself. You begin with yourself and then you can love your fellow brothers and sisters as a result of yourself love.The reasons why it exists so much hate and violence is that people use too much energy to face those awful things, if they instead could break this ugly trend and practise love and kindness.
I'm with you, that's for sure!!
All the prophets and philosophers have been knowing this, they have been practising the "Law of Attraction"
Cool. What an interesting observation. I hadn't thought of it that way before, but I think you could be right!
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Peace,
Thanks ILisa for bringing this to attention...
Many so called muslims think they can heal themselves by reading Quran and face Makka and bow down 5 times a day on a rug. But this is not healing, it not take you anywhere. Real healings you get when you ask yourself , how you feel today! And you remind yourself of how beautiful you are and that you love yourself. You begin with yourself and then you can love your fellow brothers and sisters as a result of yourself love.
There is healing in reading Quran and face Makka and bow down 5times a day etc... for some.. and for others perhaps a different ritual.. or no ritual at all... True unconditional love is bigger than ourselves and our subjective beliefs.. Love is not in minimizing the experience of another which we do not fully understand or feel does not work for us.. well if Love is what we're talking about here. Love at times can be most diffcult and esp when we want to share that Love with others... so we minimize them to help them... but soon we realize that Love is a fragile state... peace
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Greetings M_Mehdi,
Thanks ILisa for bringing this to attention...
There is healing in reading Quran
Boy, I sure wouldn't go against the fact that there is healing in the Qur'an, but does it come by mindlessly reading the Qur'an? That I'm not sure of -- and that is what the majority of muslims I have known have the habit of doing -- either out of trying to read the Qur'an in a week or less, or reading the Qur'an in Arabic when they don't understand Arabic. This is what I took Maria to be speaking about. Not whether healing comes from the Qur'an....that's a whole other topic.....
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Peace Mehdi and Lisa,
Yes, I was talking about healing when you understand the healing in itself. Quran is of course a healing if and when you understand its meaning.
Many years ago when i still practise sunnism, I wasn't satisfied, I couldn't heal myself and I didn't understood why, I was doing everything perfect, i was nearly an fanatic follower of sunnism. So I started to ask God, what i was doing wrong and I asked to be guided on the right path.
My beggings was heard and here I am today, a follower of only one powerful force and who keep asking questions and wish for things that I need.
Maria
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Peace Maria n ILisa,
I understand what you mean. I know in Mexico they still give many sermons at the churches in Latin. Most of the people who attend those churches cannot understand the sermons. It seems difficult to understand for some how these people can have so much faith without understanding a word from the sermons etc.. and many don't even read.. let alone read the Bible... However, there is an immense amount of faith that many have there. So many live good and righteous lives based on their internal faith.
peace peace -
What makes you believe that quranists are following Islam in the manner of the prophet? Just because the quranists claim to? Well, so do sunnis, shias, etc etc.
The prophet faithfully conveyed the message of the Quran and being an example and a mercy to mankind obviously he followed its injunctions. In as far as we do the same and follow only the protected teachings of the Quran and not of Abu Hureyra we may be pretty confident we are on the track of the prophet and the first muslims.
Peace -
Peace G. Omar,
The prophet faithfully conveyed the message of the Quran and being an example and a mercy to mankind obviously he followed its injunctions. In as far as we do the same and follow only the protected teachings of the Quran and not of Abu Hureyra we may be pretty confident we are on the track of the prophet and the first muslims.Peace
I don't think there is a sect within islam that claims not to be "on the track of the prophet and the first muslims." This is what I meant by subjective reality. Every sect rejoices in that which is with itself. It's when each sect wants to claim or own Islam for itself where things starts to break down. And it usually breaks down in the sense of "us" and "them."
peace.. peace
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Mehdi,
I agree! The problem starts when we get over-confident, i.e. we lose our actual humbleness (regardless of how humble martyrlike we try to portray ourselves). The problem arises when we think we know it all, when "they" are wrong and "we" are right because "our system" is the best. There is a great problem in not realizing that we, as humans, do infact know very little about anything. We limit ourslves and others due to our limited capacity of understanding, and very soon we have put everyone in a labelled box.
The world (physical, spiritual, emotional, social...) is so much bigger than we can imagine, and it is just rediculous we we think we know what is right and what is wrong... how can we know this when we can't grasp much of what exists anyway. Everything has a reason, everything has its own circumstance and context, and we just can't judge it accurately without knowing EVERYTHING about it, which humans can't do. I guess only God can know it all... be still we love to judge and say how things ARE. But we don't know, we just think we do.
People limit themselves and their judgements to their hobby religions. They shut of themselves and turn on the religion. They forget to observe the world, the creation... and not only the physical creation, not just the beautiful flowers and amazing ant stacks and such cliches, but also the spiritual world, intution, love, emotions, the unseen world which we can't see but feel...
Ulf
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Peace,
I believe the reason sects evolved is first of all the idealisation of the particular prophet one follows and second conjecture and wild stories about what a prophet supposedly said or did that we need to follow and third taking clergy as our Lords giving them the right of interpretation.
We will not all believe exactly the same if we follow the Quran, but if we leave our differences to God then none has the right to label us a sect. yay -
Peace G. Omar,
I don't think there is a sect within islam that claims not to be "on the track of the prophet and the first muslims." This is what I meant by subjective reality. Every sect rejoices in that which is with itself. It's when each sect wants to claim or own Islam for itself where things starts to break down. And it usually breaks down in the sense of "us" and "them."
peace.. peace
People using the term "we" doesn't mean that "we" are not individuals.
There's a difference between a mindless "we" (i.e. the "cultural muslims" and a thinking "we".
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People using the term "we" doesn't mean that "we" are not individuals.
There's a difference between a mindless "we" (i.e. the "cultural muslims" and a thinking "we".
I understand what you mean, OPF. If you notice many times when the word we is being used in these senses it is being used as a form of seperation instead of inclusion. Kind of like your example of "cultural muslims" vs. "thinking we."
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The problem starts when we get over-confident, i.e. we lose our actual humbleness (regardless of how humble martyrlike we try to portray ourselves). The problem arises when we think we know it all, when "they" are wrong and "we" are right because "our system" is the best. There is a great problem in not realizing that we, as humans, do infact know very little about anything. We limit ourslves and others due to our limited capacity of understanding, and very soon we have put everyone in a labelled box.
The world (physical, spiritual, emotional, social...) is so much bigger than we can imagine, and it is just rediculous we we think we know what is right and what is wrong... how can we know this when we can't grasp much of what exists anyway. Everything has a reason, everything has its own circumstance and context, and we just can't judge it accurately without knowing EVERYTHING about it, which humans can't do. I guess only God can know it all... be still we love to judge and say how things ARE. But we don't know, we just think we do.
People limit themselves and their judgements to their hobby religions. They shut of themselves and turn on the religion. They forget to observe the world, the creation... and not only the physical creation, not just the beautiful flowers and amazing ant stacks and such cliches, but also the spiritual world, intution, love, emotions, the unseen world which we can't see but feel...
bravo
thanks for your post! as we say, "true word... "
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I understand what you mean, OPF. If you notice many times when the word we is being used in these senses it is being used as a form of seperation instead of inclusion. Kind of like your example of "cultural muslims" vs. "thinking we."
This is all semantics but I meant "cultural muslims" as in "non-thinking muslims", they're opposites.
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This is all semantics but I meant "cultural muslims" as in "non-thinking muslims", they're opposites.
Yeah, I hear you on the semantics part. It was just my point being that there is no difference. I understood what you meant about cultural muslims vs. thinking muslims. I think there is a bit of both in each. peace