BIG BIG BIG BIG SINFUL ACT!
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I am a little curious. Where in the Quran, exactly, is homosexual behaviour between two females condemned. I have seen that Lot's story points to men, which is not surprising since oral and anal sex cause their own special problems, oral cancer and blood poisoning respectively, among other things. If something isn't forbidden in the Quran, it is allowed, in my opinion. Since lesbianism isn't forbidden explicitly anywhere, where is the justification for lumping it with the behaviour of gay men.
I would really like to know the Quran's ruling on this, so please reply to this.Isn't one ignoring all the possible problems with heterosexual sex? the unwanted pregnancies, the lack of funds to properly look after the child, the lack of planning by parents these days (then expecting the tax payer to fund their lifestyle choice), then there is the possibility of the child becoming a criminal liability on society (more money down the drain). To put everything into heterosexual = good, homosexual = bad, is pretty simplistic.
As for a previous post regarding homosexuality - stop acting like a child running around going, "eww, he has cooties! I might get gay off him!" - you're either gay or straight, people don't choose to be gay or straight, no matter how much pratts on this forum would like to think otherwise. For every one 'depraved faggot' some where would like to point out, I can point out at least two dozen heterosexual couples who are liabilities on society.
PS. Case in point, look at the statistics in New Zealand for 'working for families'; 'depraved faggots' like me are subsidising half the nation because half the nation choose not to take precautions and plan their families.
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I am a little curious. Where in the Quran, exactly, is homosexual behaviour between two females condemned. I have seen that Lot's story points to men, which is not surprising since oral and anal sex cause their own special problems, oral cancer and blood poisoning respectively, among other things. If something isn't forbidden in the Quran, it is allowed, in my opinion. Since lesbianism isn't forbidden explicitly anywhere, where is the justification for lumping it with the behaviour of gay men.
I would really like to know the Quran's ruling on this, so please reply to this.415, QED.
Hi Sarah
I am a little curious. Where in the Quran does it say that all these things below are condemned
- Cloning human-beings
- Making nuclear-bombs
- 100 year old man marrying an 18 year old girl.
Its all about common sense, it is easy to see what is evil or go against our nature. Not every rule must be written in the quran. Thats what the supporters of hadith likes. They want to know with which hand they should eat their food, how to exactly do wudu, with which foot they should walk into the toilet, which colors they are allowed to wear on their clothes etc...
Conclusion The things that are not in the quran should be understood through reason, and common sense.
Peace,
David1.) would go into "messing with God's creation", there is a verse against that (not necessarily forbidding it but definitely warning against it)
Isn't one ignoring all the possible problems with heterosexual sex? the unwanted pregnancies, the lack of funds to properly look after the child, the lack of planning by parents these days (then expecting the tax payer to fund their lifestyle choice), then there is the possibility of the child becoming a criminal liability on society (more money down the drain). To put everything into heterosexual = good, homosexual = bad, is pretty simplistic.
As for a previous post regarding homosexuality - stop acting like a child running around going, "eww, he has cooties! I might get gay off him!" - you're either gay or straight, people don't choose to be gay or straight, no matter how much pratts on this forum would like to think otherwise. For every one 'depraved faggot' some where would like to point out, I can point out at least two dozen heterosexual couples who are liabilities on society.
Those "problems" are a result of promiscuity, not heterosexual sex. The lack of funds to properly look after the child? Not if you're in the UK. The lack of planning of parents - that can't be solved without major reform. It doesn't happen so much in "muslim" communities, does it? The possibility of a child becoming a criminal? Maybe the earth will explode as a result of heterosexuals. It still provides no case for homosexuality.
Quranically - if you're gay, keep it to yourself or be punished. Likewise for heterosexuals.
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Those "problems" are a result of promiscuity, not heterosexual sex. The lack of funds to properly look after the child? Not if you're in the UK. The lack of planning of parents - that can't be solved without major reform. It doesn't happen so much in "muslim" communities, does it? The possibility of a child becoming a criminal? ) Maybe the earth will explode as a result of heterosexuals. It still provides no case for homosexuality.
Quranically - if you're gay, keep it to yourself or be punished. Likewise for heterosexuals.
Promiscuity - what the hell are you on about?
It does happen in Muslim communities, people having too many bloody children they can't afford to bloody feed (whilst married) then expecting ME, Joe Homo, the one whom they hate with a vicious vengeance, and would love to see stoned to death, subsidise their lifestyle of debauchery.
I'm sorry, but you can crap on about promiscuity till the cows come home, but until you heterosexuals collectively get your house in order, and stop expecting me to pay for your lifestyle choice of having more kids than you can afford, I'll keep living my depraved life thank you very much. Whilst we're at it, maybe we can construct a list of things you can't use because a gay was involved in the production some where - just to ensure that your home hasn't be 'ruined' by the stench of homosexuality.
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Peace to all,
LObster, why do you use harm as your moral guidepost, God has created everything, even the universe, and it harms people all the time, we have earthquakes, floods, hurricanes, etc, all of which were created by God and which kill people, even kind and innocent people. But we are to be judged based on what good deeds we do, so it should be doing good and not just not harming that is the basis for any moral judgement.
Just because gay sex may not physically harm you or others that consent, that doesnt mean its good, or that its good for society, or that it follows Gods laws that he wired into creation.
Kurt
peace
Yes, earthquakes harm people, but they are no one's fault. Nothing to do with morality.
And I'm not just talking about physical harm, here.
There are things that are Right (that should be done), things that are wrong (that should not be done), and things that are neutral (you dont have to do them but they are not wrong).
Sitting on the ground instead of chairs is morally acceptable (neutral)/
Sitting on the ground so an elderly woman can sit on the chair is the right thing to do.
Sitting on the chair while the elderly woman sits on the ground is wrong.
Think about it, what makes the last action wrong? What makes the second one right? -
Peace Lobster
I think homosexuality is harmful (to the human race) because it is a crooked practice to that which God has intended for mankind . I see it crooked by looking at it on more than an individual basis. Imagine that it is totally common and than we are the benefactors of the withering of our own race. One may find a loving partner in someone of the same sex, one may be happy, comfortable with that person, and they may have the same problems as a heterosexual couple for the most part. In the grander scheme of things the human race cannot be cultivated through such unions, perhaps an unholy union. It is the caricature of the right thing to do.
Joe
peace Joe
So you are saying that homosexuality is wrong because it is unnatural?
Aren't there other things which are unnatural but are okay to do? Isn't medical surgery unnatural? -
peace Joe
So you are saying that homosexuality is wrong because it is unnatural?
Aren't there other things which are unnatural but are okay to do? Isn't medical surgery unnatural?Peace Lobster
I think homosexuality is harmful (to the human race) because it is a crooked practice to that which God has intended for mankind . I see it crooked by looking at it on more than an individual basis. Imagine that it is totally common and than we are the benefactors of the withering of our own race. One may find a loving partner in someone of the same sex, one may be happy, comfortable with that person, and they may have the same problems as a heterosexual couple for the most part. In the grander scheme of things the human race cannot be cultivated through such unions, perhaps an unholy union. It is the caricature of the right thing to do.
Joe
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Promiscuity - what the hell are you on about?
It does happen in Muslim communities, people having too many bloody children they can't afford to bloody feed (whilst married) then expecting ME, Joe Homo, the one whom they hate with a vicious vengeance, and would love to see stoned to death, subsidise their lifestyle of debauchery.
I'm sorry, but you can crap on about promiscuity till the cows come home, but until you heterosexuals collectively get your house in order, and stop expecting me to pay for your lifestyle choice of having more kids than you can afford, I'll keep living my depraved life thank you very much. Whilst we're at it, maybe we can construct a list of things you can't use because a gay was involved in the production some where - just to ensure that your home hasn't be 'ruined' by the stench of homosexuality.
In a controlled study 67.5% of 200 homosexual men but only 16% of 100 heterosexual men were found to be infected with intestinal parasites. Entamoeba histolytica was isolated from 27% of the homosexual and 1% of the heterosexual men, and Giardia lamblia was isolated from 13% of the homosexual and 3% of the heterosexual men. The presence of symptoms could not be correlated with infection except when the infection was caused by more than one organism, including G. lamblia. Symptoms were much more common in both infected and uninfected homosexuals than in heterosexuals. Among the homosexual men recent foreign travel, living in a homosexual household and promiscuity were not correlated with intestinal parasitic infection, but cleansing of the anus before and sex was associated with a significantly lower prevalence of infection. These findings suggest that the male homosexual community may be an important reservoir of potentially pathogenic protozoa.
Zing! That's promiscuity.
Your excuse for homosexuality is as follows "I pay taxes". Well, so do I. That doesn't entitle me to go shag a cow. (here, is an analogy, and no, we are not talking about the finer details of shagging cows, such as consent)
Where is your proof that "heterosexuals have more kids than they can afford AND expect homosexuals to pay for it"? Chances are, the people having more kids than they can afford a.) pay for it themselves and get in debt or b.) leech of the state and get paid by everyone, no discrimination involved or c.) die off from starvation.
You can keep jamming as many strawman arguments as you like, it won't change a thing.
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Well I say that's not what God has intended. How do you counter that argument?
Oh please. Do substantiate your comments because at the moment they have as much credibility as Bukhari.
532 - SHAKIR For this reason did We prescribe to the children of Israel that whoever slays a soul, unless it be for manslaughter or for mischief in the land, it is as though he slew all men; and whoever keeps it alive, it is as though he kept alive all men; and certainly Our messengers came to them with clear arguments, but even after that many of them certainly act extravagantly in the land.
Surgery on healthy tissue IS unnatural.
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There is ZERO quranic basis for homosexuality.
Can you be a homosexual and believe in god? YES.
Can you be a homosexual and follow the quran? NO. (see Lot's story)
Hence, can you be a homosexual and be in a state of islam as described by the quran? NO. -
Peace to all,
LObster, i think if you look at the actual anatomy and functioning of a man and womans reproductive organs you will see how they are created to tperfectly complement each other, they are in fact made to work together and to produce and create new life, this is what God intended and he built it into his design, gay sex on the other hand accomplishes nothing and achieves nothing but sexual pleasure, and is just as unnatural as if a guy wanted to stick it in another guys nose for pleasure, just because its possible and he may deprieve pleasure does that mean its ok.
Man were getting rather perverse here just to prove a point, maybe we should stick to more appropriate topics.
Kurt
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peace peace
Kurt, Joe, OPF,
Why is something unnatural wrong? You are assuming that just because something is unnatural, it is wrong. That's not true.
I fail to see how something can be wrong if it does not have any negative impact on anyone.Also, we can use our body parts for unintended purposes. The purpose of our hands is to hold things, so does that make clapping wrong? The purpose of our eyes is to see, does that make winking wrong?
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peace peace
Kurt, Joe, OPF,
Why is something unnatural wrong? You are assuming that just because something is unnatural, it is wrong. That's not true.
I fail to see how something can be wrong if it does not have any negative impact on anyone.Also, we can use our body parts for unintended purposes. The purpose of our hands is to hold things, so does that make clapping wrong? The purpose of our eyes is to see, does that make winking wrong?
Where did I say "unnatural = wrong"? But anal sex, to be explicity - it most definitely is unnatural. I know homosexuality goes on in certain animal kingdoms and there is a class of monkeys that are homosexual - but they also commit incest and other things.
The purpose of your hands - they don't have a singular defined purpose. You can do a lot with hands, that's why we have them ;D The purpose of our eyes is to see - and that's all we do with them. The purpose of the eyelids? Communication, keeping the eye lubricated, keeping it pretected. So no, winking is not unnatural, it serves a purpose which may or may not be constructive (ex. vietnam soldier that blinked out "TORTURE" in morse code on live TV).
On the other hand, the purpose of the penis, just like the eye, is quite explicit. You don't go around sticking it into chickens, you don't go around sticking it into trees, etc, etc.
Isolated homosexuality - that's not "wrong". It can't be wrong because it doesn't affect anyone but the two that wish to waste away in isolation and they have full right to do that. The problem, as seen in Lot's story, is rampant homosexuality, which goes hand in hand with rampant promiscuity. Which IS wrong. AIDS used to be called GRIDS. What does G stand for there?
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Peace Lobster
The purpose of our hands is to hold things, so does that make clapping wrong? The purpose of our eyes is to see, does that make winking wrong?
The purpose of our hands is for more than the manipulation of objects. It is very helpful as a means of expression and communication. Winking is another form of communication and is helpful as well in the faciliation of communication . Otherwise I'd ask some questions like you, that is, if the purpose of ours eyes are to see why do they close when we sleep and not look out for danger? The quran makes it clear that we authenticate its truth through real life experience. Go out and live your life and weigh its positions. Apparently you find them false and that is fine.
Joe
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