Should we stone A. Wallace?
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Peace Mr. Wallace
My opinion is that a messenger would among his/her people promulgate the law of his divine king and be a living exampar of that code. Some have failed with the stress of the situation, but one must be outspoken, teach, and follow what has been preached. Not only that, if you're wrong concerning that which is "set in stone" maybe you should be altering the behavior.
Joe
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Salaam Anthony,
Why are you trying so hard to "convince" everyone that you are a messenger of God?
So many people here are rightly guided and share their "wisdom" with proofs/verses from the Quran regularly.
Why is it necessary to paste all over this forum that you are a messenger of God?
Is it for self-gratification?
Peace,
dotty -
! I suggest to create a stoning smileys.... >D >D
There is a possibility that Muhammad might reincarnate back into this time. Although reincarnation is possible, one might not remember the purpose of one's reincarnation. In this case, if what a. wallace says is true, he might be reincaranating back here, but don't know what he is suppose to do. Maybe we can help him remember. If false, well.... he's just bull. Playing us around...
*refer to David Wilcock case, he might be the reincarnation of Edgar Cayce, a psychic reader. Which also said as Ra-Ta reincarnation. An ancient Egyptian priest. There's a lot of reincarnation cases, i've studied this one. I'm speaking of a possibilities, not truth. So don't bother asking for proofs.
http//www.divinecosmos.com/images/stories/cayce-wilcock.jpg
Source
How old are you o messenger?
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Peace Anthonywallace,
3340 Mohammed was not the father of any of your men, but he is the messenger of God and the seal of the prophets. And God is fully aware of all things.
7226 The knower of the unseen, He does not reveal His knowledge(of the unseen) to anyone.
7227 Except to whom He has accepted as a messenger, then He reveals from the past and the future.
4251 And it is not for any human being that God would speak to him, except through inspiration, or from behind a barrier, or by sending a messenger to inspire whom He wills by His leave. He is Most High, Wise.
Hearing voices as if God is talking to oneself can be an indication of a mental disorder such as schizophrenia. These voices are usually whispered by the Jinn devils or Satan to make a person feel very proud and special about himself making him the center of God's Universe and giving him the feeling that the fate of the world depends upon him and he has to bring about a revolutionary enlightenment.
This kind of thinking can also be a delusion. You should seek forgiveness from God about what you thought and try to be humble and rational.
The idea of reincarnation does not exist in Quran so it is false. -
Peace "abrar",
3340 Mohammed was not the father of any of your men, but he is the messenger of God and the seal of the prophets. And God is fully aware of all things.
7226 The knower of the unseen, He does not reveal His knowledge(of the unseen) to anyone.
7227 Except to whom He has accepted as a messenger, then He reveals from the past and the future.
4251 And it is not for any human being that God would speak to him, except through inspiration, or from behind a barrier, or by sending a messenger to inspire whom He wills by His leave. He is Most High, Wise.
JK- Look carefully at 3340 again. It says that Muhammad was(past tense from context) the messenger of GOD and THEN just calls him the seal/last Prophet. If GOD meant him to be the last messenger too why not end the statement like "...was the messenger of GOD and the last amongst them" or "...was the messenger of GOD and the last messenger prophet(rasulun nabiyyan). Now on to prove to you from the Quran that NOT every messenger is a Prophet. Look at these phrases carefully
Mention in the scripture Abraham; he was a saint, a prophet(SIDDIQAN nabiyyan).
And mention in the scripture Idris. He was a saint, a prophet(SIDDIQAN nabiyyan).
Notice in both cases the term "siddiq" appears first and NEVER do we find in the Quran the reverse order. NOW can any "muslim" claim that all "siddiqs" must be "nabis"? NO, since Abu Bakrs very title has been "siddiq". On to another verse
.... Am I any more than a human messenger?(BASHARAN rasoolan)"
Again we see that "bashar" meaning "human" is the first term and this phrase is NEVER found in the reverse i.e. "rasoolan basharan" in the Quran. We can agree that not every human is/was a messenger, cant we? NOW taking this we look at these verses
Mention in the scripture Moses. He was devoted, and he was a messenger prophet(RASOOLAN nabiyyan).
And mention in the scripture Ismail. He was truthful when he made a promise, and he was a messenger prophet(RASOOLAN nabiyyan).
Here we find the term "rasoolan" to be the first in the phrase "rasoolan nabiyyan" and this order is also NEVER different in the Quran i.e. NEVER "nabiyyan rasoolan". Since we have seen from our previous examples that the first term is the more common term the same must also apply to this phrase since GOD does not choose His terms arbitrarily especially not in view of this relation. SO it must be that every messenger(rasool) is NOT a prophet(nabi) contrary to what most of the "muslims" claim.
ALSO notice that most of these important phrases are mentioned in sura 19 which is the sura initialed with the most no of initials and as you might know in 1974, Rashad Khalifa, who claimd to have been a messenger of GOD, discovered a pattern based on no 19 especially in regards to the initialed chapters i.e. they occur in the repsective suras they initial in multiples of 19. The count of the initials in aura 19 is 798(19x42).Hearing voices as if God is talking to oneself can be an indication of a mental disorder such as schizophrenia. These voices are usually whispered by the Jinn devils or Satan to make a person feel very proud and special about himself making him the center of God's Universe and giving him the feeling that the fate of the world depends upon him and he has to bring about a revolutionary enlightenment.
This kind of thinking can also be a delusion. You should seek forgiveness from God about what you thought and try to be humble and rational.
The idea of reincarnation does not exist in Quran so it is false.JK- I agree that one who makes such claims must have proof to support them otherwise anyone can make the claim. I'm waiting for Anthony to come with a sign/proof which we can verify to see whether he really is a messenger of GOD. All messengers needed proof including Muhammad otherwise the same schizophrenic claims could be made for them too. GOD Bless!
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Peace Jonny_k,
I agree with the following explanation.
Distinction between Prophets and Messengers
According to Uri Rubin, the Qur'an, as in the New Testament, ranks apostles (rasl) higher than prophets (see 1 Cor 1228-31; cf. Eph 35; 411). For example, in the Qur'an whenever both titles appear together, messenger comes first. The Qur'anic commentators state that a messenger is a prophet who is additionally given a message, a book which must be delivered. According to the Muslim scholar al-Baydawi, a messenger establishes a new religious law (sharia) whereas a prophet continues an old one. Furthermore, a prophet experiences revelation only in dreams whereas a messenger receives it from an angel. These would imply that prophets were more numerous than messengers and occupied a lower rank. According to A.J. Wensinck, both prophets and messengers are sent by God as preachers and warners to their people. In the case of messengers however, there seems to be a close relation between them and their people (ummah) God sends only one messenger to each people. This messenger will be the witness that God will take from that community on the Day of Judgment (see Sura X, 48; XVI, 38; XXIII, 46; XL, 5; IV, 45; XXVIII, 75). According to the Qur'an, Muhammad is sent to a people to whom no messenger has been sent yet. Lastly, a distinction should be made between celestial and human messengers. In the Qur'anic world, God has made the angels messengers but not prophets. The human messengers however are also prophets though not every prophet is a messenger.
Uri Rubin, Prophets and Prophethood, Encyclopedia of the Qur'an
^ a b A.J. Wensinck, Rasul, Encyclopedia of Islamhttp//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prophets_of_Islam#cite_note-EoI-2
Rashad Khalifa cannot be a human messenger of God as a messenger has to be a prophet as well.
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Peace "abrar",
JK- I agree that one who makes such claims must have proof to support them otherwise anyone can make the claim. I'm waiting for Anthony to come with a sign/proof which we can verify to see whether he really is a messenger of GOD. All messengers needed proof including Muhammad otherwise the same schizophrenic claims could be made for them too. GOD Bless!
The signs are from God...and "God misguides whom He wills and guides to Him whoever is repenting"
Peace Anthonywallace,
Hearing voices as if God is talking to oneself can be an indication of a mental disorder such as schizophrenia. These voices are usually whispered by the Jinn devils or Satan to make a person feel very proud and special about himself making him the center of God's Universe and giving him the feeling that the fate of the world depends upon him and he has to bring about a revolutionary enlightenment.
This kind of thinking can also be a delusion. You should seek forgiveness from God about what you thought and try to be humble and rational.
The idea of reincarnation does not exist in Quran so it is false.Peace,
Who said anything about me hearing voices of God talking to me???Personally I think the voices of the Jinn and devils whisperin to me that "I am not a messenger"...
And I saw that one of satans soldiers was sent to make me suffer, so that I won't feel too proud...
! I suggest to create a stoning smileys.... >D >D
There is a possibility that Muhammad might reincarnate back into this time. Although reincarnation is possible, one might not remember the purpose of one's reincarnation. In this case, if what a. wallace says is true, he might be reincaranating back here, but don't know what he is suppose to do. Maybe we can help him remember. If false, well.... he's just bull. Playing us around...
*refer to David Wilcock case, he might be the reincarnation of Edgar Cayce, a psychic reader. Which also said as Ra-Ta reincarnation. An ancient Egyptian priest. There's a lot of reincarnation cases, i've studied this one. I'm speaking of a possibilities, not truth. So don't bother asking for proofs.
How old are you o messenger?
Im 25, will be 26, God willing on the 21st...
Im a numerologist ( beginner), and the pinnical that im in states that im an "old soul" a spiritual messenger...
it suggest that people with my number have made a contract in the past life, to come back and help humankind... and they are messengers and spiritual leaders, master builders, and ministers...however its a tall order... meaning that most people with these numbers will have alot of tests and stumble and most are on drugs because these numbers ( energys) are so intence that one may revert to the lower energys...and live life in that way...people with these numbers must live in truth and accept their destiny ( and accept that they are messengers)... It is only when they are living in accord with spiritual principals and behaving as messengers ect... that they are operating at the level of " the spiritual messenger" and like you say " most dont know the purpose of there "reincarnation" and dont know what they are suppose to do."
As far as numerology is concerned ( about a past life ect... dont ask me for proof like u said). This is just what numerology suggest... And it has prooven to be true thus far...
And there is no playing with me, I am serious when i say that im Gods messenger...
Peace
Salaam Anthony,
Why are you trying so hard to "convince" everyone that you are a messenger of God?
So many people here are rightly guided and share their "wisdom" with proofs/verses from the Quran regularly.
Why is it necessary to paste all over this forum that you are a messenger of God?
Is it for self-gratification?
Peace,
dottyPeace dotty,
Im not tryin hard to convince no one, let whoever will believe me and whoever will dont...
I pasted these things to deliver my Lords messages to whomever it reaches and share my wisdom along with the many other people here ( and messengers )...and the messenger of God is the title i used and will continue to use... and its others who are makin a big deal about it , because I say im a messenger...This is not for self gratification...But it is to warn the people...
What i see so far is that I am the message... This whole situation and discution is some kind of test that i caint point out...mabey to see who will deny Gods messenger or maby to test my paitence or my endurance or something...
Personaly i think that we should always keep our ears open for the " caller." And let us not deny our messengers when they come to us... God will send messengers...
We are all differnt... Be you and im go be me... Not everyone are or have the ability to be leaders, some are followers...Not everyone are messengers, just because one person may feel that he caint be or is not a messenger doesnt mean that everyone else have to be the same way...Different strokes different folks...This is me...and my way, i invite to God in full disclosure, myself and whomever follows me. And glory be to God. And i am not of those who set up partners.
Peace,Peace Mr. Wallace
My opinion is that a messenger would among his/her people promulgate the law of his divine king and be a living exampar of that code. Some have failed with the stress of the situation, but one must be outspoken, teach, and follow what has been preached. Not only that, if you're wrong concerning that which is "set in stone" maybe you should be altering the behavior. )
Joe
Peace Joe,
I agree Joe
Peace
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Peace "abrar",
Peace Jonny_k,
I agree with the following explanation.
Distinction between Prophets and Messengers
According to Uri Rubin, the Qur'an, as in the New Testament, ranks apostles (rasl) higher than prophets (see 1 Cor 1228-31; cf. Eph 35; 411). For example, in the Qur'an whenever both titles appear together, messenger comes first. The Qur'anic commentators state that a messenger is a prophet who is additionally given a message, a book which must be delivered. According to the Muslim scholar al-Baydawi, a messenger establishes a new religious law (sharia) whereas a prophet continues an old one. Furthermore, a prophet experiences revelation only in dreams whereas a messenger receives it from an angel. These would imply that prophets were more numerous than messengers and occupied a lower rank. According to A.J. Wensinck, both prophets and messengers are sent by God as preachers and warners to their people. In the case of messengers however, there seems to be a close relation between them and their people (ummah) God sends only one messenger to each people. This messenger will be the witness that God will take from that community on the Day of Judgment (see Sura X, 48; XVI, 38; XXIII, 46; XL, 5; IV, 45; XXVIII, 75). According to the Qur'an, Muhammad is sent to a people to whom no messenger has been sent yet. Lastly, a distinction should be made between celestial and human messengers. In the Qur'anic world, God has made the angels messengers but not prophets. The human messengers however are also prophets though not every prophet is a messenger.
Uri Rubin, Prophets and Prophethood, Encyclopedia of the Qur'an
^ a b A.J. Wensinck, Rasul, Encyclopedia of Islamhttp//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prophets_of_Islam#cite_note-EoI-2
Rashad Khalifa cannot be a human messenger of God as a messenger has to be a prophet as well.
JK- MAN i just explained to you from Quran as to why messenger is the common term. Yes it is mentioned first but wherever GOD talks about "a saint prophet" he also mentions the term "siddiq" first. So does this mean in order for one to be a "siddiq" one must first be a prophet? Then in another verse GOD mentions "bashar" before he mentions rasool as in "BASHARAN rasoolan". So does one have to be a messnger first in order to be a human?? GOD Bless!
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Peace Jonny_k,
I agree with the following explanation.
Distinction between Prophets and Messengers
According to Uri Rubin, the Qur'an, as in the New Testament, ranks apostles (rasl) higher than prophets (see 1 Cor 1228-31; cf. Eph 35; 411). For example, in the Qur'an whenever both titles appear together, messenger comes first. The Qur'anic commentators state that a messenger is a prophet who is additionally given a message, a book which must be delivered. According to the Muslim scholar al-Baydawi, a messenger establishes a new religious law (sharia) whereas a prophet continues an old one. Furthermore, a prophet experiences revelation only in dreams whereas a messenger receives it from an angel. These would imply that prophets were more numerous than messengers and occupied a lower rank. According to A.J. Wensinck, both prophets and messengers are sent by God as preachers and warners to their people. In the case of messengers however, there seems to be a close relation between them and their people (ummah) God sends only one messenger to each people. This messenger will be the witness that God will take from that community on the Day of Judgment (see Sura X, 48; XVI, 38; XXIII, 46; XL, 5; IV, 45; XXVIII, 75). According to the Qur'an, Muhammad is sent to a people to whom no messenger has been sent yet. Lastly, a distinction should be made between celestial and human messengers. In the Qur'anic world, God has made the angels messengers but not prophets. The human messengers however are also prophets though not every prophet is a messenger.
Uri Rubin, Prophets and Prophethood, Encyclopedia of the Qur'an
^ a b A.J. Wensinck, Rasul, Encyclopedia of Islamhttp//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prophets_of_Islam#cite_note-EoI-2
Rashad Khalifa cannot be a human messenger of God as a messenger has to be a prophet as well.
A messenger is one that carries messages or performs errands...
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peace all
Hearing voices as if God is talking to oneself can be an indication of a mental disorder such as schizophrenia. These voices are usually whispered by the Jinn devils or Satan to make a person feel very proud and special about himself making him the center of God's Universe and giving him the feeling that the fate of the world depends upon him and he has to bring about a revolutionary enlightenment.
This kind of thinking can also be a delusion. You should seek forgiveness from God about what you thought and try to be humble and rational.
The idea of reincarnation does not exist in Quran so it is false.what makes you so sure?
how do you think all messengers/prophets got the revelation if not by hearing a VOICE?i hear voices sometimes and when i talk to God i hear Him answering back, sure it might just be me imagining His part of the conversation or maybe He is really talking to me... would you say i'm crazy?
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Im not tryin hard to convince no one, let whoever will believe me and whoever will dont...
This is a load of hooey! You are the one who started this thread.
What is the purpose if you are not trying to convince everyone of "who" you are?I pasted these things to deliver my Lords messages to whomever it reaches and share my wisdom along with the many other people here
So delivering God's message means you have to "announce your messengership" in every post? More hooey!
I enjoy reading your posts... I think others do too. But seriously man, why don't you just talk to people and quit with the resounding "I'm a messenger of God" bit? Whether you are a messenger or not... who really cares? The message of God is what matters and there are a lot of people here that share the message of God.
Peace,
dotty -
Peace all,
A schizophrenic person may hear auditory voices or even the voices in his mind which he may claim are ordering him to do something and may claim that according to the voice it is from God. These kind of people were said to be insane and the word for insanity used in Quran is "Majnoon" which means literally as someone possessed by a Jinn or a spirit as called in english. They may in some cases get treated by exorcism made by reciting verses of the Quran or may need treatment of a medical psychiatrist.
Here is an article which describes how such people were perceived throughout the history.
"The platonic ideas of a connection between madness and prophecy recur in the ancient Israel. The highly esteemed religious prophets were often regarded as mad because of their odd utterances and deviant clothes and behavior. The same conceptions later appear in the Koran in the Islamic countries. The Koran uses the word majnoon to describe mad persons as well as prophets."
http//www.hubin.org/facts/history/history_schizophrenia_en.html
List of quranic verses that describe how prophet muhammad was perceived as a madman by the unbelievers.
Chapter 15
156 And they said ?O you upon whom the Reminder has been sent down, you are crazy.?
Chapter 37
3736 And they would say ?Shall we leave our gods because of a crazy poet??
Chapter 44
4414 But they turned away from him and said ?Clearly educated, but crazy!?
Chapter 51
5139 But he turned away, in arrogance, and he said ?A magician, or crazy.?
5152 Likewise, when a messenger went to those before them, they said ?A magician, or crazy.?
Chapter 54
549 The people of Noah disbelieved before them. They disbelieved Our servant and said ?He is crazy!? and he was oppressed.
Chapter 68
6851 And those who have rejected almost attack you with their eyes when they hear the reminder, and they say ?He is crazy!?
Chapter 81
8122 And your friend is not crazy.To verify by reason alone whether a man claiming prophet hood is really telling the truth or not is a an issue as if he is disobeyed the nation is to be immidiately destroyed by God as in the past.
214 Say ?My Lord knows what is said in the heavens and in the Earth, and He is the Hearer, the Knower.?
215 They said ?No, these are just bad dreams; no, he made it up; no, he is a poet. So let him bring us a sign like those who were sent before.?
216 None of the towns which We destroyed before them had believed. Will they believe?
217 And We did not send before you except men whom We inspired to. So ask the people of the remembrance if you do not know.
218 And We did not make for them bodies that do not need to eat, nor were they immortal.
219 Then We fulfilled the promise to them, so We saved them and whom We pleased, and We destroyed those who transgressed.
2110 We have sent down to you a Scripture in which is your remembrance. Do you not comprehend?
2111 And how many a town have We destroyed because of its wrong doing, and We established after them a different people?
2112 So it was that when they perceived Our power, they were running from it.
2113 ?Do not run, and come back to that which you were living lavishly in and your homes; so that you will be questioned.?
2114 They said ?Woe to us, we have been wicked!?
2115 So that remained as their cry until We took them all, and they became still.Theological rationality is called Ilmul kalam in arabic and is a very complex issue to discuss so if you do not believe that Quran is a legitimate revelation given through messenger and prophet muhammad to mankind then you can engage in a rational theological debate.
Please read this book "The proof prophethood" to broaden your knowledge about the issue. This books gives in depth perspectives of how to verify a prophet.
http//www.hakikatkitabevi.com.tr/download/english/09-TheProofOfProphethood.pdf
True that messenger can be any bearer of a message but in the case of prophet who is a messenger as well is to deliver the God's revelations to mankind. It is a fact in Quran that although prophets had been killed but no prophet who was a messenger as well had ever been killed.
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Peace "abrar",
You have not yet answered my reply where ive proven to you from Quran that "messenger" is the general term in the phrase "rassolan nabiyyan". ALSO further proof that messenger is the general term are these verses
Messengers(RUSUL) we have told you about before you, and messengers we never told you about. And GOD spoke to Moses directly.
We have sent messengers(rusul) before you - some of them we mentioned to you, and some we did not mention to you. No messenger can produce any miracle without GOD's authorization. Once GOD's judgment is issued, the truth dominates, and the falsifiers are exposed and humiliated.NEVER does GOD make the same claim about prophets(nabiyeen/anbiya) that some prophets have been mentioned whilst others havent been. Coincidence? GOD Bless!
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Should I be stoned for sayin that I am one of Gods messengers???
Would I be wrong for sayin that im a messenger of God???
Was muhammad the last messenger???
What is a messenger??? And who can and cannot be one??? And who said they can or cannot be one???
What does a messenger have to do or make happen for people to believe in him??? Does he have to come wit somethin new, or bring a sign from heaven, or have a luxtryous mansion, or what???
Give me one reason why I am not a messenger of God... Bring proof that I caint be a messenger, then I wont claim to be one anymore...
Bring proof that I am not to be obeyed...When I command you not to serve except God, and I order rigeousness...
And we are not sent except by the command of your Lord... With Him is our present and our future... So serve Him and be paitient in His service... Do you know of anything like Him???
??? jediPeace,
Respectfully.I also say to people not to argue regaridng islam and prophet Muhammad and The Quran and i tell them to do good and ask forgivnes and mercy and i follow The Quran. But i can't say that i'm a messenger of God or His prophet is simple i am sincere and honest and God sees that.
Peace.
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God bears witness. What we say is not really relevant A.wallace. But God advises us not to assert our own righteousness,humility is vital when explaining one's religion. When you put yourself on a pedestal before people it causes people to automatically shut down. People are just as skeptical as they were in the time of Muhammad, and Muhammad had the Qur'an! We are all here now with the Qur'an in our hands, we have a duty to convey the message as well and to live by it, so in part we are akin to messengers. But we are not Messengers of God with a capital M, like it is a magnanimous title of which we are entitled to extra blessings from God.
When you call yourself a messenger of God. What difference does it make to what you are saying? Does it make your words any more truthful, powerful or valid in the hearts of people? No it is the message alone that does this.
Peace
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When you call yourself a messenger of God. What difference does it make to what you are saying? Does it make your words any more truthful, powerful or valid in the hearts of people? No it is the message alone that does this.
Peace
When the other messengers called theirself a messenger of God. What difference did it make to what they were saying> Did it make their words more truthful, powerful or valid in the heqarts of the people?
Peace,
I do not understand the subject of this thread.
I for one do not think AW is stoned, just misguided.
If you dont understand the subject then how can you say im misguided, and how am I? Pleace enlighten me by my Lords leave... Who said anything about me bein stoned???
Peace,
Respectfully.I also say to people not to argue regaridng islam and prophet Muhammad and The Quran and i tell them to do good and ask forgivnes and mercy and i follow The Quran. But i can't say that i'm a messenger of God or His prophet is simple i am sincere and honest and God sees that.
Peace.
Peace,
That is you, if you feel u caint say u the messenger of God then thats you and who u are and how you feel...
This is me, my life, and who I am... Not everybody like me...Not everybody is you...not everybody can be me...
Peace, and it is good that you advacate ritiousness. Keep it up...fa real yo...
This is a load of hooey! You are the one who started this thread.
What is the purpose if you are not trying to convince everyone of "who" you are?So delivering God's message means you have to "announce your messengership" in every post? More hooey!
I enjoy reading your posts... I think others do too. But seriously man, why don't you just talk to people and quit with the resounding "I'm a messenger of God" bit? Whether you are a messenger or not... who really cares? The message of God is what matters and there are a lot of people here that share the message of God.
Peace,
dottyhmm
Peace all,
A schizophrenic person may hear auditory voices or even the voices in his mind which he may claim are ordering him to do something and may claim that according to the voice it is from God. These kind of people were said to be insane and the word for insanity used in Quran is "Majnoon" which means literally as someone possessed by a Jinn or a spirit as called in english. They may in some cases get treated by exorcism made by reciting verses of the Quran or may need treatment of a medical psychiatrist.
Here is an article which describes how such people were perceived throughout the history.
"The platonic ideas of a connection between madness and prophecy recur in the ancient Israel. The highly esteemed religious prophets were often regarded as mad because of their odd utterances and deviant clothes and behavior. The same conceptions later appear in the Koran in the Islamic countries. The Koran uses the word majnoon to describe mad persons as well as prophets."
http//www.hubin.org/facts/history/history_schizophrenia_en.html
List of quranic verses that describe how prophet muhammad was perceived as a madman by the unbelievers.
Chapter 15
156 And they said O you upon whom the Reminder has been sent down, you are crazy.
Chapter 37
3736 And they would say Shall we leave our gods because of a crazy poet?
Chapter 44
4414 But they turned away from him and said Clearly educated, but crazy!
Chapter 51
5139 But he turned away, in arrogance, and he said A magician, or crazy.
5152 Likewise, when a messenger went to those before them, they said A magician, or crazy.
Chapter 54
549 The people of Noah disbelieved before them. They disbelieved Our servant and said He is crazy! and he was oppressed.
Chapter 68
6851 And those who have rejected almost attack you with their eyes when they hear the reminder, and they say He is crazy!
Chapter 81
8122 And your friend is not crazy.To verify by reason alone whether a man claiming prophet hood is really telling the truth or not is a an issue as if he is disobeyed the nation is to be immidiately destroyed by God as in the past.
214 Say My Lord knows what is said in the heavens and in the Earth, and He is the Hearer, the Knower.
215 They said No, these are just bad dreams; no, he made it up; no, he is a poet. So let him bring us a sign like those who were sent before.
216 None of the towns which We destroyed before them had believed. Will they believe?
217 And We did not send before you except men whom We inspired to. So ask the people of the remembrance if you do not know.
218 And We did not make for them bodies that do not need to eat, nor were they immortal.
219 Then We fulfilled the promise to them, so We saved them and whom We pleased, and We destroyed those who transgressed.
2110 We have sent down to you a Scripture in which is your remembrance. Do you not comprehend?
2111 And how many a town have We destroyed because of its wrong doing, and We established after them a different people?
2112 So it was that when they perceived Our power, they were running from it.
2113 Do not run, and come back to that which you were living lavishly in and your homes; so that you will be questioned.
2114 They said Woe to us, we have been wicked!
2115 So that remained as their cry until We took them all, and they became still.Theological rationality is called Ilmul kalam in arabic and is a very complex issue to discuss so if you do not believe that Quran is a legitimate revelation given through messenger and prophet muhammad to mankind then you can engage in a rational theological debate.
Please read this book "The proof prophethood" to broaden your knowledge about the issue. This books gives in depth perspectives of how to verify a prophet.
http//www.hakikatkitabevi.com.tr/download/english/09-TheProofOfProphethood.pdf
True that messenger can be any bearer of a message but in the case of prophet who is a messenger as well is to deliver the God's revelations to mankind. It is a fact in Quran that although prophets had been killed but no prophet who was a messenger as well had ever been killed.
jedi
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Should I be stoned for sayin that I am one of Gods messengers???
Would I be wrong for sayin that im a messenger of God???
Was muhammad the last messenger???
What is a messenger??? And who can and cannot be one??? And who said they can or cannot be one???
What does a messenger have to do or make happen for people to believe in him??? Does he have to come wit somethin new, or bring a sign from heaven, or have a luxtryous mansion, or what???
Give me one reason why I am not a messenger of God... Bring proof that I caint be a messenger, then I wont claim to be one anymore...
Bring proof that I am not to be obeyed...When I command you not to serve except God, and I order rigeousness...
And we are not sent except by the command of your Lord... With Him is our present and our future... So serve Him and be paitient in His service... Do you know of anything like Him???
??? jedi
I think A Wallace should definitely be stoned for creating this topic, because I bet being dead is better than having no life.
