Should we stone A. Wallace?

rsw

Peace,

This is what I see

First of all, be aware of God and obey me. police

This is where you lost me.

The Qu'ran repeatedly says "Obey God and the Messenger;" but that doesn't mean that because someone comes up to us and says they are a Messenger and recites scripture that we should obey them.

3367 And they will say ?Our Lord, we have obeyed our leaders and our learned ones, but they misled us from the path.?

Save us from this, Lord! We have learned this lesson from the Sunni.

And do not uphold what you have no knowledge of. For the hearing, eyesight, and mind, all these you are responsible for." (1736)

If you ask me to accept what you say on religion without explaining where in the Qu'ran you got that from then you are violating that command from God. Also, if you provide proof from the Qu'ran to support you but it is taken out of context or mistranslated or otherwise distorted from it's true meaning, then you are not delivering the Message and are not a Messenger and I ought not to obey you. We have learned this lesson from the Submitters.

I don't have any aversion to you or what you believe, but I think those of us here already have the Message (in several mediums and translations) and so do not need the Messenger. Deciphering the message is what our goal is here, not finding a Messenger to decipher it for us (they would not be a Messenger but a Decipherer or Interpreter, and the Qu'ran does not say to follow those). But I only speak for myself. Thanks for your concern though!

farida

Peace'
And that how Wallace believe

http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9188.0
Peace

Salaam brother Belalhammad,

Thank you for informing us of A. Wallac's view on fasting, I missed this side of him and thanks again for giving link to your understandings.

Now, if Wallac is Rassol Allah, then his opinion will influense everybody.
No one can disobey God's Messanger; thus, Should I Fast for three days?
Please read my opinion in

Absolutely! But, as I said, no one is going to accept him as a messenger blindly, so no question of following him and, as I see him he's not much different from quite a few on this forum except I find him a bit amusing. Such selfproclaimed "Inspired Messengers" are not rare; one wellknown is Bush junior, so he said, inspired by God; then you have seen where he is leaving the world. elektro

peace

farida

However, the word few is most commonly defined as 3...and has been always known as such...

Therefore, 3 or 4 is closer to being a " few " than 10 is...

eat

Salaam anthonywhallace

You are not simply passing on the message but telling others your interpretation; not much different from pharasies or a teacher huh. (
I suggest you stop claiming to be one of the inspired messengers of God, hypno or you may end up like General Zia ul Haq(ex president of Pakistan) who believed he was chosen and inspired by God. For a bit of fiction mixed with facts please do read ?The case of exploding mangoes? by Hanif Mohammad and roll with laughter. rotfl

peace

belH

First of all, be aware of God and obey me. police

(&#65279

It is not possible for any human being to whom All?h has given the Book and wisdom and Prophethood to say to the people "obey me rather than All?h's." On the contrary "Be people of God, for ye have taught the Book and ye have studied it earnestly." (3-79)

Peace everyone

Wallace is trying to brainwash you, by speaking the words of God and then invoke his own words.

His view of Fasting is based on a misunderstanding of 2-184 and 185; thus he is normal humanbeing who might make mistakes sometimes.
Wallace' please read my understanding of fasting in the link I provided you.

Salaam brother Belalhammad,

Thank you for informing us of A. Wallac's view on fasting, I missed this side of him and thanks again for giving link to your understandings.

Peace,
You welcome; my advice to you and every body else, Hold tight on your Book and do not obey anybody else BUT ALLAH.

he's not much different from quite a few on this forum except I find him a bit amusing.
peace

But be aware, most of the people that you comparing him to never claimed being God's Messangers !

Peace and may God Bless You

anthonywallace

(&#65279

It is not possible for any human being to whom All?h has given the Book and wisdom and Prophethood to say to the people "obey me rather than All?h's." On the contrary "Be people of God, for ye have taught the Book and ye have studied it earnestly." (3-79)

Peace everyone

Wallace is trying to brainwash you, by speaking the words of God and then invoke his own words.

His view of Fasting is based on a misunderstanding of 2-184 and 185; thus he is normal humanbeing who might make mistakes sometimes.
Wallace' please read my understanding of fasting in the link I provided you.

Peace,

This is an obvious lie! I never said to the people to obey me instead of God... But I did say be aware of God and obey me...

Im not tryin to brainwash anyone, but to clarify for them and to set free the brainwashed...and to clarify to the 3,10,and 30 day faster believers what they dispute in... ( no muslim shall be harmed for the number of days they fast in rahmadan ). weather u fast 3,10,or 30 days it is acceptable wit your Lord...and He will not waste the reward of neither worker...

I have read some of ur post but not all of it...and my veiw still stands... and we all know that a " few " means the lesser... meaning that 3 days is less than 10 and 30 days...

Rahmadan has a total of 30 fasting days... 3 days are obligatory and 27 are optional...

Once a intention for a certain number of days ( 3, 10,or 30 ) days has been formed, one should fast the full 3,10,or 30 days. The submitter has a choice of fasting for more than three days but are not obligated to...

Once a muslim begins with intention to fast a certain number of days, it becomes obligatory upon him to complete it. If he breaks it he becomes a sinner and shall have to make up on different days...so if u sunnis intend to fast 30 days then u shall complete it, and if u intend to fast 3, or ten days then u shall complete the count....God will hold each of u for what u intend...

and im not done with this yet, im still gatherin the details for Rahmadan... But this is my view thus far... and im usually right about these things... but hey, i could be wronge... but I dont think so...

peace

Salaam anthonywhallace

You are not simply passing on the message but telling others your interpretation; not much different from pharasies or a teacher huh.
I suggest you stop claiming to be one of the inspired messengers of God, hypno or you may end up like General Zia ul Haq(ex president of Pakistan) who believed he was chosen and inspired by God. For a bit of fiction mixed with facts please do read ?The case of exploding mangoes? by Hanif Mohammad and roll with laughter. rotfl

peace

God is suffecient for me...

Peace,

This is where you lost me.

sorry, couldnt resist sayin " be aware of God and obey me " tempt

didnt mean to offend or appear arrogant...But I am a trustworthy messenger to you...and i admit i could have kept that comment in this post, but its still the same wit me weather i did or didnt post it...

get back later...

Salaam brother Belalhammad,

Thank you for informing us of A. Wallac's view on fasting, I missed this side of him and thanks again for giving link to your understandings.

peace

How could u turn away now, after you had already witnessed that the messenger is true?

Hati

Waylun likulli affakin atheemin

457

Woe to every guilty impostor

Ahmad_Bilal

Im not tryin to brainwash anyone, but to clarify for them and to set free the brainwashed...and to clarify to the 3,10,and 30 day faster believers what they dispute in... ( no muslim shall be harmed for the number of days they fast in rahmadan ). weather u fast 3,10,or 30 days it is acceptable wit your Lord...and He will not waste the reward of neither worker...

Peace to all.

First of all, you said your mission was to teach the people about salat and zakat, claiming that God Himself sent a book down to you explaining everything in detail... Then, you said that The God sent down to you an English translation of al-Qur'an, something that was clearly a LIE since you admittedly follow Layth's translation, not the one you claimed God sent you... And now you're saying your mission is to teach us about Ramadhan??? The God gives us the answers to the issues we dispute about. Claiming to be a messenger of God (Allah), you can't give your personal opinion on matters and expect us to follow your personal advice. Do you say about God what you don't know?

Rahmadan has a total of 30 fasting days... 3 days are obligatory and 27 are optional...

Ramadhan has 30 days, but 27 of them are optional??? Did you intend to write this, or was this a mistake?

and im not done with this yet, im still gatherin the details for Rahmadan... But this is my view thus far... and im usually right about these things... but hey, i could be wronge... but I dont think so...

This doesn't make sense regarding your messengership either. If God Himself sent you as a messenger to His people, you should know the definate, easily-understandable answer to this question from The God, especially if He sent down to you an English translation of His Scripture. Al-Qur'an-Majeed says that when Mohammed didn't know the answer to a question, he didn't give his personal opinion, saying, "I could be wrong". He waited for God's answer through the Great Reading. Anything other than that is innovation and speculation...

Peace.

anthonywallace

Waylun likulli affakin atheemin

457

Woe to every guilty impostor

I fear if I disobeyed my Lord, the retribution of a great Day!

Peace to all.

First of all, you said your mission was to teach the people about salat and zakat, claiming that God Himself sent a book down to you explaining everything in detail... Then, you said that The God sent down to you an English translation of al-Qur'an, something that was clearly a LIE since you admittedly follow Layth's translation, not the one you claimed God sent you... And now you're saying your mission is to teach us about Ramadhan??? The God gives us the answers to the issues we dispute about. Claiming to be a messenger of God (Allah), you can't give your personal opinion on matters and expect us to follow your personal advice. Do you say about God what you don't know?

Ramadhan has 30 days, but 27 of them are optional??? o Did you intend to write this, or was this a mistake?

This doesn't make sense regarding your messengership either. If God Himself sent you as a messenger to His people, you should know the definate, easily-understandable answer to this question from The God, especially if He sent down to you an English translation of His Scripture. Al-Qur'an-Majeed says that when Mohammed didn't know the answer to a question, he didn't give his personal opinion, saying, "I could be wrong". He waited for God's answer through the Great Reading. Anything other than that is innovation and speculation...

Peace.

You are a lier... You put words into my mouth... The God knows what u do...

We are only required to fast for a " few" number of days... So how many is a few???

Bring the Quran and show us that we are required to fast a certain number of fixed days ( 10, or 30 days ).

We all know that a " few " acually means 3 or 4, and it coulod mean just allittle more than that, but not too much more...Now bring your evidence that im wronge...

And yes, Rahmadan is the month of fasting, therefore everyday of Rahmadan is a fasting day, but we dont have to fast the full 30 days, we are only required to fast for a " few" days within ramadan...

O.k. so what do u suggest... Are we obligated to fast 30 days??? and will I go to Hell if I only fast 3 or 10??? Or should we harm someone who only fasts for 3 days or even should we hatm someone who doesnt fast at all in Rahmadan??? Does the Quran ordain that we fast for a specific number of days???

Gather your proofs and be sure that it doesnt come against you...and judge me and dont hold back...

And this is what I do know, the Quran has not ordained any specific days to fast on, nor has it ordained any specific number of days to fast except for a "few" ( which commonly means 3 or more, but not too much more as one might expect...)...

Ahmad_Bilal

Peace.

You didn't explain anything at all. You keep pointing out the word "few", yet you don't know how many this refers to. How do you know that The God won't inflict His judgement upon those who don't fast/abstain? Has God told you this? You are only speculating, you don't know for sure how many days we're instructed to abstain. So, how can you tell us how many YOU THINK we should fast? Do you speak about The God what you do not know?

You are a lier... You put words into my mouth... The God knows what u do...

If I've lied, SHOW ME WHERE I LIED. I'm only asking you to explain what you said...

And yes, Rahmadan is the month of fasting, therefore everyday of Rahmadan is a fasting day, but we dont have to fast the full 30 days, we are only required to fast for a " few" days within ramadan...

O.k. so what do u suggest... Are we obligated to fast 30 days??? and will I go to Hell if I only fast 3 or 10??? Or should we harm someone who only fasts for 3 days or even should we hatm someone who doesnt fast at all in Rahmadan??? Does the Quran ordain that we fast for a specific number of days???

So, when does this "month" of ramadhan start and end, if you are truthful? Ramadhan is detailed in al-Qur'an as a fixed period, not a month. Who told you that ramadhan has "30 days" in it? What you speak is falsehood, pure speculation. The God is fully aware of what you do...

belH

We are only required to fast for a " few" number of days... So how many is a few???

Peace,

Wallac, you are using "Few" as a translation for the arabic word "M3dodat", as Ayman does.

in verse (2-184) means COUNTED DAYS and NOT FEW DAYS.
Please, understand that and refer to the following (as you said, you are a human and you can make mistake or misled by others tempt)

http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9188.new;topicseen#new

anthonywallace

Peace to all.

Ramadhan has 30 days, but 27 of them are optional??? Did you intend to write this, or was this a mistake?

This doesn't make sense regarding your messengership either. If God Himself sent you as a messenger to His people, you should know the definate, easily-understandable answer to this question from The God, especially if He sent down to you an English translation of His Scripture. Al-Qur'an-Majeed says that when Mohammed didn't know the answer to a question, he didn't give his personal opinion, saying, "I could be wrong". He waited for God's answer through the Great Reading. Anything other than that is innovation and speculation...

Peace.

O people, I am merely warning you all with the Quran... Let us come to an agreement... Are those who know the definate equal to those who do not know? The below is the definate and it explains my teachings to you

Rahmadan fasting agreement

Desired Results - ( This is what The God expexts of all the believers )

Fast for a few number of days in the month of Ramadan. 2184 - 185 handshake

Guidelines- ( This is what not to do )

(1.)It has been made lawful for you during the night of fasting to approach your women sexually. They are a garment for you and you are a garment for them. God knows that you used to betray your souls so He has accepted your repentance, and forgiven you; now you may approach them and seek what God has written for you. And you may eat and drink until the white thread is distinct from the black thread of dawn; then you shall complete the fast until night; and do not approach them while you are devoted in the temples. These are God?s boundaries, so do not transgress them. It is thus that God makes His revelations clear to the people that they may be righteous. 2187 handshake

Accountabilities- ( This is the standard performance that is expected of you,how you are to fast, and what you will be held accountable for )

(1.) Eat and drink until the white thread is distinct from the black thread of dawn; then complete the fast until night; 2187 handshake

Consequenses &

Rewards - ( These are the benifits of fasting )

3335 Surely, .... the fasting men, and the fasting women,........ God has prepared for them a forgiveness and a great recompense. handshake

Punishments - &

N/A handshake wow hmm wow

And have paitience upon yourselves regarding those who go meet their Lord dawn and dusk seeking His presence. And let not your eyes over look them that you seek the beauty of this worldy life, and do not obey the one whom We have made his heart headless of our rememberance and he followed his desire and his fate was lost...

And someone more powerful than me is giong to come and I am not even worthy enuff to carry his sandles...

And I must add, let each work according to his own, your Lord is fully aware of who is best guided to the path...

If God wished, He would show them to you so that you could recongnize them by their looks ( The 30 day fasters, or the ten day fasters, or the three day fasters), however, you can recongnize them by their speech...

( Believers , when you fast dont be like them show offs... Dont let anyone know you are fasting or how many days you are fasting... Do it in private, Your Lord knows what is done in private. And He will reward you for it... I assure you that them show-offs already have their reward. )

And the truth has come from your Lord, so whosoever is guided is only being guided for himself and whosoever is misguided will remain so; and I am not a caretaker over you...

I personally believe that this is a blessing from our Lord... Recall when God united your hearts, when you were enemys...Then you became as brothers...

And Rahmadan is here, and clarity has come to you all in this matter... That however many days you intend to fast... To all you 30 day fasters, and to all you 10 day fasters, and to those who fast 3 days or more... You will be held accoutable for your intention, so if you intend to fast 30 days, then u better fast it and if you break it you become a sinner and it must be made up on different days to complete the count... And this goes for those who intend to fast 3 - 10 days and so on also...

peace

anthonywallace

Peace.

You didn't explain anything at all. You keep pointing out the word "few", yet you don't know how many this refers to. How do you know that The God won't inflict His judgement upon those who don't fast/abstain? Has God told you this? You are only speculating, you don't know for sure how many days we're instructed to abstain. So, how can you tell us how many YOU THINK we should fast? Do you speak about The God what you do not know?

If I've lied, SHOW ME WHERE I LIED. I'm only asking you to explain what you said...

So, when does this "month" of ramadhan start and end, if you are truthful? Ramadhan is detailed in al-Qur'an as a fixed period, not a month. Who told you that ramadhan has "30 days" in it? What you speak is falsehood, pure speculation. The God is fully aware of what you do...

First of all bring forth qouts to match what you accuse me of saying and all your partners without twistin your touge it to somethin else... And give me no respite...

O.K. so do you know the exact number of days we are suppose to fast? Bring your proof if you are truthful...

none know the number except God and a " few."

Is there a certain number mentioned in the verse? HuH ?

Does it say in the Quran fast 30 days, or 10 days, or three days specificaly?

Im only in on this to say, let each work according to his own way...

anthonywallace

I also saw that one of satans messengers was sent to make me suffer so that I would not feel too proud...

belH

Rahmadan fasting agreement

Desired Results - ( This is what The God expexts of all the believers )

Fast for a few number of days in the month of Ramadan. 2184 - 185 handshake

No...NO
Its

Rahmadan fasting DISagreement

The Ramadan Agreement should be according to Quran and not you, as follow

Fast for a number of days in the month of Ramadan. 2184 handshake

And the number of days is

Ramadan MONTH is in which was sent down the Qur'an as a guide to mankind also clear (Signs) for guidance and judgment (between right and wrong). So everyone of you who witness that month should spent it in fasting, but if anyone is ill, or on a journey, the prescribed period (should be made up) by days later. Allah intends every facility for you He does not want to put you to difficulties. (He wants you) to complete the prescribed period, and to glorify Him in that He has guided you; and perchance ye shall be grateful. (185)

WE Have To Complete The Period of RAMADAN MONTH--Agreement handshake

I also saw that one of satans messengers was sent to make me suffer so that I would not feel too proud...

rotfl

anthonywallace

No...NO
Its

Rahmadan fasting DISagreement

The Ramadan Agreement should be according to Quran and not you, as follow

Fast for a number of days in the month of Ramadan. 2184 handshake

And the number of days is

Ramadan MONTH is in which was sent down the Qur'an as a guide to mankind also clear (Signs) for guidance and judgment (between right and wrong). So everyone of you who witness that month should spent it in fasting, but if anyone is ill, or on a journey, the prescribed period (should be made up) by days later. Allah intends every facility for you He does not want to put you to difficulties. (He wants you) to complete the prescribed period, and to glorify Him in that He has guided you; and perchance ye shall be grateful. (185)

WE Have To Complete The Period of RAMADAN MONTH--Agreement handshake
rotfl

nope

When to fast?

Fast in the month of Rahmadan... handshake

How many days to fast?

Fast for a counted number of days... handshake

belH

nope

When to fast?

Fast in the month of Rahmadan... handshake

How many days to fast?

Fast for a counted number of days... handshake

Thus;
if the fast for the Ramadan Month
and

(He wants you) to complete the prescribed period

is to complete the Month
then, can we agree that the month is not 3 days nor 10 days BUT 29 or 28 or 30 days at least?

brooklyn36100

Salaam to all

As I read all the posts, I could not help, seeing, this image

A man in ancient times (if you will) thrown to the grown and being beaten by the many spectators, and why is this, because he dared to speak his mind...Allah will leave to stray those whom he wills / pleases ...if you make a choice (LOL) then it is just that your choice and you alone will be responsible for it. Some say here that if they listen to Mr. wallace they will be astry and some think silently... could it be the other way around...?

in each case..remains the same conclusion you must make a decision..which will it be?

For allah to leave astry a person...1. he must already know they are not worth anything...2. they refuse to adhere and amend by what he has sent, (DOES NOT MATTER WHO IS SAYING / PARROTING IT)

I wish to see anyone Quote / say / Parrot other than Quran

don't we all wish we could be sure of each and every ayat of the reading...but for some reason the doubt still lingers on..and we persue to review them over and over again...ask yourself why?

Allah will only make understand..the reading to those who are sincere...but how do YOU measure your sincere.

Quran says measure and wiegh justly...like in measure your words...they carry much wieght... if you say something in contrary to thier undrstanding..you may force them to speak against thier lord...why would you provoke this..there is no complusion in this deen.

And they did not begin to debate / fight one another until the revelation came to them.

So before this...everyone was happy in thier ignorance?...no one really paid attention to anyone else because then they KNEW all were equally stupid.

Are we advancing / progressing...or are we with a bar in front and behind and merely standing still, contemplating our fantasies of wanting to believe and submit.

Looking at the behavior and speech of many here and other forums...I do get worried...self righteous...or freedom from shirk...to associated with Allah comes thru not understanding his plan and purpose...and I am one who if I do not understand...KNOW that Allah remains the same and has control over everything...all day and night...never ending.

I could go on, but I do not wish to bore / anger / confuse anyone...as to my thoughts....be at peace with your choice.

belH