salat timing

palestina

Thank you ay.

I know people who do not pray at all... but, remember God often, do good works, give to charity, stay clear from wrongdoing, show constant acts of kindness, and believe in the hereafter. I also know the other spectrum of people who never miss a prayer, but display wickedness regularly.

Which is better?

peace,

yes I think the same - praying for the sake of prayer is useless.... thats why I believe in the quran when demanded of us, its usually (always?) followed by a command to do good/reform (salihat) - God knows best!
chapter 107 is a good example i find

Performance Agreement ( Salat/prayer )

Affirmaton- jedi

17111 And say Praise be to God who has not taken a son, nor does He have a partner in sovereignty, nor does He have an ally out of weakness.

peace aw - im just curious as to why you chose this affirmation as the one you have to say in your prayers specifically?

rsw

Glory be to our God!

Literal

2238 observe/guard on the prayers, and the prayers the middle, and stand/call to God obeying worshipping humbly.

Humbly = on bended knee, apoligeticly, ect...lowered....

Middle= daily, regularly, day in and day out, often, ect.....

( However this verse is still being analized, because their is a " middle " prayer ( the late night prayer ) )...

peace

Try analyzing it in the context of being about marriage/divorce, because that is what the verses around it are about.

anthonywallace

peace,

peace aw - im just curious as to why you chose this affirmation as the one you have to say in your prayers specifically?

This is an important part of both morning and evening prayer services cause it is the statement of the submitters monotheism and Gods providence. And it is the foundation of Submission ( Islam).

There are parts of prayer which are absolute proof. If any of these parts are not fulfilled, the prayer is rendered null or void. And thus must be repeated. police

After making intention for prayer to say

"Praise be to God who has not taken a son, nor does He have a partner in sovereignty, nor does He have a ally out of weakness."

(17 110-111 And do not be too loud in making your ( prayers ), nor too quite; but seek a path in between. And say "Praise be to God who has not taken a son, nor does He have a partner in sovereignty, nor does He have an ally out of weakness." )

( you might want to repeat this affirmation at least thrice. ( and glorify Him greatly 17111 ) )

To pray to God

Example to say "My Lord, forgive and have mercy. And You are the most Mesrciful.?

(1082 Therefore, you shall pray to your Lord ??)

The posture of prostration

( 4102 And if you are with them and you keep the prayers for them, then let a group from amongst them stand with you and let them bring their weapons; and when they have prostrated then let them stand guard from behind; and let a group who has not yet prayed come and pray with you, and let them be wary and let them bring their weapons with them.

3342 Bow down and worship Him dawn and evening at sunset. hail hail pr hail pr

rsw

There are parts of prayer which are absolute proof. If any of these parts are not fulfilled, the prayer is rendered null or void. And thus must be repeated.

I don't see any clear statements which declare the prayers "null and void" when we don't say those specific words. Actually, doesn't the Qu'ran say that GOD would never make our faith of no effect? Also, why "must be repeated?" This implies that the prayers are compulsory, but, I thought the Qu'ran said there is no compulsion in religion?

anthonywallace

I don't see any clear statements which declare the prayers "null and void" when we don't say those specific words. Actually, doesn't the Qu'ran say that GOD would never make our faith of no effect? Also, why "must be repeated?" This implies that the prayers are compulsory, but, I thought the Qu'ran said there is no compulsion in religion?

The God commands you to say the affirmation after making intention for your prayer. Do you see it in 17110-111...And to pray to Him....1082

If you do not affirm that you are indeed praying to the one who did not take a son, nor has a partner in soverinty, nor has ally out of weakness....

You might fall into idol worship in His presence...

Alot of people pray, but some of their prayers are nothin but noise and aversion....Why? Because they nullify their prayers by seting up partners in Gods service...And they praise others and set up equals with Him...While the thanks be to God...

You call on your Lord out of fear and want...And do not set up any partner in His service...And be aware of God whom you ask about, and the relatives...

anthonywallace

And how can your prayer be valid if you dont pray?

You have to pray/salat in order to be of those who pray... Thus if u dont pray then you didnt pray....so your prayer is not valid...ect..

rsw

The God commands you to say the affirmation after making intention for your prayer. Do you see it in 17110-111...And to pray to Him....1082

I have read those verses, they do not say to say them as an affirmation at the beginning of prayer; they simply say "SAYCall on GOD..." etc. There are many verses which begin with the command to "SAY," why did you choose these two instead of the hundreds of others? Also, if I followed your command to use this affirmation at the beginning of my prayer wouldn't I be setting YOU up as a partner with GOD, and thus falling into idol worship?

I do pray, but it is nothing like what you describe. I did not settle on my prayer habit without carefully considering the clear statements in the Qu'ran; and I find it hard to believe that my prayers are null because I am not opening them with 'magic word' recitations. Actually, the idea of a prayer being 'null' is completely absurd to me, GOD hears everything we say, and when we speak to HIM, HE listens, regardless of whether we are worshiping HIM, asking HIM for help, etc. Even ablution is unnecessary; the Qu'ran says it is only recommended so that GOD can complete His favor on us, that we might be thankful. There is no compulsion in religion, etc.

nerspi

peace, all)

We spend so much time debating when or how to pray, instead of embracing the whole idea of prayer itself and realizing how blessed we are to have the opportunity to connect with the Almighty God, Creator of life and death.

bravo
i totally agree that it's not HOW we pray, rather the goal, the purpose, the end result of it.

You might fall into idol worship in His presence...

slow down there

you make it seem that God is so strict He wants us to be like robots, to say this and that like this and that to move like this and that... lets be reminded that God does not need anything,
i'm sure if He wanted such a thing He could have created special beings just for that.
but quran was sent to us for our benefit, everything in it is for us, to develope ourselves, to learn, to observe, to grow.
it wasn't sent 'cause God needed to feel big and important that He'd have to prescribe certain form of a ritual that needs to be done exactly 1 way and if 1 detail missed, bang, nullified. c'mon now.

And how can your prayer be valid if you dont pray?

You have to pray/salat in order to be of those who pray... Thus if u dont pray then you didnt pray....so your prayer is not valid...ect..

how do you know he doesn't pray/establish the connection?

besides, it is shown in our daily lives, in how we behave, in our development.

rsw

it wasn't sent 'cause God needed to feel big and important that He'd have to prescribe certain form of a ritual that needs to be done exactly 1 way and if 1 detail missed, bang, nullified. c'mon now.

In support of this notion, the Qu'ran explicity tells us that God is not in need of our prayers. He is free of need, Self-sustaining. It is us who need Him, and it is us who need to worship Him, He does not need our worship. The prayers are to maintain our connection to Him, to help us avoid evil, etc. It's for us, not God. Not following a ritual formula designed by someone else is neither going to make that connection stronger or weaker (and why should we obey that which neither helps or hinders us? The Qu'ran comes together!). If the ritual works for anyone in maintaining their connection it is a Good Thing (tm) for them, but they should not seek to impose their rituals on others. I think the Qu'ran is pretty clear on people who impose their beliefs on others, too.

Also, as far as this topic goes I'm surprised to find I'm essentially in complete agreement with you and dotty concerning salat. that never happens! lol

anthonywallace

I have read those verses, they do not say to say them as an affirmation at the beginning of prayer; they simply say "SAYCall on GOD..." etc. There are many verses which begin with the command to "SAY," why did you choose these two instead of the hundreds of others? Also, if I followed your command to use this affirmation at the beginning of my prayer wouldn't I be setting YOU up as a partner with GOD, and thus falling into idol worship?

I do pray, but it is nothing like what you describe. I did not settle on my prayer habit without carefully considering the clear statements in the Qu'ran; and I find it hard to believe that my prayers are null because I am not opening them with 'magic word' recitations. Actually, the idea of a prayer being 'null' is completely absurd to me, GOD hears everything we say, and when we speak to HIM, HE listens, regardless of whether we are worshiping HIM, asking HIM for help, etc. Even ablution is unnecessary; the Qu'ran says it is only recommended so that GOD can complete His favor on us, that we might be thankful. There is no compulsion in religion, etc.

17110 Say ?Call on God or call on the Almighty. Whichever it is you call on, for to Him are the best names.? And do not be too loud in making your communion, nor too quite; but seek a path in between.
17111 And say ?Praise be to God who has not taken a son, nor does He have a partner in sovereignty, nor does He have an ally out of weakness.? And glorify Him greatly.

The word "and" means to say this after making intention for prayer... These verses are " salat " plain and simple...And this verse is proof...weather you choose to say it or not to...However, if u choose to only observe 2 ( see above ), without saying the affirmation, you have prayed...but you didnt praise or say the affirmation...Thus, your prayer is valid, but is lacking....ect.....

Also many verses are commands to say certain things at certain times and certain situations,ect...

And whoever obeys God and His messenger will be amonst the upright, and the martys,and the blessed from the prophets and pious peiople of old...

I tell you for certain, that anyone who believes in my message and the one who sent me has already went from death to life...

And I showed you the absolute proofs from Quran to confirm this...

anthonywallace

peace, all)
bravo

you make it seem that God is so strict He wants us to be like robots, to say this and that like this and that to move like this and that... lets be reminded that God does not need anything,
i'm sure if He wanted such a thing He could have created special beings just for that.
but quran was sent to us for our benefit, everything in it is for us, to develope ourselves, to learn, to observe, to grow.
it wasn't sent 'cause God needed to feel big and important that He'd have to prescribe certain form of a ritual that needs to be done exactly 1 way and if 1 detail missed, bang, nullified. c'mon now.

how do you know he doesn't pray/establish the connection?

besides, it is shown in our daily lives, in how we behave, in our development.

God did not creat you except to serve Him...

Does God not command one to say this and say that and do this and do that at this time ect...?? Sure He does...

17110 Say ?Call on God or call on the Almighty. Whichever it is you call on, for to Him are the best names.? And do not be too loud in making your communion, nor too quite; but seek a path in between.
17111 And say ?Praise be to God who has not taken a son, nor does He have a partner in sovereignty, nor does He have an ally out of weakness.? And glorify Him greatly.

And for every nation He has established certain rites that they must fullfil...

I didnt say he didnt observe the prayers...

mmkhan

Salaaman Anthony,

17110 Say Call on God or call on the Almighty. Whichever it is you call on, for to Him are the best names. And do not be too loud in making your communion, nor too quite; but seek a path in between.

This translation is incorrect. It does not mean "Loud nor quite", if so it will be said as "wa laa tajhar bil qawl" as in 207

Please refer. 17110 talks about displaying of Salaat.

Regards,
mmKhan

anthonywallace

Salaaman Anthony,

This translation is incorrect. It does not mean "Loud nor quite", if so it will be said as "wa laa tajhar bil qawl" as in 207

Please refer. 17110 talks about displaying of Salaat.

Regards,
mmKhan

O.k. Well displaying of salat....And say Praise be to the One who did not take a son, ect.......................

anthonywallace

969 Have you seen the one who deters, A servant from praying ? Have you seen if he was being guided, Or he ordered righteousness? Have you seen if he lied and turned away? Did he not know that God can see? Alas, if he does not cease, We will strike the frontal lobe. A frontal lobe which lies and errs. So let him call on his supporter. We will call on the guardians. So do not obey him, prostrate and come near.

7205 And get down upon your kneez and remember your Lord in private, dawn and evening at sunset. And do not be of the neglectful.

17110 And do not be too loud in making your communion, nor too quite; but seek a path in between.
17111 And say ?Praise be to God who has not taken a son, nor does He have a partner in sovereignty, nor does He have an ally out of weakness.? And glorify Him greatly.

anthonywallace

hail hail hail Praise be to God who did not take a son, nor does He have a partner in soverinty, nor does He have ally out of weakness." pr hail hail hail hail

2238 And dedicate the prayers;
whithout once missing.
And kneel and pray
to God Almighty apologetically.

hail pr & pr hail hail hail hail hail hail hail hail hail hail hail hail pr hail hail

rsw

if we pray directly to God why isn't your affirmation addressing God directly (like Dozens Of other prayers in quran do)? it looks like something we are supposed to say when as a testimony upon conversion to Islam, the context supports this theory.

anthonywallace

if we pray directly to God why isn't your affirmation addressing God directly (like Dozens Of other prayers in quran do)? it looks like something we are supposed to say when as a testimony upon conversion to Islam, the context supports this theory.

You should begin your prayer with praises to God...The affirmation/ statment is not the prayer itself, it is praises to God.

This a an important part of prayer...

Salam

Kitaaban Mawqoota! Set times!

Are these SET times as mentioned in the Quran Alone. Always definate sunrise and sunset times (when the birds really go off!) = 2 compulsory contact/praising times. Because remember Tasbeeh is mentioned for sunrise and sunset too and birds are given as example in the Quran.

Any thoughts?

Salam

mmkhan

Salaaman Anthony,

O.k. Well displaying of salat....And say Praise be to the One who did not take a son, ect.......................

Yes! That part is compulsory.

Regards,
mmKhan

anthonywallace

hail hail hail hail pr

1.In the name of God,
the Merciful, the Most Merciful.
2. All praises to God,
the worlds Lord.
3. The Merciful,
the Most Merciful.
4. The Master
of Judgment Day.
5. We worship You only,
and we seek help from You only.
6. Guide us to the path,
that is straight.
7. Those You blessed on them's path,
and not those with the wrath on them,
nor the misled. jedi

hail hail hail hail pr

rsw

Why do I keep seeing this word "compulsory?" Doesn't Qu'ran explicitly state that there is no compulsion in religion ... ?

Let's look at this "say" in it's CONTEXT

17107 Say ?Believe in it or do not believe in it. Those who have been given the knowledge before it, when it is recited to them, they fall to their chins prostrating.?
17108 And they say ?Praise be to our Lord. Truly, the promise of our Lord was fulfilled.?
17109 And they fall upon their chins crying, and it increases them in humility.
17110 Say ?Call on God or call on the Almighty. Whichever it is you call on, for to Him are the best names.? And do not be too loud in making your communion, nor too quite; but seek a path in between.
17111 And say ?Praise be to God who has not taken a son, nor does He have a partner in sovereignty, nor does He have an ally out of weakness.? And glorify Him greatly.

Verses 107-109 are describing "those who have been given the knowledge before it," that is, people who have already believed in God who are being exposed to the Qu'ran for the first time. "Say" is a command for us, the reader, what we should say to them. We should tell them to call on God by whatever name you called Him already, and to praise Him who hasn't taken a son, has no partner or ally.

Why do you think we are being told to say these verses before a prayer? Just because it says "and glorify Him" after you say those things does not mean that you have to say them EVERY TIME before you glorify Him, it only means you should glorify Him EVERY TIME after telling this to a believer who has been exposed to the Qu'ran for the first time, who falls on their chins crying.