Number of wives?
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Assalaam Alaikum Brotha Badar
Azwaji-ka means YOUR mates or spouses, the 'Ka' is a 2nd person pronoun,
So far so good...
denoting now, present tense NOT past tense.
A prnoun has no past or present...just as a noun. If you mean the whole sentence, then this is redundant since the verse is addressing the prophet at that time when he was alive, which we know, and are not deducing this information of "past address" from the construction of the verse.
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Is not 'ka' singular, masculine reference? 2nd person?
Ya ayyuha alrrasoolu balligh ma onzila ilayka min rabbika
567 You, you the messenger deliver what was descended to you from your LordHow many spouses/wives?
Ya ayyuha alnnabiyyu lima tuharrimu ma ahalla Allahu laka tabtaghee mardata azwajika waAllahu ghafoorun raheemun
661 You, you the prophet, why you forbid what God permitted for you, you desire wives' approvals, and God (is) forgiving, merciful.Wa-ith asarra alnnabiyyu ila baAAdi azwajihi
663 And when confided the prophet to some (of) his wives...How many daughters?
1178...he said "You (my) nation those are daughters (banatee), they are purer for you...
1179 They said "You had known is not for us from right in daughters ( banatika), and that you know what we want." -
So far so good...A prnoun has no past or present...just as a noun. If you mean the whole sentence, then this is redundant since the verse is addressing the prophet at that time when he was alive, which we know, and are not deducing this information of "past address" from the construction of the verse.
In ANY language reference, a 2nd person pronoun is present tense, the person who is present, reading or listening
3rd person reference is one who is NOT present, past tense reference to others
1st person is the person doing the speaking, in present tense, who is speaking to others who are present as such they are 2nd person.
ANY person speaking in 1st person and speaks about or references others in 3rd person, who are NOT present, thus is speaking either about them or in past tense, about them.
If one takes issue, then please contact the publishers of 'Language of The Holy Quran' by Nadwi page 162
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In ANY language reference, a 2nd person pronoun is present tense, the person who is present, reading or listening
3rd person reference is one who is NOT present, past tense reference to others
1st person is the person doing the speaking, in present tense, who is speaking to others who are present as such they are 2nd person.
ANY person speaking in 1st person and speaks about or references others in 3rd person, who are NOT present, thus is speaking either about them or in past tense, about them.
If one takes issue, then please contact the publishers of 'Language of The Holy Quran' by Nadwi page 162
What you should be talking about is present versus absent; not present tense versus past tense.
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What you should be talking about is present versus absent; not present tense versus past tense.
Actually, we are attempting to develop a consensus of agreement. We are 'talking about' what needs to be talked about to develop that consensus.
At this point, it appears that we all agree as to the definitives of azawjika as it relates to Sura 33.50 and 33.59
The relevance of those ayahs is applicable to the current circumstance of the Muslim community. As such, the grammatical analysis lends itself towards the application of the instruction to the current circumstance.
Thats what we are focusing on.
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Dear friends the word that your are considering as a noun Azwaji attached with a personal pronoun Ka is not one word or combination. It is actually three words. Which are & . Peace and love. Please continue the discussion, comments and criticism will be greatly appreciated.
Badar
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Salaam,
I have voted for "as one as one can manage" and remember that managing means, be there for her as her husband in all walks of life, supporting her financially and sexually as well as companionably, strong enough to provide for her needs....any example there? angel
Not like wealthy Arabs who can only give their wives enough money to shop and are unable to satisfy them, thus leaving many sexually frustrated.
peaceNo one is forcing those women to get married. If they do not think it is worth it, they wouldn't have gotten married in the first place. Plus, the big number of women left unmarried in a monogamous world, will be more frustrated because they will have no sexual satisfaction at all, except through unlawful means.
Peace,
Good point sister Farida!!! Men are too greedy, they want too much and cannot manage it ;D
Maria
Yeah, greedy men taking care of multiple women, providing them with family and children! Those women would have been better off prostituting themselves, right? Isn't that what you want?
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No one is forcing those women to get married. If they do not think it is worth it, they wouldn't have gotten married in the first place. Plus, the big number of women left unmarried in a monogamous world, will be more frustrated because they will have no sexual satisfaction at all, except through unlawful means.
Salaam
In fact I urge women to demand marriage of men and not allow men to degrade them by taking them as girlfriends or mistresses.Yeah, greedy men taking care of multiple women, providing them with family and children! Those women would have been better off prostituting themselves, right? Isn't that what you want?
To find out my views about polygyny please see my thread http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=16043.0
I do not argue about the permission to take more than one wife, however I want men to remember that it's not a joke but a permission from God for very valid reasons and you either comply with all the responsibilities of a husband or stick to just the one wife (or none).peace
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No one is forcing those women to get married. If they do not think it is worth it, they wouldn't have gotten married in the first place. Plus, the big number of women left unmarried in a monogamous world, will be more frustrated because they will have no sexual satisfaction at all, except through unlawful means.
Yeah, greedy men taking care of multiple women, providing them with family and children! Those women would have been better off prostituting themselves, right? Isn't that what you want?
Nop you are absolutely on a wrong side they are not marrying them out of mercy are to help them and you know that very well and still trying to cover their wrongs.
a few months back a 90 years old Saudi millioner paid a poor Egyptian family to marry their 16 years young daughter but the court took action against him and stopped that marriage.
Why he never tried to find a widow are divorce women why he need a virgin?
Fahad tell me will you marry a 90 years old women. hmm
peace -
Nop you are absolutely on a wrong side they are not marrying them out of mercy are to help them and you know that very well and still trying to cover their wrongs.
a few months back a 90 years old Saudi millioner paid a poor Egyptian family to marry their 16 years young daughter but the court took action against him and stopped that marriage.
Why he never tried to find a widow are divorce women why he need a virgin?
Fahad tell me will you marry a 90 years old women. hmm
peacePeace,
But this is also a special case of the rich people, they always think they can get what they want because they have money )
Maria
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No one is forcing those women to get married. If they do not think it is worth it, they wouldn't have gotten married in the first place. Plus, the big number of women left unmarried in a monogamous world, will be more frustrated because they will have no sexual satisfaction at all, except through unlawful means.
Yeah, greedy men taking care of multiple women, providing them with family and children! Those women would have been better off prostituting themselves, right? Isn't that what you want?
Nop you are absolutely on a wrong side
Am I wrong that the big number of women left unmarried in a monogamous world will be more frustrated because they will have no sexual satisfaction at all, except through unlawful means?
Am I wrong that every women has a right to have a husband and children?
Tell me.
they are not marrying them out of mercy are to help them
Isn't it merciless to leave women unmarried? Doesn't it help a woman to be married instead of staying unmarried and unfulfilled?
and you know that very well and still trying to cover their wrongs.
WHAT EXACTLY do you think is wrong in polygyny? How many women will be left unmarried in a monogamous society? Wouldn't THAT be wrong?
a few months back a 90 years old Saudi millioner paid a poor Egyptian family to marry their 16 years young daughter but the court took action against him and stopped that marriage.
I was talking about marriage, not about rape.
Why he never tried to find a widow are divorce women why he need a virgin?
Whats wrong with a virgin?
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Nop you are absolutely on a wrong side
Am I wrong that the big number of women left unmarried in a monogamous world will be more frustrated because they will have no sexual satisfaction at all, except through unlawful means?
Am I wrong that every women has a right to have a husband and children?
Tell me.
Isn't it merciless to leave women unmarried? Doesn't it help a woman to be married instead of staying unmarried and unfulfilled?
WHAT EXACTLY do you think is wrong in polygyny? How many women will be left unmarried in a monogamous society? Wouldn't THAT be wrong?
I was talking about marriage, not about rape.
Whats wrong with a virgin?
Yes - you're wrong, because the number of men and women in the world between the ages of 15-50 are roughly even. The excess of women is only above the age of 70 (above the male life expectancy.
So this idea of an excess of women who need polygamy to find a husband is complete fantasy. In fact, in many countries like China and Saudi Arabia, there is a big excess of men. So your arguement needs to be reversed.
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Peace,
But this is also a special case of the rich people, they always think they can get what they want because they have money )
Maria
Peace Maria & Fahad
NO this is not a special case almost all those men who have a few dirham?s are rupees will try to find a teenage and buy her, they are not marrying them to help them. Why don?t they go for those widows who needs help, the truth is that they are doing it to satisfy their lust and to abuse God hukm.
) I remembered in India there is tribe i forget the name, they have a tradition the women are the head of family and bread winner they marry 4 men and the men stay at home and do the cooking cleaning etc.
So is that from God are that is their culture. hmm
peace
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Shortage of men is not a natural occurence. When it happens is due to wars fought on the battleground or when they emigrate and leave women behind, which is a localised phenomenon and is accompanied by excess men in the place where they go. Wars today kill at least as many civilians as they do military, so really the number should even out with a slight excess of males in the earlier years and an excess of women in old age.
As it happens and Liq... points our in fact with selective abortions and male preference the fact is that a big problem is cooking of excess men who will not be able to find a wife because there will not be enough women around. The best possibility of poligamy for them is to make sure they do reach a very old age and keep waiting for other males to die and marry their old widows.
Salaam
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Are you sugesting poligamy for women hmm
;DNo. I am not suggesting anything at all and I do not think any woman deserves being punished with extra husbands. In most cases one is punishment enough. And if in fact she has got that most precious and rare wonder of a good husband, most definitely she won't want to dilute it adding anything less than that, nor deprive other women of the same possibility if she happened to come across more than one of that rare species.
No, I am not a cruel person nor a women hater, therefore I would never advocate more than one husband.
That notwithstanding I am really worried about what those extra men may come up with deprived of the hope of having a woman. May be the popularity of homosexuality has been a providential tendency that might soothen the excess men problem.
And, brother Afridi, I appreciate your posts, but please do not look so wary of me or my thoughts. I am a very sweet person and rather cautious, and also straightforward, if I want to suggest something I go and suggest it straight out not leave it hanging, except for irony, but that can be readily appreciated, I hope.
Salaam
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No. I am not suggesting anything at all and I do not think any woman deserves being punished with extra husbands. In most cases one is punishment enough. And if in fact she has got that most precious and rare wonder of a good husband, most definitely she won't want to dilute it adding anything less than that, nor deprive other women of the same possibility if she happened to come across more than one of that rare species.
No, I am not a cruel person nor a women hater, therefore I would never advocate more than one husband.
That notwithstanding I am really worried about what those extra men may come up with deprived of the hope of having a woman. May be the popularity of homosexuality has been a providential tendency that might soothen the excess men problem.
And, brother Afridi, I appreciate your posts, but please do not look so wary of me or my thoughts. I am a very sweet person and rather cautious, and also straightforward, if I want to suggest something I go and suggest it straight out not leave it hanging, except for irony, but that can be readily appreciated, I hope.
Salaam
;D please don?t take it that way it?s my habit joking with everyone it was only a joke I don?t like polygamy at all if the purpose is helping someone then ok otherwise no.
Any way in case of women shortage we can send those exes men to the above said Indian tribe.
I hope you will agree with me on this !peace
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;D please don?t take it that way it?s my habit joking with everyone it was only a joke I don?t like polygamy at all if the purpose is helping someone then ok otherwise no.
Any way in case of women shortage we can send those exes men to the above said Indian tribe.
I hope you will agree with me on this !peace
http//www.maharashtra.gov.in/pdf/gazeetter_reprint/Poona-I/appendix_c.html#.
http//books.google.com.pk/books?id=ix4T-qyrhWAC&pg=PA63&lpg=PA63&dq=polyandry+in+indian+tribe&source=bl&ots=TfIX1OWJt-&sig=W7PD6-P5wLUCCbY0OZm9SR4rFkU&hl=en&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=1&ct=result#PPA64,M1