The Shahada
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Here are my views in regard shahada
first of all im not looking for an audience, i am simply stating what i beleive, and if people want to do or say only to get an audience, well we know what god says of that, it is very clear in the quran that the majority is always in the wrong, as for chapter 631 http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9597475.msg186326#msg186326
but i do not see a chapter for the other aya even though i have a pretty good idea what it is saying or implying but to be on the safe side if you can get me the chapter number it would be helpful -
but i do not see a chapter for the other aya even though i have a pretty good idea what it is saying or implying but to be on the safe side if you can get me the chapter number it would be helpful
Chapter three;
please note that any one who is accepting the Quran as a divine Message, he or she will have to testify that the person who Wrote that book for them is a Messenger of God; otherwise, why they are following the Book.If I were to be a new Moslem, who had no religion, first I will have to testify that there is no God But Allah (The One); second, in order for me to accept the Quran to be the words of Allah, I have to accept the person who wrote it as a True Prophet of God.
But if I were a Jew or a Christian, I had testified before that there is no God but the One (Alloha or YHOW); So, what will make me a Moslem is to accept the Quran and the Person who wrote it. -
Chapter three;
please note that any one who is accepting the Quran as a divine Message, he or she will have to testify that the person who Wrote that book for them is a Messenger of God; otherwise, why they are following the Book.If I were to be a new Moslem, who had no religion, first I will have to testify that there is no God But Allah (The One); second, in order for me to accept the Quran to be the words of Allah, I have to accept the person who wrote it as a True Prophet of God.
But if I were a Jew or a Christian, I had testified before that there is no God but the One (Alloha or YHOW); So, what will make me a Moslem is to accept the Quran and the Person who wrote it.is that a condition that one must testify, well i am a muslim and i dont testify, but i know he is a messenger and the very fact that i read quran proves that i beleive he was a messenger and that the quran is the word of god.
god is talking about the kafireen,which everything is nullified when it comes to them, that in itself proves that even if they did shahada it doesnt mean anything just like the monafiqeen, and that is also in there time, they didnt do shahada that he is a rasool they did it as he is true to what he says, but then again it really doesnt matter waht they say they are kufar.... god did shahda to himself, if it was abligatory do you not think that god would have added mohamad to the shahada in the quran in 318
even if you read the ayat after 386 it shows that these very people will enter hell or be punished -
3 86 How can God guide a people who have rejected after believing, and they witnessed that the messenger is true, and the clarity had come to them? God does not guide the wicked people.
631 When the hypocrites come to you they say ?We bear witness that you are the messenger of God.? And God knows that you are His messenger, and God bears witness that the hypocrites are liars.
According to the previous verses my understanding is that we should testify sincerly that Mohamed is the messneger of God. The hypocrites testified but they were not sincere, they were lying.
But still i dont put this testmony in conjuction with la illah ila allah, cos la illah illa allah is always mentioned alone in the quraanIf I were to be a new Moslem, who had no religion, first I will have to testify that there is no God But Allah
And what about saying I submitt to the Lord of the world " " according to the stories of Ibrahim and the queen of chiba?
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Peace BelH,
Do you testify that the Person who wrote the Quran for Us is a Messenger of God?
Yes or No answer please, so we can move on.No. I ACKNOWLEDGE that Mohammed is a messenger of GOD, but I don't testify about other than Allah. GOD is enough of a witness for the messengership of the prophets.
Peace,
Ahmad
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Belh
salam
We cannot be a witness to the fact that Mohammad was/is a messenger, because we were not present, and hence we did not witness while he was being crowned/authorised as a prohphet/messenger in/by devine hierchey, and if we do so, we are jumping the gun and telling a lie.
peace
siki -
is that a condition that one must testify, well i am a muslim and i dont testify,
I'm talking about the new comers and not you, as the thread is focusing on. The Thread is about a New Moslem.
I believe He should testify that the writer of the Quran is a prophet of God; otherwise, why would he accept the Quran.Belh
salam
We cannot be a witness to the fact that Mohammad was/is a messenger, because we were not present, and hence we did not witness while he was being crowned/authorised as a prohphet/messenger in/by devine hierchey, and if we do so, we are jumping the gun and telling a lie.
Peace
So in your words we can not testify that there is Haven or Hellfire nor their is Judgment Day. We can Testify about the unseen if God showed us the truth about it. We can Testify that the Prophet Mohamed is God Messenger because God Said so in the Quran.Peace BelH,
No. I ACKNOWLEDGE that Mohammed is a messenger of GOD, but I don't testify about other than Allah. GOD is enough of a witness for the messengership of the prophets.
Peace,
Ahmad
If God is a Witness then why should not you be a witness as well.
And what about saying I submitt to the Lord of the world " " according to the stories of Ibrahim and the queen of chiba?
Sure, I say that all the time and I never included Mohamed with it; The shahada we are talking about is for the New Moslems when accepting Islam.
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salam rashidala.
I think, a Shahada which just had "There is no God but God" in arabic would be quite sufficient..
there are many who claim to believe in god, and few who witness they believe in god and the messenger muhammad.
because the message, conveyed by muhammad to mankind, completes the faith, to exclude the name of him as a messenger, introduces ambiguity.
to say, there is no god but god and moses is his messenger, or, there is no god but god and jesus is his messenger, or to say, there is no god but god, introduces ambiguity.
the ambiguity introduced is, the witness does not acknowledge he has received the complete faith.allah is the truth.
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According to the previous verses my understanding is that we should testify sincerly that Mohamed is the messneger of God.
Perhaps you did not read my posting on this threat.. I will not repost it, but I think if you read it you would not insist on adding Muhammad's name into Shahadah. Furthermore, "Muhammad IS NOT a messenger of God" but "Muhammad WAS a Messenger of God" If you have not heard it yet, here is the news Muhammad died about 14 centuries ago.
Peace,
Edip -
Peace BelH,
No. I ACKNOWLEDGE that Mohammed is a messenger of GOD, but I don't testify about other than Allah. GOD is enough of a witness for the messengership of the prophets.
Peace,
Ahmad
Well said Ahmad... But, the main issue is this Why they insist adding Muhammad's name when they testify for the ONENESS of God? The answer is clear Satan wants to make that statement merely half lip-service.
Peace,
Edip -
Shalom , Peace , Asalaam Alaikoum All
nineteen is a proof of everything in the Quran the pillars is coded ( Shahadaa , salat , Sawm , zakat , hadj ) you need only to check the Miracle of the Quran ( nineteen )the thing which you haven't understand that God is capable to do miracles , but unfortunatly I see that some people hasn't beliefs in their hearts , they like to sing only by the God's word.
Shalom , Peace , Asalaam Alaikoum
Abdallah Mecherbet -
Sure, I say that all the time and I never included Mohamed with it; The shahada we are talking about is for the New Moslems when accepting Islam.
Peace BelH
This is what i am talking about also ). When God ordered ibrahim to submit (accept islam) Ibrahim said I submit to god, he didnt say La illah illa allh, and the same happened with the queen of chiba when she accepted islam, these are two examples mentioned in the quraan of what the new moslem should say when accepting islam.
peace
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salam rashidala.
there are many who claim to believe in god, and few who witness they believe in god and the messenger muhammad.
because the message, conveyed by muhammad to mankind, completes the faith, to exclude the name of him as a messenger, introduces ambiguity.
to say, there is no god but god and moses is his messenger, or, there is no god but god and jesus is his messenger, or to say, there is no god but god, introduces ambiguity.
the ambiguity introduced is, the witness does not acknowledge he has received the complete faith.allah is the truth.
im sorry say that again............... i did not get what you meant, if one does not say mohamad or other then one ha not accepted the full faith..............and where did you get this idea from .......do we all know mohamad was a messenger yes,do we all beleive in god as one yes, do we all believe in the quran yes, then whats the problem mohamad is dead he is no more but the messege lives on lets concentrate on that instead of someone who has been dead for many years almost 1400 to be exact. for all who beleive that shahda for mohamad is neseccary then you have not understood the concept of god.
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Do Saten Testify for the ONENESS of God...as well?
of course he does, it is not god he is agaisnt but humans, that is why his arrogance brought him down, the fact that he would bow down to a human, but before that he worshipped god as the rest.....
arrogance, pride, ego, these are the work of a devil ,
he has said to god that he will do his upmost to bring people to hell, but said only those who follow you (allah) that i cannot come near. he has such a hatered for us humans that he will do all he can to send us to hell, i say good luck to him. what a loser he is, i feel sorry for him, his arrogance blinded him -
of course he does, it is not god he is agaisnt but humans, that is why his arrogance brought him down, the fact that he would bow down to a human, but before that he worshipped god as the rest.....
arrogance, pride, ego, these are the work of a devil ,
he has said to god that he will do his upmost to bring people to hell, but said only those who follow you (allah) that i cannot come near. he has such a hatered for us humans that he will do all he can to send us to hell, i say good luck to him. what a loser he is, i feel sorry for him, his arrogance blinded himHe is not loser here but in hereafter he succede geting mor folowers then....