Wife Beating is a Therapy
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Why should a woman enter into marriage only to be beaten up since she is for rent? Why not take the easy way out of all the hassle and obligations to obey?
Btw., since you are answering my posts, maybe it would be helpful if you could take a look at my reply N0 31.She doesn't have to marry if she refuses to. And why da heck will she undergo 'nushuz' and insist on it. Regarding reply 31, the man in your example didn't take the steps before he spanked her.(reminds me of the viscious guy in my avatar)
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She doesn't have to marry if she refuses to. And why da heck will she undergo 'nushuz' and insist on it.
Undergo Nushuz who, the husband or the wife?
Regarding reply 31, the man in your example didn't take the steps before he spanked her.(reminds me of the viscious guy in my avatar) D
Nor did the husband in your reply no 28 P, which goes to show that husbands don?t really understand the relevance of 'nushuz' ie fear of temper crossing its limit and important instructions to curb it.
peace -
Undergo Nushuz who, the husband or the wife?Nor did the husband in your reply no 28 , which goes to show that husbands dont really understand the relevance of 'nushuz' ie fear of temper crossing its limit and important instructions to curb it.
peaceBoth should respect the marriage. I still cant get this nushuz business. What will a human do in a marriage to be called 'nashez' ? how can you know that nushuz is coming to fear it and act?
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Both should respect the marriage. I still cant get this nushuz business. What will a human do in a marriage to be called 'nashez' ? how can you know that nushuz is coming to fear it and act?
Yes! Both should recognise their respective roles and respect each other as equal partners but different in character.
Once we understand exact relevance of nashez' only then we would understand this passage of the Qur?an properly..
peace -
Peace,
Beating wife is force; but then using force is not Islam! And this shall be the essential practice of a muslim in the path of Islam. Therefore meaning to the ayat concerned must be constructive to Islam and Quran. Stop beating Islam; stop beating Quran!
Regards,
.
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Peace,
Beating wife is force; but then using force is not Islam! And this shall be the essential practice of a muslim in the path of Islam. Therefore meaning to the ayat concerned must be constructive to Islam and Quran. Stop beating Islam; stop beating Quran!
Regards,
Salaam,
Yes using force is not in line with the character of one who is supposed to be QWAMOON/protector/assurer. They can very well perform this role when they have non-challenging, believing women, but as for those who are provoked in their manhood, to the extent that they are unable to maintain their task as the protector, and fear that they may not be able to obey to God in their duty as qwamoon are reminded about this 'nushuz' and to follow certain procedures that prevent them from using force. This is how I see it; otherwise to give a go-ahead to beat a woman, perhaps the mother of your child, is not in line with other passages where man and woman are given equal rights and respect.
Men are told that the wives are as their tilths and many people take this to mean that they are simply for the menial task of passing on man?s seed. This, IMO, is a wrong understanding, as the tilth, the tilled land, is a farmer?s most precious possession that he protects and nurtures , averting any harm to it, as from his tilth grows his livelihood. Similarly, as expected of a qwamoon over nisa, a man should strive to live in love and tranquillity with his most treasured companion, his wife and vice versa.
peace -
Salaam,
Men are told that the wives are as their tilths and many people take this to mean that they are simply for the menial task of passing on man?s seed. This, IMO, is a wrong understanding, as the tilth, the tilled land, is a farmer?s most precious possession that he protects and nurtures , averting any harm to it, as from his tilth grows his livelihood. Similarly, as expected of a qwamoon over nisa, a man should strive to live in love and tranquillity with his most treasured companion, his wife and vice versa.
peacefarida,
Any God Blessed true mumin will have the same meaning to the ayat; and one more important thing to be explored in the ayat is that they must go to them in just manner that Allah had admonished. None cares to know what this admonition is. Since with monthly periods Allah purifies a woman, it is mandatory upon the husband to complete certain norms before he nears his purified wife like he is newly wedded. So it is incumbent upon a person to give the dowry before he touches her as had given her for the first time when he got married to her.
Peace,
.
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Peace,
OK, the verse says to beat not to abandon or leave, if so it should have said "idribu anfusakum 3anhon"(strike yourselves away from them). Read your Quran boys.
Peace.
Salaam Rami,
Violence against the weaker party is a problem in all societies, regardless of religion, education or social background. Many men, consumed with anger regularly abuse their physical advantage over nisa and brutally injure and even kill women. It is a kind of addiction, not a loss of love or a desire to divorce, but just sheer violence. This situation calls for detailed studies and therapy for the parties involved.
My understanding is the two, time-consuming hurdles should be given more attention than the beating part, as this would require more than a day to arrive at the third stage. In the meantime both parties are given the chance to reflect on the situation, lessening chance of addiction to control and of course anger would cool down. During this period there is no way that nushuz could be continued, as there is a break in the build up of aggression.
If the pattern is again repeated the process only needs to start from the beginning and the beating (third) stage would never arrive, as each action would need new set of process to start from stage one. Like Alf-Leila (thousand and one nights) how Sherezade managed to avert her killing hmmpeace
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OK, the verse says to beat not to abandon or leave, if so it should have said "idribu anfusakum 3anhon"(strike yourselves away from them). Read your Quran boys.
No Quran would and does say exactly waohjuroohunna to mean ?and abandon them?
To understand waidriboohunna ?and ignore/show them? it is necessary to understand idriboohu
273
Not about beating people with a dead cow?s hoof or tail.
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Really?
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=13171.75
Yes Sir.
No Quran would and does say exactly waohjuroohunna to mean and abandon them
To understand waidriboohunna and ignore/show them it is necessary to understand idriboohu
273
Not about beating people with a dead cows hoof or tail.
273 talks about hitting the corpse with parts of the cow.
Peace.
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OK. So what is the true meaning of 273??
273
Faqulna idriboohu bibaAAdiha kathalika yuhyee Allahu almawta wayureekum ayatihi laAAallakum taAAqiloonaSo We said "give/show/hit with some/part of it." Like that God revives/makes alive the dead and He shows you His signs/verses/examples, maybe you understand/comprehend.
Not about or like the absurd Jewish ritual to sprinkle burnt reddish cow ash-water on those who touched a corpse in order to purify them. To give/show or ?hit you? with another example
4358
Waqaloo aalihatuna khayrun am huwa ma daraboohu laka illa jadalan bal hum qawmun khasimoonaAnd they said "Are our gods better or He?" They did not give it (the question/objection) to you except arguing, but they are a nation disputing.
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Shall We then turn away the Message from you and repel (you), for that ye are a people transgressing beyond bounds?
(5)
(Taken from Wakas link)
The object here is the "dhikr " . Rephrasing "afa nadhribul thikra 3ankum " Shlall we turn away the dhikr from you. The preposition is not for the thikr (which is turned away) but for "you ". Clearly dharaba here means turn away nadhribul thikra turn the dhikr away; 3ankum from you
( I did not respond to the original message then because at the time I was in Sudan without internet connection)
Thanks Wakas for bringing up this link. -
OK. So what is the true meaning of 273??
2 72 Remember you slew a man and fell into a dispute as to the crime But Allah was to expose what you did hide.
2 73 So We said "Strike him with a portion of it." Thus Allah brings the dead alive and shows you His Signs so that you may understand
In the present world we see people slaying each other and then they dispute and deny the crime. But when the appointed time arrives for the killer he shall be exposed.
Now the order and justice from Allah is that it is blood for blood; and there is life for you in avenging justly; but if you forgive, then it is pardon for your own sins. Thus from taking revenge justly as Allah had ordained, to forgiving the crime, there is a range of punishment that could be exercised on the guilty ; 2 73 So We said "Strike him with a portion of the crime he had done." Thus Allah saves the lives of the people from the deadly community and shows you His Signs so that you may understand!
Salam.
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peace all,
Background reading from www.quranx.com
Asad 273 We said "Apply this to some of those in this way God saves lives from death and shows you His will, so that you might use your reason.
Muhammad Asad - End Note 57 (273)
The phrase idribuhu bi-ba'diha can be literally translated as "strike him with something of her " -and this possibility has given rise to the fanciful assertion by many commentators that the children of Israel were commanded to strike the corpse of the murdered man with some of the flesh of the sacrificed cow, whereupon he was miraculously restored to life and pointed out his murderer! Neither the Qur'an, nor any saying of the Prophet, nor even the Bible offers the slightest warrant for this highly imaginative explanation, which must, therefore, be rejected-quite apart from the fact that the pronoun hu in idribuhu has a masculine gender, while the noun nafs (here translated as "human being" is feminine in gender from which it follows that the imperative idribuhu cannot possibly refer to nafs. On the other hand, the verb daraba (lit., "he struck" is very often used in a figurative or metonymic sense, as, for instance, in the expression daraba fi 'l-ard ("he journeyed on earth", or daraba 'sh-shay' bi'sh-shay' ("he mixed one thing with another thing", or daraba mathal ("he coined a similitude" or "propounded a parable" or "gave an illustration", orala darb wahid ("similarly applied" or "in the same manner", or duribatalayhim adh-dhillah ("humiliation was imposed on them" or "applied to them", and so forth. Taking all this into account, I am of the opinion that the imperative idribuhu occurring in the above Qur'anic passage must be translated as "apply it" or "this" (referring, in this context, to the principle of communal responsibility). As for the feminine pronoun ha in ba'diha ("some of it", it must necessarily relate to the nearest preceding feminine noun-that is, to the nafs that has been murdered, or the act of murder itself about which (fiha) the community disagreed. Thus, the phrase idribuhu bi-ba'diha may be suitably rendered as "apply this to some of those " for it is obvious that the principle of communal responsibility for murder by a person or persons unknown can be applied only to some and not to all such cases.Muhammad Asad - End Note 58 (273)
Lit., "God gives life to the dead and shows you His messages" (i.e., He shows His will by means of such messages or ordinances). The figurative expression "He gives life to the dead" denotes the saving of lives, and is analogous to that in 532 . In this context it refers to the prevention of bloodshed and the killing of innocent persons (Manar I, 351), be it through individual acts of revenge, or in result of an erroneous judicial process based on no more than vague suspicion and possibly misleading circumstantial evidence.QXP 273 We said, Apply the law to such cases of unsolved murder. This is how God gives life to the dead. And He expounds His messages for you to use your common sense.
Shabbir Ahmed - End Note 56 (273)
There is life for you in the law of Just Recompense. A law that deters murder and, thus, saves lives, in fact, gives you life 2179. The Mosaic law, according to the Bible, ordains the sacrifice of a cow in cases of unsolved murder. The elders of the town wash their hands and say Our hands have not shed this blood, nor have our eyes seen it. The community is then absolved of the collective responsibility (Deuteronomy 211-9). In this particular instance the mystery was solved and the murderer was identified
