Gelatin & Additives
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What do you want to do with the bones?
We make soup with bones... We do that for beef... Its used in many cuisines worldwide... to make stews and so on... You asked the wrong question... But I will answer it very simply.. I want to CONSUME it.. does not matter in which dish or how its prepared... Tell me if its ok or not... You can consider the brains as well, as its fat and not flesh.
Also, if you answer yes, then tell me whats in the flesh that are not in the bones?
Thank you
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We make soup with bones... We do that for beef... Its used in many cuisines worldwide... to make stews and so on... You asked the wrong question... But I will answer it very simply.. I want to CONSUME it.. does not matter in which dish or how its prepared... Tell me if its ok or not... You can consider the brains as well, as its fat and not flesh.
Also, if you answer yes, then tell me whats in the flesh that are not in the bones?
Thank you
Well I can definitely tell you that the brain is forbidden. As for the consumption of the bone in a soup... I think it is forbidden as there were/still might be parts of meat on the bone. I wouldnt recommend it.
Definite answers
- The meat is prohibited
- The fat is lawful
- The brain is unlawful. It is also part of the meat.
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Well I can definitely tell you that the brain is forbidden. As for the consumption of the bone in a soup... I think it is forbidden as there were/still might be parts of meat on the bone. I wouldnt recommend it.
Definite answers
- The meat is prohibited
- The fat is lawful
- The brain is unlawful. It is also part of the meat.
You did not recommend the THE BONES because of the fact that there might be fleshy remnants into it... Now I can tell you I will clean it white with whatever tool/process before cooking it... you will need to do another mental twist to answer that.
However, you DID recommend the fat and you disregarded the POSSIBLE pollution of the fat with the fleshy stuff... more into the atomic/cellular level. Take heed.. You are recommending someone to consume some stuff which can be unlawful... So, put all these clearly why you are saying such... Because we should take good care of the tongues when it comes to halaal and haraam...
So...
- The meat is prohibited /AGREE
- The fat is lawful/DISAGREE, i consider it to be part of flesh as fat is present in flesh
- The brain is unlawful. It is also part of the meat./AGREE... HOWEVER!
How you consider the brain to be flesh and the fat to be non flesh? Did you ever eat brains? I assure you, fried brain and fried fat is almost the same. Same texture, slighly different taste...
When we say, we are allowed to consume beef, we just say beef is allowed... we don't say beef tongue is allowed, intestines are allowed, bones are allowed and so on... Just plain... beef is allowed... Now don't ask me if we are allowed to eat the wastes inside the beef because this is plain common sense...
So with same logic, when God says PORK flesh is haraam, it means other than pork flesh, any other flesh is halaal except those explicitly mentioned as haraam.... So ok, pork flesh is haraam... I dont eat it... Beef flesh is halaal, so I eat it... then what happens for the beef bones, flesh, fat etc... Halaal or haraam? Because the verse speaks about flesh.. You got the point?
To end ... You contradicted yourself on this brother. -
You did not recommend the THE BONES because of the fact that there might be fleshy remnants into it... Now I can tell you I will clean it white with whatever tool/process before cooking it... you will need to do another mental twist to answer that.
However, you DID recommend the fat and you disregarded the POSSIBLE pollution of the fat with the fleshy stuff... more into the atomic/cellular level. Take heed.. You are recommending someone to consume some stuff which can be unlawful... So, put all these clearly why you are saying such... Because we should take good care of the tongues when it comes to halaal and haraam...
So...
- The meat is prohibited /AGREE
- The fat is lawful/DISAGREE, i consider it to be part of flesh as fat is present in flesh
- The brain is unlawful. It is also part of the meat./AGREE... HOWEVER!
How you consider the brain to be flesh and the fat to be non flesh? Did you ever eat brains? I assure you, fried brain and fried fat is almost the same. Same texture, slighly different taste...
To end ... You contradicted yourself on this brother.
The fat is 100% lawful. Are you suggesting that God does not know what to order when he says THE MEAT. Where is THE FAT prohibited? NOWHERE!
No contradiction WHATSOEVER. BTW the trichine bacteria/virus stuff is IN THE MEAT NOT THE FAT.
http//www.quran-islam.org/159.html
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What do you want to do with the bones?
Peace
Gelatin can be made from the bones too according to Dr.Wiki...
http//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gelatini reside in Hong Kong and almost all products / hotels / restaurants / shops use PORK as main ingredients for all kinds of food products... it is quite difficult to differentiate.... anyways thats another topic...
Ooh Hong Kong!
God bless
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The fat is 100% lawful. Are you suggesting that God does not know what to order when he says THE MEAT. Where is THE FAT prohibited? NOWHERE!
No contradiction WHATSOEVER. BTW the trichine bacteria/virus stuff is IN THE MEAT NOT THE FAT.
http//www.quran-islam.org/159.html
Same for the bones and other stuff i mentioned above... Its nowhere stated they are unlawful... Another point you did not answer regarding the brains! Brain is not flesh... Its fatty and jello...
You did contradict yourself because you said FAT 100% ok and BRAIN to be haraam! BTW... are you sure flesh meat is forbidden just because the trichine bacteria? Can there be other factors as well?? Of course yes.. But the full reasons rest with Allah and is undisclosed...
Was about to say it but nsws1988 said it... Gelatin is mainly made from bones.
So, if you are convince (since u say 100%) that ONLY flesh of pig is haraam, then i guess you should find no problem eating the UN-MENTIONED stuff in pigs.
Also, pay attention to the replies well before you answer back... I will never suggest that God does not know what he does...
The fact that God did not made us to be robots, and gave us a wonderful mind and made us into intelligent beings... He is always wanting us to use this great gift... And what you are doing is, sticking to the text and leaving the intellect behind.
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Same for the bones and other stuff i mentioned above... Its nowhere stated they are unlawful... Another point you did not answer regarding the brains! Brain is not flesh... Its fatty and jello...
You did contradict yourself because you said FAT 100% ok and BRAIN to be haraam! BTW... are you sure flesh meat is forbidden just because the trichine bacteria? Can there be other factors as well?? Of course yes.. But the full reasons rest with Allah and is undisclosed...
Was about to say it but nsws1988 said it... Gelatin is mainly made from bones.
So, if you are convince (since u say 100%) that ONLY flesh of pig is haraam, then i guess you should find no problem eating the UN-MENTIONED stuff in pigs.
Also, pay attention to the replies well before you answer back... I will never suggest that God does not know what he does...
The fact that God did not made us to be robots, and gave us a wonderful mind and made us into intelligent beings... He is always wanting us to use this great gift... And what you are doing is, sticking to the text and leaving the intellect behind.
What's up with you?
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I am not leaving the intellect behind.
Go see what Christians do - they eat pork. Now use your "intellect" and you will see that they are fine and healthy and then you would say "I guess pork is healthy and not toxic, so i'll eat it". Well, you see, you have to look at the text. -
I am not obliged to answer your questions. I gave you some of my opinions. Whether you accept them or not is your choice. But don't tell me that I HAVE to answer your question or that what I said is wrong, etc.
Eat what you want. Look at the Quran. If you dont believe me, then thats not my problem. Go ahead and eat the brain, etc. but dont say that I didnt warn you!
Peace
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IS BLOOD OF THE PIGS HARAAM?
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IS BLOOD OF THE PIGS HARAAM?
Of course. Remember, blood in general is haram.
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Of course. Remember, blood in general is haram.
Even cooked Blood?
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Peace,
I partially agree with Progressive on this one... The meat (flesh) of pigs is the only thing specifically forbidden in the scripture, and we shouldn't declare anything "haraam" unless G-d specifically forbade it. Therefore, if someone wants to eat the fat, the bones, or even the brains of a pig, it's that person's choice; it's not unlawful to do so. The only thing forbidden is the flesh...
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Peace,
I partially agree with Progressive on this one... The meat (flesh) of pigs is the only thing specifically forbidden in the scripture, and we shouldn't declare anything "haraam" unless G-d specifically forbade it. Therefore, if someone wants to eat the fat, the bones, or even the brains of a pig, it's that person's choice; it's not unlawful to do so. The only thing forbidden is the flesh...
Well the blood too are forbidden...
Maria
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Of course. Remember, blood in general is haram.
Even cooked Blood?If there is blood in the meat, that is fine. But not pure, running blood. When I say that the blood is forbidden, I mean running blodd which you can put in a glass jar and cook.
Peace
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What's up with you?
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I am not leaving the intellect behind.
Go see what Christians do - they eat pork. Now use your "intellect" and you will see that they are fine and healthy and then you would say "I guess pork is healthy and not toxic, so i'll eat it". Well, you see, you have to look at the text. -
I am not obliged to answer your questions. I gave you some of my opinions. Whether you accept them or not is your choice. But don't tell me that I HAVE to answer your question or that what I said is wrong, etc.
Eat what you want. Look at the Quran. If you dont believe me, then thats not my problem. Go ahead and eat the brain, etc. but dont say that I didnt warn you!
Peace
Peace...
Now you made me very angry! LOL ;D
- I don't need to go and see the christians if they are fine or not... Evil is of 2 kinds, the apparent and clear one which everyone can see and the second is hidden... So maybe they seem healthy but they are not. Also, we just had the swine flu outbreak, so time to re-think some stuff.
2.You are never obliged to answer and I never implied it that way. You are a participant as well as me.
You do not get my point at all.. I am not all guns at you. A question is being asked and we are discussing on it, thats all...
ANYWAYS...
I got some clarification for you and everyone else, feel free to answer and discuss on it.
I think that LAHM (meat) as used in the Quran is not restricted to only the Flesh of the animal but it covers all the EATABLE stuff from the animal... That include bones, marrow, brain, tongue, fat etc....
Look at these verses.
And We shall bestow on them fruit and meat in abundance - whatever they may desire.5222
and with the flesh of any fowl that they may desire.5621
And He it is who has made the sea subservient , so that you might eat fresh meat from it, and take from it gems which you may wear. And on that one sees ships ploughing through the waves, so that you might go forth in quest of some of His bounty, and thus have cause to be grateful .1614
In all these verses the word LAHM is used.
Let me talk on the first 2 verses, 5222 and 5621
The verses say that the any LAHM the people pf Paradise will desire, they will get it. The question is, do we only eat pure flesh, or we eat flesh with some bones and so on. Infact, lots of people even dislike and hate to eat pure flesh and prefer to eat 'entre-cote', ribs surrounded with meat... Some people like to eat the legs, especially the marrow inside the bones, some people like the brain and so on... So, if such people get into Paradise, will they get just pure flesh when they desire to eat some fat or bones along?
The second verse talks about the flesh of birds... can flesh of birds not contain bones? Even the skin is left with the flesh most of the time as it is so thin. Can you eat the chicken flesh only without the fat? impossible...
Now you can say that the stuff we will eat in Paradise will be different from the one we have here and we eat... However, there is a verse in Surah Baqarah which says that the food from Paradise will be similar to the ones we have and eat here. Look 225
Now the third verse talks about fishes from the sea.. LAHM TWARIYAN means fresh meat. Fresh meat here means the whole fish, with bones, fats and everything. Its not 100% meat... even tough, the word LAHM is used to refer to fish.
To end up.
I will say that LAHM does not means only the flesh from the animal but all the other eatable parts.
May Allah guide us
Peace
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Peace...
Now you made me very angry! LOL ;D
- I don't need to go and see the christians if they are fine or not... Evil is of 2 kinds, the apparent and clear one which everyone can see and the second is hidden... So maybe they seem healthy but they are not. Also, we just had the swine flu outbreak, so time to re-think some stuff.
2.You are never obliged to answer and I never implied it that way. You are a participant as well as me.
You do not get my point at all.. I am not all guns at you. A question is being asked and we are discussing on it, thats all...
ANYWAYS...
I got some clarification for you and everyone else, feel free to answer and discuss on it.
I think that LAHM (meat) as used in the Quran is not restricted to only the Flesh of the animal but it covers all the EATABLE stuff from the animal... That include bones, marrow, brain, tongue, fat etc....
Look at these verses.
In all these verses the word LAHM is used.Let me talk on the first 2 verses, 5222 and 5621
The verses say that the any LAHM the people pf Paradise will desire, they will get it. The question is, do we only eat pure flesh, or we eat flesh with some bones and so on. Infact, lots of people even dislike and hate to eat pure flesh and prefer to eat 'entre-cote', ribs surrounded with meat... Some people like to eat the legs, especially the marrow inside the bones, some people like the brain and so on... So, if such people get into Paradise, will they get just pure flesh when they desire to eat some fat or bones along?
The second verse talks about the flesh of birds... can flesh of birds not contain bones? Even the skin is left with the flesh most of the time as it is so thin. Can you eat the chicken flesh only without the fat? impossible...
Now you can say that the stuff we will eat in Paradise will be different from the one we have here and we eat... However, there is a verse in Surah Baqarah which says that the food from Paradise will be similar to the ones we have and eat here. Look 225
Now the third verse talks about fishes from the sea.. LAHM TWARIYAN means fresh meat. Fresh meat here means the whole fish, with bones, fats and everything. Its not 100% meat... even tough, the word LAHM is used to refer to fish.
To end up.
I will say that LAHM does not means only the flesh from the animal but all the other eatable parts.
May Allah guide us
Peace
Peace
Lam-Ha-Miim = flesh/meat, to feed with flesh, skin/hide/cloth
Now we have to look at two very important verses in the Quran...
first of all this one
6145 Qul la ajidu feema oohiyailayya muharraman AAala taAAimin yatAAamuhuilla an yakoona maytatan aw daman masfoohan aw lahmakhinzeerin fa-innahu rijsun aw fisqan ohilla lighayri Allahibihi famani idturra ghayra baghin wala AAadinfa-inna rabbaka ghafoorun raheemun
6145 Say, "I do not find in what is inspired to me forbidden for an eater except that it be already dead, or blood poured forth, or the meat of pig, for it is foul; or what is corruptly dedicated to other than God." Whoever is forced without seeking disobedience or transgression, then your Lord is Forgiving, Compassionate.
The second crucial verse is the following
6146 For those who are Jewish, We forbade all that have claws; and from the cattle and the sheep We forbade their fat except what is attached to the back, or entrails, or mixed with bone. That is a punishment for their rebellion, and We are truthful.
Do you see how exact these prohibitions are?
So we can conclude the following- The meat of pigs is forbidden (YES, this includes their brains)
- The fat of pigs is lawful
- As for bones, there might still be parts of the meat of the pigs on/inside them, so I'd stay away from those.
What do you guys think about gelatine?
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Salaam
The fat is expressly mentioned and outlined very well in this verse, there is no disagreement on that. The question is, why has God outlined the FAT from the rest? Just because it forms part of the LAHM. And the verse project the same image when it says except those mixed with the back, bones etc... meaning the fat forms part of all these.
However... I was talking about the use of the word LAHM. Did you consider the verses I posted above... Do you think they mean only pure flesh? That is the question.. What is the true and most logical meaning the word LAHM is conveying as per the Quran.
The verse says we get LAHM TWARIYAN from the sea and rivers... do fisherman only catch pure flesh in their hooks when they fish? Does it make sense? Look at the word used in that verse, fish is known as samakah or hoot... However, the work LAHM is used and not samakah. It is no secret that we get fat also from fishes as well as oil. Try to understand what I am trying to say.
May Allah guide us.
Wasalaam
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Salaam,
Got some new blinks in my mind.
From the very verse you posted, the very verse you posted, the 6146... it make us know that even the entrails and bones are eatable... And if the fat was stuck with them, then there is no harm in eating them.
The point I want to make is, there is no verse from the Quran which tells us that from the cattle we get meat + bones + entrails + fat to eat... All verses say that we get LAHM from the cattle...
And the 6146 is being very specific to filter the fat from the LAHM as it forms part of it.
Forgot to reply on the gelatin, gelatin is obtained mostly from the bones... But my opinion is, nothing can be consume from the pig as per my understanding.
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Forgot to reply on the gelatin, gelatin is obtained mostly from the bones... But my opinion is, nothing can be consume from the pig as per my understanding.
You then misunderstood/did not understand the verses from the Quran. The fat is NOT "lahm". It is 100% lawful. Please remember 6146 and how SPECIFIC the prohibitions were for the Jews.
Furthermore, in 6146 "lahm"/meat IS NOT MENTIONED.
6146 WaAAala allatheena hadooharramna kulla thee thufurinwamina albaqari waalghanami harramnaAAalayhim shuhoomahuma illa ma hamalatthuhooruhuma awi alhawayaaw ma ikhtalata biAAathmin thalikajazaynahum bibaghyihim wa-inna lasadiqoona
6146 For those who are Jewish, We forbade all that have claws; and from the cattle and the sheep We forbade their fat except what is attached to the back, or entrails, or mixed with bone. That is a punishment for their rebellion, and We are truthful.
This proves that the fat is lawful. I have NO DOUBT WHATSOEVER regarding that issue. Absolutely no doubt. As for gelatine...I am not sure. It is not "lahm" so technically it shouldnt be forbidden.
However, the brain is absolutely forbidden. It is part of the "lahm". I have no doubt regarding that issue.Peace
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You then misunderstood/did not understand the verses from the Quran. The fat is NOT "lahm". It is 100% lawful. Please remember 6146 and how SPECIFIC the prohibitions were for the Jews.
Furthermore, in 6146 "lahm"/meat IS NOT MENTIONED.
6146 WaAAala allatheena hadooharramna kulla thee thufurinwamina albaqari waalghanami harramnaAAalayhim shuhoomahuma illa ma hamalatthuhooruhuma awi alhawayaaw ma ikhtalata biAAathmin thalikajazaynahum bibaghyihim wa-inna lasadiqoona
6146 For those who are Jewish, We forbade all that have claws; and from the cattle and the sheep We forbade their fat except what is attached to the back, or entrails, or mixed with bone. That is a punishment for their rebellion, and We are truthful.
This proves that the fat is lawful. I have NO DOUBT WHATSOEVER regarding that issue. Absolutely no doubt. As for gelatine...I am not sure. It is not "lahm" so technically it shouldnt be forbidden.
However, the brain is absolutely forbidden. It is part of the "lahm". I have no doubt regarding that issue.Peace
Peace
Here God says "We forbade all that have claws", not the MEAT of those with claws. Meaning the whole of the animal is prohibited.
But when God tells us to not eat the flesh of the pig, He is being specific to the flesh. The same when He is prohibiting the fat of cattle and sheep to the Jews. Also, when prohibiting the fat, God further specifies what fat is OK.
That is what I understand at the moment so please let me know if there is anything wrong of my understanding.Regarding the reason why the flesh of pigs is prohibited yet those who eat the flesh do not get ill from it, can it be a test?
Then we revealed to you this scripture, truthfully, confirming previous scriptures, and superseding them. You shall rule among them in accordance with GOD's revelations, and do not follow their wishes if they differ from the truth that came to you. For each of you, we have decreed laws and different rites. Had GOD willed, He could have made you one congregation. But He thus puts you to the test through the revelations He has given each of you. You shall compete in righteousness. To GOD is your final destiny - all of you - then He will inform you of everything you had disputed
We eat the meat of animals of claws and the fat of cattle and sheep and we don't get ill. So for the present Jews, even though the food prohibited to them doesn't cause illness, they cannot consume it as it is a test.
Can the prohibition of the flesh of the pig also be a test for all those who were prohibited from eating its flesh?
God bless
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Peace
Here God says "We forbade all that have claws", not the MEAT of those with claws. Meaning the whole of the animal is prohibited.
But when God tells us to not eat the flesh of the pig, He is being specific to the flesh. The same when He is prohibiting the fat of cattle and sheep to the Jews. Also, when prohibiting the fat, God further specifies what fat is OK.
That is what I understand at the moment so please let me know if there is anything wrong of my understanding.Regarding the reason why the flesh of pigs is prohibited yet those who eat the flesh do not get ill from it, can it be a test?
Then we revealed to you this scripture, truthfully, confirming previous scriptures, and superseding them. You shall rule among them in accordance with GOD's revelations, and do not follow their wishes if they differ from the truth that came to you. For each of you, we have decreed laws and different rites. Had GOD willed, He could have made you one congregation. But He thus puts you to the test through the revelations He has given each of you. You shall compete in righteousness. To GOD is your final destiny - all of you - then He will inform you of everything you had disputed
We eat the meat of animals of claws and the fat of cattle and sheep and we don't get ill. So for the present Jews, even though the food prohibited to them doesn't cause illness, they cannot consume it as it is a test.
Can the prohibition of the flesh of the pig also be a test for all those who were prohibited from eating its flesh?
God bless
6145 Say, "I do not find in what is inspired to me forbidden for an eater except that it be already dead, or blood poured forth, or the meat of pig, for it is foul/contaminated; or what is corruptly dedicated to other than God." Whoever is forced without seeking disobedience or transgression, then your Lord is Forgiving, Compassionate.
The Jews made-up their own prohibitions just like today's Sunnis/Shias. God punished them with more prohibitions. God is inviting the Jews though back to the original prohibitions (i believe). Remember, Jesus wanted to lessen the prohibitions for the Jews - check the Quran.
Peace