JALABIB in the context of v33:59
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Peace
Herbman ! Do you want to say that" jilbaab" means a gunman acting as a guard ?
RegardsPeace,
not necessarily a gunman but someone like a "tourist guide", someone known in town, remember in those days people were armed with swords and any "offense" could result in a fight, we were in JAHILIYA. So a women alone or not known or lost far from the group could be in danger.
I am just supposing, trying to put things in the context to understand what the verse could mean. But a piece of tissue which everyone was wearing at that time will definitely not protect you against offenders knowing you are not from the town.May Allah guide us.
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Dear Herbman, how much space you suggest is needed to separate words? Dear, it was a hand written script. However, now what all we have preserved language, on one hand, in lexicons and grammar books. On the other hand, we have ready made tafaseers, based on hearsay. We have to choose between one or the other for understanding of the message. Every one who claims to understand can not explain these discrepancies between supposed understanding of words and inability to find these words in lexicons or lack of grammatical explanations. Question, are we willing to have a fresh start for the sake of our Rubb?
Badar
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Peace Bkanwar,
I know what you mean, but you know as well that a space in arabic doesnt necessarily mean a separation between 2 words.
e.g
etc etc
Separation is often only indicative of writing technique utilized in different script formats. If you look at the Gold Quran script from Johns Hopkins library of archives, recently posted by you, you will see extensive use of separating the letters. If we look at different scripts of the word in question, can the firsr root be Jiim Lam Lam, followed by another word starting with Ba? But we have to very carefully analyze the word and keep an eye on the whole context as well.
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Dear Herbman, how much space you suggest is needed to separate words? Dear, it was a hand written script. However, now what all we have preserved language, on one hand, in lexicons and grammar books. On the other hand, we have ready made tafaseers, based on hearsay. We have to choose between one or the other for understanding of the message. Every one who claims to understand can not explain these discrepancies between supposed understanding of words and inability to find these words in lexicons or lack of grammatical explanations. Question, are we willing to have a fresh start for the sake of our Rubb?
Badar
Peace Brother
Breaking words into "pieces" as a butcher cuts the animal into pieces does not give you any sense.
What will happen if I break up "bkanwar " into
-b-
-Kan
-war
-2
What will it mean ?
Regards -
Separation is often only indicative of writing technique utilized in different script formats. If you look at the Gold Quran script from Johns Hopkins library of archives, recently posted by you, you will see extensive use of separating the letters. If we look at different scripts of the word in question, can the firsr root be Jiim Lam Lam, followed by another word starting with Ba?
Peace Kn,
You have very good memoryI have a question for u and Dr Bkanwar,
The Chii support their faith refering to the Quran stating that we should follow "ahl ul bayt"
The suni support their faith refering to the Quran stating "what ever Mohamed give you, you should follow"
The submitters support their faith refering to Quran "there is 19 over it"Can you give any argument found in the Quran that support your way of "tafsir".
Thanks
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Peace Brother
Breaking words into "pieces" as a butcher cuts the animal into pieces does not give you any sense.
What will happen if I break up "bkanwar " into
-b-
-Kan
-war
-2
What will it mean ?
RegardsPeace
Herbman ! Do you want to say that" jilbaab" means a gunman acting as a guard ?
RegardsI personally will not make fun or get upset at other peoples attempt at understanding. Trust me we all are trying to be as close to the message as we possibly can. More over we cannot cut the words just for the sake of cutting it, but only if the script technique, grammar rules, lexical concept and the context in the message allows us to do so. May Allah give us all more understanding so we could be closer to his message more and more
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Brother we should not make fun or get upset at other peoples understanding. Trust me we all are trying to be as close to the message as we possibly can. More over we cannot cut the words just for the sake of cutting it, but only if the script technique, grammar rules, lexical concept and the context in the message allows us to do so. May Allah give us all more understanding so we could be closer to his message more and more
Peace
There is no question of making fun.
If one word can be "dissected " why not other words ? These home made methods are only for Quranic words ? Do you have any support/evidence for this methodology ?
Honestly ,it is the most horrible way to play with Quranic words ,I have ever seen.
Regards -
Peace
There is no question of making fun.
If one word can be "dissected " why not other words ? These home made methods are only for Quranic words ? Do you have any support/evidence for this methodology ?
Honestly ,it is the most horrible way to play with Quranic words ,I have ever seen.
RegardsDear Brother, method is presented here, again and again, is there any body willing to pay attention to it?
Badar
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Dear Bkanwar,
I agree sometimes this method is used for some words in certain cases well known in arabic BUT I don't think it has to be used on all the words.
e.g. it is not + this makes no sense.
regards
Dear Brother, method is presented here, again and again, is there any body willing to pay attention to it?
Badar
Peace
There is no question of making fun.
If one word can be "dissected " why not other words ? These home made methods are only for Quranic words ? Do you have any support/evidence for this methodology ?
Honestly ,it is the most horrible way to play with Quranic words ,I have ever seen.
RegardsWe all pray to Allah to grant us the wisdom to understand his message, the way Prophet(S) and his companions(R) understood it.
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Dear Bkanwar,
I agree sometimes this method is used for some words in certain cases well known in arabic BUT I don't think it has to be used on all the words.
e.g. it is not + this makes no sense.
regards
Peace
This method cannot be anywhere unless the word under consideration is really combination of two obvious words like " " .It is a combination of two words.
Any long word in any language has "syllables" . One cannot break up these syllables in peaces and establish their meanings and then join them together as was done with "Muttaqeen".
Quran was revealed in Arabic Language which was existing before revelation of the Quran.We should learn that language first then we will be able to comment something about the language.
It is another thing that people think that they have right to criticize the language without knowing it.
Regards
Regards -
Peace
This method cannot be anywhere unless the word under consideration is really combination of two obvious words like " " .It is a combination of two words.
Any long word in any language has "syllables" . One cannot break up these syllables in peaces and establish their meanings and then join them together as was done with "Muttaqeen".
Quran was revealed in Arabic Language which was existing before revelation of the Quran.We should learn that language first then we will be able to comment something about the language.
It is another thing that people think that they have right to criticize the language without knowing it.
Regards
RegardsDear brother let me ask you this very humbly, what is the method of learning a language, that is no more spoken anywhere.
Badar
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Dear brother let me ask you this very humbly, what is the method of learning a language, that is no more spoken anywhere.
Badar
Peace
Exactly ,the way the people learn other languages which are nowadays are not spoken anywhere.Arabic is spoken but some advanced (Modern) form as is Old English and Modern English.Classical Hebrew and Modern Hebrew.Regards
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Dear Bkanwar,
I agree sometimes this method is used for some words in certain cases well known in arabic BUT I don't think it has to be used on all the words.
e.g. it is not + this makes no sense.
regards
Dear Herbman and Q-Student, not an appropriate example. Let me take another shot again with some example. Having compound words is not unusual in languages. Two independent words forming a new word. In English two words "Black" and "Bird". The can be written together to form a new word called a Blackbird for any bird of black color. In addition by an accent on BLACKbird one could imply, the bird that sings. You could note that this compound word does carry meanings of individual words so to call "roots". Same way are "LilMutaqeena" and "Jalabibhuna"
Peace.
Badar
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Dear Herbman and Q-Student, not an appropriate example. Let me take another shot again with some example. Having compound words is not unusual in languages. Two independent words forming a new word. In English two words "Black" and "Bird". The can be written together to form a new word called a Blackbird for any bird of black color. In addition by an accent on BLACKbird one could imply, the bird that sings. You could note that this compound word does carry meanings of individual words so to call "roots". Same way are "LilMutaqeena" and "Jalabibhuna"
Peace.
Badar
Dear Brother
If one word is compound of two words ,then it is ok.But how can you decide that some word is a compound or single unless you know the language.
I give you an example.
There is an English word cupboard.Two syllables
Cup
Board
Both have different meanings individually but when they become compound they give absolutely a different meaning.
Exactly in the same way ,there are words in the classical arabic and these words are known as " " but we ourselves cannot decide .As per other languages we have to learn the language first in letter and spirit.
Regards -
Dear Bkanwar, Kn, all
Why don't you ask the FM Administrators to create a new section under General Issues, Project or wherever is the best dedicated to your method where you can centralise all your articles and posts so you have a central repository with all the informations related to your method. So will avoid repeting your point of view hundred times. Also people interested in your view know where to go straight forward and can either help/criticise/support or just read. This is just a suggestion.
Peace
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Dear Q-Student, again a wrong analogy. There is a branch of linguistics, a science of lnguage, called entomolgy, that traces the origin of words. Here is the entomolgy of word cupboard. It was meant to be what it includes. However it's meaning have changed just like Lilamutaqeena over time. This is a natural linguistic phenomenon, called sementic shift or change.
http//podictionary.com/?p=281Vitaliano Pancaldi Neck Tie
http//www.answers.com/topic/cupboard
It is this science of language, we need to use to understand the message, not the natural art of making sounds that a baby learns, in mothers lap while growing up.
Herbman thanks for suggestion. It is very good idea. I do not know who is the organizer/owner of this site? Do you?
Badar
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If one doesn't have a blog or something, you can create a thread in any appropriate section and list clearly and precisely what your views/methods etc are and link to it via your signature. Make the title clear as to what it contains as well and you can keep adding to it etc. It's relatively easy and imo, better than creating a separate section.