JALABIB in the context of v33:59
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Dear Bkanwar, Kn, all
Why don't you ask the FM Administrators to create a new section under General Issues, Project or wherever is the best dedicated to your method where you can centralise all your articles and posts so you have a central repository with all the informations related to your method. So will avoid repeting your point of view hundred times. Also people interested in your view know where to go straight forward and can either help/criticise/support or just read. This is just a suggestion.
Peace
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Dear Q-Student, again a wrong analogy. There is a branch of linguistics, a science of lnguage, called entomolgy, that traces the origin of words. Here is the entomolgy of word cupboard. It was meant to be what it includes. However it's meaning have changed just like Lilamutaqeena over time. This is a natural linguistic phenomenon, called sementic shift or change.
http//podictionary.com/?p=281Vitaliano Pancaldi Neck Tie
http//www.answers.com/topic/cupboard
It is this science of language, we need to use to understand the message, not the natural art of making sounds that a baby learns, in mothers lap while growing up.
Herbman thanks for suggestion. It is very good idea. I do not know who is the organizer/owner of this site? Do you?
Badar
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If one doesn't have a blog or something, you can create a thread in any appropriate section and list clearly and precisely what your views/methods etc are and link to it via your signature. Make the title clear as to what it contains as well and you can keep adding to it etc. It's relatively easy and imo, better than creating a separate section.
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If one doesn't have a blog or something, you can create a thread in any appropriate section and list clearly and precisely what your views/methods etc are and link to it via your signature. Make the title clear as to what it contains as well and you can keep adding to it etc. It's relatively easy and imo, better than creating a separate section.
Thanks for your suggestion. But you did not answer my question. Who are patrons for this site? Who established it?
Peace,
Badar
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Layth afaik.
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The owner of this site is called Layth Al Shaiban. That is his name. I'm sorry but I don't know how to elaborate any further, maybe I could knight him and call him Sir Layth or something? You can get in touch with him by using the PM system and messaging "Layth", or by sending him an email which you could get off the main site.
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Happy to have helped.
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Separation is often only indicative of writing technique utilized in different script formats. If you look at the Gold Quran script from Johns Hopkins library of archives, recently posted by you, you will see extensive use of separating the letters. If we look at different scripts of the word in question, can the firsr root be Jiim Lam Lam, followed by another word starting with Ba? But we have to very carefully analyze the word and keep an eye on the whole context as well.
Peace brother,
Jiim Lam Lam is not part of the word, why add tashdeed when there isn't?
And Jiim Lam alone do not exist.I am looking into ETYMON to try to explain this word.
Etymon are bi-letters that originally made the word we know.
The so called ROOT in arabic derived/are inherited from the Etymons
I will give more examples later when I will have time, I created a post called Root Theory vs Etymon Theorie.Regards
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In my reseach for the word JALABIB I found out the following
root can be JLBB then if it is the case the class for these 4 letters type root is called in arabic
These 4 letter root words are based on 3-letters roots plus the last letter doubled e.g.
becomes JALABA become JALBABA
or insering between the radicals either a
e.gformed from
reference
http//books.google.com/books?id=uFwUAAAAQAAJ&pg=PA101&lpg=PA101&dq=racine+arabe+quadrilit%C3%A8res&source=bl&ots=rtiXrIzxt2&sig=9bPX4CN2NQVnuECzk1HBuFKZR3g&hl=en&ei=QA02SrGwN9ib-gak3snQCQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=8Peace
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In a ARAB-French dictionnary nammed Kazimirski we can find JILBAB that also means "slave"
JILBAB any living good (cheap, goat camels or slave) that can be brought to the market and soldreference ARAB-French dictionnary Kazimirski
please if anyone can find such dictionnary online, please share.
So my suspicion was correct to think JILBAB can be someone and not something
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Dear Herbman, I was not questioning your intergarity of research. You had French, book as attachment in your post above. It was just a question, to find out, if you have come across his books English translation. I have not seen so it far.
Badar
Dear Badar,
previous post was intended for all, it was not a specific reply for you )
I was looking for this french dictionnary to proof my saying, which now is done.
For your question I still have to look for it, but in any case I use google as everyone.regards
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Peace,
Here is an hypothesis I will try to develop if God wills, and I hope you can help to support or reject this idea
I seek refuge in God against Satan the banished.
In 3359 we read the following
O prophet! tell thy wives and daughters, and the believing women, that they should cast their outer garments over their persons (when abroad) that is most convenient, that they should be known (as such) and not molested and Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.
Dal-Nun-Waw (Dal-Nun-Alif) = To be near, come near or low, let down, be akin to.
JALABIB root is JIM-LAM-BA
Also JALIB means the he helped, he assistedAlso PR-Online take the root Jiim-Lam-Ba-Ba = Woman's outer wrapping garment, that which envelopes the whole body, wide garment for a woman, dominion or sovereignty or rule
The whole idea of the verse is to protect the women which are the weakest to be protected from offenses from offenders.
How to protect them? They have to be known, by the offenders.
Once they are known they will be no more offended.
The question is does a piece of tissue protect you against the offenders? Knowing that everyone in these time, men and women were covering their heads and body against sun.The problem is to find the correct meaning of a word which has no other reference in Qur?an, the only occurance we can find is with the root JLB.
Jiim-Lam-Ba = To drive/bring/convey/transport, to draw/attract/procure a thing, gain or earn, seek after or seek to gain, to raise cries/shouts/noises, chide or urge on, to threaten, bring together/assemble/gather/collect, commit a crime or offence, to heal, to help/aid or assist, take or borrow, to seek or demand, to cover or clad oneself.
This occurrence can be found in 1764 and means to assemble/collect/put together
In Lane?s we find JLBB under JLB and means garnement.
SO let?s take the origine of the word to try to understand the context and meaning.
The first meaning is to drive, bring one thing from one country to another or from one town to another. That supports the idea of migrating from one town to another.
So back in the context
By 9100 to 9103 we know some believers moved to Medina, they were the first and therefore a minority in a new town.
Some people from Medina were hypocrites and were therefore offending the minority.
At that time and still now in some countries/town when you are a stranger you are an easy victim for thieves/ aggressors/ offenders etc and that is why GOD promised to the offenders to be killed if they continue in their behaviors.In conclusion
My idea here is that JALABIB does not mean a piece of tissue/ garnment to protect you from the offenders but a PERSON who can help you, defend you from offenders in a foreign town and who is well known by the citizen of that town so the immigrant are safe with him.
So the verse should look like
O prophet! tell thy wives and daughters, and the believing women, that they should come near/ be near/get closer/ in group from the jilbab (assistant/helper/guide of the town) So these who offend know you and therefore will not offend you and Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful
This is an hypothesis and I am looking forward for yours comment to support or reject this idea.
Peace
any thought on this issue?
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Salam Herbman,
Thank you for a thought-provoking analysis. I?d like to comment on a few points, if I may.
The whole idea of the verse is to protect the women which are the weakest to be protected from offenses from offenders.
How to protect them? They have to be known, by the offenders.
Once they are known they will be no more offended.
The question is does a piece of tissue protect you against the offenders? Knowing that everyone in these time, men and women were covering their heads and body against sun.I don?t think you?re asking the right question above when you said ?the question is does one piece of cloth?? The clothing (assuming jilbab is a cloth) isn?t meant to protect her directly but to give recognition and therefore not be hurt ( ن
In that capacity, a piece of clothing would be fine.
Jiim-Lam-Ba = To drive/bring/convey/transport, to draw/attract/procure a thing, gain or earn, seek after or seek to gain, to raise cries/shouts/noises, chide or urge on, to threaten, bring together/assemble/gather/collect, commit a crime or offence, to heal, to help/aid or assist, take or borrow, to seek or demand, to cover or clad oneself.
This occurrence can be found in 1764 and means to assemble/collect/put together
What if the ?ajlib? in17/64 meant ?to draw/attract?? 17/64 would then read
And beguile whomsoever of them you can with your voice, and draw attention on them your forces riding and on foot, and share with them in wealth and children, and hold out promises to them; and the Shaitan makes not promises to them but to deceiveThis would mean that jilbab in 33/59 would be any item which shows recognition that these women are protected. That would fit better with the context, as in 33/60 it says
Truly, if the Hypocrites, and those in whose hearts is a disease, and those who stir up sedition in the City, desist not, We shall certainly stir thee up against them Then will they not be able to stay in it as thy neighbours for any length of time
If the believing women already had guides or protectors, then there won?t be any need for this statement.
I really like your study into etymons though. I hope you will keep us updated on that. I feel that modern grammar and morphological rules have stifled the natural flexibility of Quran?s own Arabic and stopped it from being explained better. A good example is this JLB and JLBB thing.Thanks.