Free-Minds.org is another Sect...like Suni and Shia Sects.
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they won't believe in the book, so they'll pick and choose, and deliberately skip over 37
no book is ever evil
the people who interpret it may be. even in the books by rashad k, even though a lot is false, he did hit the nail on the head concerning rejecting bukhary as a source of guidance.Are you saying that the Hadith Books does not contain Evil? Are you saying that the Books that call to woriship the Fire or an Idol instead of God are Good?
So woe to those who write the Book with their hands then say This is from God, so that they can purchase with it a cheap price! Woe to them for what their hands have written and woe to them for what they gained.
279Here what God called these Books
Did you not see those who were given a portion of the Book, they believe in sorcery and evil, and they say to those who rejected You are better guided than those who believed the path.
451It is Satan who took the promise to mislead us; and some of his tools, is to make people write misleading religious books.
Peace -
Peace belH
oh dear...
There is no point in answering you
you will give the hadithist answer, then say you just translated ;D
i think you are brainwashed without realizing it...Peace, my interpretation is not based on Hadith...It based on word by word translation.
Question, if God revealed to us the punishments of any crime, in your understanding, what are the revealed punishments for
Killing
Stealing
Zina(sorry about the typo... ;D)
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Peace
This sounds like an admonishment against advancement to me. I say this because your post makes it seem like if one "advances" or "grows" as a person than they are wrong.
Joe
Peace,
No, this is not what I refereed to when saying this. I was referring to this promise
He said For that which You have caused me to be misled, I will stalk for them on Your straight path.
716He said My Lord, for that by which You have caused me to be misled, I will beautify for them what is on the earth, and I will mislead them all.
1539 -
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Peace belH
i do not respond to idiocy
when you start really behaving like someone who genuinely wants to learn and reform, i will respond on your terms,
for now i do as i please ;D - you do not deserve any better...It seems that I'm too aggressive for your comfort zone (Quote from Nabster from another thread)
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Peace, my interpretation is not based on Hadith...It based on word by word translation.
Question, if God revealed to us the punishments of any crime, in your understanding, what are the revealed punishments for
Killing
Stealing
Zina(sorry about the typo... ;D)
I will answer for Nabstr
Killing punishment is Death
Stealing is Cut-Off hands
Zina is 100 lashesThere is no mentioning for Jail time in the Quran as a Punishment. If this is true, then what is the punishment for Thief? what is a Good punishment for Medoff who stole 50 Billion dollars?
Is it to get him a Job as Free.minds.org doctrine calls for????? What kind of Job that would make him make 50 Billion dollars? Is this the Joke of the century?ps - Yosemite, ask BelH, what happens if he steals another 50 billion and when his remaining hand is cut off and he has no more hands left, ask him what he will do if he steals another 50 billion. Then watch the reply. Enjoy.
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What kind of Job that would make him make 50 Billion dollars? Is this the Joke of the century?
He's definately got a point here. There's no job a person can get to repay a stolen 50 billion dollars, no matter how hard or how long they work. So, perhaps working to repay the money isn't the only alternative. There has to be another just punishment for this crime too, other than just getting a job...
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Hey belh salams
Some things I wanted to say.. you said if you ask any arab born speaking what does this ? ? mean, they will say ?cut hand? and you know what you?re 100% right and guess what I come from an Arabic speaking background!
You know why? because we all know qata3 is to cut and yad is the hand. So it makes sense for someone to say ok it means ?cut their hands? though you seem to be forgetting something really really important and that?s Contexts.
But let me give you a different insight, because of your sociocultural contexts your understanding of the word is ONLY physically cut. But if you know Arabic you will know it doesn?t mean just that.
Shall I give examples in different contexts? (seeming you come from arabic speaking background i'll assume you understand what i am saying)
How about qata3 el shakk b elyaqeen ? he removed all doubt with fact.
qata3 masafet 70km ? he travelled/passed the distance 70km
qat3an can also mean sure or certainty for example if i asked are you sure they got married "qat3an" can be a response
or absolutely like be el qat3.
What about qat3t elshere3 ? I crossed the road
Actually I just thought of something qat3 isn?t chop, and you seem to indicate chopping the hand off, chop is fa ra meem. Farum.
To iqta3 their hands you don?t need to physically cut/chop them off. It?s been explained before.
Anyway furthermore you say your interpretation is not based on hadith but word by word translation. So than do you believe one word means the exact same thing in every context in the whole world, or even in the whole quran?.
Whats your undestanding of verse 37?
BTW who on earth said free-minds is flawless? Free-minds is a social network where people share their thoughts and studies. Do you think any person is infallible? No one is! Not even your judgement based on word by word translations! Free-minds is a network of people with YOU included, so I guess there?s no point in trying to prove you as flawless.
Everyone is going to have differences of opinions, even the people who claim to follow the same creed same book same sheikh/scholar/person thing.
We all make mistakes do you think you or anyone in this world would be pure from sin/mistakes? If that?s the case maybe you should start rethinking things.
Belh the laws are in the Quran right you agree to this? The way you understand it might be different to how I understand it. The question is can you justify your standing? And how do you do that, and whether I can or not. Ultimately it?s not you who I need to please, not people on forums or any of that. To God is our return so if you want to pick on differences and imperfect ideologies you will die doing so.
Justify your reasoning if you think it?s right so be it, I or anyone else can?t change that thought. But we can debate what you disagree with if you choose to have an open mind about things and not be arrogant in your opinion. And this is how we learn through investigating and sharing thoughts because after all none of us are flawless.
Salam
(p.s taking a break be back in 2 weeks)
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He's definately got a point here. There's no job a person can get to repay a stolen 50 billion dollars, no matter how hard or how long they work. So, perhaps working to repay the money isn't the only alternative. There has to be another just punishment for this crime too, other than just getting a job...
How about one Million Dollar, which is the common stolen amounts this days...Can free-minds.org provide 1000000 Jobs that can make the more than 100,000.00 thieves earn 1 million each?
If you can, let me know may be I can claim that I'm a thief so I can get this job...even Nabstar would claim he is a thief as well rotfl
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so if someone steals and repents tough luck they get their hand chopped off?
if someone steals because they need food, tough luck?
what happens to someone who steals on going they have 2 hands chopped off already, then what? what happens next, should you chop them bit by bit till they become pieces?
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But let me give you a different insight, because of your sociocultural contexts your understanding of the word is ONLY physically cut. But if you know Arabic you will know it doesn?t mean just that.
Shall I give examples in different contexts? (seeming you come from arabic speaking background i'll assume you understand what i am saying)
How about qata3 el shakk b elyaqeen ? he removed all doubt with fact.
qata3 masafet 70km ? he travelled/passed the distance 70km
qat3an can also mean sure or certainty for example if i asked are you sure they got married "qat3an" can be a response
or absolutely like be el qat3.
What about qat3t elshere3 ? I crossed the road
Peace,
Thanks for sharing your inputs in a Good Manner.
I agree with you that we can use the word Qat3 with other words and we will have different meanings; however, when the word is used with words that refers to Physical things that can be cut, then it will only mean Cut; examplesCut the Apple
Cut the Watermelon
Cut the Dress
Cut the TreeActually I just thought of something qat3 isn?t chop, and you seem to indicate chopping the hand off, chop is fa ra meem. Farum.
This is not true; here is why
Ground Beef is Lahma Mafroma
Does that mean Chopped Beef?To iqta3 their hands you don?t need to physically cut/chop them off. It?s been explained before.
If you are referring to Free.minds.org explanation, which I'm arguing in this thread, then I disagree.
Anyway furthermore you say your interpretation is not based on hadith but word by word translation. So than do you believe one word means the exact same thing in every context in the whole world, or even in the whole quran?.
No I do not; here an example of a Word
Saa'l which means the following three meanings "Liquid" --- "Someone in Need"--- "Someone asking Question"
Whats your undestanding of verse 37?
Do not follow the non-well-established in meanings verses unless you go back to the well-established ones. (It is the Verses and not The words)
BTW who on earth said free-minds is flawless? Free-minds is a social network where people share their thoughts and studies. Do you think any person is infallible? No one is! Not even your judgement based on word by word translations! Free-minds is a network of people with YOU included, so I guess there?s no point in trying to prove you as flawless.
I'm criticizing their doctrine (their definition of what is the correct Islam) that is in their welcome Page.
Peace
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so if someone steals and repents tough luck they get their hand chopped off?
if someone steals because they need food, tough luck?
what happens to someone who steals on going they have 2 hands chopped off already, then what? what happens next, should you chop them bit by bit till they become pieces?
These were answered before; but if you want me to answer, I will do that tomorrow.
Good Night