Praise Be to Muhammad rasool Allah
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I don' understand one thing only, people here love some scientists to the extreme, give too much reverence to many philosophers but when it comes to mohamed, emmmm he's just a man, he's almost a nobody, he just delivered the quran and died, over for him, he's in the grave, allah will cutt his heart if he didn't deliver .....etc , but abraham, ohhhh the father of faith, we follow the religion of abraham , ghady? emmm he said the truth.... jack nickolson? good actor, but mohamed? an idol, an object for worship etc....... , I don't understand, when allah said to his companions, you were the best people that came on earth, what does that mean? their leader is the best leader that came on the earth, do the math , nothing wrong with loving the prophet, don(t be afraid, if you love him for his struggle and his patience and his perseverence and his success etc............ nothing wrong with that, after all, allah set him as an example to us, and who choose the best example better than allah ? Mohamed have been blessed by been the last of the prophets and bringing the last message to mankind, that's a great honor from allah, nobody from us will get that honor and nobody before him will have the honor of been the last prophet, he will not testifie against us in the hearafter , because we didn't leave the quran, so quranists have the privilege to say we are mohamed's true people, please, do not doubt your faith, coran followers worship allah and appreciate everything that isz good, thank you
It's a rebound effect. You get stung by a bee, for some time you will stay a few hundred meters away from the bee hive even if you survive on honey alone. We must go to the beehive without getting stung!
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I don' understand one thing only, people here love some scientists to the extreme, give too much reverence to many philosophers but when it comes to mohamed, emmmm he's just a man, he's almost a nobody, he just delivered the quran and died, over for him, he's in the grave, allah will cutt his heart if he didn't deliver .....etc , but abraham, ohhhh the father of faith, we follow the religion of abraham , ghady? emmm he said the truth.... jack nickolson? good actor, but mohamed? an idol, an object for worship etc....... , I don't understand, when allah said to his companions, you were the best people that came on earth, what does that mean? their leader is the best leader that came on the earth, do the math , nothing wrong with loving the prophet, don(t be afraid, if you love him for his struggle and his patience and his perseverence and his success etc............ nothing wrong with that, after all, allah set him as an example to us, and who choose the best example better than allah ? Mohamed have been blessed by been the last of the prophets and bringing the last message to mankind, that's a great honor from allah, nobody from us will get that honor and nobody before him will have the honor of been the last prophet, he will not testifie against us in the hearafter , because we didn't leave the quran, so quranists have the privilege to say we are mohamed's true people, please, do not doubt your faith, coran followers worship allah and appreciate everything that isz good, thank you
Please people, the influence of rashad khalfa is obvious,
I bear witness there is no god but ALLH
The quran is the word of allah, is the same as saying mohamed is the messenger of allah; not bearing witness, but recognising that his message is the quran,
Jews also can say I bear witness there's no god but allahBut what is the difference ? we believe in the quran brought to us by mohamed, they don't
to differenciate as an identity only, Mohamed is the messenger of allah
wedon(t bear witness for mohamed the messenger of allah becau, se we werent't there and we're not hypocrits, but we believe in mohamed as the messenger of allahI bear witness that there is no god But Allah, And Mohamed is the messenger of allah
I don't believe there's a blasphemy here, because we only bear witness that there is no god but allah, we identify ourselves as mohamed folowers
What do you think ?
The two best posts I've read in this forum so far !
May God bless you brother.
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Peace "Badr" and "loxbox",
First let me comment on "loxbox's" statements but "Badr" do read and comment on it too
Please people, the influence of rashad khalfa is obvious,
I bear witness there is no god but ALLH
The quran is the word of allah, is the same as saying mohamed is the messenger of allah; not bearing witness, but recognising that his message is the quran,
Jews also can say I bear witness there's no god but allahJK- Saying the Quran is the Word of Allah is NOT THE SAME as saying Muhammad is the messenger of Allah. In the first phrase the emphasis is on the revealed book not making distinction between any of GOD's messengers whilst with the second phrase you're making a distinction and thus violating one of GOD's commandments. Have you ever wondered whilst the statement "la ilaaha ilallah/hu" occurs many times in the Quran NOT A SINGLE TIME IS IT FOLLOWED BY "Muhammadurrasolullah" NOT EVEN in the sura named Muhammad itself where "la ilaaha ilallah" is mentioned in verse 19?
But what is the difference ? we believe in the quran brought to us by mohamed, they don't
to differenciate as an identity only, Mohamed is the messenger of allah
wedon(t bear witness for mohamed the messenger of allah becau, se we werent't there and we're not hypocrits, but we believe in mohamed as the messenger of allahJK- But most sunni Muslims do say "...wa ASHADU ana Muhammadan abduhu wa rasooluhu" meaning "..and I BEAR WITNESS that Muhammad is GOD's servant and messenger" in the tashahud of every salat. Also doesn't the Adhaan of every hadith "Muslim" include "Ashadu ana Muhamur rasoolullah" as the 2nd statement? Ofcourse it does or have you never heard it? Would you admit that those "Muslims" are very wrong to do so?
I bear witness that there is no god But Allah, And Mohamed is the messenger of allah
I don't believe there's a blasphemy here, because we only bear witness that there is no god but allah, we identify ourselves as mohamed folowers
What do you think ?
JK- I think perhaps a tiny bit better but not enough for the distinction between messengers is still being made.
The two best posts I've read in this forum so far !
May God bless you brother.
JK- Have you ever wondered whilst the statement "la ilaaha ilallah/hu" occurs many times in the Quran NOT A SINGLE TIME IS IT FOLLOWED BY "Muhammadurrasolullah" NOT EVEN in the sura named Muhammad itself where "la ilaaha ilallah" is mentioned in verse 19? GOD Bless!
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Peace "Badr" and "loxbox",
First let me comment on "loxbox's" statements but "Badr" do read and comment on it too
JK- Saying the Quran is the Word of Allah is NOT THE SAME as saying Muhammad is the messenger of Allah. In the first phrase the emphasis is on the revealed book not making distinction between any of GOD's messengers whilst with the second phrase you're making a distinction and thus violating one of GOD's commandments. Have you ever wondered whilst the statement "la ilaaha ilallah/hu" occurs many times in the Quran NOT A SINGLE TIME IS IT FOLLOWED BY "Muhammadurrasolullah" NOT EVEN in the sura named Muhammad itself where "la ilaaha ilallah" is mentioned in verse 19?
JK- But most sunni Muslims do say "...wa ASHADU ana Muhammadan abduhu wa rasooluhu" meaning "..and I BEAR WITNESS that Muhammad is GOD's servant and messenger" in the tashahud of every salat. Also doesn't the Adhaan of every hadith "Muslim" include "Ashadu ana Muhamur rasoolullah" as the 2nd statement? Ofcourse it does or have you never heard it? Would you admit that those "Muslims" are very wrong to do so?
JK- I think perhaps a tiny bit better but not enough for the distinction between messengers is still being made.
JK- Have you ever wondered whilst the statement "la ilaaha ilallah/hu" occurs many times in the Quran NOT A SINGLE TIME IS IT FOLLOWED BY "Muhammadurrasolullah" NOT EVEN in the sura named Muhammad itself where "la ilaaha ilallah" is mentioned in verse 19? GOD Bless!
I couldnt say it better than Lox, we have to think good about our prophet who has been chosen amongst all mankind and we differentiate ourselves from those who followed the islam of moses abraham etc...
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Peace "Badr",
I couldnt say it better than Lox, we have to think good about our prophet who has been chosen amongst all mankind and we differentiate ourselves from those who followed the islam of moses abraham etc...
JK- Why not differnetiate yourself by simply adding "wal Quranun Kittabullah" meaning "the Quran is the Book of GOD" or something like that to "la ilaaha illah" instead of mentioning Muhammad and thus making distinction amongst GOD's messengers? Remember also that the human messenger does not remain the main focus after his death but the inspired part that he leaves behind i.e. Quran in this case. GOD Bless!
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Peace "Badr",
Besides you h not answered yet as to why IYU ,whilst the statement "la ilaaha ilallah/hu" occurs many times in the Quran, NOT A SINGLE TIME IS IT FOLLOWED BY "Muhammadurrasolullah", NOT EVEN in the sura named Muhammad itself where "la ilaaha ilallah" is mentioned in verse 19? GOD Bless!
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I couldnt say it better than Lox, we have to think good about our prophet who has been chosen amongst all mankind and we differentiate ourselves from those who followed the islam of moses abraham etc...
How can anyone read hadith and think good about the prophet from them?
Why should we differentiate ourselves from those who followed the Islam of Moses and Abraham etc? Allah tells you in Quran to follow the religion of Abraham who was true in faith!! ??? Allah tells you in Quran we make no distinction among His prophets and you are telling us we should! o
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Ayisha
Why should we differentiate ourselves from those who followed the Islam of Moses and Abraham etc?
Because Allah says so. He sent Muhammad peace is upon him because people (the followers of Moses and Abraham) for got the teachings of their prophets and invented new things on their own. We shall and will differentiate ourselves from them.
"...This day I have perfected your religion for you, completed My favour upon You, and have chosen for you Islam as your religion."....(Qur'an. 53)
And thus we have made you a just community that you will be witnesses over the people and the Messenger will be a witness over you. And We did not make the qiblah which you used to face except that We might make evident who would follow the Messenger from who would turn back on his heels. And indeed, it is difficult except for those whom Allah has guided. And never would Allah have caused you to lose your faith. Indeed Allah is, to the people, Kind and Merciful.
2143And there is none from the People of the Scripture but that he will surely believe in Jesus before his death. And on the Day of Resurrection he will be against them a witness. 4159
For wrongdoing on the part of the Jews, We made unlawful for them good foods which had been lawful to them, and for their averting from the way of Allah,4160
So you can be one of them but we are to be differentiated from them as per words of Allah.
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How can anyone read hadith and think good about the prophet from them?
Why should we differentiate ourselves from those who followed the Islam of Moses and Abraham etc? Allah tells you in Quran to follow the religion of Abraham who was true in faith!! ??? Allah tells you in Quran we make no distinction among His prophets and you are telling us we should! o
Assalamu Alaikum.
Please read this comment http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9601994.msg271741#msg271741
You shall get your answer. Allah commanded people to follow specifically that messenger who were sent to them.
And, nowhere in the Quran will you find any ayat that commands "YOU" to follow Abraham.
And, please read this comment http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9601994.msg271641#msg271641
a) Allah's command to follow Muhammad (sm) is so strict that HE tagged our love for him with whether we follow Muhammad (sm) {{331 Say, "If you love God then follow/obey me so God will love you and forgive your sins." God is Forgiver, Compassionate.}}---Translated by Edip-Layth.
This ayat indicates that if we do not follow Muhammad (sm), then that will make the meaning that WE DO NOT LOVE ALLAH. In other words, If we say that we love Allah, but do not follow Muhammad (sm), then our "love" is not real love, and will not be granted to Allah.
b) Moreover, Allah made it a condition for guidance {{2454>> If you follow/obey him, you will be guided}}.
The indication is clear. If you do not follow Muhammad (sm), you will not be guided.
Is there any other Messengers and Prophets, revelations and books etc., whom Allah has commanded us to follow? And is there any other Messengers and Prophets, revelations and books etc., with whom Allah has tagged His love, or guidance ?
Thank you.
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Dear Antibhondo,
Actually, you are wrong. The Quran does command us to follow in the footsteps and way of Abraham
395 Say ?God bears truth. Follow the creed of Abraham, monotheism, and he was not of the polytheists.?
4125 And who is better in the system than the one who submits himself to God, and he is a good doer, and he follows the creed of Abraham in monotheism? And God took Abraham as a friend.
But more importantly, the way of Abraham as defined in the Quran is "monotheism" and not a particular walk or style or words...
As for your second point, you seem to insist on elevating Mohammed to a status that God forbids us to give any prophet.
Mohammed was messenger like others before him (3144).
Without the message of God, Mohammed is nothing but a man like other men...
Therefore, the following and obeying of the messenger is in following and obeying the message he was privileged to deliver - that is the love of God.
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Dear Antibhondo,
Actually, you are wrong. The Quran does command us to follow in the footsteps and way of Abraham
395 Say ?God bears truth. Follow the creed of Abraham, monotheism, and he was not of the polytheists.?
4125 And who is better in the system than the one who submits himself to God, and he is a good doer, and he follows the creed of Abraham in monotheism? And God took Abraham as a friend.
But more importantly, the way of Abraham as defined in the Quran is "monotheism" and not a particular walk or style or words...
As for your second point, you seem to insist on elevating Mohammed to a status that God forbids us to give any prophet.
Mohammed was messenger like others before him (3144).
Without the message of God, Mohammed is nothing but a man like other men...
Therefore, the following and obeying of the messenger is in following and obeying the message he was privileged to deliver - that is the love of God.
Good point.
The reason why some Musims tend to elevate Muhamamd to divine status is to seperate themselves from jews and Christian due to sectarian rivalries. But you are right, its the faith in the message thats important not the messenger.
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Still, it is not a mere messenger as the one who brings the post and doesn't know what is in it. Muhammad did know the message and he was also a poster for it. And delivering a message to the whole of Humanity in a certain way is part of the message. The message that God took good care that everybody got the message. Deivering it entailed to be able to loose it, have it falsified, defaced, erased.
No it is not justified to give Muhammad the standing christians give Jesus, but I do think that he did a most glorious feat and he did show a great goodness in it. The results say so. You and I and anybody have today a Qur'an we can refer back to any time. We do not depend on any man or institution being good to us and dispensing some little wisdom...
I do not think there is anything wrong with loving Muhammad or with loving any persn who may have existed previously and from whom we learn things and somehow love and understand and identify with. It is a helpt from God. It is an emotional and spiritual support, companionship in a way, companionship with the whole of humanity since its beginnings.
Salaam
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Layth
Without the message of God, Mohammed is nothing but a man like other men..
Should remember he was chosen for the message to be delivered and not only to deliver but to practically implement it successfully; the most important task you may have skipped. Therefore he is NO ordinary man but the Chosen one the SEAL.
Huruf
Still, it is not a mere messenger as the one who brings the post and doesn't know what is in it. Muhammad did know the message and he was also a poster for it. And delivering a message to the whole of Humanity in a certain way is part of the message. The message that God took good care that everybody got the message. Deivering it entailed to be able to loose it, have it falsified, defaced, erased.
No it is not justified to give Muhammad the standing christians give Jesus, but I do think that he did a most glorious feat and he did show a great goodness in it. The results say so. You and I and anybody have today a Qur'an we can refer back to any time. We do not depend on any man or institution being good to us and dispensing some little wisdom...
Some excellent points in above paragraphs.
Bigmo
But you are right, its the faith in the message thats important not the messenger.
That is simply a misleading statement. How can a message earn a respect if it is to be delivered by a person who is drunk, steals, embezzles,lies,and lives a life for himself. The messenger is the most important part of the system that Allah has made to listen to his commands and implement it.
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Dear Rajah,
I suppose it is inevitable that each nation gets obsessed with their messenger (405).
Mohammed is a man - who happened to be chosen by God to deliver His message. God could have chosen a guy called "Adnan" and we would see the same tape being played out with people "praising Adnan" and talking about how great he is and how they want to love him and think about him all the time...
Call me selfish, but I am concerned about saving my own neck and that of my family...The last thing I really care about is the fate of x or y messenger whom I know have already made the cut and are guaranteed heaven by virtue of them being chosen - great for them.
Let's all not get distracted with the medium and keep focus on the source
1035 Say ?Are there any of those whom you set up as partners who can guide to the truth?? Say ?God guides to the truth. Is He who guides to the truth more worthy of being followed, or he who does not guide except after he is guided? What is wrong with you, how do you judge??
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Dear Antibhondo,
Actually, you are wrong. The Quran does command us to follow in the footsteps and way of Abraham
395 Say ?God bears truth. Follow the creed of Abraham, monotheism, and he was not of the polytheists.?
4125 And who is better in the system than the one who submits himself to God, and he is a good doer, and he follows the creed of Abraham in monotheism? And God took Abraham as a friend.
But more importantly, the way of Abraham as defined in the Quran is "monotheism" and not a particular walk or style or words...
Brother Layth
Thank you for presenting the Ayats. See?You are not commanded to follow Abraham. You are to follow the creed of Abraham.
What do you see in the ayats regarding following Muhammad (sm)?
Following The creed of the messenger? Following what the messenger followed? No brother, this is a direct command to follow the messenger.
As for your second point, you seem to insist on elevating Mohammed to a status that God forbids us to give any prophet.
It was a very interesting comment of you. All I mentioned were ayats of Quran. I just reiterate all those in my words. Please carefully read the following and detect what I said wrong
a) Allah's command to follow Muhammad (sm) is so strict that HE tagged our love for him with whether we follow Muhammad (sm) {{331 Say, "If you love God then follow/obey me so God will love you and forgive your sins." God is Forgiver, Compassionate.}}---Translated by Edip-Layth.
This ayat indicates that if we do not follow Muhammad (sm), then that will make the meaning that WE DO NOT LOVE ALLAH. In other words, If we say that we love Allah, but do not follow Muhammad (sm), then our "love" is not real love, and will not be granted to Allah.
b) Moreover, Allah made it a condition for guidance {{2454>> If you follow/obey him, you will be guided}}.
The indication is clear. If you do not follow Muhammad (sm), you will not be guided.
Is there any other Messengers and Prophets, revelations and books etc., whom Allah has commanded us to follow? And is there any other Messengers and Prophets, revelations and books etc., with whom Allah has tagged His love, or guidance ?
I do not know what to tell you. Allah has said something in the QURAN, and you are telling me that by saying that particular things, Allah has elevated Muhammad (sm) to such a level that he himself forbids us to give any prophet???????????
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Salaam,
Please allow me to interfere.
a) Allah's command to follow Muhammad (sm) is so strict that HE tagged our love for him with whether we follow Muhammad (sm) {{331 Say, "If you love God then follow/obey me so God will love you and forgive your sins." God is Forgiver, Compassionate.}}---Translated by Edip-Layth.
This ayat indicates that if we do not follow Muhammad (sm), then that will make the meaning that WE DO NOT LOVE ALLAH. In other words, If we say that we love Allah, but do not follow Muhammad (sm), then our "love" is not real love, and will not be granted to Allah.
b) Moreover, Allah made it a condition for guidance {{2454>> If you follow/obey him, you will be guided}}.
The indication is clear. If you do not follow Muhammad (sm), you will not be guided.
Is there any other Messengers and Prophets, revelations and books etc., whom Allah has commanded us to follow? And is there any other Messengers and Prophets, revelations and books etc., with whom Allah has tagged His love, or guidance ?
Brother, both the aayaats are misquoted.
Firstly there is NO mentioned of Prophet Mohammeds'(AS) name in any of the aayats above as 395 and 4125 mentioned Prophet Ibrahim (AS)
Secondly, please take a close look at 331, and let me know whom this "Qul" is referring to?
If you say "Qul" is referring to Prophet Mohammed (AS) then all "Quls" of AlQuraan is referring to him alone.
Like "Qul huwa Allahu ahad", that means only Prophet Mohammed (AS) can say?Another IF that "Qul" in 331 is referring to Prophet Mohammed only, then whom the "Qul" is referring to 332?
331
332331 Say If you love Allah then follow me so Allah will love you and forgive your sins. Allah is Forgiver, Merciful.
332 Say Obey Allah and the messenger. But if they turn away, then Allah does not love the rejecters.May Allah guide us all to His path pr
Mohammed M. Khan -
Salaam,
Please allow me to interfere.
Brother, both the aayaats are misquoted.
Firstly there is NO mentioned of Prophet Mohammeds'(AS) name in any of the aayats above as 395 and 4125 mentioned Prophet Ibrahim (AS)
Secondly, please take a close look at 331, and let me know whom this "Qul" is referring to?
If you say "Qul" is referring to Prophet Mohammed (AS) then all "Quls" of AlQuraan is referring to him alone.
Like "Qul huwa Allahu ahad", that means only Prophet Mohammed (AS) can say?Another IF that "Qul" in 331 is referring to Prophet Mohammed only, then whom the "Qul" is referring to 332?
331
332331 Say If you love Allah then follow me so Allah will love you and forgive your sins. Allah is Forgiver, Merciful.
332 Say Obey Allah and the messenger. But if they turn away, then Allah does not love the rejecters.May Allah guide us all to His path pr
Mohammed M. KhanBrother Mohammed M. Khan
Assalamu Alaikum.Is there anywhere written that when a word is used in a book many times that word must have bear only one meaning in every place they are used?
What about the words for Quran? Do you have any reference for that?
Read carefully the 2454; it is obvious that the qul is to the man to whom the ayats have been revealed.
332 clarifies the qul in 331.
332 Say, "Obey God and the messenger.
331 Say, "If you love God then follow me.Look carefully.
Thank you.
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Dear Rajah,
I suppose it is inevitable that each nation gets obsessed with their messenger (405).
Mohammed is a man - who happened to be chosen by God to deliver His message. God could have chosen a guy called "Adnan" and we would see the same tape being played out with people "praising Adnan" and talking about how great he is and how they want to love him and think about him all the time...
Salaam Layth,
I respect your stand for monotheism. We find rare Arabs who do not elevate Muhammad peace is upon him higher than what Allah has, you are one of those rares I guess. Yes Muhammad is a man but chosen one, it was not Adnan who was chosen it was Muhammad peace is upon him and his qualities are different from any ordinary person and I am sure he or other messengers were not chosen by pick and chose game at random or by a lottery, there was hard work, toil , mediation, sacrifices which ordinary people even won't think of. Therefore all respect is due to all the messengers of Allah and Muhammad peace is upon him.Layth
1035 Say ?Are there any of those whom you set up as partners who can guide to the truth?? Say ?God guides to the truth. Is He who guides to the truth more worthy of being followed, or he who does not guide except after he is guided? What is wrong with you, how do you judge??
No I am not setting any partners over here it is different, Muhammad peace is upon him was the greatest Monotheist and we follow him as per command of Allah.
antibhondo bravo
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Brother Raaajah
Assalamu Alaikum.
Thank you.
By the way, Brother Layth,
what did you want to make by mentioning 405?405 is Before they, the people of Noah denied and the opponents after them. Every nation plotted against their messenger to seize him, and they disputed by means of falsehood to defeat with it the truth. So I seized them; how then was My punishment!
How does this ayat give you the impression that {{each nation gets obsessed with their messenger }}?
How does it fit in this discussion? -
Wa Alaikum Salaam wa Rahmath Allah,
Brother Mohammed M. Khan
Assalamu Alaikum.Is there anywhere written that when a word is used in a book many times that word must have bear only one meaning in every place they are used?
What about the words for Quran? Do you have any reference for that?
AlQuraan is the word of Allah and sent for the guidance, if its words has more than one meaning then it cannot guide to the path of Allah, but everyone can extract the meaning that suites their understanding.
Read carefully the 2454; it is obvious that the qul is to the man to whom the ayats have been revealed.
If it is so then why not ME is said instead of AlRasool same as in 331
If "Qul" is for AlRasool then it will be said "Ati Allaha wa Ati-oon" instead of "Ati Allah wa Ati AlRasool"
332 clarifies the qul in 331.
332 Say, "Obey God and the messenger.
331 Say, "If you love God then follow me.Look carefully.
As per your suggestion I looked carefully and found the same answer as per the above
May Allah open our hearts to accept the truth and guide us all on His path pr
Mohammed M. KhanNote Brother, if you are a sincere and honest truth seeker, then don't ignore what you see as truth, otherwise you will be away from the guidance. I don't ask you to follow me, but I ask you to follow what Allah is showing you. And IF you don't understand the truth, then please ask Allah for help and guidance for the TRUE path ONLY.
