Esoteric/mystical understanding of The Quran.
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I will percieve all consciousness as God. Also yours.
NO! Don't you put that evil on me, Ricky Bobby!
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Anyone who thinks the same way about the Quran as me? Or do you believe this discussion is "illegal"? )
Peace Be With You,
Paradox Uncreated.When I first opened the Quran, I had a million bells going off at once and they all said "Tao Te Ching, Tao Te Ching, Tao Te Ching". A learned Qadri shaykh confirmed my perceptions and explained to me that Al Lah is not gendered at all but can be thought of as both mother and father, Ir-Rahman, Ir-Rahim. I later realized that the stories of Jesus came from the gospels that didn't make the official Judeo-Roman Christian canon.
We have a man, peace be upon him, apparently/supposedly descended from an abandoned and banished Egyptian slave woman and her son -- whose culture, historically speaking, is slowly being encroached upon by a foreign element which has ties to this paternal line. But, as in the case of say.... Anglo-Saxon culture in Britain or Aryan culture in India ...it wasn't simply an encroachment or attempt at colonisation, at least not from a street perspective. For the most part, people were just changing .....assimilating to one another.
Now, instead of proposing war against them, he suggests tolerance and coexistence. In other words, compassion. A kind of reformation. He is, essentially, one of the original Christians, living on the fringe of the established church (as were many others more or less unaccounted for during this time frame, and through the reaches of a vast expanse of land and culture whose very language was slowly being eliminated via the encroachment I mentioned).
The Qaba is archaeologically linked to Brahma ....the root aspect of a multi-faceted deity. His counterpart, of course, is Saraswati ....which, in reality, is an ancient river long since dried up.
When you have an idea about something and need to express it, especially one with serious political implications, there is a way to do this without upsetting long-established belief systems and making yourself an enemy of the general population. Again, compassion.
One can say that there is no god but Al Lah and it is the same god as that of the Bible... or one can say there is no god but God. God is one, no matter what you call it. It's the same.
That is what I think of the Quran. And I don't care if it's illegal or not. It's been long enough.
Salaam. -
When I first opened the Quran, I had a million bells going off at once and they all said "Tao Te Ching, Tao Te Ching, Tao Te Ching". A learned Qadri shaykh confirmed my perceptions and explained to me that Al Lah is not gendered at all but can be thought of as both mother and father, Ir-Rahman, Ir-Rahim.
Indeed, the tao is the same transcendent entity as Allah. However you should think of it as genderless, like consciousness is. However that doesn't mean that consciousness has a meaning on what is right and wrong, to do with ones physical (created) gender. Such as making homophilia illegal.
I later realized that the stories of Jesus came from the gospels that didn't make the official Judeo-Roman Christian canon.
Yes, they seem to be from apocryphal writings. Which is interesting, maybe that is a way of saying, that these scriptures have some higher status than the others, in the eyes of prophet Muhammed. I don't believe nothing is included in the Quran, but for some reason of value in spiritual teaching. Or maybe they were better known than what the canon is today.
We have a man, peace be upon him, apparently/supposedly descended from an abandoned and banished Egyptian slave woman and her son -- whose culture, historically speaking, is slowly being encroached upon by a foreign element which has ties to this paternal line. But, as in the case of say.... Anglo-Saxon culture in Britain or Aryan culture in India ...it wasn't simply an encroachment or attempt at colonisation, at least not from a street perspective. For the most part, people were just changing .....assimilating to one another.
Now, instead of proposing war against them, he suggests tolerance and coexistence. In other words, compassion. A kind of reformation. He is, essentially, one of the original Christians, living on the fringe of the established church (as were many others more or less unaccounted for during this time frame, and through the reaches of a vast expanse of land and culture whose very language was slowly being eliminated via the encroachment I mentioned).
It's is a heavenly message. It would be the solution to world peace, if only people knew. I guess God can give us a scripture, but it might not be that people are ready, or understand.
The Qaba is archaeologically linked to Brahma ....the root aspect of a multi-faceted deity. His counterpart, of course, is Saraswati ....which, in reality, is an ancient river long since dried up.
Yes, Brahma and Saraswati, is Abraham and Sarai of judaism. While the gnostic teachings were better preserved in the bible, the hinduistic accounts, were severly distorted. Parallel development.
When you have an idea about something and need to express it, especially one with serious political implications, there is a way to do this without upsetting long-established belief systems and making yourself an enemy of the general population. Again, compassion.
And ofcourse using the most popular variants of accepted religious texts there is. Not that it's wrong or made up. However when someone tells a story of a man who has achieved gnosis, who tells of heavenly and hellish mindstates, of ones own nature as god, the next generation distorts it a little, and soon, "God" is external, maybe a man who lived a long time ago, and his children maybe start to be seen as sons of God, and maybe popular stories of warriors are included, and turned into gods, if not just completely made up gods, to sell wooden idols, are made up. And so forth. And heaven and hell are eternal.
But someone comes along, and sees what the original message was about, because he has experienced gnosis himself. And he can correct these texts, with the eye of his mind. However changing the texts too much, might cause upset, and hinder the growth of the religion. So the religion is launched, on the carriers of well-established religion, however wording it in a way, that in the end, the adherent gains insight into the poetical nature behind the text.
And so the religion grows, based on popular concepts, and becomes a major religion in the world, and ones intent of illuminating the world, and bringing peace, are kept. The ultimate act of doing good, and using one insights one might say.
One can say that there is no god but Al Lah and it is the same god as that of the Bible... or one can say there is no god but God. God is one, no matter what you call it. It's the same.
That is what I think of the Quran. And I don't care if it's illegal or not. It's been long enough.
Salaam.One God!
Peace. -
PU,
Have you read any of Frithjof Schuon's writings? Think you'd enjoy him.
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I had a superficial look at them. It seems to be quite a bit of sufism. Not really anything I haven't been through already. Nice to see that he sees a universal religion, at the core of the religion.
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I think sufism is a bit obscure. I tend to base all my religious views, on The Quran these days. Suprisingly, or maybe not, I am gaining a lot of insight into Buddhism these days, from this. I think Sufism was a lower stage than this, I did listen to some of it, for quite some time. I am starting though, for instance to see Rumis dance, as a way of trying to seek God, but believing God also to be externally, he opens his arms to recieve God, however God tries to tell him, that it is his own consciousness. Therefore spinning, reaching out, and being told that God is inside. However believeing God to be external, still reaching out.
Buddha however, or this may be varying depening on teachings, seems to have passed that stage, and believes his consciousness to be God, or some similar entity.
God is without desires, and this is the state that Buddha seeks. And in this state one may reflect on creation, and realize that all consciousness is God, and God does not err. There is truly no wrong in the world. It is only the creation of God. And this is in the teachings of the Buddha aswell.
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Goes both ways really. Who was more advanced doesn't really concern me.
Many facets of Buddhism are great; same with Sufism. Various branches of the same tree and whatnot.
I will say, though, with regard to the Mevlevi whirling the dance, like many other spiritual practices, functions on different levels. Exoterically, you have the basic explanation of one hand up to God, or planets revolving around the Sun, etc. Esoterically, however, it is just another form of focus meditation. In this regard, it is similar to acoustic driving (what many shamanistic traditions do, with repetitive drumming), extreme bouts of fasting, rain dances, and the use of certain hallucinogenic substances. Just spiritual technologies through which the initiate becomes increasingly aware of the one consciousness, as the ego melts away.
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As the "I" drives away in a flower-powery volkswagon. D
heheh.. Not sure if I agree with you on the hallucinogenic part there but.. To each their own, maybe?
I tried to analyse that phenomena from a viewpoint of one who does not use such things.
The primary argument for pro-"entheogens" these days, are that it can help dying patients, relieve the fear of death.
This is their argument, and ofcourse, this does not support use outside this situationHowever they should ofcourse instead go through advanced stages in religion, who also remove fear of death.
Well, other than that I haven't heard much arguments for legalization. I did see neurosoup on youtube also. She is not really giving me the impression of getting deep knowledge of religion, rather the other way around.
Are you sure this about hallucinogenics isn't just a myth?
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Sure, to each their own. Like with anything, it also has to do with mindset. I've seen Neurosoup's videos as well and she doesn't have much of a spiritual bent, so it's no surprise that her experiences don't really have a spiritual flavor to them. Shouldn't really be looking to someone like her for spiritual insights on entheogens.
The use of certain hallucinogens has a long history, not just relegated to the 60s flower-power generation. D Shamans worldwide have often used them as forms of spiritual practice (ranging from Africa to South America to Central America/Mexico, even Europe and the Far East), for centuries, if not millenia. Look to archaic rituals like the Eleusinian mysteries, and other shamanic rites. There is a lot of literature out there. You don't have to go too far; a signfiicant portion of modern-day users report spiritual benefits as well. Not just relieving the fear of death (though that certainly is part of it). Just another spiritual technology, really. These technologies, at their very heart, aim to bring the practitioner to altered states of consciousness. That's all meditation is, for example. Just different routes is all. Meditation is a lifelong discipline; using something like psilocybin can be a short-lived shortcut to the same goal. Glimpses of the One.
An example of what I meant by what modern-day users report
In 2006, the United States government funded a randomized and double-blinded study by Johns Hopkins University, which studied the spiritual effects of psilocybin mushrooms. The study involved 36 college-educated adults who had never tried psilocybin nor had a history of drug use, and had religious or spiritual interests; the average age of the participants was 46 years. The participants were closely observed for eight-hour intervals in a laboratory while under the influence of psilocybin mushrooms.
One-third of the participants reported that the experience was the single most spiritually significant moment of their lives and more than two-thirds reported it was among the top five most spiritually significant experiences. Two months after the study, 79 percent of the participants reported increased well-being or satisfaction; friends, relatives, and associates confirmed this. They also reported anxiety and depression symptoms to be decreased or completely gone.
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Steve Jobs is also often qouted by users of entheogens, that "LSD was one of the most important things he did in his life".
And then, you ofcourse have the hippie who's gone tired of it and says "Talking sandwiches is less amusing at the age of 50".Scripturally, I have deduced certain facts
The "tree of eternity" may very well be a psychedelic substance, which after use, Adam falls to earth (from heaven).
One can interpret this, to go from higher morals, to lower. It's quite possible that The Beatels song "help" is about this.
An experience of eternity, seems to be typical, and part of users arguments, for use of the drug.
The Quran also says, "don't touch this tree, unless you should become angels, or live forever".
That the quran states angels here, is ofcourse very interesting. That means that the experience may have religious content.
However, it was Satans doing, of giving them the fruit.
Which means that overall, the experience is satanic.High profile user John Lennon have stated negative remarks about their own use.
John Lennon "I got a message on acid that you should destroy your ego," he later explained, "and I did, you know. I was reading that stupid book of Leary's (Psychedelic Book of the Dead) and all that shit. We were going through a whole game that everyone went through and I destroyed myself... I destroyed my ego and I didn't believe I could do anything."My own thoughts on the subject is much like that of the aged hippie. I don't think psychedelic experience is something of interest to the grown man.
We'll have to differ on this, CD!
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I pushed mushrooms as far as I could go and I almost killed myself. I believe these are medicinal plants, which Allah created to cure mental illness. They lift the veil between the two worlds reality and imagination. They modulate perception and dissolve harmful mental patterns, like an internal mirror.
Terence McKenna developed an extensive theory around this idea that mushrooms are the original tree of knowledge when we humans lived in the Eden of our grassland phase. But if mushrooms were truly the forbidden fruit, then it would not be left for guessing. Anything harmful for humankind has been explicitly revealed in the Qur'an.
Was there anything special about Thamud's camel? Could it have been a floppy eared rabbit instead? Whether it's a fruit or a camel, the point is the same. They are simply tests from Allah to see if his servants can remain within the boundary of their Lord's command. If not, then you pay.
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As far as the topic is concerned, I'll be the one to remind everybody about this ayah
(3.7) He is the One who sent you down the Book which contains decisive verses. They the basis of the Book; while others are allegorical. Those whose hearts are prone to falter follow whatever is allegorical in it, seeking to create dissension by giving interpretation of it. Yet only God knows its interpretation; those who are versed in knowledge say "We believe in it; it all comes from our Lord!" However only prudent persons bear it in mind.
So just be careful of re-interpreting the decisive verses.
And also, I believe it was Dr. Nasr, perhaps in Garden of Truth, who said the Qur'an as a whole is a map of the soul's entire journey through life, just as it is a map of the earth's journey from creation to destruction. As above so below. The Fire gets a lot hotter than this.
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Yes, those who transgress. Which implies that the Quran, supports having a dynamic mindset and thinking, so to not, transgress. And that is a part of trusting ones own consciousness ofcourse. And ultimately learning that conciousness is God.
A lot of the guidance in The Quran, is simply that I think, to spark that light which is within, and to learn to rely on it. And afterwards, one will not need The Quran, in the same way.
A religion of personal development, indeed. And ofcourse eradicating all the idols, that stand in the way.
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Asalaamu alaykum Paradox,
I couldn't agree with you more! I have identified God with Consciousness for a while now and too have the exact same interpretation and method of interpretation (about heaven, hell, God, the metaphysical) toward the Qur'an as you have described in this thread.
Every atom is a level of consciousness experiencing itself. All is one existence and the Divine is the ultimate reality.
Farhan
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Walaikumsalaam Mutazilaah.
I am happy to hear that you have similar views to mine, however be aware that I do not think of matter, as God. I separate creation, from The Creator.
I have several reasons for doing so.
In no particular order
- It does not fit typical religious logic. God is eternally the same, and therefore not a creation, that comes and goes.
- It was not a part of my experience of God, 10 years ago. (Judgement Day/Gnosis if you wish) Rather the typical view of creator and created was. Also insight that resembled a big bang'ish nature of creation. Gaining insight into first cause, arguments, however instead based on immanence. It's a bit difficult to explain, but, if one traces ones own consiousness back to the beginning, the first consciousness, one finds God. The exact wording that I experienced is "All words are derived of the first word".
- I did actually become a sufi for a while, but various things led me to doubt sufism, and I researched my religion better, and found that "The Word" is indeed, many places in religion.
This, convinced me that consciousness alone is God, and creation is not consciousness, however created out of nothing (as scripture states).
Thought created and controls everything, in other words. - Definately a nuance you should consider, and think about.
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Well.
In advanced stages of sufism, one also gets to know spirits. This is ofcourse not special to sufism, but in sufism, the spirits use/abuse the errors you have in faith. So, if you have a God that is external, the spirits will pretend to be this God. But spirits can be offensive. There are good spirits aswell, just as the Quran states. But on the whole, the meeting with spirits, made me doubt the sufistic concept of God. And I thought back at my own experience of God, and that experience was about "The Word". And I researched religion further, and found "The Word" many places. I become conviced that the sufis was wrong.
And I started thinking about it, and much of what is in their teachings is wrong. For instance, sufis teach that, one becomes one with God. This is false, consciousness always is God. Because of the sufis errors, some sufis believe they represent God alone, and therefore should be worshipped by others as God, or having the title "The Beloved". When infact, there is no "becoming one with God". One always is God. And it is everyone. (consciousness).
Some sufis also teach "divine love". This is usually about having an intimate relationship to "God", which is really a spirit. So in reality, it is love of a spirit, not God. This is offensive.
I had several more reasons also, but I cannot remember them now.
Some good came of it though, I learned to be godconscious a different way. You know The Quran states that those who worship God correctly, are protected against spirits. So, I found that meditation on paradox, the transcendent nature of God, is good against spirits. So I did quite a bit of meditation on "I am paradox", when going from the sufi concept of God, to consciousness alone. This is also something you can try - meditation on "I am paradox", and possibly add "creator of everything". Remember that paradox is the transcendent nature of consciousness though.
Atleast that helped me, in difficult stages with spirits, who seemed to try and take the place of God, in my mind.I think it is important that one fully accepts The Quran's teachings on spirits aswell. I don't think many sufis do that. In their world, satan "can be a good spirit". They fail to understand the very nature of that, satan is a disbeliever. Infact, if there is disbelief somewhere, this is due to the illusions of satan. If you can bring this illusion down, by inner or outer dialog, and reflection, you will realise God. So sufis, who are supposedly seeking God, and at the same time, disbelieving in satan as an enemy, carry with them the greatest hindrance, to realizing God. Some sufis also teach immorality, through the use of intoxicants, promiscuity, homophilia, saying "it's all God". But this is wrong. If one is to realize the correct path, one must take the Qurans teachings on these things, seriously. They are all of satan, in The Quran.
The teachings on Satan has got lost, not only in sufism, but to a great degree, in contemporary religion aswell. But as one who has experienced spirits, I can just say that, believe in them! They are real, and is a fundamental part of The Qurans teachings.
Without rejecting satan, one cannot fully realize oneself as a human. And down the road, lies also that which is called heaven.
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It's getting to be some time ago, prince. I can't really remember. But satan is real, and rejection of him, is a major part of the path. It may be that all seekers will experience jinn. However it also may be that, if you are protected from jinn, (by your godconciousness), you may skip that part entirely. But know that they are real, even if you have no problems with them. If on the other hand, you do have problems with them, try my meditation. Alt. meditate on "We" instead of "I". You can also meditate on the qualities of God, as described in The Quran. For instance, "We are paradox, self-sufficient".
Suppression of Satan is the very key, to progress of society, and worldpeace.
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As I am going through various stages with this meditation technique, I am also updating it. Currently "I am the paradox that is all life" seems good. If I ever come to a point where I feel I have perfected it, I will surely write something about it.