Looking to interview code 19 deniers
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Yeah... Ayman, quick. Change your address. The KGB is after you now.
Well, I like your joke. Indeed the producer of the film, who knows English well, hired an American private agent to find the contact addresses of some people, such as Bill Maher, who is a funny atheist.
Unfortunately, we do not know Ayman's real name and any information to locate him for a Socratic grilling session. I have challenged many detractors for a face-to-face debate, which is much more powerful in exposing contradictions and dishonesty. I know it from my personal experience on live Turkish TV debates, where my opponents had to retract their claims or escape from the studio under the watching eyes of millions of people. The imam in London for instance. He was exposed in front of his own people, and had to escape from the room in humiliation (unfortunately, that was not recorded on video but I listed the names of witnesses in that meeting in my report)... The video clips of some of my Turkish debates are now available at youtube.com
So, in a sense you are right. If I knew Ayman's whereabouts, I would suprise him like those newsreporters confronting Maddoff and other crooks. Ayman and his ilk are worse than Maddoff, since they use their knowledge to distort and hide God's signs.
Peace,
Edip -
peace Edip, all,
If I knew Ayman's whereabouts, I would suprise him like those newsreporters confronting Maddoff and other crooks. Ayman and his ilk are worse than Maddoff, since they use their knowledge to distort and hide God's signs.
I dont see the need to "find" anyone these days for a face to face interview, considering we have the internet. I think an audio narration written and/or narrated by Ayman over a slideshow of his points would suffice.
And for sake of argument, lets say Ayman has used his knowledge to distort God's signs... I do wonder who has contributed more to the understanding of The Quran Ayman or all code-19 supporters put together? To my knowledge I only know of one code-19 supporter who actually does any Quran-meaning based study, and that is you. If you know of anyone else who writes articles on better understanding the meaning of The Quran, let us know, as I've often been curious about that.
I must say that I find the code-19 camp rather peculiar in the sense that they seem to spend a disproportionate amount of time on code-19 calculations/debate rather than better understanding The Quran. Or at least this is the impression I get from various online forums, and I'm sure I'm not the only one. Each to their own.
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Indeed. Is 19`ers calculations about righetousness, or is it an occult attraction to numbers?
The number itself is about the 19 angels, that guard hell. The amount of angels is a test, that confounds the disbelievers. "What does God mean by this?" - This must be esoteric knowledge at the highest level. If one should encounter these angels, I guess, as a believer, one would not be confounded.
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I do wonder who has contributed more to the understanding of The Quran Ayman or all code-19 supporters put together? To my knowledge I only know of one code-19 supporter who actually does any Quran-meaning based study, and that is you. If you know of anyone else who writes articles on better understanding the meaning of The Quran, let us know, as I've often been curious about that.
You forgot Layth. He acknowledges 19.
His words "I am a supporter of code 19 as there is sufficient evidence for its existence in the Quran. What I do not support is some of the inconsistent counts and forced conclusions based on erronoeus data."
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Well, I like your joke. Indeed the producer of the film, who knows English well, hired an American private agent to find the contact addresses of some people, such as Bill Maher, who is a funny atheist.
Unfortunately, we do not know Ayman's real name and any information to locate him for a Socratic grilling session. I have challenged many detractors for a face-to-face debate, which is much more powerful in exposing contradictions and dishonesty. I know it from my personal experience on live Turkish TV debates, where my opponents had to retract their claims or escape from the studio under the watching eyes of millions of people. The imam in London for instance. He was exposed in front of his own people, and had to escape from the room in humiliation (unfortunately, that was not recorded on video but I listed the names of witnesses in that meeting in my report)... The video clips of some of my Turkish debates are now available at youtube.com
So, in a sense you are right. If I knew Ayman's whereabouts, I would suprise him like those newsreporters confronting Maddoff and other crooks. Ayman and his ilk are worse than Maddoff, since they use their knowledge to distort and hide God's signs.
Peace,
EdipI don't believe AYMAN will reveal his true identity for many reasons
1 - history westerners of the 18th century enemies and haters of Islam, the quran and the messengers, colonised all muslim countries with no exceptions, one of the most important duties was to alter the system of Islam , and by doing that , the enemy is the quran, so they invented all ahadiths and tafassir and false history of Islam to break the mainstream f the muslim societies , and they get lost , after that they all get independant in the same period, mission accomplishethese people aren't gonna allow any one who dare expose and explain the true explanation of the quran, therefore exposing the true history of humanity before the 17 th century. they will never allow any honest man to expose the truths , but again, they had no problem with people like khalifa , specially a person called messenger f god who had no problem at all with the FBI or CIA or The MOSSAD or all that powerfull people , just because he didn't bother them, what bother them is. the truth, an honest person and a pwerfull one specially..
if you EDIP were on the truth, you will have no publicity for your version of the quran.
Ayman , is a person I don't know where he lives or if he's a good person or not, but according to his vision of things, He is more universal that you, who just created another sect, you're not gonna bother anyone with a sect, there are thousands in every religion, whatbother governments is universal truths, not religion truth
Deen isn't religion
Deen is the Due , we owe God. our conduct and actions, and not mosques and prayers.
re read the quran without any doctrine in your mind be it 19ers or sunni or shiaa or anything, read the qqura and a person who belong to the universe and not to a group or a sect.I don't believe Ayman will reveal himself because of his honesty , and if he does, maybe his honesty will cost him.
this is purely the way i analyse our people here. my personal view, I might be wrong
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When can we expect the final product to be released ? Agree with code 19 or not, I dont see why the video should be uninteresting. Unless ofcourse its like the creationist videos on youtube, people wearing lab coats claiming to be scientists and preaching flat earth ideas.
Allah guide us please )
-------------------------- Student of Allah
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Peace
Why is time and money being wasted on such an endeavour? Out of all the things in the Quran, you are choosing to focus on something that is not explicitly stated in the Quran and that has little bearing on anything. Does the Quran not instruct us not to spend too much time over these verses?
Just like your ABC interview, which went very well until you started talking about 19.
The fact is that '19' is impossible to verify for most as they do not have the ability to go through the Quran counting word numbers, applying numerical values to words etc.
And just like the ABC video, you are unable to explain in any specific way, what code 19 is, except to say that, when it suits you, there is some multiple of 19 so the text must mean X,Y,Z etc.
If you were going to make a documentary, why not make it on how and why the Quran forbids the hadith, particularly as people such as Aisha Musa, Fred Donner etc. have shown historical documentation to support the argument.
What a waste of time and a futile exercise you are performing to boost your own ego.
Roshan
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Peace all,
There are Millions you can interview who disagree with deleting verses 7-128 and 129. However most of them are not code 19 deniers.
Edip, Are you going to admit your disbeliving of 7-128 and 129 in your project?I believe it was 9128 and 129
Peace
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I really don't see what on Earth is the problem. Code 19 or denier of both code AND extra-Quranic teachings, don't we still just believe in the Quran?
Is it really a big deal that one group are skeptical of two verses (out of about 6340) pretty much repeating what is stated elsewhere in the Quran, that God sent us a messenger (Muhammad) who cares about us and told him to tell those who rejected his teachings that God is sufficient and the lord of the worlds, and believe in a messenger after Muhammad who brought NOTHING NEW to the table?
No, not a big deal at all. Code 19 supporters and plain Quranists believe in virtually 99% the same thing. They are not the idiotic traditionalists who will mudsling and come packed with swords and stones confronting one another.
It is a big deal when one group of people believe babies must be circumcised, women must have a nonsensical sexist dress code, men can't shave, and married people must be stoned to death for nonmarital sex, among tons of other pagan teachings and general nonsense, while another group doesn't. The similarities between Sunnis/Shiites and Quran aloners (pro and anti-19ists) isn't even close to 50%.
-M
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Today, one of the most famous American atheists was exposed and literally check-mated in a Socratic debate between me and him on the Quran, its scientific aspect and code 19.
I will write an article on this issue. The docufilm, will inshallah be ready by the end of this year.
Peace,
Edip -
I really don't see what on Earth is the problem. Code 19 or denier of both code AND extra-Quranic teachings, don't we still just believe in the Quran?
Is it really a big deal that one group are skeptical of two verses (out of about 6340) pretty much repeating what is stated elsewhere in the Quran, that God sent us a messenger (Muhammad) who cares about us and told him to tell those who rejected his teachings that God is sufficient and the lord of the worlds, and believe in a messenger after Muhammad who brought NOTHING NEW to the table?
No, not a big deal at all. Code 19 supporters and plain Quranists believe in virtually 99% the same thing. They are not the idiotic traditionalists who will mudsling and come packed with swords and stones confronting one another.
It is a big deal when one group of people believe babies must be circumcised, women must have a nonsensical sexist dress code, men can't shave, and married people must be stoned to death for nonmarital sex, among tons of other pagan teachings and general nonsense, while another group doesn't. The similarities between Sunnis/Shiites and Quran aloners (pro and anti-19ists) isn't even close to 50%.
-M
Yes the code and the miracles of the Quran have absolutely nothing to do with religious guidance(laws). However what if someone were to ask you ? What makes the Quran unique?? , or ? How can you be 100% sure that this book is from God? ? or ? I know scholars who can write a better book than the Quran. What makes this book any different than the 100?s of other religious books written by literary giants. ?
Answer The Quran is not the type of book that can be written by men. The miracles of the Quran play an important role in verifying the authenticity of the book. If the signs wasn't an important part of the Quran then God wouldn?t have included it in his book.
Sura 1788 Say, "If all the humans and the Jinn were to gather to bring a Quran like this, they could not come with its like, even if they were helping one another."
The Quran is a unique book because of the message and the signs.
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I really don't see what on Earth is the problem. Code 19 or denier of both code AND extra-Quranic teachings, don't we still just believe in the Quran?
I am not a "believer". Those who beileve in the Quran without reason and evidence, believe in many other books and teachings too without reason and evidence.
Peace,
Edip -
I am not a "believer". Those who beileve in the Quran without reason and evidence, believe in many other books and teachings too without reason and evidence.
Peace,
EdipEvidence proves Rashad Khalifa was not a Messenger. He made numerous mistakes in his teachings.
"If any book contains a few lies (and we have more than just "a few", then, the endorsement of that book is not reliable." 'Quran - A Reformist Translation' Appendix 6 "Why Trash All the Hadiths as Secondary Authority Beside the Quran?", pg. 627
Allah does not make mistakes, nor forgets. Surah 482, 2052
Reason upholds if a man says he is a Messenger of Allah and makes mistakes in his teachings, fabricating falsehood, he is not a Messenger.
Reason upholds following hadith is forbidden by Allah, yet it is still upheld as proven by your removal of two ayats from your Quran translation, among other teachings by Rashad Khalifa upheld in your commentary and Appendices.He professed to represent a returning Messiah and Mahdi, teachings not found in the Quran. This is found in his newsletter and reported on submission.org
http//www.quranalone.com/SP/57_1989_09.pdf
http//www.submission.org/millennium/mahdi.htmlHe made prophecy that did not come true
http//www.quranalone.com/SP/64_1990_03.pdfHe made prophecy of when the Day of Judgment comes.
Only Allah has knowledge of the Hour. Surah 4361-66, 7227Rashad Khalifa claimed he was the Messenger of the Covenant, using Malachi 31 as proof. However, the Messenger of the Covenant is named in Malachi 45.
"See, I will send you the prophet ELIJAH before that great and dreadful day of the LORD comes."Elijah, known as Elias (pbuh), is spoken of in the Quran and the Bible. Peace and blessings on all the Prophets of Allah.
Surah 685, 37123-130, I Kings 1820-40
Rashad Khalifa is not Elias.
?And certainly We have made clear for men in this Quran every kind of description, but most men consent naught save denying.? Surah 1789Allah is clear; those who write something and say it is from Allah are Zalimun (alththalimeena); wicked, unjust, evil doers. Surah 2174-176, 394, 693, 625
?Then whoever fabricates a lie against Allah after this, these it is that are the unjust.? Surah 394The Appendices of Rashad Khalifa are nothing more than rewritten hadith.
Muhammad (pbuh) was the Seal of Prophets, the Final Messenger, as the Quran is pure, protected by Allah. As long as we have the Quran, we need no other Message.
Muhammad is Final Prophet, Seal of the Prophets Surah 3340, 381, 2213, 684-89
?And neither would he enjoin you that you should take the angels and the prophets for lords; what! would he enjoin you with unbelief after you are Muslims?? Surah 380Muhammad sent for all nations/beings Surah 3108, 690, 12104, 21107, 251, 3887, 6852, 8127, 3428, 7158, 3340, 4170, 4733, 480, 619, 21107, 479-80
Allah perfected the deen of Al-Islam during the time of Muhammad (pbuh) Surah 319, 385, 53, 6125, 974, 2192, 3922, 4917, 617
Not the people of Arabia, mankind.
There is no need for further Messengers as we still have the Truth with us today.
"Those who listen to the word, then follow the best of it; those are they whom Allah has guided, and those it is who are the men of understanding." Surah 3918Muhammad was the Messenger who verified previous Books Surah 381, 4252, 548, 241, 289, 291, 2101, 303, 692
Let us be clear Those who follow teachings outside of what Allah revealed commit idolatry.
Let us be crystal clear Those who follow the teachings of Rashad Khalifa commit idolatry. They will not be forgiven on the Day of Judgment for their shirk; it is the unforgivable sin.
We are called upon to be witnesses of Al-Islam, giving the good news and warning of the Day of Judgement Surah 9122, 2278, 353-4, 3523, 361-4, 6114
But we are not Messengers."So We have appointed to every Prophet an enemy -- Satans of men and jinn, revealing tawdry speech to each other, all as a delusion; yet, had thy Lord willed, they would never have done it. So leave them to their forging," Surah 6112
It is not too late to change your condition before your appointed term, Edip Yuksel.
Replace the two ayats removed from your translation. There is no proof they are additions, as Allah clearly states no falsehood would enter it, in the past or in the future"Those who disbelieve in the Remembrance when it comes to them -- and surely it is a Book Sublime; falsehood comes not to it from before it nor from behind it; a sending down from One All-wise, All-laudable." Surah 4141-42
Allah protects the Quran. He made this known at the time of revelation. You cannot change the words of Allah.
"It is We who have sent down the Remembrance, and We watch over it." Surah 159
Renounce the teachings of Rashad Khalifa and turn to Allah alone to guide you. You will lose many followers, of course. But does that truly matter when the Hereafter is the manifest reward, and more enduring?
Do not fear man, fear Allah.This is a reminder and a warning about associating partners with Allah.
Following teachings beside what Allah revealed is a form of idolatry. Surah 619, 931, 3031-32
If you continue on this path, then you have made your choice. Enjoy this life. Surah 1430
"and when it is said to him, 'Fear God', vainglory seizes him in his sin. So Gehenna shall be enough for him -- how evil a cradling!" Surah 2206
I'm sorry to hear you are not a believer, Edip Yuksel. It's not too late though.
"And whosoever does deeds of righteousness, be it male or female, believers (mu/minoona)- they shall enter Paradise, and not be wronged a single date-spot." Surah 4124
"Their Messengers said to them, 'We are nothing but mortals, like you; but God is gracious unto whomsoever He will of His servants. It is not for us to bring you an authority save by the leave of God; and in God let the believers (almu/minoona) put all their trust." Surah 1411Proof Guidance
http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=RcRNJNXiOc8May Allah increase the believers in knowledge.
Peace.
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Peace,
I am not a "believer".
It's obvious you also lack basic logic and remove verses out of ignorance.
7431 ...and not We have made their count only fit'natan for those kafar
It is not too late to change your condition before your appointed term, Edip Yuksel.
Replace the two ayats removed from your translation. There is no proof they are additions, as Allah clearly states no falsehood would enter it, in the past or in the futureThis absolutely and logically destroys al-kufri removing 2 verses...
4829 ?
Muhammad messenger of Allah and those who with him firm against al-kufri and merciful among themselves?1724
and lower to them wing humility of al-ramata654
and when come to you those who believe in our verses so say,
"Peace upon you, your Lord has prescribed upon Himself al-ramata
that he who among you does evil in ignorance furthermore repents after it and reforms
then indeed He oft-forgiving, ramun655 and thus We explain the Verses so that becomes manifest way the criminals.
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Evidence proves Rashad Khalifa was not a Messenger. He made numerous mistakes in his teachings.
"If any book contains a few lies (and we have more than just "a few", then, the endorsement of that book is not reliable." 'Quran - A Reformist Translation' Appendix 6 "Why Trash All the Hadiths as Secondary Authority Beside the Quran?", pg. 627
From the quotation and juxtaposition above I predict that you will most likely be confusing the LIES with ERRORS. Let's see...
Allah does not make mistakes, nor forgets. Surah 482, 2052
Considering the context you are quoting this verse, I predict that you will most likely be confusing a fallible HUMAN with GOD and you have most likely IDOLIZED a human messenger. Let's see...
Reason upholds if a man says he is a Messenger of Allah and makes mistakes in his teachings, fabricating falsehood, he is not a Messenger.
As I predicted above you are confusing the human errors and deficiencies with lying. The human messenger in your mind cannot make any error in understanding. According to you a human messenger is omniscient, that is, has the same knowledge as God. According to you Muhammad knew everyhting mentioned in the Quran, which is clearly rejected by the Quran itself.
Reason upholds following hadith is forbidden by Allah, yet it is still upheld as proven by your removal of two ayats from your Quran translation, among other teachings by Rashad Khalifa upheld in your commentary and Appendices.
I am not following any commentary or appendices of Rashad, and I never quoted Rashad for saying this or saying that. You are making up your own story about me. As for the 9128-129 in your manuscript, I do not see your point here.... Since you mentioned here is a simple question what is your evidence that those two statements are indeed part of the Quran, not later addition to the manuscript? Do you have any evidence besides a NUMBEr, the number of the people who believe so?
He professed to represent a returning Messiah and Mahdi, teachings not found in the Quran. This is found in his newsletter and reported on submission.org
http//www.quranalone.com/SP/57_1989_09.pdf
http//www.submission.org/millennium/mahdi.htmlI disagree with you framing the issue, since Rashad rejected the Sunni and Shiite beliefs in returning Messiah and Mahdi. But, like everything you tend to understand the way you wish. I will not indulge in wasting time discussing Rashad's hadith.
Unfortunately, I do not have time to respond all of your arguments and indicate your errors and distortions. For instance, I see that you distort the translation of verse about the finality of prophethood.
Peace,
Edip -
From the quotation and juxtaposition above I predict that you will most likely be confusing the LIES with ERRORS. Let's see...
Calling oneself 'the Messiah and Mahdi' is an error and not a falsehood? When the Quran does not teach this, but the additions of man teach this, and the man STATES it was revealed to him by Gabriel, you say that is an error?
Allah is very clear about those who say something is revealed to them when it is not"And who does greater evil than he who forges against God a lie, or says, 'To me it has been revealed', when naught has been revealed to him, or he who says, 'I will send down the like of what God has sent down'? If thou couldst only see when the evildoers are in the agonies of death, and the angels are stretching out their hands 'Give up your souls! Today you shall be recompensed with the chastisement of humiliation for what you said untruly about God, waxing proud against His signs.'" Surah 693
A man who says he was revealed to by Allah teachings not found anywhere in the Quran is lying; fabricating falsehood.
"Whoso forges falsehood against God after that, those are the evildoers." Surah 394
You should have checked the links, Edip.
Considering the context you are quoting this verse, I predict that you will most likely be confusing a fallible HUMAN with GOD and you have most likely IDOLIZED a human messenger. Let's see...
Who is the one upholding a fallible human's teachings and human hadith to remove ayats from the Quran, as well as uphold teachings the Quran does not teach?
Rashad Khalifa stated hadith are false teachings of man, yet he pulls from hadith to remove two ayats from the Quran to support his Code 19. His Code 19 does not work if the Quran is unchanged. And as shown earlier, Allah promised to protect the Quran and states that falsehood would not enter it in the past or in the future. Surah 4142But by removing the two ayats, you bear witness Allah did not uphold His Word.
You give ammunition to the disbelievers who come forth and say Allah did not protect the Quran by allowing falsehood to enter it over 1400 years ago.As I predicted above you are confusing the human errors and deficiencies with lying. The human messenger in your mind cannot make any error in understanding. According to you a human messenger is omniscient, that is, has the same knowledge as God. According to you Muhammad knew everyhting mentioned in the Quran, which is clearly rejected by the Quran itself.
Wrong.
Muhammad (pbuh) taught ONLY what Allah told him to say."Had he invented against Us any sayings, We would have seized him by the right hand, then We would surely have cut his life-vein and not one of you could have defended him." Surah 6944-47
Muhammad bore witness that he followed only what Allah revealed. He repeats this numerous times in the Quran. Surah 650, 7203-204, 1015, 469
No where have I stated Muhammad (pbuh) was omniscient or possessed attributes of Allah. Please avoid creating strawman rhetoric, as it only proves your foundation is made from sand, and you seek to beat up a false argument.
The statement is concerning what the man taught, and who he said he was giving him his teachings.
Rashad Khalifa changed his Quran translation to insert his name into it. He removed ayats based on teachings found in hadith, to support his false 'Code 19' doctrine. He said he was given revelation, even going to far as to meet all the Prophets (pbut) when ascended to 'heaven' during Pilgrimage.
How can a person meet all the Prophets when everyone is sleeping in the grave, and won't be returned until the Day of Judgment?
Answer He cannot.Do you deny Rashad Khalifa did any of the above?
If he did one of these actions, he is a false Messenger, as he teaches what Allah did not reveal nor upholds in the Quran.Rashad Khalifa stated he was receiving revelation and was sent as a 'Messenger of the Covenant', teachings lifted from the Bible and not from the Quran. As a person who says he receives revelation, but then makes mistakes, Allah is crystal clear
""Will they not then meditate on the Quran? And if it were from any other than Allah, they would have found in it many a discrepancy." Surah 482
You cannot hide from the teachings Rashad himself professed.
I am not following any commentary or appendices of Rashad, and I never quoted Rashad for saying this or saying that. You are making up your own story about me. As for the 9128-129 in your manuscript, I do not see your point here.... Since you mentioned here is a simple question what is your evidence that those two statements are indeed part of the Quran, not later addition to the manuscript? Do you have any evidence besides a NUMBEr, the number of the people who believe so?
You don't follow any commentary of Rashad's, nor his Appendices? Allow me to bring my proof from your own Quran translation.
In your Quran translation above Surah 381 you have 'The Messenger after All Prophets', which is a teaching of Rashad Khalifa, who would 'verify' previous Books.
The Quran was sent to verify (musaddiqun) previous Books Surah 381, 4252, 548, 241, 289, 291, 2101, 303, 692
"And when (Wa-ith) God took (akhatha Allahu) Compact of the Prophets (meethaqa alnnabiyyeena) 'That I have given you of Book and Wisdom; then there shall come to you a Messenger verifying (musaddiqun) what is with you -- you shall believe in him and you shall help him; do you agree?' He said. 'And do you take My load on you on that condition?' They said, 'We do agree.' God said, 'Bear witness so, and I shall be with you among the witnesses.'" Surah 381
"Wa-ith akhatha Allahu meethaqa alnnabiyyeena lama ataytukum min kitabin wahikmatin thumma jaakum rasoolun musaddiqun lima maAAakum latu/minunna bihi walatansurunnahu qala aaqrartum waakhathtum AAala thalikum isree qaloo aqrarna qala faishhadoo waana maAAakum mina alshshahideena" Surah 381
This Compact - promise, agreement - is with those who inherited the Book, for the Messengers of Allah verified the Book that was with them.
"And when God took compact (meethaqa) with those who had been given the Book 'You shall make it clear unto the people, and not conceal it.' But they rejected it behind their backs and sold it for a small price -- how evil was that their selling!" Surah 3187
The Quran verifies previous Books.
"And We have sent down to thee the Book with the truth, verifying (musaddiqan) the Book that was before it, and assuring it. So judge between them according to what God has sent down, and do not follow their caprices, to forsake the truth that has come to thee. To every one of you We have appointed a right way and an open road. If God had willed, He would have made you one nation; but that He may try you in what has come to you. So be you forward in good works; unto God shall you return, all together; and He will tell you of that whereon you were at variance." Surah 548
"This is a Book We have sent down, blessed and verifying (musaddiqu) that which was before it, and for thee to warn the Mother of Cities and those about her; and those who believe in the world to come believe in it, and watch over their prayers." Surah 692
"He has sent down upon thee the Book with the truth, verifying (musaddiqan) what was before it, and He sent down the Torah and the Gospel." Surah 33
"When there has come to them a Messenger (rasoolun) from God verifying (musaddiqun) what was with them, a party of them that were given the Book reject the Book of God behind their backs, as though they knew not," Surah 2101
"And believe in that I have sent down, verifying (musaddiqan) that which is with you, and be not the first to disbelieve in it. And sell not My signs for a little price; and fear you Me." Surah 241
Surah 337-8 speaks of the Covenant and Compacts taken by those sent the Messengers; an agreement Allah takes with all who submit their will to Him
"And remember God's blessing upon you, and His compact (wameethaqahu) which He made with you when you said, 'We have heard and we obey. And fear you God; surely God knows the thoughts in the breasts." Surah 57
"And when We took Compact (meethaqahum) of the Prophets, and from thee, and from Noah, and Abraham, Moses, and Isa, Mary's son; We took from them a solemn compact (meethaqan) that He might question the truthful concerning their truthfulness; and He has prepared for the unbelievers a painful chastisement." Surah 337-8
Covenant and Compact of the Book and Prophets Surah 227, 263, 283-84, 377, 381, 3187, 57, 512-14, 570, 6152, 7169, 1320, 1325, 1691, 1695, 1734, 1978, 3315, 3323, 4810, 578
Compact/agreement (meethaqan) 421, 490, 492, 856, 872, 1266, 1280"And We took compact (meethaqa)with the Children of Israel, and We sent Messengers (rusulan) to them. Whensoever there came to them a Messenger (rasoolun) with that their souls had not desire for, some they cried lies to, and some they slew." Surah 570
"And there succeeded after them a succession who inherited the Book, taking the chance goods of this lower world, and saying, 'It will be forgiven us'; and if chance goods the like of them come to them, they will take them. Has not the compact of the Book (meethaqu alkitabi) been taken touching them, that they should say concerning God nothing but the truth? And they have studied what is in it; and the Last Abode is better for those who are godfearing. Do you not understand?" Surah 7169
"such as break the covenant of God after its solemn binding (meethaqihi), and such as cut what God has commanded should be joined, and such as do corruption in the land -- they shall be the losers." Surah 287
"And those who break the covenant of God after His compact (meethaqihi), and who snap what God has commanded to be joined, and who work corruption in the earth -- theirs shall be the curse, and theirs the Evil Abode." Surah 1325
"How is it with you, that you believe not in God seeing that the Messenger is calling you to believe in your Lord, and He has taken compact (meethaqakum) with you, if you are believers?" Surah 578
"God took compact (meethaqa)with the Children of Israel; and We raised up from among them twelve chieftains. And God said, 'I am with you. Surely, if you perform the prayer, and pay the alms, and believe in My Messengers and succour them, and lend to God a good loan, I will acquit you of your evil deeds, and I will admit you to gardens underneath which rivers flow. So whosoever of you thereafter disbelieves, surely he has gone astray from the right way. "
So for their breaking their compact (meethaqahum) We cursed them and made their hearts hard, they perverting words from their meanings; and they have forgotten a portion of that they were reminded of; and thou wilt never cease to light upon some act of treachery on their part, except a few of them. Yet pardon them, and forgive; surely God loves the good-doers.
And with those who say 'We are Christians' We took compact (meethaqahum); and they have forgotten a portion of that they were reminded of. So We have stirred up among them enmity and hatred, till the Day of Resurrection; and God will assuredly tell them of the things they wrought." Surah 513-14"So, for their breaking the compact (meethaqahum), and disbelieving in the signs of God, and slaying the Prophets without right, and for their saying, 'Our hearts are uncircumcised' -- nay, but God sealed them for their unbelief, so they believe not, except a few --" Surah 4155
In your Appendix 3, you even quote Rashad's Quran translation "Simple To Understand, Impossible To Imitate". You use the same teachings as found in his Appendices to 'prove' Code 19, even giving detailed description of Rashad Khalifa and his life. Do you want me to go through your entire Quran and post the numerous recycled teachings therein?
There are more than 9, Edip.
And you continue to uphold numerous other teachings found in hadith, copied into Rashad's Appendices, and continued in your translation/Appendices. Granted, you add new teachings like allowing abortion, but the focus of this dialogue is on what you are recycling, not the new fabrications in your translation Appendices.I disagree with you framing the issue, since Rashad rejected the Sunni and Shiite beliefs in returning Messiah and Mahdi. But, like everything you tend to understand the way you wish. I will not indulge in wasting time discussing Rashad's hadith.
Let's quote his words as shown on his newsletter and on the website, shall we?
"Through Gabriel; I was commanded to make this announcement AFTER I DIE MILLIONS OF BELIEVERS WILL KNOW That I represent the Messiah the Jews have been waiting for, the Christ Christians have been expecting, the Mehdi the Muslims have been praying for? I am God's Messenger of the Covenant."
Does not sound like he rejected the beliefs in a returning Messiah and Mahdi if he is proclaiming himself to be those individuals. Proof is from his own words.
Unfortunately, I do not have time to respond all of your arguments and indicate your errors and distortions. For instance, I see that you distort the translation of verse about the finality of prophethood.
Then insha'Allah, if you ever find the time Respond. I will bring proof from the Quran to support why I believe what I believe.
Until you respond, they are unanswered."Then if they do not answer thee, know that they are only following their caprices; and who is further astray than he who follows his caprice without guidance from God? Surely God guides not the people of the evildoers." Surah 2850
My obligation is only to remind and warn, Edip. I have done so and will continue to respond to you using proof from the Quran, insha'Allah.
To me are my deeds and to you are your own. I won't be asked what you did, and on the Day of Judgment we will see who is rightly guided and who was led astray by teachings of satans.
But you cannot say you were not warned.May Allah guide us closer to the Truth.
Peace.
