"Hebrew", the Children of Israel, and the Semitic Migrations
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Originated in the Levant?
Well allow me to say Sorry Jafar, but you are dead wrong.
Arabia is the source of all Semitic migrations. The so-called Phoenicians, originally came from the coast of the Red Sea, in South West Arabia, where they were sea-faring people. They migrated North to the Levant, and became sea-faring peoples of the Meditteranean.
The "Phoenicians" were a cousins of The Assyrians which were a cousin of "Indo-Iranian" people coming from the north.
http//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andronovo_culture
That explained the many similarities between Phoenicians script and Assyrian Aramaic script..
And we're talking about 3000-1500 BC here...Why don't you look at this "Phoenician" alphabet of yours, and pay close attention to the letters
aleph - ba- ja - da- ha- wa - z.....notice anything familiar??
It is the exact same as the Arabic alphabet, with the exception of 6 missing letters. You expect me to believe that these people magically "appeared" in the Levant and brought with them the SAME alphabet that was spoken as far south as Yemen?
Of course the so-called 'Arabic alphabet' IS a derivation and extension from phoenician script..
It influence then grew far south to Yemen and Ethiophia....Of course, the arrogant Lebanese, who think that God created them and then broke the mold, are always boasting about how their "ancestors", the Phoenicians, invented the alphabet. But the truth is, they invented NOTHING. The people of Sheba and Thamud had their own written alphabet since before 1500 BC.
Lebanese unlike the Yemenites doesn't see that "God created them and then broke the mold" or let alone 'boasting about their ancestor the Phoenicians'.. Lebanese doesn't have that crisis of 'identity and pride' which commonly felt among Yemenites today...
You can check for yourself, a sample of a Sheban inscription unearthed near Hadaramawt (I wonder why "Hazaramaveth" is mentioned BY NAME in the Torah hmm). This carved block sits in the Louvre Museum, and is alone enough to expose Jafar's false beliefs.
http//commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/FilePanel_Almaqah_Louvre_DAO18.jpg
I've check it and it's dated 700 BC!! And not 1500 BC as you claimed earlier..
Stop the delusion.. Pazuzu//Jafar continues to stubbornly deny what the anthropologists of the 19th and 20th Century have confirmed concerning the origin of the Phoenicians, and how they reiterated the very same truth that was known to the ancient Greeks and Romans, who had combed every inch of the Levant area.
Yes of course the Greeks and Romans basic intentions was Invasion...
They will try to show that those 'filthy native people' are just a bunch of 'barbarians'.. subject for 'slavery' or 'massacres'...Little did the Romans knew that The Phoenicians was in fact their ancestor as well....
Greek boys f***d Phoenicians girls and VOILA.. The Romans is born...It's strange for me to find that you trust "Herodotus" and his cohorts.. the 'imperialist' of ancient times..
I tell you that their attitude are MUCH WORSE than today's Zionist...Of course, Jafar can never be convinced. He will label Herodotus as "delusional", or accuse him of inventing lies, because no matter what proofs are brought before him that the Phoenicians, along with their miserable alphabet, came from Arabia, he will still stubbornly refuse the truth.
My friend I think you should snap out from your dream....
But Jafar will continue to insist that the Phoenicians magically "appeared" on the Mediterranean coast.
No they didn't... see above...
Most definitely THEY"RE NOT COMING FROM YEMEN!And I'm telling you now that THERE WAS NEVER SUCH THING AS A HEBREW LANGUAGE. EVER.
This is a Zionist invention.
The so-called "hebrew" alphabet you see today is the squared Aramaic script!!As there were never such thing as "ARABIC LANGUAGE" either...
This is "Arab Nationalist" invention...Yemen is the origin of Judaism.
Right.. Yemen is the origin of ALL THINGS.. just like you said.. (or perhaps just like you dream of)
Adam was in Yemen, Eve was in Yemen, Noah was in Yemen, Enoch was in Yemen, Abraham was in Yemen, Lot was in Yemen, Pharaoh was in Yemen, Moses was in Yemen, Muhammad was in Yemen, Mike Tyson was in Yemen, Isaac Newton was in Yemen.
Yemen is the source of Gold, Silver, Silk, Incense.. and all of the sort of valuable resources.
Yemen is the holy land.. while those area outside Yemen were just a filthy unholy land which contains nothing...
Yemenites is the 'choosen people' and non-Yemenites are lesser people who should be subjugated to serves Yemenites..Hmmmm sounds familiar?
But then again.. there are no compulsion in judgement as truth stands out clear from error..
You are free to believe anything that you want..Salam / Peace
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PS If one try to analyze the historical facts.. he/she should do it 'objectively'.. and not letting 'today's political conflict' and/or one's own nationality / social identity or hatred and enmity towards certain group of people clouded his/her judgement...
Salam / Peace
Salaam Jafar
You gave a link from wikipedia so did I, in what way its biased and not objective confused
It is an obligation upon all believers to search for the truth and to strive against wrong. To expose a tyrant country, which prides itself in being the only democracy in ME , and whose people have had access to the best education yet behave like savages is doing God's work. The Zionist entity that calls itself Israel is at present responsible for most conflicts in the world, all because they use the books of Allah to claim superiority over the whole world. No it's clearly our duty as Muslims to expose that lie against Allah.
I have had the opportunity to go to university with Israeli students and I was aghast at the arrogance of those students when treated as equal to the rest of us. I pitied them seeing that it was not their fault. They have been fed this lie, that Israelis are a superior race, since childhood and the sooner they learn that they are not superior to any other race the better it will be for them.That said I have searched my soul to see if it's inbread predjuce which shaped my reply to you and after sleeping on it I assert that I have nothing whatsoever against Jews, Christians or Sunnis etc so long as they adhere to the best of conduct.
Allah says in the Qur'an 49;13 O mankind! We created you from a single (pair) of a male and a female, and made you into nations and tribes, that ye may know each other (not that ye may despise each other). Verily the most honoured of you in the sight of Allah is (he who is) the most righteous of you. And Allah has full knowledge and is well acquainted
This and many other ayat from the Qur'an confirm that Allah has not given superiotiy to any one group of people due to their origin. However, when we read in the Qur'an that the children of Israel were favoured over the rest of the world it seems to conflict, but wiith Pazuzu's findings this puzzle is resolved. All three books were given to the children of Israel in the same area and they were reminded of this favour over the rest of the world, but this favour was conditioned on keeping the covenant with God. The people of the book were not required to desert their book in favour of the final revelation. This shows that God did not make any book to be superior over others as they are all part of the same revelation, but He expects us all to follow our respective covenant and uphold His word to the rest of the world.
peace
PS Even brother SEid agrees Yes they spoke the same semitic mother root language/tree...
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9601944.10 -
Hi,
now the propanganda goes one step forward and link the U.S. natives to hebrew, this is better done on a media propaganda channel they have
http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=NgnRN-GOLLI&feature=relatedThey still speaks about hebrew when all linguist know a simple fact
hebrew-samaritan-phoenician alphabet is the same!!!!!!But still it is their discoveries thus their alphabet 0
It makes me think the same when they say
"We protect democracy all around the world" like if they were the owner and inventor of that system!!!!!peace
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Peace everyone peace
Hebrew and Aramaic are both sister language which have been historically both used by the Hebrew People.
Some of the Bible books were written in Aramaic, and there are some refrences to aramaic words in the Torah itself (e.g Laban, uncle of Jacob (who was from Paddan-aram) called the pile of stones Yegar- sahadutha (Aramaic) but Jacob called it Gal-Ed (Hebrew for "heap of witness".Also, the Quran Cites a Language used which is the tongue of David and Jesus. If you read David's Psalms, you will see that they are in Hebrew. Also, Jesus must have known some Aramaic, as some biblical books are again written in Aramaic, and also because it can be said that it was the lingua franca during that time period.
"Condemned are those who disbelieved among the Children of Israel, by the tongue of David and Jesus, the son of Mary. This is because they disobeyed and transgressed.(Quran 57
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Salaam Jafar
You gave a link from wikipedia so did I, in what way its biased and not objective confused
It is an obligation upon all believers to search for the truth and to strive against wrong. To expose a tyrant country, which prides itself in being the only democracy in ME , and whose people have had access to the best education yet behave like savages is doing God's work. The Zionist entity that calls itself Israel is at present responsible for most conflicts in the world, all because they use the books of Allah to claim superiority over the whole world. No it's clearly our duty as Muslims to expose that lie against Allah.
I have had the opportunity to go to university with Israeli students and I was aghast at the arrogance of those students when treated as equal to the rest of us. I pitied them seeing that it was not their fault. They have been fed this lie, that Israelis are a superior race, since childhood and the sooner they learn that they are not superior to any other race the better it will be for them.That said I have searched my soul to see if it's inbread predjuce which shaped my reply to you and after sleeping on it I assert that I have nothing whatsoever against Jews, Christians or Sunnis etc so long as they adhere to the best of conduct.
Allah says in the Qur'an 49;13 O mankind! We created you from a single (pair) of a male and a female, and made you into nations and tribes, that ye may know each other (not that ye may despise each other). Verily the most honoured of you in the sight of Allah is (he who is) the most righteous of you. And Allah has full knowledge and is well acquainted
This and many other ayat from the Qur'an confirm that Allah has not given superiotiy to any one group of people due to their origin. However, when we read in the Qur'an that the children of Israel were favoured over the rest of the world it seems to conflict, but wiith Pazuzu's findings this puzzle is resolved. All three books were given to the children of Israel in the same area and they were reminded of this favour over the rest of the world, but this favour was conditioned on keeping the covenant with God. The people of the book were not required to desert their book in favour of the final revelation. This shows that God did not make any book to be superior over others as they are all part of the same revelation, but He expects us all to follow our respective covenant and uphold His word to the rest of the world.
peace
PS Even brother SEid agrees Yes they spoke the same semitic mother root language/tree...
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9601944.10God has favoured all peoples, in one way or another. There are no priviledged people. To think on one's people as more favoured is only a temptation to vanity and going astray. Each peopla has its destiny, all of them created by God and all of them equally worth living.
In my view all the bible talk about chosen people and the expectation of a redeemer who must come from such and such people is an invitiation to distortion of the real destiny of humanity and of the fraternity of all peoples and persons and their equal worth. More favoured in respective things, closer to God, or with advantage over others, no.
And the Qur'an says prophets have been sent to all people. This is very forgotten. The lineage that is talked of in the Qur'an is simply an ilustration of general Prophethood in each circumstance, it is not a reduction or a list of the Prophets or the best rophets and that is also one reason why, plce or age does not matter particularly, because we are not concerned with unique circumstances that may be necessary for anything. Something in the sense of Those are prophets, there are many, but a prophet may be like this. It is not to be taken as something exclusive.
Muslims, followers of the Qur'an have been very much taken in the trap of linking their history and meaning to some Christian or Judaic patent, as if they were of the same stock, but it is not so. Qur'an is universal, all peoples have had prophets. We are not bound to any lineage because we had to wait for some messiah or other. We may not know them all world's prophets are our Prophets, and that is why we are not interested in any particular plight of any people in history as more significant than any other. All plights are significant. An that is why it is silly to expect that God is intent in setting this or that in Egypt or in Arabia or wherever, although, if the revelation is made to Muhammad it is logic that the revelation is going to illustrate its messages in those themes that are close to the people among which Muhammad lives and has grown, and not on the anciente history of ppeoples which are not the immediate matter of those among which he lives. The revelations desended in Japan or Mexico will relate to those themes that are known to the people of Japan or Mexico, logically.
An universal culture has been greatly dammaged by that exclusivity of Prophethood claimed by the Judaic-Christian tradition.The Qur'an does not support exclusivity nor uniqueness of revelation and that is why I support Pazuzu's efforts of the efforts of anyone who wants to undo the dammage caused by monopolistic religion.
A time will come, I hope, in which people know more about other traditions and other revelations and assumme fully that it "has always rained over all of humanity" and not just over a few handpicked.
Salaam
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....The Qur'an does not support exclusivity nor uniqueness of revelation and that is why I support Pazuzu's efforts of the efforts of anyone who wants to undo the dammage caused by monopolistic religion.
.......
A time will come, I hope, in which people know more about other traditions and other revelations and assumme fully that it "has always rained over all of humanity" and not just over a few handpicked.Salaam
Salaam
Had We sent down this Qur'an on a mountain, verily, thou would have seen it humble itself and cleave asunder for fear of Allah, such are the similitudes which We propound to men, that they may reflect.
Humility, not arrogance is the trait of those who made a covenant with God and accepted to convey the word forward. It's not just a privilege but a trust given to us humans.
peace -
Peace everyone group
I would think arrogance/pride/racism should be deemed a psychological disorder D
I mean look at all of us, God Guided us to this, and we're from all over the world!
God's Grace is infinite; The Jews, the Christians, and even the Muslims do not own His Grance;
no one owns his grace!
Who has not sinned? Who is pure and 100% perfect?
Have you note noted the Doctrine of Jesus? "Whoever Exalted himself will be debased" and "Whoever Humbles Himself will be exalted". This is the truth because the Devil is the most profound example i can cite.518 "And the Jews and the Nazarenes said "We are the children of God, and His loved ones." Say "Then why does He punish you for your sins?" No, you are merely human beings which He has created. He forgives whom He pleases, and He punishes whom He pleases. And to God is the sovereignty of the heavens and the earth and all that is in-between, and to Him is the destiny.
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Salaam Pazuzu
On your first post you show a burner with Aramaic writing. You say it was dug up in South Arabia, near Najran, but I did not find this information on the website of the Saudi National Museum. I found the burner, though, under Aramaic inscriptions. Can you please give a link? It would also be helpful if other proof on Aramaic being found in South Arabia so as not to consider the burner a one-off non specific incident.
As far as I know, the ancient language of South Arabia is the Sabaean. Such links will change a lot of theories built on my understanding.
This is a copy paste from the site of the Saudi Museum
Notes on the Origin and Development of Writing in Arabia
It is generally thought that writing gradually developed from the human, animal and other figures that prehistoric artists had been depicting on rocks for thousands of years before the first alphabets. Thousands of petroglyphs are located all over the Arabian Peninsula. To many observers, the various phases of rock art suggest that such images were initially created as an aesthetic activity, but they later became increasingly symbolic and semantic.
Writing was an important means of communication between the Arabian Peninsula and the civilizations of Mesopotamia, Syria and Egypt. Writing is thought to have originated around 3500 BC in Mesopotamia and perhaps originated independently in Egypt as well. The oldest scripts are known as Cuneiform in Mesopotamia and Hieroglyphic in Egypt. These writing systems had developed over time from the use of pictographs, signs and symbols. The available evidence suggests that writing might have developed in the Arabian Peninsula from the early Sinatic script around 2000 - 1500 BC.
By around 1000 BC two families of ancient writings had developed in the Arabian Peninsula. The one in the north (the North Arabic family) was called Musnad al-Shamali and the one in southern Arabia (the South Arabic family) was called Musnad al-Janubi.
Musnad al-Shamali (North Arabic) spread out around the first millennium BC through northern Arabia, and from this developed the Lihyanite, Safaitic and Aramaic writing systems, which flourished in the north of Arabia around the middle of the first millennium BC. From Aramaic Nabataean script and from Nabataean, Arabic writing developed.
Meanwhile the use of South Arabic forms of writing also expanded, and developed into the Sabaean, Qatabani, Hadrami, and Hassanean scripts.
With the rise of Islam, Arabic spread all over the region, both north and south, and the more ancient writing forms vanished. Thus none of these other writing systems has been in common use in Arabia for around 1,400 years.
http//www.mnh.si.edu/epigraphy/e_pre-islamic/preislamic.htm
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Salaam Pazuzu
On your first post you show a burner with Aramaic writing. You say it was dug up in South Arabia, near Najran, but I did not find this information on the website of the Saudi National Museum. I found the burner, though, under Aramaic inscriptions. Can you please give a link? It would also be helpful if other proof on Aramaic being found in South Arabia so as not to consider the burner a one-off non specific incident.
As far as I know, the ancient language of South Arabia is the Sabaean. Such links will change a lot of theories built on my understanding.
This is a copy paste from the site of the Saudi Museum
Yes, the oldest written alphabet in Arabia was Sabaean (Sheban), which dates back to somewhere between 2000 BC and 1500 BC ( although Thamudic also vies for this).
I did not have access to the link for the Museum website. Thank you for bringing this to my attention. The information I got was from an article written by a group of people of Bahrainy, Iraqi, and Saudi Arabian nationality. These were the same people who co-wrote the book "Nida'a al Surat" (Call of the Heights). There is no one single author who claims the rights to that book.
Perhaps they spoke with the Museum curator and he told them this information (that the insense burner was uncovered in the south of Saudi Arabia??).. Anyway, how else could it be? The Saudis have not been known to STEAL archeological artifacts from OTHER'S lands and put them on display in their own museums, have they?? This is only something the CIVILIZED WEST is famous for doing. (Which explains the presence of Sheban inscriptions in the LOUVRE Museum of Paris).
Anyway, thank you for the link. I will definately check it out again and see what I can find.
Peace...
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Dear Samia...
I just realized something. On the Home Page of that website, it clearly states that all the inscriptions on the site were discovered in Saudi Arabia.
Regards...
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Good day to all.
The following thread will not be as long as the other two. I will make no more than 3 posts here. I urge you to read this, because it is like a bridge which connects the two other threads.
Regards.
To Be ContinuedSalaam Pazuzu
Looking forward to your next post on this subject.
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Dear Samia...
I just realized something. On the Home Page of that website, it clearly states that all the inscriptions on the site were discovered in Saudi Arabia.
Regards...
Hello Pazuzu
Yes I know, precisely in the Arabian Peninsula.
But Arabia is a vast Peninsula. Some pieces were discovered in the South, some in the North.
The site also speaks of two big language families Aramaic in the North and Sabean in the South.
For the Aramaic inscription it shows this vase on the page I copy-pasted, but could not copy paste the photos; and for the Sabean it shows the stone of Abraha found in Yemen. However, it does not say where exactly the vase was found, and this was my question how you knew it was found in the South.If the vase was found anywhere in the North, then it is normal. If it was found in the South, then to have any significance, more inscriptions in Aramaic should be found besides it, or we should expect some commentary from Archaeologist as to why it was there, contrary to their own theory concerning the distribution of languages as explained on the same page.
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Peace @huruf,
you need to be extremely careful...
Allah in the Quran says that no community is punished unless it has been warned with a Messenger...
It goes on to say that all communities have been sent Messengers, as Allah is Just and does not deny His guidance to anyone...
On the subject of Prophethood, not once does it say that all communities had Prophets from among them, and when it refers to Prophets, it refers to them by name, and/or through lineage...
The overwhelming majority of the Prophets cited in the Quran are from the progeny of Abraham...
This leads to the conjecture (not necessarily true) of the possibility that Prophethood was solely granted from among the descendants of Abraham, and Allah knows best...That being said, the only one who decides what capabilities are granted to Messengers and Prophets is Allah Himself, this is why as an article of faith we are ordered (a commandment) not to distinguish among any of them... This is Allah's business, and He grants His favour to whomever He pleases...
Our business, and duty is to obey His commandments, i.e. to hear and obey... no other choice for any who wishes to be a Believer and enters Allah's Grace and Mercy...
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- ?Hebrew? ? A Language, or a Description?
Whenever this word ?Hebrew? is mentioned, it immediately brings to our minds a nation or a people who have embraced Judaism as their creed, who speak a certain language that has been decreed exclusively for them by God, and who consider the Old Testament to be their sacred text.
But is this what the word really means? Or was the term given ? for political reasons ? a meaning that was different from its original context, in order to create the illusion of a ?chosen people? racially superior to all others?
We have seen from the previous post that this language ?Hebrew? never existed in the first place. And what we hear the ?Israelis? speaking today is a corrupted form of Aramaic that was created, from scratch, by the Zionist movement in the early 20th century, and infused with the rural Yiddish dialect of Germany, as well as hundreds of Arabic words. And the proof is that the elderly generation who migrated to Palestine, their alleged "Promised Land?, had never even heard of this language, and were forced to learn it from the younger generation.
The truth we are about to reveal, which only few people are aware of, is that the word ?Hebrew? or ?3ibri - 3ibrani? (singular) / "3ibriyyoun" (plural) is an Arabic term, more precisely an adjective, used to describe those who have ?crossed over?, or ?crossed from one region to another?. In fact, the word ?3ubour? (crossing a region, river, valley, etc?) is derived from it.
So does this word really carry in its meaning a certain people who have a special exclusive language, and who follow a certain creed?
If we look in the old and forgotten books of the Arab geographers, we can see glaring clues as to the real meaning of the word ?3ibri?.
For example, geographer and historian Yaqoot al-Hamwi gives us the following explanation
" ..."
What is Yaqoot saying here?
Translation .Source Yaqoot (Mu3jam al Buldan - Vol 4 - page 7
Another prominent geographer, Al- Bakri al- Andalusi casts more light on the subject, in his book entitled ?Mu3jam ma Stu3jam?. Here is what he says
. .
What is al-Andalusi trying to tell us?
He begins by giving us a geographical definition of ?Tahama? (This is the same "Tahum" which appears 30 times in the original Aramaic Torah, and has left Biblical scholars dumbfounded as to its meaning). "Tahama" - - is a coastal area along the Red Sea (?ma sayara al-bahri?) which includes ? among other locations Mecca, Al-3ibr, Al-Tur, and Al-Jazeera. So the ?3ibr? is within Tahama, which is a greater coastal region that also includes the valley where Mecca lies today. Then he gives the same definition of this ?3ibr? as Yaqoot al Hamwi, by saying ?the area stretching from the Phorat across the Arabian wilderness?.
Al-Andalusi and Yaqoobi are basically telling us
1- That there was a wilderness area known to the Arabs as ?al-3ibr?, which was part of Tahama (the coastal region extending from Mecca, all the way to the ?elbow? of Arabia in Yemen).
2- This area was bounded by the Red Sea coast on one side, and by the Phorat on the other.
3- ALL those who "cross" (ya3bur) this area of the wilderness near the coastal strip ( ?3ibr?), and make their way towards the Surat Mountains (The Heights) along the Red Sea coast were called ?3ibran? or ?3ibraniyyeen? (HEBREWS).
ANd among them were the Jews, when they crossed the Phorat.Hence, ?Hebrew? was an adjective - a label - given by the inhabitants of the Tahama coastal region and its mountains to all those who came from across the wilderness of Arabia, seeking sanctuary in the shades and streams of the Surat.
Included in the region of Tahama is also a very famous mountain known to the Arabs for ages untold. They called it "al-Tur". And I will tell you now what it means, and prove to you that it is NOT in the Sinai Pennisula.
The Quran calls it ?Tur Seeneen? (NOT ?Tur Sinai?). And the word ?seeneen? is a PLURAL noun. The question is A plural of what?
There is a very well known tree which grows in the mountainous regions of Western Arabia called ?seeniya? (shajarat al-seeniya). If you go and investigate this further, you will see that it is the same tree which they call, in the common Arabic, ?al-3ulleiq? .
Now, if you look it up in a translator, you get ?BRAMBLE?
Here is what Ibn Manzhour tells us in ?lisan al Arab? about the word ?seeneen?
Note the underlined definition he gives us Al-Seeniyya = a type of tree. The plural form is "seeneen".
What this means is that the ?Tur? mentioned in the Quran is a wooded mountain, on which several kinds of trees grow. In fact, the Quran talks about another tree in that mountain
{And a tree which emerges from the Tur Sineen (the mountain of brambles), grows oil and is a relish for those who eat} ?
What is this tree being mentioned here? Does this sound like it's in the desert in the middle of the Sinai Pennisula? Has anyone ever PROVEN that the mountain the Jews worship over there was called "Al-Tur"? Moreover, how did the word ?seeneen?, a plural noun which appears in the Quran indicating a type of tree (bramble), become the proper noun "Sinai", given to the pennisula east of Egypt?
Going back to the issue of ?Hebrews?, we can conclude that the word means ?those who have crossed over? . And we have seen where this area of crossing over is, in relation to Tahama (the coastal strip of Arabia).
The question is How did this adjective, which the inhabitants of Tahama used to describe ANY and ALL who crossed over the wilderness and came to settle in their mountainous region, become a term EXCLUSIVELY used for the Children of Israel?
This is another of the many forgeries which they perpetrated to hide the true identity of the Israelites. The truth of the matter is that Abraham (P) was called ?Hebrew? in the Torah. Why is that so? The OT texts speak of Abraham as "The Hebrew", and elsewhere as ?The lost Aramian? (meaning that he was looking for a place to settle). This is because Abraham was among the first to ?cross over? and settle in the region of Tahama. Interestingly, the Torah NEVER uses the term ?Hebrew? to describe Abraham?s sons, Ismael and Isaac. Why is that so? Could it be because they didn?t cross over with their father? Could it be because they were BORN in the region of Tahama? Nowehere in the Torah do we read about ?Ismael the Hebrew? or ?Isaac the Hebrew? or even ?Jacob the Hebrew?. But we do read about ?Joseph the Hebrew? for reasons that we will show you very soon. (What I am trying to tell you here is that the Torah describes Abraham as ?Hebrew?. Then, this term disappears and is not mentioned anywhere in relation to his descendants Ismael, Isaac, and Jacob, only to re-appear again with the mention of Joseph). This is very important and needs to be looked into. The descendants of Abraham did not migrate across the Arabian wilderness to the coastal mountain region. They were born IN the region of Tahama. So technically, theye were descendants of a Hebrew, but were not Hebrews themselves. They were simply "Israelites".
The proof that the word ?Hebrew? does not indicate a language or a particular ?Pure and Chosen Race? is found in the Torah itself.
Take a look at the following passages from the Old Testament, which talks about one of the many laws that Moses is claimed to have taught his people
"Now these the judgments which you shall set before them "If you buy a Hebrew servant, he shall serve six years; and in the seventh he shall go out free and pay nothing. "If he comes in by himself, he shall go out by himself; if he married, then his wife shall go out with him. "If his master has given him a wife, and she has borne him sons or daughters, the wife and her children shall be her master's, and he shall go out by himself. "But if the servant plainly says, 'I love my master, my wife, and my children; I will not go out free,' "then his master shall bring him to the judges. He shall also bring him to the door, or to the doorpost, and his master shall pierce his ear with an awl; and he shall serve him forever? (Exodus 21 2-6)
These regulations given by Moses to the Israelites clearly distinguish between the Israelites themselves (who, by that time, were established in the Tahama area, near the ancient trade routes), and the slaves, among whom were Hebrews who ?crossed over? towards the new homeland of the Israelites. The latter were bought and sold as SLAVES, and this was absolutely FORBIDDEN to the Israelites to do it among themselves! Has anyone ever heard of an Israelite (a member of ?God?s Chosen People?) buying or selling another Israelite as a slave?
But then, why is Joseph called ?Hebrew??? Wasn?t he too, born in the Tahama region?
This is because the inhabitants of the Tahama region of Arabia, who had control of the entire coastal region (including the trade routes) still considered the later generations of Israelites as being somewhat ?beneath them?, and looked upon them with some kind of contempt. As such, Joseph in particular was still considered ?Hebrew?, even though he was born in that region. (It is because his ancestor, Abraham, was not originally from that land, but migrated to there)
This is why, we read in the Torah as well, the following passage
So they set him a place by himself, and them by themselves, and the Egyptians who ate with him by themselves; because the Egyptians could not eat food with the Hebrews, for that an abomination to the Egyptians. (Genesis 4332)
Pay attention to the context of the word ?Egyptians? in the above text. In the original Aramaic text, the word we see is ?Misrim?.
What the passage is saying is The MISRIM could not eat food with the Hebrews (because they were disgusted by them, and viewed them as beneath their station).
The Septuagint criminals, however, perpetrated a blatant forgery by replacing the word MISRIM (or ?msrm? as it appears in the original, silent, Aramic text), with ?Aegypto".
But I will show you now how their forgery was exposed
Whenever someone forges a text, he is bound to make a mistake somewhere, which gives away his crime. Among the glaring forgeries that were perpetrated by the Septuagint priests (which suited the interests of the Ptolemic rulers of Egypt), was that they looked for every single instance of the word ?Misrim?, and replaced it with ?Aegypto?. But there was one instance that they mistakenly failed to pay attention to. There is one passage in their forged Torah which mentions ?Misrim? in its true context
Take a look at this please
If the Tribe of Egypt will not come up and enter in, they no they shall receive the plague with which the LORD strikes the nations who do not come up to keep the Feast of Tabernacles. (Zecheriah 141
Why is "Egypt" being described here as a ?tribe? ??? (in some modern translations of the Torah, the passage mentions ?family of Egypt?, while in others we read ?clan of Egypt?).
My question to you is the following
Has anyone EVER heard of Egypt being described as a "tribe" or a "clan"?
If you look at the original Aramaic text of Zecheriah, it says ?Mishfaht Misrim?. The word ?Mishfaht? is an Aramaic word meaning TRIBE.
Also, the two letters ?i? and ?m? added to the ends of words are used to denote the plural tense in the Aramaic dialect. This is also the exact same phenomenon which we encounter in the Old Yemeni (Himyarite) dialect, and is only ONE of the DOZENS of similarities between the two, proving that they all originated in the same geographical region.
Here are other examples of this Aramaic plural form
Eloh ? Elohim (god ? gods)
Cherub ? Cherubim (angel ? angels)
Katub ? Katubim (book ? books)
Himyar ? Himyarim (Himyarite ? Himyarites)
Msr ? Msrim (MISR ? MISRAIM)So the word MSRM is the plural form of MSR. (This is exactly how it appears in the original Aramaic text, which did not contain vowels).
So what is MSR then? According to the passage of Zacharia, it is a TRIBE. And this tribe had control of the Tahama region of Arabia. Furthermore, The ?s? in ?MSR? is the heavy ?sadd? sound, which in Arabic is pronounced . This is why the name is written in the Arabic translations (NOT ).
So the text is talking about the TRIBE OF MSR
And these people are the same MSRM (in the plural tense) who were disgusted at the idea of eating with Joseph the ?Hebrew? (whose ancestors were outsiders and had migrated to their region, and where therefore looked upon with disdain).
And they were NOT Egyptians.
Abraham never set foot in Egypt, nor did his descendents.
So who are those people then? What is this TRIBE of MSR??
I will not reveal this information here. I will leave it for a special thread about Abraham?s journey. So I will let you guess and do some research. But I will give you three clues
1- There was once, long ago, a GIGANTIC tribe in Arabia, which included many clans within its fold. And this tribe was so legendary, that it is now commonly known to all historians, and is mentioned in many verses of ancient Arabic poetry.
2- The various clans of this huge tribe lived in the region known as Tahama - (The "Tahum" of the Aramaic Torah), and had control of the Red Sea Coast of the Hijaz, and Asir.
3- The Aramaic version of the name is MSR (with the heavy ?s? sound), which differs from the Arabic version of the name, because there are 6 letters in the Arabic alphabet not found in Aramaic.
So I leave it up to you, for now, to try to figure out who they are, while also keeping in mind that the following website (link below) came VERY, VERY close to the truth concerning the identity of ?MISRM?
http//oce.catholic.com/index.php?title=Arabia
(scroll down to the 12th paragraph THE NORTH-ARABIAN MUSRI AND THE OLD TESTAMENT MISRAIM ).So scratch your heads a bit, dear readers, and try to crack this puzzle who is the Tribe of Misrm? And when you do find the answer, you will know immediately that you have, because your jaw will probably drop to the floor.
We conclude from all of the above, that the term ?Hebrew? simply means ?Those who have migrated or crossed-over from one region to another?. And in the context of our subject it has now become clear
The Bani Israel were the grand-children (descendants) of Abraham, the Hebrew (3abrani) who had migrated / crossed (3abar) the wilderness of Arabia and settled in the mountainous and fertile region of Asir, which Allah describes as the ?Blessed Land? (because of its rich resources, fruits, and many fresh water streams and rivers). This land was home to the legendary Arab tribe of MSR (as the name is spelled in Aramaic, due to the LACK OF A CERTAIN ALPHABETICAL LETTER).
So the Israelites were not the only "Hebrews". They were among those who had ?crossed over? from the wilderness of Arabia to its shady and fertile mountainous regions. ANY and ALL who migrated in this same manner were given the label of ?Hebrews? (3abran) by the inhabitants of Tahama.
And this Arabic term ?3abrani? is still used even today in some Arab countries, like Jordan or Syria, where it describes the inhabitants of the rural areas (or small villages) who make the trip to the capital, by bus, as they ?cross over? the wilderness towards the large urban centers.
It is a word that is deeply imbedded in the memory of Arabia, and provides further evidence as to where the events of the Torah took place.
To Be Continued
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Salaam Pazuzu and thank you for the lastest post sun
BTW we are not the only one discussing Hebrew
Israeli Ambassador Daniel Taub was formally welcomed to the UK by the Queen at a Buckingham Palace ceremony........
"They discussed the miracle of the revival of the Hebrew language in Israel, ........"
http//www.thejc.com/news/uk-news/58505/israeli-ambassador-meets-queen
peace