Cleavage and Verse 24:31

Ikrame

lol really??

well I really could care less if other women wear nice jewellery and I think your reasoning is fault and even offensive towards women like were some kind of jealous species.
So guys shouldn't drive nice cars because it encourages jealousy against you guys, hmm or how about some nice shoes.

In my opinion the verses talk about the body not about material things.
Also I think there s nothing wrong with wearing nice clothes and pretty things as long as you stay inside the boundry s Allah has given us. I even feel that men can wear gold if they like too and also silk if they think it s nice and not like what hadith says.
And about cleavage I think it s definetely part of the breasts and men like to stare at it. almost nobody walks topless in everyday life but they do wear cleavage and it does attract in a wrong way but that s just how I see it.

peace

_Ala_

author=Ikrame link=topic=9603500.msg292889#msg292889 date=1328697585

[well I really could care less if other women wear nice jewellery and I think your reasoning is fault and even offensive towards women like were some kind of jealous species.
So guys shouldn't drive nice cars because it encourages jealousy against you guys, hmm or how about some nice shoes.

Jealousy is a human attribute, God is telling us about it many times.
I think the point is not to show off. If you need to get from point A to point B and need a car to do that, wouldn't any car do the job? Why would a man drive a Ferrari if its not to show off?

peace!

Ikrame

what if that s the car he s driving? and it s his favorite kind of car and he thinks it drives nice.(btw I think a ferrari is ugly)
A question, When you go shopping for clothes and assecoires do you buy things that is your personal taste/flavor or do you buy what people would think it looks good on you?
So if your dress is really pretty it suits your complex etc but still modest and lets say there s a big chance some people would envy you, would you still not wear it?
if not, what would you wear then, a black dress? what if there are other persons are going to envy your black dress.

and also what s not to show off, your beauty the one Allah given us or material things if you think it s the second please provide evidence from quran

Ikrame

My reaction was also towards Huruf I would appreciate an answer from him as well, if he thinks that jalousy is a thing that only plays a part with women or not because if Im correct the verses are adressing women, so I want to know if he thinks it only counts for women. thanks

Student_of_Allah

Shalom Aleikhem,

I do not see the ayaat to be directing towards anything apart from BODY parts. The good fortune that God grants me, I will enjoy them in this life and on the next life, if I am successful, they will be exclusively for the successful ones. So, being jealous of my Super Car is your problem. However, when God bothered to reveal this ayaat, one must pay heed.

I do understand extenuating circumstances. I understand why at certain times I may be forced to break and bend some rules for the greater good. But to disobey a command because of my culture ???? To fit it ?? Which part of "La ilaha illah Allah" do I not understand ? Some worship statues, some worship cultures, some simply obey their own desires beside God.

I know its all simply my opinion. But given the opportunity, I want to be Ibrahim and go against my society/fore fathers. No matter how strong the social pressure is, I want to be Moses and face this cultural-Pharoah and inform them that I do not submit to their will and will not sell my God's ayaat for cheap price.

In any case, these are just my opinions. And indeed, Gabriel doesn't type on my behalf.

So, Peace be on you all.

------------ Student of Allah

huruf

My reaction was also towards Huruf I would appreciate an answer from him as well, if he thinks that jalousy is a thing that only plays a part with women or not because if Im correct the verses are adressing women, so I want to know if he thinks it only counts for women. thanks

I am not a "him" but a "her".

Vanity and jealousy are not "feminine" shortcomings but human shortcomings, just like anger and highhadedness are not male shortcomings but human shortcomings.

BUT many times, vanity is socially approved in women, far more than in men, competitivenes on beauty is somehow fostered in women, but not as much or not at all in men, whereas highhandedness and anger have been socially condoned in men more so than in women. Many times historically it has been done in the laws, more so even than in the customs.

Not the qur'an does that, but societies some times or many times do. So, as in many other things, the Qur'an stands out of that and sets things straight, vanity is not good, jealousy is not good, anger is not good highhandedness is nto good... for anybody, either males or females. But some things are "sold" more to one sex than the other. And in certain teenagers environments this far from getting better is getting worse.

Beauty is a "beatiful" thing, we should enojoy it, but not make a show off of it nor use it as a weapon for competition. Just as punch power is a gift, but not something to show off or make the wrong use of it.

Not to make a show of our attributes and to use of them for the common good is modesty and the opposite is arrogance.

Hope now it is clear what I meant.

Salaam

Ikrame

I understand but I disagree that jalousy is something that you can find more in women
I don t think it s gender related I do think women are pressured to be beautiful and men not that s the biggest difference but if you look at men they compete with other things like power and fortune so I leave that to Allah cause he knows humanity best and he knows what s in the hide and whats in the open.

And about anger I totally disagree as well because men are physically far mor stronger than woman and maybe if we had the same strenght and power the damage would be equal, Allah knows best.

I just think people should stick to the boundry s of Allah and not decide on their own what s not to be done because where do you draw the line, look at my previous post what if a simple black dress looks beautiful on you what should you were then?
people differ in taste.

if somebody bakes a nice cake and make it really good looking some will probably say that person is showing off??

and further more I think people are free to express their personality and their culture through clothing and other materials and also yes look beautiful and show their nice taste I love it if people change ideas and learn from eachothers cultures.
I think nice things are a delight for my eyes and something I can appreciate very much

Look how bad it is in Saudi Arabia, everyone is wearing black, no expression no culture, because why? people can t express their self.
I think that s a dangerous mindset and Im definetely not supporting it.

If people can t appreciate nice things it s kind of their problem, especially if they take it as arrogance, let Allah be the judge
and showing off is not a synonym for arrogance, arrogance is feeling/acting that your better if you ask me.

I think we better agree to disagree.

Peace peace

huruf

I understand but I disagree that jalousy is something that you can find more in women
I don t think it s gender related I do think women are pressured to be beautiful and men not that s the biggest difference but if you look at men they compete with other things like power and fortune so I leave that to Allah cause he knows humanity best and he knows what s in the hide and whats in the open.

And about anger I totally disagree as well because men are physically far mor stronger than woman and maybe if we had the same strenght and power the damage would be equal, Allah knows best.

I just think people should stick to the boundry s of Allah and not decide on their own what s not to be done because where do you draw the line, look at my previous post what if a simple black dress looks beautiful on you what should you were then?
people differ in taste.

if somebody bakes a nice cake and make it really good looking some will probably say that person is showing off??

and further more I think people are free to express their personality and their culture through clothing and other materials and also yes look beautiful and show their nice taste I love it if people change ideas and learn from eachothers cultures.
I think nice things are a delight for my eyes and something I can appreciate very much

Look how bad it is in Saudi Arabia, everyone is wearing black, no expression no culture, because why? people can t express their self.
I think that s a dangerous mindset and Im definetely not supporting it.

If people can t appreciate nice things it s kind of their problem, especially if they take it as arrogance, let Allah be the judge
and showing off is not a synonym for arrogance, arrogance is feeling/acting that your better if you ask me.

I think we better agree to disagree.

Peace peace

Disagree in what? You are saying the same I said. I quote myself

"Vanity and jealousy are not "feminine" shortcomings but human shortcomings, just like anger and highhadedness are not male shortcomings but human shortcomings. "

Salaam

Ikrame

I think we do. I don t care if women are more 'socially aproved' being jalouse cause I know that women are more demonized by society and it probably doesn t matter where you live so I don t care for labels

and also I do think beauty is ment to be shown off wich you disagree on as I quote you( 'Beauty is a "beatiful" thing, we should enjoy it, but not make a show off of it) what s the point if it s not been showed? it s a gift to humanity and it s something people can exchange like their culture.

peace

huruf

Show is no the same as show off, as far as I know. A beauty that shows off is less of a beauty.

But if you are keen on desagreeing with me, I am not going to quarrel.

Salaam

Ikrame

Allah knows best who shows of and who doesn t people will accuse eachother of doing so like I said Allah knows best who s arrogant and who s not if someone is expressing their identity by their taste etc it s easy to accuse one fast of showing off instead of just showing.

Yes, let s leave it at this.

Peace

Red_Eye_Girl

Hmm i'm still unsure of a proper answer. The idea of a cleavage is fairly modern, thus I'd think that the verse refers to how people just either bared it all or not at all. Here we have the idea of having a bit of cleavage out which has your breasts covered, but a thin line in the middle still shows.

So yeah... i'm still stuck on an answer / Sure there is the idea of "you can do it as long as your intention isn't sexual" but I don't see this verse as stating you can't beautify yourself otherwise we'd have to cover ourselves completely like our hair and such as anything on a woman can be sexual really and same goes for a man.

Thus rather I think the private parts refers to the fact that it is shameful to have out as well as invitation to sex and the breasts are as well another invitation to sex. So therefore I believe that breasts are to be covered from all except to what is stated there whether it is lust or not. Thus why I wanna know if the cleavage can shown if the breasts are generally covered?

Abdul-Hadi

Greetings and Peace, all group

Hmm i'm still unsure of a proper answer. The idea of a cleavage is fairly modern, thus I'd think that the verse refers to how people just either bared it all or not at all. Here we have the idea of having a bit of cleavage out which has your breasts covered, but a thin line in the middle still shows.

So yeah... i'm still stuck on an answer / Sure there is the idea of "you can do it as long as your intention isn't sexual" but I don't see this verse as stating you can't beautify yourself otherwise we'd have to cover ourselves completely like our hair and such as anything on a woman can be sexual really and same goes for a man.

Thus rather I think the private parts refers to the fact that it is shameful to have out as well as invitation to sex and the breasts are as well another invitation to sex. So therefore I believe that breasts are to be covered from all except to what is stated there whether it is lust or not. Thus why I wanna know if the cleavage can shown if the breasts are generally covered?

Modesty is individual and cultures vary. Is a mother breast-feeding an infant immodest? hmm

Justiced Stewart once stated (I paraphrase) that he didn't know how do define pornography, but he knew what it was when he saw it. ! If one feels that attire is inappropriate/questionable, it probably is. If one lives in a place where the majority of people dress indecently--then one should move to where they are comfortable! In some parts of the world, going topless is normal. We aren't born with clothes on--are we indecent when born?

If one is comfortable and do not make others uncomfortable, how is that immodest? In some places, covering up draws more attention than not covering up. In others, the climate/weather conditions may be such that covering up is uncomfortable. Does the Deen require hardship? <hypothetical question>

A person who dresses modestly but has immodest behavior is in no way superior to a person who dresses in accordance with their comfort (and the cultural norms of their place and time) and who acts with modesty.

ALLAH knows best.

peace

~Abdul-Hadi

Red_Eye_Girl

Greetings and Peace, all group

Modesty is individual and cultures vary. Is a mother breast-feeding an infant immodest? hmm

Justiced Stewart once stated (I paraphrase) that he didn't know how do define pornography, but he knew what it was when he saw it. ! If one feels that attire is inappropriate/questionable, it probably is. If one lives in a place where the majority of people dress indecently--then one should move to where they are comfortable! In some parts of the world, going topless is normal. We aren't born with clothes on--are we indecent when born?

If one is comfortable and do not make others uncomfortable, how is that immodest? In some places, covering up draws more attention than not covering up. In others, the climate/weather conditions may be such that covering up is uncomfortable. Does the Deen require hardship? <hypothetical question>

A person who dresses modestly but has immodest behavior is in no way superior to a person who dresses in accordance with their comfort (and the cultural norms of their place and time) and who acts with modesty.

ALLAH knows best.

peace

~Abdul-Hadi

I see what you mean and it makes a lot of sense. Well here in the west, a bit of cleavage is considered a norm and not considered indecent unless one overdoes it.

Yet there is still the command stating to "cover the breasts" which while they are covered show a some cleavage, which I don't know what it means at that point.

Also can I get some insight on what this part of 2431 means?

""And tell the believing females to lower their gaze and keep covered their private parts, and that they should not reveal their beauty except what is apparent, and let them put forth their shawls over their cleavage."

While it says to keep private parts covered and that we should not reveal it either, what does it mean by "except what is apparent"? Considering the only two major stuff that are told to be covered are private parts and breasts, how can they be apparent at the same time? I have heard it range from accidentally being shown, to dress to what is a cultural norm?

Thanks

_Ala_

Salam on you!

Mr. Abdul Hadi, your opinions has nothing to do with the ayas in the Quran, God gave us rules to follow, the aya doesnt say "if you feel uncomfortable the do as you like" Its not a matter of feeling and comparing oneself with others. God dont want you to be hurt, so if you are living in Saudi and not have hijab you will get hurt but living in a secular country who will hurt you if you dont wear a cleavage? Honestly is it really that hard and uncomfortable to stay away from cleavages??

Posted by Abdul-Hadi

it probably is. If one lives in a place where the majority of people dress indecently--then one should move to where they are comfortable! In some parts of the world, going topless is normal. We aren't born with clothes on--are we indecent when born?

If one is comfortable and do not make others uncomfortable, how is that immodest? In some places, covering up draws more attention than not covering up. In others, the climate/weather conditions may be such that covering up is uncomfortable. Does the Deen require hardship?

Posted by Red Eye Girl

I see what you mean and it makes a lot of sense. Well here in the west, a bit of cleavage is considered a norm and not considered indecent unless one overdoes it.

Yet there is still the command stating to "cover the breasts" which while they are covered show a some cleavage, which I don't know what it means at that point.

Red eye girl, so all you wanted to hear is "thats ok because you live in the west"? ??? I didnt know God made a special Quran for the "modern" westerns
By the way JUYUB is not breasts, no one say juyub to breasts in arabic, juyub means actually pockets and since arabic woman used to put stuf in their cleavages so people started to call cleavage juyub as well, and thats nothing modern but it was called so in the time of revelation. What you are doing is choosing to translate it to breasts because that fits your intentions.
If you want to wear cleavage please go on and do it. Your intentions and your choices is something between you and God and nobody cares about them.
But if you want to have a Quranic answer, its good that you are asking people here. I saw many answers from the Quran among the posts here so reflect on them read by yourself and think about the total message of clothing in the Quran. Why are we asked to cover ourselves at all? Reflect about your culture and compare to the culture in the Quran and dont compromise. Cover is not equal to cover some.

Peace!

_Ala_

Salam again,

This post is about showing off.

This is what the dictionary says about showing off

(verb) exhibitionist, show-off
someone who deliberately behaves in such a way as to attract attention
Synonyms flasher, show-off, exhibitionist

In my opinion the verses talk about the body not about material things.

Ikram, the verses talk about the body and the material things as the word ZEENAH means beauty/decoration and that could be both, but showing of is less likely to be a muslim quality regardless what you are showing off.

Here are the ayas as what I think they mean.I would be glad to discuss it if anybody have another opinion.
Its about Qaroon 2876- 2879.

2876

That Qaroon/Korah was from Moses' nation, so he oppressed/transgressed on them, and We gave/brought him from the treasures what that its keys (is a) burdensome weight with (for) the group/band/company of strength/power , when his nation said to him "Do not rejoice/delight , that God does not love/like the rejoiced/delighted ."

The shadowed text is to help see how the Arabic text is translated in case you want to check it by yourself.

So God gave Qaroon a big material wealth. And Qaroon was very happy with that as many people would be, considering the material goals of our culture today and also what God is saying about humankind (greedy). But God dont love/like the rejoiced/delighted ones it says! Why God dont like the rejoiced/delighted ones?
I think rejoiced or delighted in the Quran means not thankful, and God want us to remember always where our material wealth and immaterial wealth coming from, from Him. If we remember that our reaction would then be humbleness rather than joy and delightfulness. Humbleness means being aware of what I get from God is not mine, but its something God decided to give me now and maybe take it away when he wishes to, this thinking will make me less greedy, less stingy and eliminate the owner inside me. This was the opposite in Qaroons case.

2877

And wish/desire in what God gave you, the home/house (of) the end (other life), and do not forget your share/fortune in the present world, and do good deeds (give charity) as/like God did good to you, and do not wish/desire the corruption in the land/Planet Earth, that God does not love/like the corrupting/disordering .

God gave Qaroon a huge material wealth and God knows thats powerful in the worldly life so first he is reminding Qaroon about his intentions and what his goal with this wealth should be. God is simply telling him with this wealth I gave you strive to come closer to me by thinking about the hereafter. After that God tells him how to do it. God is ordering Qaroon to do good as God did to him. What did God do for Qaroon? God gave him alot and also he reminded him about the hereafter so God is asking him to give alot from that wealth and remind people about the hereafter, but! God knows we need material things so He is telling Qaroon not to forget his share. I think his share means what he needs. In my opinion a Ferrari is not a need, a Dior dress is not a need, those are like Qaroons wealth.

2878

He said "But/truly I got it on knowledge at me/from me." Did he not know that God had perished/destroyed from before him from the generations/peoples of eras who he is stronger than him power/strength and more gathering/assembling? And the criminals/sinners do not be asked/questioned about their crimes.

But Qaroon is arrogant and not thankful or humble at all. He thinks the knowledge was his own maybe he thinks he was smart, clever, sneaky enough to make the fortune he had. His arrogance made him rejects or forget that God is the one who gives and if God didint want to give him then he wouldent have any chance of getting a coin.

2879

So he got out/emerged on (to) his nation in his decoration/beauty/ornament, those who want the life the present/worldly life said "Oh, if only for us similar/equal (to) what Qaroon/Korah was given/brought to, that he truly is of great luck/fortune."

Why did Qaroon went out in his decorations/beauty to his nation? My answer is to show off, being the arrogant human he was. He didint believe that all he got was a gift from God which he had to share with others. He simply wanted to show to people how great he was making such a fortune, he was barging by showing himself and his decoration/beauty (ZEENAH). And that made people jealous, they wished they had the beauty of material things he had.

Then we all know what happened to this human...

My conclusion
Considering 732
" Say "Who forbid God's decoration/beauty/ornament (&#1614which He brought out to (for) His worshippers/slaves, and the enjoyable/goodnesses from the provision/things of benefit or value ?"Say "It is to those who believed in the life the present/worldly life clearly/purely (in) the Resurrection Day, as/like that We detail/explain/clarify the verses/evidences to a nation knowing."

and 731
" You Adam's sons and daughters, take/receive your decoration/beauty (&#1618at every/each mosque/place of worshipping God, and eat and drink and do not waste/spoil/ignore , that God does not love/like the wasters ."

ZEENA (beauty/decoration) is not haram. God made it for us to enjoy but with measure, without transcending Gods lines. God gave us the example of Qaroon to explain to us what transcending is. Qaroon was arrogant and thought he got it all by himself so that made people jealous. He also liked to show off what he had as a measure of self-expression/self-realisation. God is telling us to enjoy everything but do that with humbleness and with measure, dont show off, remember that its from God and it can be taken back anytime.
When it comes to womens beauty/decoration regardless body or clothes we all know whats beautiful in it. God says in 2431

" And say to the believers they (F) lower/humble from their eye sights, and they (F) protect/safe keep from their genital parts between their legs, and they do not show their decoration/beauty (&#1614 except what appeared/is visible from it, and they hold in place/sew (E) with their covers on their collar opening in clothes/chests , and they do not show their decoration/beauty (&#1614 except to their husbands, or their fathers, or their husband's fathers (fathers in-law), or their sons, or their husband's sons (step- sons), or their brothers, or their brother's sons (nephews), or their sisters' sons (nephews), or their women, or what their right (hands) owned/possessed (i.e. care-giers under contract), or the followers/servants (those) not (owners) of need/desire/intelligence and resourcefulness (without a sexual drive) from the men or the child/children (the very old or very young), those who did not see and know of on the women's shameful genital parts , and they (F) do not beat/strike with their (F) feet to be known what they (F) hide from their decoration/beauty , and repent to God all together , oh you the believers, maybe/perhaps you succeed/win."
Regardless the discussable parts of this aya I think the red marked part of it is pretty clear.

Hope this made my point on beautiful things clear. You are welcome to discuss my understanding of the ayas.
Peace!

Kamzo19

Salam on you!

Mr. Abdul Hadi, your opinions has nothing to do with the ayas in the Quran, God gave us rules to follow, the aya doesnt say "if you feel uncomfortable the do as you like" Its not a matter of feeling and comparing oneself with others. God dont want you to be hurt, so if you are living in Saudi and not have hijab you will get hurt but living in a secular country who will hurt you if you dont wear a cleavage? Honestly is it really that hard and uncomfortable to stay away from cleavages??

Red eye girl, so all you wanted to hear is "thats ok because you live in the west"? ??? I didnt know God made a special Quran for the "modern" westerns o
By the way JUYUB is not breasts, no one say juyub to breasts in arabic, juyub means actually pockets and since arabic woman used to put stuf in their cleavages so people started to call cleavage juyub as well, and thats nothing modern but it was called so in the time of revelation. What you are doing is choosing to translate it to breasts because that fits your intentions.
If you want to wear cleavage please go on and do it. Your intentions and your choices is something between you and God and nobody cares about them.
But if you want to have a Quranic answer, its good that you are asking people here. I saw many answers from the Quran among the posts here so reflect on them read by yourself and think about the total message of clothing in the Quran. Why are we asked to cover ourselves at all? Reflect about your culture and compare to the culture in the Quran and dont compromise. Cover is not equal to cover some.

Peace!

I wanted to answer to AbdulHadi and to RedEyeGirl but I found my thoughts resumed in Ala's answer...all I have to say is Nothing to add !

Bender

I am Quran-Aloner, but 2431 made me wonder a bit about cleavages.

"And tell the believing females to lower their gaze and keep covered their private parts, and that they should not reveal their beauty except what is apparent, and let them put forth their shawls over their cleavage. And let them not reveal their beauty except to their husbands, or their fathers, or fathers of their husbands, or their sons, or the sons of their husbands, or their brothers, or the sons of their brothers, or the sons of their sisters, or their women, or those maintained by their oaths, or the male servants who are without need, or the child who has not yet understood the composition of women. And let them not strike with their feet in a manner that reveals what they are keeping hidden of their beauty. And repent to God, all of you believers, that you may succeed."

In regards to cleavage I understand not exposing all of your breast but is something like this okay
http//www.hairstyleswebsite.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/women-hairstyles3.jpg

Like you see a little bit of cleavage on her, but her breasts are covered more or less. It feels like a grey area here, if you can give me your opinions?

Salaam sister,

Please note to who this verse is referring. The verse begins with And tell the believing females...
So do you think of yourself that you belong to this group of women?
If not then you can do whatever you want.

But if you believe that Allah is talking about you then I don't see any grey area.
You translated the verse as "... shawls over their cleavage ..."
then you say "Like you see a little bit of cleavage on her, but her breasts are covered more or less."
So to me if only 0,00...001% of cleavage is shown then you did not put your shawl on the correct way over your cleavage.

also note that this verse is for all believing females. Thus not only females in some cultures or in some time-era.
AND as responding to Abdul-Hadi this verse is also for believing mothers who want to give their child breastfeeding (as they are also believing females). Breastfeeding in public nope no matter what culture or time you live.

Abdul-Hadi

Greetings and Peace, all group

To each their own.

1736 And do not uphold what you have no knowledge of. For the hearing, eyesight, and heart, all these you are responsible for.

Which is better, knowledge and logic--or emotion and tradition?

726 O Children of Adam, We have sent down for you garments to alleviate your bodies, and feathers; and the garment of righteousness is the best. That is from the signs of GOD, perhaps they will remember.

What is the best garment? sun

2256 There is no compulsion in the system; the proper way has been clarified from the wrong way. Whoever rejects evil, and believes in GOD, indeed he has taken grasp of the strongest hold that will never break. GOD is Hearer, Knower.

Are/should people be forced to follow the understanding of another? hmm

3114 And We enjoined man regarding his parents. His mother bore him with hardship upon hardship, and his weaning takes two years. You shall give thanks to Me, and to your parents. To Me is the final destiny.

Two years to wean is substantial time. Should a woman let her child go hungry if in public--or just stay at home all the time if breast feeding in public is "forbidden"? Just how long has baby formula been available, anyway?

http//www.greenprophet.com/2010/06/breastfeed-your-baby-in-a-hijab-public-breastfeeding-in-the-middle-east/

16116 And do not say, as to what your tongues falsely describe "This is lawful, and that is forbidden;" that you seek to invent lies about GOD. Those who invent lies about GOD will not succeed.

3022 And from His signs is the creation of the heavens and the earth, and the difference of your tongues and your colors. In that are signs for the world.

It sure sounds like different culture is accepted and well known--we don't have to look/act/be the same. Nudity is the norm in some cultures, but a person doesn't have to join that culture/can leave it.

If doubt exists, there is no doubt--it is better not to do a thing where there is doubt involved. Don't eat a food item if the safety is dubious and likewise don't dress in a certain way if the dress is questionable.

ALLAH knows best.

peace

~Abdul-Hadi

_Ala_

Salam Abdul-Hadi,

Which is better, knowledge and logic--or emotion and tradition?

I dont know who is talking emotions and traditions here, I havent seen that. I think emotion and traditions is when you say "its ok if you are uncomfortable and if its ok in your culture".

726 O Children of Adam, We have sent down for you garments to alleviate your bodies, and feathers; and the garment of righteousness is the best. That is from the signs of GOD, perhaps they will remember.

What is the best garment? sun

I anderstand this aya as it doesnt matter if you wear feathres or sack, beautifull or ugly clothes, it doesnt matter for God , but The God is actually telling us how to cloth, not what to cloth in 2431.

2256 There is no compulsion in the system; the proper way has been clarified from the wrong way. Whoever rejects evil, and believes in GOD, indeed he has taken grasp of the strongest hold that will never break. GOD is Hearer, Knower.

Are/should people be forced to follow the understanding of another? hmm

"Whoever rejects evil, and believes in GOD" that for me means reject evilish things like popular culture and trying to be like others, or show the beauty in wrong place and time. And believing in God is doing as told by God, regardless culture.

3114 And We enjoined man regarding his parents. His mother bore him with hardship upon hardship, and his weaning takes two years. You shall give thanks to Me, and to your parents. To Me is the final destiny.

Two years to wean is substantial time. Should a woman let her child go hungry if in public--or just stay at home all the time if breast feeding in public is "forbidden"? Just how long has baby formula been available, anyway?

Why should the baby go hungry, is there no middleway? either show breasts and feed or not feed? why not put something on her brest while feeding? (I dont have children I dont know, just wondering)

16116 And do not say, as to what your tongues falsely describe "This is lawful, and that is forbidden;" that you seek to invent lies about GOD. Those who invent lies about GOD will not succeed.

What people tryed to say here is only Gods ayas, showing them and insisting on not compromising with them. Actually I think its more dangerous to give the green light to do something God has allready told us not to do, just because you are not sure. Maybe better not to say anything?
What do you think cover your cleavages means?

don't dress in a certain way if the dress is questionable.

I think that was supposed to be your answer from the begening. If cleavage is questionable and you are not sure, then simply dont do it.

ALLAH knows best.
Peace on you!