What are the rights of non-muslims?
-
Dear Maha;
I have only known you from a few posts, yet I?ve learnt more about you than you appear to have during your time of studying me. So here is my experience with you
-
I had never known you before yesterday, yet you accuse me of acting like a Sunni-Qur?anist. It does not matter whether you thought I was Muslim or not (certainly wasn?t Sunni or ?Qur?anist?), but the point is that you must explain why people like Edip Yuksel and Ahmed Bahgat who follow a qiblah in Mecca are not likewise Sunni-Qur?anists? You did not answer my point relating to that.
-
Secondly, you deliberately twisted my words by implying I had to prove ?religion? and ?deen? were the same when I had already clearly said that they were different.
-
Thirdly, you lie to my face by implying you ALREADY asked me why I am teaching a religion that I don?t believe in (so why did you use the word ?religion??).
-
Fourthly, you say my logic is flawed and that I cannot be taken seriously, meantime having answered none of my points whilst making things up. You seem to have a hidden agenda, and you label me a hopeless imbecile.
-
Fifthly, during this time you adopted a spiteful and targeted approach (with me). Now you accuse me of lying.
I do not know you, so if you have a problem with me, rather than targeting me here, come onto my YouTube. I do not know if you think the others will help you here because you call yourself ?Qur?anist? (whilst I say I am not Muslim), but I?m almost used to this. If I want to talk to such people, I would normally go to SunniForum or Faithfreedom.org. But I am not going to leave here just because you want me to. You should perhaps have ?researched? me more before trying this.
If you are too embarassed to explain yourself here, just remember my offer.
Cheers.
? -
-
Dear Maha;
I have only known you from a few posts, yet I?ve learnt more about you than you appear to have during your time of studying me. So here is my experience with you
-
I had never known you before yesterday, yet you accuse me of acting like a Sunni-Qur?anist. It does not matter whether you thought I was Muslim or not (certainly wasn?t Sunni or ?Qur?anist?), but the point is that you must explain why people like Edip Yuksel and Ahmed Bahgat who follow a qiblah in Mecca are not likewise Sunni-Qur?anists? You did not answer my point relating to that.
-
Secondly, you deliberately twisted my words by implying I had to prove ?religion? and ?deen? were the same when I had already clearly said that they were different.
-
Thirdly, you lie to my face by implying you ALREADY asked me why I am teaching a religion that I don?t believe in (so why did you use the word ?religion??).
-
Fourthly, you say my logic is flawed and that I cannot be taken seriously, meantime having answered none of my points whilst making things up. You seem to have a hidden agenda, and you label me a hopeless imbecile.
-
Fifthly, during this time you adopted a spiteful and targeted approach (with me). Now you accuse me of lying.
I do not know you, so if you have a problem with me, rather than targeting me here, come onto my YouTube. I do not know if you think the others will help you here because you call yourself ?Qur?anist? (whilst I say I am not Muslim), but I?m almost used to this. If I want to talk to such people, I would normally go to SunniForum or Faithfreedom.org. But I am not going to leave here just because you want me to. You should perhaps have ?researched? me more before trying this.
If you are too embarassed to explain yourself here, just remember my offer.
Cheers.
?why dont you just answer my questions? Whenever I caught you in lying you immediately change the topic with a nasty attitude, why? The biggest proof of you being a hopeless imbecile is that you preach a religion you dont believe in and you refuse to tell me why you do that. Why do you say things you dont believe in? In any case, thanks for showing me your true ugly face, mesmorial.
And your youtube channel is full of BS so please keep it to yourself.Bye
-
-
Shalom Aleikhem,
@ Maha and MesMorial
Can we end the dispute here ???? This thread has been hijacked already !! I do realize that both of you have good reasons for coming back and explaining things...however, for the sake of the rest of the community, it is better that either you stop it, or simply continue your dispute in some other place. For example, you guys can send PMs to each other. How about that ??? In your Private Message folder, you guys can host your eternal debate .
Peace
--------------- Student of Allah
-
Shalom Aleikhem,
@ Maha and MesMorial
Can we end the dispute here ???? This thread has been hijacked already !! I do realize that both of you have good reasons for coming back and explaining things...however, for the sake of the rest of the community, it is better that either you stop it, or simply continue your dispute in some other place. For example, you guys can send PMs to each other. How about that ??? In your Private Message folder, you guys can host your eternal debate . )
Peace
--------------- Student of Allah
salam. I already said bye to him before your post and ended the conversation with him. I have no interest in debating the dispute with him any further. However I asked you about your defination of a non-muslim and I am waiting to read your reply.
Cheers
-
salam. I already said bye to him before your post and ended the conversation with him. I have no interest in debating the dispute with him any further. However I asked you about your defination of a non-muslim and I am waiting to read your reply.
Cheers
Shalom Aleikhom,
I will copy paste a response that I gave to someone on this website. The subject was similar, see if you can understand my view from it
Shalom Aleikhom,
It is not my job to go around calling people muslim or non-muslim. I can only perceive people as muslim/non-muslim based on my understanding of what Islam is. Now, since there is no guarantee that my overall understanding is 100% correct, it would be unfair of me to label others as such.
Can an atheist be muslim ?
Well, on a philosophical level , see if you agree with me on this. You agree that God sent messengers, at the present, its our duty to spread the message instead of concealing it, right ? Now, when the nice athiest approaches Islam, he/she is immediately bombarded with bizzare ideas. He/She like you and me takes objection to statements such as "having beard is righteous", "you have to wipe butt with odd number of stones to be loved by God", "if you leave Islam you have to be beheaded", etc.
So, what they reject of God is not Islam, but the man made fabrication. The sheikhs/imams/mullahs/scholars conceal Qur'an from both muslims and non-muslims. Not everyone has the same life experience, so the atheist might have been in a disadvantage compared to you and me. Think about the illiterate hungry and poor people in third world countries. The mullahs/sheiks conceal what was revealed and make these less fortunate people do bad things. These people are not doing what they do to reject Allah, but to please Him. So, we should not jump to conclusion over such matters.
The enemy here is not the masses, but the Pharaohs that conceal the revelation and enslave the masses. If your idea is that everyone has the means to read Qur'an, I would ask you to wake up. In that case these concealers would not be able to succeed with their lies.
Peace
------------ Student of Allah -
Dear Maha;
Perhaps you misread my message.
I pointed out 5 things you did which you have not denied. You trait is to project your own faults onto me.
In my experience, Sunnis answer questions with more questions. Islamophobes answer questions by telling you to answer questions which they asked after you asked them questions they never answered. The difference is that Sunnis tend to run, and Islamophobes just argue.
The reason that Sunnis say they believe in Sunnism is because it gives them identity. When you counter them, there is no point in them arguing since their identity is deflated. They don?t want to cause it more damage (like wearing a good shirt during exercise).
http//www.sunniforum.com/forum/showthread.php?79213-Why-do-you-believe-in-hadith/page59&s=8049f999ac73edf2af43ff699516cdde
It is not about personal ego, though of course there are some (currently one on YT) who start dreaming aloud about one burning in Hell.
The reason that Islamophobes continue is either because they are in a forum friendly to their views, or because they are insecure and keep going until they win a point. They feel that they ?must be right?, whereas Sunnis say to themselves ?how I wish I was right! Come on!?
You will find here 4 threads with my name, all designed to catch me out
http//forum09.faithfreedom.org/viewforum.php?f=22
And another
http//forum09.faithfreedom.org/viewforum.php?f=21
There are 6 threads here which concern ?MesMorial?s? debates
http//forum09.faithfreedom.org/viewforum.php?f=23
The top one is typical of how Islamophobes will not stop until they catch you out on a point, no matter how many they already tried.
Of course the reason I mention is that you have the nastiness of certain Sunnis, with the behaviour of the other. Neither uses logic, and it is a sign of emotional attachment to something. I would like to know which emotional attachment inspires your posts, and I basically asked this at the end of my first post (to you).
The other reason I mention is to show you something more about my activities, with hopes you will not continue to talk without knowledge. You thought I was Sunni-Qur?anist, then (still) a liar ? what?s next? That is the point.
Let?s see
You tell me that I am nasty when you catch me lying, but maybe you were reading it with a mirror.
You inform me I preach a religion (you used that word again) which I do not believe. Unfortunately we were discussing a matter of history, therefore if as a Muslim I tended towards a certain historical opinion, there is no reason why I would not hold that position now.
Finally, my YouTube is basically poetry, Islamic reform and philosophy. Could you please be more specific?
My final question would be why you preach a religion you don?t practice.
Cheers.
-
Dear Maha;
Dear Maha;
Perhaps you misread my message.
I pointed out 5 things you did which you have not denied. In my experience, Sunnis answer questions with more questions. Islamophobes answer questions by telling you to answer questions which they asked after you asked them questions they never answered. The difference is that Sunnis tend to run, and Islamophobes just argue.
The reason that Sunnis say they believe in Sunnism is because it gives them identity. When you counter them, there is no point in them arguing since their identity is deflated. They don?t want to cause it more damage (like wearing a good shirt during exercise).
http//www.sunniforum.com/forum/showthread.php?79213-Why-do-you-believe-in-hadith/page59&s=8049f999ac73edf2af43ff699516cdde
It is not about personal ego, though of course there are some (currently one on YT) who start dreaming aloud about me burning in Hell.
The reason that Islamophobes continue is either because they are in a forum friendly to their views, or because they are insecure and keep going until they win a point. They feel that they ?must be right?, whereas Sunnis say to themselves ?how I wish I was right! Come on!?
You will find here 4 threads with my name, all designed to catch me out
http//forum09.faithfreedom.org/viewforum.php?f=22
And another
http//forum09.faithfreedom.org/viewforum.php?f=21
There are 6 threads here which concern ?MesMorial?s? debates
http//forum09.faithfreedom.org/viewforum.php?f=23
The top one is typical of how Islamophobes will not stop until they catch you out on a point, no matter how many they already tried.
Of course the reason I mention is that you have the nastiness of certain Sunnis, with the behaviour of the other. Neither uses logic, and it is a sign of emotional attachment to something. I would like to know which emotional attachment inspires your posts, and I basically asked this at the end of my first post (to you).
The other reason I mention is to show you something more about my activities, with hopes you will not continue to talk without knowledge. You thought I was Sunni-Qur?anist, then (still) a liar ? what?s next? That is the point.
Let?s see
You tell me that I am nasty when you catch me lying, but maybe you were reading it with a mirror.
You inform me I preach a religion (you used that word again) which I do not believe. Unfortunately we are discussing a matter of history, therefore if as a Muslim I tended towards a certain historical opinion, there is no reason why I would not hold that position now.
Finally, my YouTube is mostly poetry, Islamic reform and philosophy which certainly isn?t Sunni (probably more ?Qur?anist?). Could you please be more specific?
My final question would be why you preach a religion you don?t practice.
Cheers.
-
Dear Maha;
Perhaps you misread my message.
I pointed out 5 things you did which you have not denied. You trait is to project your own faults onto me.
In my experience, Sunnis answer questions with more questions. Islamophobes answer questions by telling you to answer questions which they asked after you asked them questions they never answered. The difference is that Sunnis tend to run, and Islamophobes just argue.
The reason that Sunnis say they believe in Sunnism is because it gives them identity. When you counter them, there is no point in them arguing since their identity is deflated. They don?t want to cause it more damage (like wearing a good shirt during exercise).
http//www.sunniforum.com/forum/showthread.php?79213-Why-do-you-believe-in-hadith/page59&s=8049f999ac73edf2af43ff699516cdde
It is not about personal ego, though of course there are some (currently one on YT) who start dreaming aloud about one burning in Hell.
The reason that Islamophobes continue is either because they are in a forum friendly to their views, or because they are insecure and keep going until they win a point. They feel that they ?must be right?, whereas Sunnis say to themselves ?how I wish I was right! Come on!?
You will find here 4 threads with my name, all designed to catch me out
http//forum09.faithfreedom.org/viewforum.php?f=22
And another
http//forum09.faithfreedom.org/viewforum.php?f=21
There are 6 threads here which concern ?MesMorial?s? debates
http//forum09.faithfreedom.org/viewforum.php?f=23
The top one is typical of how Islamophobes will not stop until they catch you out on a point, no matter how many they already tried.
Of course the reason I mention is that you have the nastiness of certain Sunnis, with the behaviour of the other. Neither uses logic, and it is a sign of emotional attachment to something. I would like to know which emotional attachment inspires your posts, and I basically asked this at the end of my first post (to you).
The other reason I mention is to show you something more about my activities, with hopes you will not continue to talk without knowledge. You thought I was Sunni-Qur?anist, then (still) a liar ? what?s next? That is the point.
Let?s see
You tell me that I am nasty when you catch me lying, but maybe you were reading it with a mirror.
You inform me I preach a religion (you used that word again) which I do not believe. Unfortunately we were discussing a matter of history, therefore if as a Muslim I tended towards a certain historical opinion, there is no reason why I would not hold that position now.
Finally, my YouTube is basically poetry, Islamic reform and philosophy. Could you please be more specific?
My final question would be why you preach a religion you don?t practice.
Cheers.
-
I would like to understand the rights of non-muslims in order to determine whether or not Islam truly teaches that all people are equal. If non-believers are not allowed into Makkah, or cannot be greeted with Salaam alaykum, or deserve the same justice that would apply if a believer was murdered, then Islam does not teach equality.
Yup the religion called Islam (tm) does not teach equality..
However God teaches equality in the Quran... everyone will be fairly judged according to their deeds..
Salam / Peace
-
Shalom Aleikhem,
@ Maha and MesMorial
Can we end the dispute here ???? This thread has been hijacked already !! I do realize that both of you have good reasons for coming back and explaining things...however, for the sake of the rest of the community, it is better that either you stop it, or simply continue your dispute in some other place. For example, you guys can send PMs to each other. How about that ??? In your Private Message folder, you guys can host your eternal debate . )
Peace
--------------- Student of Allah
That would be wonderful (since I asked that), however my last post contained some links which may be of more benefit.
In the meantime, you might observe how it sprung from my otherwise relevant point about 2225.
Cheers
-
Dear Maha;
Perhaps you misread my message.
I pointed out 5 things you did which you have not denied. You trait is to project your own faults onto me.
In my experience, Sunnis answer questions with more questions. Islamophobes answer questions by telling you to answer questions which they asked after you asked them questions they never answered. The difference is that Sunnis tend to run, and Islamophobes just argue.
The reason that Sunnis say they believe in Sunnism is because it gives them identity. When you counter them, there is no point in them arguing since their identity is deflated. They don?t want to cause it more damage (like wearing a good shirt during exercise).
http//www.sunniforum.com/forum/showthread.php?79213-Why-do-you-believe-in-hadith/page59&s=8049f999ac73edf2af43ff699516cdde
It is not about personal ego, though of course there are some (currently one on YT) who start dreaming aloud about one burning in Hell.
The reason that Islamophobes continue is either because they are in a forum friendly to their views, or because they are insecure and keep going until they win a point. They feel that they ?must be right?, whereas Sunnis say to themselves ?how I wish I was right! Come on!?
You will find here 4 threads with my name, all designed to catch me out
http//forum09.faithfreedom.org/viewforum.php?f=22
And another
http//forum09.faithfreedom.org/viewforum.php?f=21
There are 6 threads here which concern ?MesMorial?s? debates
http//forum09.faithfreedom.org/viewforum.php?f=23
The top one is typical of how Islamophobes will not stop until they catch you out on a point, no matter how many they already tried.
Of course the reason I mention is that you have the nastiness of certain Sunnis, with the behaviour of the other. Neither uses logic, and it is a sign of emotional attachment to something. I would like to know which emotional attachment inspires your posts, and I basically asked this at the end of my first post (to you).
The other reason I mention is to show you something more about my activities, with hopes you will not continue to talk without knowledge. You thought I was Sunni-Qur?anist, then (still) a liar ? what?s next? That is the point.
Let?s see
You tell me that I am nasty when you catch me lying, but maybe you were reading it with a mirror.
You inform me I preach a religion (you used that word again) which I do not believe. Unfortunately we were discussing a matter of history, therefore if as a Muslim I tended towards a certain historical opinion, there is no reason why I would not hold that position now.
Finally, my YouTube is basically poetry, Islamic reform and philosophy. Could you please be more specific?
My final question would be why you preach a religion you don?t practice.
Cheers.
Oh my God you just insist on writing to me although i tried to ignore you brickwall. Cant you just get away ? You know that I dont care about your silly opinions, so I would really appreciate if you dont write anything to me again, thanks.
Bye bye
-
Dear Maha;
Next time you try to bully someone (or next time someone makes you feel insecure), choose someone worth it.
I already said the reason you said "bye" was because I asked you to explain yourself, and you could not. When StudentofAllah comes in, you try to use that "bye" for some other reason, although I had already asked you to take it to my YT.
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9603519.msg293204#msg293204
Now if you really want the last word, and think yourself righteous (when actually you are a lying hypocrite for all to see), you can reply to this and make me reply again. Or you can do as you preach and just let it go.
Cheers.
-
Think of this as a lesson on the rights of non-Muslims at the hands of self-proclaimers such as Maha.
P.S. At Maha;
As I mentioned, the network was down. I wrote and posted that message before I even saw StudentofAllah's message and your reply. It is best you follow your own advice.
-
What are the rights of non-Muslims? What are the duties of Muslims toward non-Muslim (people of the book or not)?
What do you mean by duties and rights? There is no difference between a believer and non believer in anything to do with rights amd duties as far as the state law is concerned.
As far as rights and duties imposed on individual believers there are certain things the Koran commanded believers to do regarding unbelievers like not to marry them and not to associate with them when they mock God and the prophets and also not to pray for them when they die. There are also many duties the Koran imposed on believers like giving to those in need and speaking the truth and to try to reconcile between warring parties and so on.
I am not usre what you really mean as there are many duties the Koran imposed on believers. As far as non believers well they probably would not care about the Koran and what it says. How can the Koran impoe on them rights and duties that they do not believe in? The Koran did have many warnings on the non believers. After all this is the job of the prophets, to warn the disbelievers about God.
But if you mean by rights and duties by national law and government legislation then I see no difference as far as the Koran is concerned between believers and non believers.
-
What do you mean by duties and rights? There is no difference between a believer and non believer in anything to do with rights amd duties as far as the state law is concerned.
As far as rights and duties imposed on individual believers there are certain things the Koran commanded believers to do regarding unbelievers like not to marry them and not to associate with them when they mock God and the prophets and also not to pray for them when they die. There are also many duties the Koran imposed on believers like giving to those in need and speaking the truth and to try to reconcile between warring parties and so on.
I am not usre what you really mean as there are many duties the Koran imposed on believers. As far as non believers well they probably would not care about the Koran and what it says. How can the Koran impoe on them rights and duties that they do not believe in? The Koran did have many warnings on the non believers. After all this is the job of the prophets, to warn the disbelievers about God.
But if you mean by rights and duties by national law and government legislation then I see no difference as far as the Koran is concerned between believers and non believers.
Actually, governments and man made law are fully against Allah and the Natural Law ( which is the only right law there is, which is now lost forever due to humanity stupidity )
-
-
I am all for philosophy, but by definition, how can Natural Law be lost?
When 99.99% of humans follow the man-made one. I don't mean lost as you understood. But lost as people don't know it's the only good law there is ( with the guidance of Allah of course ) and they don't uphold it.