Would you like to marry a hadither?
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I think its easier for a koranist to marry a Christian than it is with a Muslim.
But then again how would a Muslim know you are a Koranist unless he seees you pray. I think what happens is that some Koranist believe that Sunnis are mushriks. This is the biggest mistake that Koranist do as many do not have an understanding of whats shirk. This makes them hostile towards Sunnis and often feel they have to convert them. There is really no theological difference between Koranist, Jews, Christians and Muslims. Its doctrine where we differ. But our theology is the same. The Koranist recognized Jews and Christians as monotheist but because many Koranist have taken Shirk to be Tawassul, they now label anyone as Mushrik. They treat Sunnis and Shias and Christians like pagans.
I think this has to do with the salafi influence. Abdul wahhab, the founder of the Wahhabi movement equated tawassul with shirk. That is why some Koranist see the Ka'ba as an idol or think that visiting Muhammad's tomb is shirk etc. This is not shirk.
Anyways for people interested in understanding what is shirk and what is a mushrik, please listen and watch this 45 minute lecture. It explains shirk properly.
http//video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7359195828637989025#
This is a very important lecture and you will understand many verses of the Koran about shirk when you understand what shirk is. Its VERY different than what many of you might think.
What do you mean with Muslim and why isn't a "Koranist" one?
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What do you mean with Muslim and why isn't a "Koranist" one?
Muslims I mean Sunni and Shia. A Koranist is also a Jew(yahudi means guided and is used in the Koran for believers) and also a Christian(nasara is used in the Koran on Jesus's disciples) and also a Koranist can be a Muslim. The Koran uses many adjectives but mostly it used mu'min.
I think what happens is that many Koranist i see here are actually intolerant of other faiths. This can reflect badly in marriages as the Koranist might be always lecturing and arguing. And when the Muslim or Christian does not respond he then looks at verses in the Koran regarding the pagans and applies it on them. The Koranist tells himself or herself that the reason he is not responding because he is blind, or he has a sickness in his heart, or he is under the influence of satan etc.
Maybe I am wrong. But i do see how some here will have a hard time with any other religious tradition other than theirs.
If a person wants to eat with his right hand or wants to do 7 tawaf around ka'ba or believes that prayer should be done 5 times a day at certain times and that the prophet of the Koran will intercede for humans on the day of judgement that has no bearing to me. He or she can believe so. It does not make him a mushrik. Shirk is a big word in the Koran and is not something that we think it is. Shirk is basically undermining God and placing in the sam status as humans. Shirk is the belief that God is limited, either by nature or by fate or by abilities. Shrik sees God as a superhuman but not really all powerful.
Anotherthing i noticed is that some Koranist have more knowledge than most Muslims do and may try to use that to argue with Muslims who may want to avoid the subject. The belief that a Sunni or Shia is mushrik and an idol worshiper makes some Koranist think unless I can persuade that Sunni or Shia then only I can be with him. This creates conflicts.
Marriage requires some compromise and if you are someone who has a very narrow definition of whats acceptable than its almost impossible for different religions to work. The Koran says that God created humans belonging to different religious communities and tells us that Jews and Christians and Muslims including Koranist have one God.
Why should we then question the Koran's judgement. The Koran allowed us to marry Christian and Jews. Yet some here still refuse that. So how can you then get along with Sunnis. When we say we are non sectarian we must be true to that. The Koran says anyone who believes in God and the herefater is a believer. So lets keep that criteria and not add our own. This is what seperates us from the others, we should recognize that God is for everybody who believes in Him.
The Koran tells us there are believing Jews and Christians and non believing Jews and Christians and tells us that Muhamamd was surrounded by believers but also hypocrites who are even worst than the non believers. But the Koran reminds us that we would never be one community even if we have one God. That is God's judgement and we should accept that. We should look at people's charcater and personality and not fight over circumcission and drinking from the well of zam zam. Even if you believe Abraham was never in Mecca it really does not matter. God deals with intentions. All of us here probably have interpretations of some verses of the Koran that may be incorrect. It does not have to be that we need to straighten a Sunni or Shia out everytime he believes in something like the black stone. Koranist can be very emotional and feel the need to correct others but it could turn of people who may want religion to be somewhat traditional. As long as it does not contradict the Koran than why not?
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Muslims I mean Sunni and Shia. A Koranist is also a Jew(yahudi means guided and is used in the Koran for believers) and also a Christian(nasara is used in the Koran on Jesus's disciples) and also a Koranist can be a Muslim. The Koran uses many adjectives but mostly it used mu'min.
I think what happens is that many Koranist i see here are actually intolerant of other faiths. This can reflect badly in marriages as the Koranist might be always lecturing and arguing. And when the Muslim or Christian does not respond he then looks at verses in the Koran regarding the pagans and applies it on them. The Koranist tells himself or herself that the reason he is not responding because he is blind, or he has a sickness in his heart, or he is under the influence of satan etc.
Maybe I am wrong. But i do see how some here will have a hard time with any other religious tradition other than theirs.
If a person wants to eat with his right hand or wants to do 7 tawaf around ka'ba or believes that prayer should be done 5 times a day at certain times and that the prophet of the Koran will intercede for humans on the day of judgement that has no bearing to me. He or she can believe so. It does not make him a mushrik. Shirk is a big word in the Koran and is not something that we think it is. Shirk is basically undermining God and placing in the sam status as humans. Shirk is the belief that God is limited, either by nature or by fate or by abilities. Shrik sees God as a superhuman but not really all powerful.
Anotherthing i noticed is that some Koranist have more knowledge than most Muslims do and may try to use that to argue with Muslims who may want to avoid the subject. The belief that a Sunni or Shia is mushrik and an idol worshiper makes some Koranist think unless I can persuade that Sunni or Shia then only I can be with him. This creates conflicts.
Marriage requires some compromise and if you are someone who has a very narrow definition of whats acceptable than its almost impossible for different religions to work. The Koran says that God created humans belonging to different religious communities and tells us that Jews and Christians and Muslims including Koranist have one God.
Why should we then question the Koran's judgement. The Koran allowed us to marry Christian and Jews. Yet some here still refuse that. So how can you then get along with Sunnis. When we say we are non sectarian we must be true to that. The Koran says anyone who believes in God and the herefater is a believer. So lets keep that criteria and not add our own. This is what seperates us from the others, we should recognize that God is for everybody who believes in Him.
The Koran tells us there are believing Jews and Christians and non believing Jews and Christians and tells us that Muhamamd was surrounded by believers but also hypocrites who are even worst than the non believers. But the Koran reminds us that we would never be one community even if we have one God. That is God's judgement and we should accept that. We should look at people's charcater and personality and not fight over circumcission and drinking from the well of zam zam. Even if you believe Abraham was never in Mecca it really does not matter. God deals with intentions. All of us here probably have interpretations of some verses of the Koran that may be incorrect. It does not have to be that we need to straighten a Sunni or Shia out everytime he believes in something like the black stone. Koranist can be very emotional and feel the need to correct others but it could turn of people who may want religion to be somewhat traditional. As long as it does not contradict the Koran than why not?
You didn't need to write such a long essay. But I can tell that Sunnis and Shia aren't Muslims. They're stupid and idol worshippers.
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Salam Maha )
When I was 17 my mom abandoned Sunna and became a submitter (19er) and my father couldent accept that. He accused the women who taught my mother the Quran alone mentality to be a zionist jew who wanted to destroy his family. It ended with my mother leaving the house and moving to another city. alhamdolillah this didint last long because my father is too dependent on her, so he accepted the new fact and she came back home with this new knowledge. This was almost 13 years ago. Today he talks bad about hadeeth and dont like traditionalism. I think he thinks rejecting hadeeth is modern and logical, but I cant say he captured the soul of being muslim and reading Quran and really trying hard to change for the sake of God.
When I started to be interested in men and dated some I knew I was searching for a Quran only muslim, it didit matter if he was Indian, American, Arab or Chinese. I knew that this way of life is above all nationalities and traditions. Alhamdolillah I met my husband who is Swedish and Quran alone muslim. We have the same starting-point when we resason, argue, discuss, take decisions and that is so nice. We can allways remind eachother with Quran ayas and be thankfull if arguing or even just talking. This is what brings us togather besides our love for eachother and we know that our love grows everytime we grow in faith and knowledge of God. Of course personality matters. Being a mature and openminded person makes big different.
I could not think about myself being married with someone who do not take God and Quran as seriously as I do, I think that would couse alot of missunderstandings and tensions at least for me. I think its important for a couple to have the same starting point in taking decisions.Salam peace
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I used to be a Sunni myself for a long time. I don't remember worshiping idols. Maybe u can remind me.
Then you weren't a sunni. Sunnis worship Muhammad, the black stone, Bukhari and a number of other things
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Salam
I am married to a sunni. Strange enough I think I owe some thanks to the sunni doctrine for my wife accepting my QA belief. She has been taught that her husband is her master and she will be punished ?f she does not obey me. Of course she is not like that, she is very open and liberal and relies more on the Quran than hadith and she definately does not back down from a fight with her husband.......but sometimes I get the sense that her indoctrinated instinct tells her to shut up and listen....
Living together with a person with different beliefs is very difficult, but not impossible. The key is to realize and accept in your heart is that your spouse believes in the same God as you do and He is the only one who knows what is right and what is wrong. Leave the judgement up to God and if you do find you cannot discuss religion without getting into an argument, then stop discussing religion.
The kids are a nightmare however. As a QA I am of the belief that if you act according to islam you must first understand your relationship to Allah. This is what Allah teaches us, we must think for ourselves and the Quran gives us a warning not to blindly follow our fathers. This is a warning also to the fathers, they must give their children the chance to make their own decisions about what they believe in and whatnot.
I noticed the hard way that is not the standard sunni tactic. In sunni, children are taught at a very young age what kind of muslims they are, for boys it starts when they are seven days old with the good old snip of the scissors, for girls the "evidence" shown to the public is wearing a hijab starting around 9-10 years (generalizing about the age).So the kids are a potential fubar.....tread lightly brothers and sisters in mixed-belief marriages.
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Then you weren't a sunni. Sunnis worship Muhammad, the black stone, Bukhari and a number of other things
What do you mean I was not a Sunni? I was very Sunni and in fact I was early in my life salafi like. I was also well verses in many aspects of Sunni law and was a follower of the Muslim Brotherhood. I don't remember worshiping idols.
Looking back some of the things I did and used to believe was stupid, but I don't remember worshiping idols. My faith in God has not changed one bit since my Sunni days. What changed was my understanding of the deen.
I don't think you know what idol worshipping is. Why don't you tell us?
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salamu aleikum
I think many of us were Sunnis or Christians or, or, or. I was also one and , however i agree with Bigmo, I never had the feeling, worshiping stones. I was misguided and Allah (be praised), He has shown me the right way.
Judging about others is very simple, exactly as do the Sunnis against us . So who classifies someone as a kafir or mushrik , can expect from the opposite side nothing else.
I think it is pity to put others in various categories. Would we stop to think this way, and personally look at every person, there would be less hate in this world. peace -
Salam!
In marriage couples influence eachother, this is almost unavoidable because you share everything and spend alloot of time togather. Thats why in my opinion it is important to have a spous who you can share thoughts with and learn usefull things from and most important of all, who affects you to come closer to God. God sais believing women and believing men are for eachother. In my experience women get influenced by their men to a greater extent.
Not only marriage but even friendships influence alot. God talks in many places about not taking idolworshipers, hipocrates and rejectors close as friends. 328, 488-89, 4139, 4144, 557 are some of the ayas.
We have to think twice about whom we spend our time with and get influenced by.Peace! peace
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dear Ala.
if i would be not married, I would say the same. It is clear, if you have the opportunity to discuss before entering into a marriage, you should do so.
However, to be married with several children, and then changing the faith ( ex. Sunni to Quranalone ), then there are big problems. It is then always the question of how to react and what to do?
Because I simply can't generalize, I will make no statement. The situations are different, just as the human also. Allah gives guidance to whom and when he has decided. It remains in this case just to give the matter to Allah, because sometimes you do not know whether it is appropriate to act or to be patient .... -
dear Ala.
if i would be not married, I would say the same. It is clear, if you have the opportunity to discuss before entering into a marriage, you should do so.
However, to be married with several children, and then changing the faith ( ex. Sunni to Quranalone ), then there are big problems. It is then always the question of how to react and what to do?
Because I simply can't generalize, I will make no statement. The situations are different, just as the human also. Allah gives guidance to whom and when he has decided. It remains in this case just to give the matter to Allah, because sometimes you do not know whether it is appropriate to act or to be patient ....Ofcourse sis. it is another story if you are married and you change faith. Gods example is Pharaos wife. I dont mean your husband is Pharaoh of course.
She had patient and prayed to God, still married to pharaoh. What has been done is done, we have to focus on the future inshaallah.Salam. group
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Salaam.
I know this topic is kinda old but it is just one year old right?
MARRY A HADITHER?
HELL NO! NEVER!
Oh I often imagine if I was married to a hardcore hadither who had a thick beard and often wears white robe and the Arabian male head-covering.
And if I refused to "go to bed" with him, he would say "Hey Yuliana! Obey me or angel will curse your name till morning". >DInterestingly the hadith which says that "woman who refuses "to bed" with her husband, angel will curse her till morning" is in my school Islamic textbook in Chapter Nikah (marriage).
Also, the hadith that says woman who died and if her husband is pleased by her will enter paradise is also in the Chapter Nikah in my Islamic textbook.
And I think If I was married to a hadither, he would
- Force me to wear the black sack
- Satisfy him
- Beat me if I displeased him
- Not alllow me to go out without his guardian
- Would not allow me to listen to music
- Would beat me if I communicate on internet
- Would stab or scourge me if he found out that I talked to non-mahrams. elektro elektro elektro elektro elektro
Et cetera
Ugh terrible.
My former boyfriend is a Qadiani Ahmadi. I don't see much difference between typical Sunni laws and Ahmadi laws. I asked him what he thought of dancing. "Is dancing really haram? What about ballroom dancing?" He told me that every type of dance is haram. He also supported veiling (headscarf) for women because he believed that it could prevent women from being raped. Just like Sunni thinking.
Anyways I hope I would find someone who I have been praying for. Someone that can be my soulmate? a Qur'an-alone muslim, non-19er, not so strict, cool and funny; sincere, faithful and caring.
I am just 17 years old but often think about life with a soulmate
May God give us joy and happiness ^_^
Kind regards,
Yuliana -
Interestingly the hadith which says that "woman who refuses "to bed" with her husband, angel will curse her till morning" is in my school Islamic textbook in Chapter Nikah (marriage).
Also, the hadith that says woman who died and if her husband is pleased by her will enter paradise is also in the Chapter Nikah in my Islamic textbook.
Says it all really. Pathetic.
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Salaam Yuliana,
Salaam.
I know this topic is kinda old but it is just one year old right?
MARRY A HADITHER?
HELL NO! NEVER!
Oh I often imagine if I was married to a hardcore hadither who had a thick beard and often wears white robe and the Arabian male head-covering.
And if I refused to "go to bed" with him, he would say "Hey Yuliana! Obey me or angel will curse your name till morning". >DInterestingly the hadith which says that "woman who refuses "to bed" with her husband, angel will curse her till morning" is in my school Islamic textbook in Chapter Nikah (marriage).
Also, the hadith that says woman who died and if her husband is pleased by her will enter paradise is also in the Chapter Nikah in my Islamic textbook.
And I think If I was married to a hadither, he would
- Force me to wear the black sack
- Satisfy him
- Beat me if I displeased him
- Not alllow me to go out without his guardian
- Would not allow me to listen to music
- Would beat me if I communicate on internet
- Would stab or scourge me if he found out that I talked to non-mahrams. elektro elektro elektro elektro elektro
Et cetera
Ugh terrible.
My former boyfriend is a Qadiani Ahmadi. I don't see much difference between typical Sunni laws and Ahmadi laws. I asked him what he thought of dancing. "Is dancing really haram? What about ballroom dancing?" He told me that every type of dance is haram. He also supported veiling (headscarf) for women because he believed that it could prevent women from being raped. Just like Sunni thinking.
Anyways I hope I would find someone who I have been praying for. Someone that can be my soulmate? a Qur'an-alone muslim, non-19er, not so strict, cool and funny; sincere, faithful and caring.
I am just 17 years old but often think about life with a soulmate
May God give us joy and happiness ^_^
Kind regards,
YulianaPerhaps as you progress in life, you will realise that people are not limited to the assigned characteristics of the particular categories which you choose to put them in, or indeed, the labels they associate with themselves.
Take care.
Salaam.
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I used to be a Sunni myself for a long time. I don't remember worshiping idols. Maybe u can remind me.
That's my thought process entirely when people bang on about "Sunni's" being "mushriks". I don't ever recall being a "mushrik" either, and a reminder, would, at times, be a helpful point of reference to jog my faded memory.
Peace.
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Peace family,
We are to be sure before categorizing someone without evidence and knowledge.
I have the unique position of being in contact with muslims from different backgrounds
and we talk, debate all the time, and what I find is that we all are on a journey and
one's position may change over time. Like in a good marriage, good communication
is key.Yusuf Ali O ye who believe! When ye go abroad in the cause of Allah,
investigate carefully, and say not to any one who offers you a salutation "Thou
art none of a believer!" Coveting the perishable goods of this life with Allah are
profits and spoils abundant. Even thus were ye yourselves before, till Allah conferred
on you His favours Therefore carefully investigate. For Allah is well aware of all that
ye do.Being dogmatic, self righteous, or abusive is not good for any relationship.
Communicate in the best way possible.You shall invite to the path of your Lord with wisdom and kind enlightenment,
and debate with them in the best possible manner. Your Lord knows best who has strayed
from His path, and He knows best who are the guided ones.Blessed ramadan to all!
peace
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Salaam "hawk",
Peace family,
We are to be sure before categorizing someone without evidence and knowledge.
I have the unique position of being in contact with muslims from different backgrounds
and we talk, debate all the time, and what I find is that we all are on a journey and
one's position may change over time. Like in a good marriage, good communication
is key.Yusuf Ali O ye who believe! When ye go abroad in the cause of Allah,
investigate carefully, and say not to any one who offers you a salutation "Thou
art none of a believer!" Coveting the perishable goods of this life with Allah are
profits and spoils abundant. Even thus were ye yourselves before, till Allah conferred
on you His favours Therefore carefully investigate. For Allah is well aware of all that
ye do.Being dogmatic, self righteous, or abusive is not good for any relationship.
Communicate in the best way possible.You shall invite to the path of your Lord with wisdom and kind enlightenment,
and debate with them in the best possible manner. Your Lord knows best who has strayed
from His path, and He knows best who are the guided ones.Blessed ramadan to all!
peace
You are a wise owl!
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Peace Yuliana,
What exactly is a 19er? You said you wanted a non-19er?
Is mere belief in the so-called 'Code 19' enough to render someone a 19er or is there any other criterion?
I believe in 19 being a identifier or sign, but I regard it as no more than that. Does it make me a 19er?
I am a 7er too in that case hypno
God bless you
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Salaam Yuliana,
Perhaps as you progress in life, you will realise that people are not limited to the assigned characteristics of the particular categories which you choose to put them in, or indeed, the labels they associate with themselves.
Take care.
Salaam.
Salaam.
I was talking about hardcore hadither. Not Sunnis in general. Sunnis in general are not really hadithers.
