Shahr/month in the light of the quran
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mz,
Please express your self without calling name and verify your information in the light of the quran before spreading wrong information
Allah says "They ask you about such people"(about the property owners ,who cheat,in the previose ayat,AlAhlate),"Say arrange /or has been arranged a fixed time for them and the Haj.........." (Use lanes and qd)
Peace
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Salaams,
i will add some info for anybody who has a lanes and qd could check something enlightening.page 121 lanes
Inahum laahlo al-ahillati = verily they are sojourners ,or settlers,possessed of property.
so al-ahillati=sojourners ,settlers,property owners.
mawakeeto=time appointed for the performance.
Hee=though may prepare/arrange/he/it.Now look at what the ayat 188 is talking about
And you see shooting the moondown,in ayat 189 and using the said translation makes it clear Allah is talking about the people ,possessers of property who are bribing the judges in the ayat 188
188.
And do not eat up your property among yourselves for vanities, nor use it as bait for the judges, with intent that ye may eat up wrongfully and knowingly a little of (other) people's property.
189.
Yas-aloonaka AAani al-ahillati qul hiya mawaqeetulilnnasi waalhajji walaysa albirrubi-an ta/too albuyoota min thuhooriha walakinnaalbirra mani ittaqa wa/too albuyoota min abwabihawaittaqoo Allaha laAAallakum tuflihoona
They ask thee concerning such people. Say It has been arranged/appointed for the people with the Haj,But it is no virtue that you enter the houses from their backs but It is virtue if ye fear Allah. Enter houses through the proper doors And fear Allah That ye may prosper.May Allah guide/you /me and everybody to his dominion.
Salaams idolfree ,all.
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They ask thee concerning such people. Say It has been arranged/appointed for the people with the Haj,But it is no virtue that you enter the houses from their backs but It is virtue if ye fear Allah. Enter houses through the proper doors And fear Allah That ye may prosper.
"Wa Alhajj" is translated as "as well as for alhajj" or "and for Alhajj", with is a wrong translation for the letter "Wa"
You translate mawaqeet by "arrange, appoint", where is the notion of time (alwaqt) in your translation of the word "mawaaqeet?
See also mawqoot (4103)
The quran is its best commentary and dictionnary
May Allah guide us
I leave you with peace
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Salaams,
sorry we have been to two different schools and me for one will never try to convince anybody be it a hindu or someone of another faith , as my time is not for wasting ,just assume i lost your argument as i don't have the your talents,to you be yours.
Thanks.
peace
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Peace be upon you MZ,
That does not help me to accept your position.
You stated
al-ahillati=sojourners ,settlers,property owners.
But when you gave the translation you translated as "such people". Walk me through the process of going from "sojouners,settlers, property owners" to "such people"".
Also, you continue to imply context as the basis to take 2188-189 as the same subject, but 2189 could EASILY be the beginning of the phase of questions which continue later in this chapter. Each time we see "and they ask you about..." it is the start of a new subject, why would this "and they ask you..." be any different?
Regarding the symbolism of the woman and the moon, both with 28 day courses, we are told not to touch the women when they are menstuating. Perhaps this is being equalled to the full moon where we must abstain from something.
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Peace MZ,
2189 is not about the moon. I agree this is holding on to paganism. We are to use the sun and the moon to calculate time, that is all.
The reply in this verse mentions ?nas? or mankind as to when it will appear or to begin. I am also thinking the buyut in the verse cannot be taken as a physical house. I compared it to ?the frailest house is the house of the spider?. Research gives no indication that a spider?s house is frail and a spider does not live in its web which is by no means frail. Science has still not been able to duplicate a substance that in portion would equal the strength and elasticity of a spider?s web. And if you substitute system, for example, Moses? people were told to make their system their focus or qiblah. I think if we understand the rest of the verse it will help with the beginning. No moon watching in deen al Islam. I am still trying to puzzle this out but as I said, no MOOOOOOOON.
shock -
Peace be upon you Grourself,
I understand that you think it is not about the moon, but what is your understanding regarding the actual word used, is it 'moon" or does it speak about "people"?
I thought I was getting close, but I seem far away now, may the God increase us in knowledge.
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Salaams marie,
No i cannot accept it not as you are sugesting,thanks ,and i do sugest you might try and focus on what i said. - just a sugestion. And may be we might see some light.
And look into the context of the verses around abouts.Just to give you an example,how cunning/decieving,people can be
youn saywa =as well as for haj and we cant call it as anything else.
I think i do need may be to give you just a little lesson , a non arab to an arab lady.
Wa =And/Also/But/Whilst/At/Together/WHITH/ e.t.c and check the dictionary you may have dear and see how deceptive people like to be just so they may be right/mighty in front of others -not me.
ALLah hafiz to you.
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Salaams grourself,
And yes i belive the pagans have adopted many words to mean the moon - as they where worshipping it no dought.
Thanks i will try and look into the spiders web,i remember ayman was looking into that aswell sometime back.Salaams.
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Salaams idolfree,
can you imagine Allah creating the moon for timing the Haj - this really blows me.The moon has been around billions of years ,before men i think ,and just think how many other moons are in the solar system???And may be marie and other guys think them may be for Haj as well,(just a silly joke).In translations a person can use ,if you was prificient, a given number of words to mean exactly the same meaning to the translation - I am not as proficient in the word usage but By god i may not be proficient but can see clearly ,usualy, the picture behind the context to an extent.
Which anyways most people can also , but may be some less then others.
Salaams.
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I think i do need may be to give you just a little lesson , a non arab to an arab lady.
Wa =And/Also/But/Whilst/At/Together/WHITH/ e.t.c and check the dictionary you may have dear and see how deceptive people like to be just so they may be right/mighty in front of others -not me.
Peace mz357
After examining your posts I see that neither Arabic nor English is your mother tongue or a language that you have mastered. My guess is that your origin is Pakistani (judging by your phrasing and errors).
Let me give you a lesson on Wa, and With.
Did you know "With" is a multiple meaning word - well over 30 different meanings. One of them being "And" shock shock .
For example
"burhan and benny wrote a book"
maybe written as
"burhan, with benny wrote a book" or
"burhan wrote a book with benny"It's for that reason that "with" is listed as a translation for Wa in some Arabic/English dictionaries.
In other words "Wa" can be translated as "With" as long as the meaning of "With" is understood to be "And".
To use "With" in the sense you did, Arabic has "Ba" as in Bismillah etc.
Also note that they are translations only, to understand truly what an arabic word means you have look in arabic lexicons and literature. You have to learn the grammar rules and apply them.
Not being an expert doesn't mean you are not entitled to a view or an opinion. It just means that you will look like a fool when you pretend to know something you don't.
Take care. wink
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Peace all,
some meanings for AHL
AHL Family
AHL be qualified for a grade or a job, to have enough qualifications for something.
AHLAN welcome
AHLOO ASHAYE? owners of something.Like in People of the book, or more precisly "those able(qualified) to writing".??
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Salaams burhan,
Thankyou! Your a master in arabic and may be english as well as no dought ,it seems only the arabs can have the arabic and english as their mother lingoes,i still see that it fits in my perception of the meaning of the sentance though as i saw.
No disrespects meant.Thanks.
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Salam mz,
Wa =And/Also/But/Whilst/At/Together/WHITH/ e.t.c and check the dictionary you may have dear and see how deceptive people like to be just so they may be right/mighty in front of others -not me.
The quran in arabic language is my only reference and I trust any dictionnary and lexicons. A perfect translation does not exist.
Allah is my only teacher and His perfect words are sufficient for me. my responses I find them in the quran itself. I need not no exterior source to explain it; it explains itself, all prise to Allah.
To you is your method, and to me is mine.
I leave you with peace
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Salaams marie,
Yes you are right to you be yours but me i always like to see other peoples views,it helps.And no the quran alone doesn't solve it ,each person has only a certain amounts of intellect to understand and percieve and even using lxicons you are looking into words /perceptions of/ into meanings,it will help for us to see a problem from many angles and thus be able to find better solutions.
Thanks and peace.
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Peace all,
"shahr/month" = a full-moon cycle is not supported by the quran.
When Allah speaks about the sun, it is a full sun and not a partial sun, in the same way for the moon (alqamar) which is a full moon and not a partial moon.
The full moon/alqamar in the light of the quran through stages becomes a crescent (3639).Allah speaks only about hilal/new moon as a mechanism timing for people and for Alhajj.
Alaqamar/the full moon and Hilal/new moon are not interchangeables but supplementary.
In arabic, the verb Halla / halla(n) means appear, to show itself to the horizon, begin.
- Initiator of morning and Maker of the night to reside in; and the sun and the moon for counting. Such is the measure of the Noble, the Knowledgeable.
2189 brings an additional information to 696, Allah specifies at which phase of the moon is a timing mechanism for the people and for the
- They ask you regarding the new moons/alahillat, Say ?They are a timing mechanism for the people and for the alhajj.? And piety is not that you would enter a home from its back, but piety is whomever is righteous and come to the homes from their main doors. And be aware of God that you may succeed.
The word "Hallatu(n)" means first rain
and
Hallatu alqamar (the moon) means the beginning of the moonAllah knows best
Peace
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Salaam to you.
it seems only the arabs can have the arabic and english as their mother lingoes
Anyone can learn arabic or english if they work hard and make an effort to learn it. I know plenty of people here who spend time learning and improving their language skills and you can see their hard work clearly.
i still see that it fits in my perception of the meaning of the sentance though as i saw.
In other words you will redfine english and arabic words as you see fit.
You will accpet falsehood even after you have seen the truth.No disrespects meant.
You should be worried about disrespecting God more. Don't you feel anything when you speak without knowledge.
What you do is far worse than hadith books.
You have arrived on the path to changing God's words by deception.
It's only small trivial things now but the seeds have been planted for greater distortion. I see a new science of word manipulation being born.This is not so different of the path christians took when they translated God as "I am", and thus when Jesus said, "God is your lord" they changed it to "I am your Lord".
This is such a sad for me to see. cry
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Salaams burhan,
sorry to say you are thinking that way as i don't aim to disrespect anyone ,especially God.But Br. look at your own history who has manipulated the peoples of this world ,frankly you and people like you should be shamsful .Mistranslating the quran and trying your level best to keep it that way ; you are responsible for your actions,but i wouldn't be heathen a follower of such i rather be dead.But whilst i am living i rather do my level best for Allah whether your kind like it or otherwise.Thanks.
And Br. you don't know my education level and i don't want to mention and look proud.Fear god.
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salams all,
fancy meeting you again mz357. you know this discussion is becoming painful to watch, and now are you beginning to have the gall to claim others are mistranslating the Quran?? Did i hear that right?
Aren't you the one who just a short while ago was claiming khinzeer doesn't mean pig? And despite my numerous efforts to convince you that you cannot break an arabic word into 2 roots, you were adamant and did not learn? And on top of it were also spelling Arabic words incorrectly?
Let me show you AGAIN how you commit yet another spelling mistake and start truly MIStranslating the Quran, and then trying to "guide" others and trying to "shame" them.
AHL and HALLA are TOTALLY separate roots. Yes hamza-ha-lam is a root that relates to a group of people, like ahl-al-kitaab. But ha-lam-LAM (two lams) is a TOTALLY different root with TOTALLY different derivative words like hilaal the PLURAL of which is ahilla (this is clearly stated in the lexicons but perhaps not in QD).
You can't just drop a lam and then start mistranslating the word and the verse to whatever meanings you want. You CLEARLY do need to spend a little more time learning basic Arabic for the sake of the Quran, as do we all... but you especially since you are jumping to conclusions without the proper knowledge AND when people try to confront you with the proper knowledge you refuse.
As far as moon-worship goes, Muslims no more worship the moon than Westerners worship the sun. Muslims happen to follow a lunar calendar, which comes into religious use for certain things such as timing of ramadan, hajj. That's all.
wassalam