My PERSONAL conclusions about salaat (contact prayer)
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And the first part, as an introduction as well, to the theme of Sol-laa
http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=rjOcNNTwI1k&feature=relmfu
sun
enjoy
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I just stopped doing Salat, as taught by submitters 5 times a day, altogether, for the time being.
First, because I am not any more convinced that it was instructed by God.
Second, because I think it is an Islamic innovation and invention.
And thirdly, after reading many posts here, I think Salat is probably an inner link and subconscious bondage with God, not a ritual prayer with motions.I feel something missing though, and I also think that it is a good physical exercise.
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I think Salat is probably an inner link and subconscious bondage with God, not a ritual prayer with motions.
Peace,
Those who make that ludicrous claim are not sincere and shouldn't be considered Muslim IMO. Salat has been performed since prophet Ibrahim, it's nothing new!
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Peace,
Those who make that ludicrous claim are not sincere and shouldn't be considered Muslim IMO. Salat has been performed since prophet Ibrahim, it's nothing new!
Can you prove that Abraham was performing the ritual salat prayer 5 times a day?
What proof there is that it was instructed by G-d before imposed by hadiths?Thank you
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Can you prove that Abraham was performing the ritual salat prayer 5 times a day?
What proof there is that it was instructed by G-d before imposed by hadiths?Thank you
not 5 times a day (I didn't claim that)
thousands of believers performed salat, it's a historical fact.
if you don't believe anything from history, then for example you have no reason to believe that the Roman empire existed.
Peace
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Then, one of the most interesting Forum-fellows pointed to me this thread today, and it confirmed my decision to halt the ritual prayers, since I always had this intuitive suspicion that Islam had this huge Zoroastrian influence (specially wudu and salat)
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=8029.msg17307#msg17307
@Recluse, history is seldom proof of anything, often just a chronicle of what idiots do...
We have committed to Hell multitudes of jinns and humans. They have minds with which they do not understand, eyes with which they do not see, and ears with which they do not hear. They are like animals; no, they are far worse--they are totally unaware.
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Hmmm...I see both points being made.
Prayer is something that is evidenced as far back as the Torah. What is not evidenced as much is the prostrations. As a Christian I was always taught to pray either kneeling or at the least with my head bowed in reverence to God.
Then there is the issue with the repetition of words.
Just this weekend I performed Salaat in both Arabic and English and even thought I paid more attention to what I was saying in English, it still seemed very ritualistic.
With Peace,
Amina
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Peace,
Those who make that ludicrous claim are not sincere and shouldn't be considered Muslim IMO. Salat has been performed since prophet Ibrahim, it's nothing new!
Peace,
- Well, if that claim is ludicrous or not depends on one's own subjective opinion.
- Why would such a claim not be sincere? Just because you don't agree with it? What has that to do with sincerity? Sincere towards what if I may ask?
- Such a person should not be considered Muslim according to what criterion? I guess you specifically mean Sunni or other sect name.
Cheers
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Thank you @Zulf.
sun
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...Salat is probably an inner link and subconscious bondage with God, not a ritual prayer with motions...
nice revelation that I agree with wholeheartedly... and visions/dreams with God/angels is the next step in the contact evolution wow
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It appears to me more and more, that one's understanding of the quran, and what is mentioned in the quran, does not ultimately depend on one's logic or skills in arabic, but instead of one's level of understanding of reality... i.e. how much truth of the life, reality and one's own nature and being that Allah has revealed to oneself... which isn't a thing that you derive from studying the quran. Perhaps this is obvious to people, but I feel many people, traditional or not, think that the quran (or other religious sources, if you can't stick to one only) is THE source of wisdom and truth to pour from. (or perhaps I just got the wrong impression).
However, I don't really agree to this. I think it has to START with your own inner self, your maturity, the strength of your connection to Allah, your sincerity and intentions. Once your inner self is aligned with truth seeking, ACTUAL truth seeking, then you will be able to get the most wonderful things out of the quran. I guess the quran mentions this as the purity of the heart. And I also suspect out of experience that this is when you will see things very differently from the traditional interpretations. The message will become more and more whole and wonderful.Cheers and peace all! laugh
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It appears to me more and more, that one's understanding of the quran, and what is mentioned in the quran, does not ultimately depend on one's logic or skills in arabic, but instead of one's level of understanding of reality... i.e. how much truth of the life, reality and one's own nature and being that Allah has revealed to oneself... which isn't a thing that you derive from studying the quran. Perhaps this is obvious to people, but I feel many people, traditional or not, think that the quran (or other religious sources, if you can't stick to one only) is THE source of wisdom and truth to pour from. (or perhaps I just got the wrong impression).
However, I don't really agree to this. I think it has to START with your own inner self, your maturity, the strength of your connection to Allah, your sincerity and intentions. Once your inner self is aligned with truth seeking, ACTUAL truth seeking, then you will be able to get the most wonderful things out of the quran. I guess the quran mentions this as the purity of the heart. And I also suspect out of experience that this is when you will see things very differently from the traditional interpretations. The message will become more and more whole and wonderful.Cheers and peace all! laugh
I totally agree with you, very well said
peace
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Okay, are you referring to method of prayer or just prayer? I would be here all day long if I gave you every single example of someone praying in the first books of the Bible.
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I mean, if thousands of Muslims performed salat, isn't that enough evidence for us that prostration was part of it? If we look at all the hadith sources we see prostration mentioned. Nobody has ever doubted that prostration was part of it. Even if we ditch all hadith, prostration is still mentioned in the Qur'an, and the early Christians also prostrated.
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Peace scaredmuslimah.
You were right, about salat in the old testament , actually it was performed 3 times a day.
I also agree with Edip,Quote
The Old Testament has at least three verses referring to Contact Prayers (Sala) and they confirm this understanding. Though we may not trust the Biblical translations verbatim, we may not consider them as errors since both internal and external consistency of the Biblical passages regarding the Contact Prayers are striking.
?And as soon as the lad was gone, David arose out of a place toward the south, and fell on his face to the ground, and bowed himself three times and they kissed one another, and wept one with another, until David exceeded.? (1 Samuel 2041)
?As for me, I will call upon God; and the Lord shall save me. Evening, and morning, and atnoon, will I pray, and cry aloud and he shall hear my voice.? (Psalms 5516-17) (PS crying aloud apparently means praying with passion).
?Now when Daniel knew that the writing was signed, he went into his house; and his windows being open in his chamber towardJerusalem, he kneeled upon his knees three times a day, and prayed, and gave thanks before his God, as he did aforetime.? (Daniel 610)
Also an example of morning prayer in Psalm 5 3
" My voice shall thou hear in the morning O LORD, in the morning will I direct my prayer unto thee, and will look up."Peace.
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One would be tempted to think that something is evidence for this or that thing simply due to the large amount of number of people that subscribe to something. It's understandable to think this way.
But then we also need to acknowledge for example what Christians believe, for example about the divinity about the character Jesus.... simply since so many people do believe in it (and has done over the ages)... so numbers don't imply correctness. Also, the quran mentions how following the majorities will lead one astray.
Peace all
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One would be tempted to think that something is evidence for this or that thing simply due to the large amount of number of people that subscribe to something. It's understandable to think this way.
But then we also need to acknowledge for example what Christians believe, for example about the divinity about the character Jesus.... simply since so many people do believe in it (and has done over the ages)... so numbers don't imply correctness. Also, the quran mentions how following the majorities will lead one astray.
Peace all
Thank you @Zulf, you are right. Majority usually follows blind tradition and customs without conscience. What majority does is not proof of anything.
We have committed to Hell multitudes of jinns and humans. They have minds with which they do not understand, eyes with which they do not see, and ears with which they do not hear. They are like animals; no, they are far worse--they are totally unaware.
Same for Xtians, they do not know that Christ (Greek for Messiah) is Spirit within us, which is part of God that can "save" us from ignorance, stupidity and error.
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Peace scaredmuslimah.
You were right, about salat in the old testament , actually it was performed 3 times a day.
I also agree with Edip,Quote
The Old Testament has at least three verses referring to Contact Prayers (Sala) and they confirm this understanding. Though we may not trust the Biblical translations verbatim, we may not consider them as errors since both internal and external consistency of the Biblical passages regarding the Contact Prayers are striking.
?And as soon as the lad was gone, David arose out of a place toward the south, and fell on his face to the ground, and bowed himself three times and they kissed one another, and wept one with another, until David exceeded.? (1 Samuel 2041)
?As for me, I will call upon God; and the Lord shall save me. Evening, and morning, and atnoon, will I pray, and cry aloud and he shall hear my voice.? (Psalms 5516-17) (PS crying aloud apparently means praying with passion).
?Now when Daniel knew that the writing was signed, he went into his house; and his windows being open in his chamber towardJerusalem, he kneeled upon his knees three times a day, and prayed, and gave thanks before his God, as he did aforetime.? (Daniel 610)
Also an example of morning prayer in Psalm 5 3
" My voice shall thou hear in the morning O LORD, in the morning will I direct my prayer unto thee, and will look up."Peace.
One should know, that almost everything in the Bible, is allegorical and metaphorical. The only things that are materially performable could be taught from wise and knowledgeable Rabbis. The rest of "clerics" who approach the Bible are simply astray.
So, @good logic, you should know that those verses, as particularly ALL of the Psalms, are instructions for the meditation and inner contemplation. What prostrates is not the body, with some choreographic movements, but the spirit, and the mind, subduing the ego to reach god-conscience!