Surah 70 Ayah 40

mmkhan

Salaam,

But it says for example in 7040

7040 "so I do NOT swear..."

btw I am not sure if "swear" is the correct translation for "uqsimu".

Salaam,
Bender

Salaam,

Correct! I agree with you bro.

7040
7040 So I swear by the Lord of risings and settings that indeed We are able.

That "la" is missing in translation. Fa means so, La means not/no, etc. etc.

May Allah increase us in knowledge and guide us to His true path pr
mmKhan

Indelwyn

One of the reasons I posted that translation. It was so different and confusing to my other ones. Thank you all for your opinions.

)

Maha

According to my understanding of the Quran, it's not God who directly "talks". Quran is a recap of what all messengers have said during the years, and hence it's the messenger(s) who swears on God and not God who swears on himself.

Bigmo

Salaam,

So what is the "LA" doing in there?

Salaam,
Bender

la can mean to do. Like La ta'itoon which means you will come. La uqsim means i will swear. la tuqsimun means you all will swear.

Just like the Quran say la umrika meaning "by your life" when God swears on Muhammad's life when the Quran talked about the destruction of people of Lot.

Fa la uqsim actually men "so i will swear". Or even "no i ill swear". Not no i wont swear which would have been lan uqsim. or falan uqsim which means no i will not swear. ITS IMPORTANT TO LOOK AT THE CONTEXT OF THE VERSE.

Bender

la can mean to do. Like La ta'itoon which means you will come. La uqsim means i will swear. la tuqsimun means you all will swear.

Just like the Quran say la umrika meaning "by your life" when God swears on Muhammad's life when the Quran talked about the destruction of people of Lot.

Fa la uqsim actually men "so i will swear". Or even "no i ill swear". Not no i wont swear which would have been lan uqsim. or falan uqsim which means no i will not swear. ITS IMPORTANT TO LOOK AT THE CONTEXT OF THE VERSE.

Salaam,

red Can you please give an verse number.
blue It's not the same LA, take a look
7040
1572
and in 1572 it's also not swearing, there are a lot of ayaats where this La (the la of 1572) is used, and as far as I know it's never used as a swear but as a certainty, correct me with a verse if you think I am wrong.

Can you give 1 verse where this LA (the LA of 7040) is not used for a neg.?
If you can then we can look further.

Salaam,
Bender

Bigmo

Salaam,

red Can you please give an verse number.
blue It's not the same LA, take a look
7040
1572
and in 1572 it's also not swearing, there are a lot of ayaats where this La (the la of 1572) is used, and as far as I know it's never used as a swear but as a certainty, correct me with a verse if you think I am wrong.

Can you give 1 verse where this LA (the LA of 7040) is not used for a neg.?
If you can then we can look further.

Salaam,
Bender

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There is a good topic about how la is used in rabic

http//www.alfaseeh.com/vb/archive/index.php/t-28015.html

Bender

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There is a good topic about how la is used in rabic

http//www.alfaseeh.com/vb/archive/index.php/t-28015.html

Salaam Bigmo,

Sorry I don't understand arabic. I could recognize some text was taken from The Quran.

Anyway, I asked if you could give me a verse from The Quran not from some arab grammar book.
Please if you quote an verse give also the verse number, it makes life for me easier )

Salaam and thanks,
Bender

Bigmo

Salaam Bigmo,

Sorry I don't understand arabic. I could recognize some text was taken from The Quran.

Anyway, I asked if you could give me a verse from The Quran not from some arab grammar book.
Please if you quote an verse give also the verse number, it makes life for me easier )

Salaam and thanks,
Bender

qiyamah (2) And I do call to witness the self-reproaching spirit (Eschew Evil).

Al Balad (1) I do call to witness this City;-

Younis (62) Behold! verily on the friends of Allah there is no fear, nor shall they grieve

Al noor (22) Let not those among you who are endued with grace and amplitude of means resolve by oath against helping their kinsmen, those in want, and those who have left their homes in Allah?s cause let them forgive and overlook, do you not wish that Allah should forgive you? For Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.

Bender

qiyamah (2) And I do call to witness the self-reproaching spirit (Eschew Evil).

Al Balad (1) I do call to witness this City;-

Salaam Bigmo,

These 2 ayaat are the same as 7040, thus not something we want to compare with, as I will again say that here also the LA is a neg.

Younis (62) Behold! verily on the friends of Allah there is no fear, nor shall they grieve

Thank you, I was searching for examples like this.
As per my current understanding the Alif in the beginning is for interrogative sentences ( I hope this is the correct term).

So as per my current understanding it has to be read like this
1062 Is it NOT for sure that on the allies of God there is no fear over them nor will they grieve?
Not the best translation but I hope you understand what I mean.

Al noor (22) Let not those among you who are endued with grace and amplitude of means resolve by oath against helping their kinsmen, those in want, and those who have left their homes in Allah?s cause let them forgive and overlook, do you not wish that Allah should forgive you? For Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.

I guess you are reffering to the red part. But here the translator already made it a interrogative sentence.
As per my understanding how the translator translated this part is correct. he had to do the same with 1062

Salaam,
Bender

Bender

Salaam again Bigmo,

May I ask from where you did quote those ayaats?
Can you please give me a link.

Thank you,
Bender

Bigmo

Salaam Bigmo,

These 2 ayaat are the same as 7040, thus not something we want to compare with, as I will again say that here also the LA is a neg.

Thank you, I was searching for examples like this.
As per my current understanding the Alif in the beginning is for interrogative sentences ( I hope this is the correct term).

So as per my current understanding it has to be read like this
1062 Is it NOT for sure that on the allies of God there is no fear over them nor will they grieve?
Not the best translation but I hope you understand what I mean.

I guess you are reffering to the red part. But here the translator already made it a interrogative sentence.
As per my understanding how the translator translated this part is correct. he had to do the same with 1062

Salaam,
Bender

Than if that is the case why not "Should I not swear" being the case. I think you are trying to imply the la here means no. Than you changed it to negative. As I said negative can also be "should I not swear". The problem is the la here does not mean no. Alla is also about emphasis. However you try to word that emphasis is not relevant.

Such as the verse

"

(214) Or do ye think that ye shall enter the Garden (of bliss) without such (trials) as came to those who passed away before you? they encountered suffering and adversity, and were so shaken in spirit that even the Messenger and those of faith who were with him cried "When (will come) the help of Allah?" Ah! Verily, the help of Allah is (always) near!

You can translate is as "is it not the case that Allah's victory is near" as long as you dont change the meaning. However gramatically its about emphasis and not negative or positive. But with the la uqsim you actually changed the meaning of the text to mean God does not swear rather than God swears.

Al Dhariyat (7) By the Sky with (its) numerous Paths,

( Truly ye are in a doctrine discordant,

(22) And in heaven is your Sustenance, as (also) that which ye are promised.

(23) Then, by the Lord of heaven and earth, this is the very Truth, as much as the fact that ye can speak intelligently to each other.

There are many examples where God swears. The notion that la uqsimu means God does not swear is changing the meaning and does not make Quranic sense or gramatical sense.

Even a casual glance at these verses tell us what la uqsimu means

Al Waqia'Al (75) Furthermore I call to witness the setting of the Stars,-

(76) And that is indeed a mighty adjuration if ye but knew,-

(77) That this is indeed a qur?an Most Honourable,

(7 In Book well-guarded,

(79) Which none shall touch but those who are clean

(80) A Revelation from the Lord of the Worlds.

http//www.oneummah.net/quran/

Mazhar

- Interrogative Particle + Negation Particle (1)913(2)1259(3)2422(4)2611(5)2625(6)26106(7)26124(26142(9)26161(10)26177(11)3791(12)37124(13)5127(14)6714(15)8304=15

Initiation and interjection particle. It lends/affords particular emphasis to the context in general and functions as attention drawing particle and gentle and strong encouragement particle. It may precede either a nominal sentence or verbal sentence.
(1)631(2)662(3)754(4)949(5)1105(6)1108(7)1118(1160(9)1168(10)1195(11)1328(12)1625(13)1659(14)3903(15)3905(16)3915=16

Same with prolongation sign (1)212(2)213(3)2214(4)7131(5)999(6)1055(7)1055(1062(9)1066(10)1105(11)1160(12)1168(13)2464(14)37151(15)4154(16)4154(17)4205(14218(19)4245(20)4253(21)5818(22)5819(23)5822=23

mmkhan

Thank you, I was searching for examples like this.
As per my current understanding the Alif in the beginning is for interrogative sentences ( I hope this is the correct term).

So as per my current understanding it has to be read like this
1062 Is it NOT for sure that on the allies of God there is no fear over them nor will they grieve?
Not the best translation but I hope you understand what I mean.

Salaam brother,

I agree with you on 1062. And 292 makes it more clear in usage of initial alif, inshaAllah.

292

May Allah increase us in knowledge and guide us to His true path pr
mmKhan

Bender

Than if that is the case why not "Should I not swear" being the case.

Salaam Bigmo,
Because there is no Alif in the beginning of the "qasam", but a Fa.

I think you are trying to imply the la here means no. Than you changed it to negative. As I said negative can also be "should I not swear". The problem is the la here does not mean no. Alla is also about emphasis. However you try to word that emphasis is not relevant.

As per my undersatning La means always No/Not

In the verses with "qasam" there is not such a questioning, it's simply "thus no".

I couldn't find a single verse with Fa-La where it was about empasis, so there is for me not a single reason to make an exception for the "Fala uquasimu" verses.

Here are some examples with "fala" where no translator traslate it as an emphasis
11109
955
1447
There are many many more. So how come in all those verses it's a neg. but ONLY in the qasam verses it's to emphasis?
Please share if you can find 1 verse where Fala means to emphasis.

Such as the verse
"
(214) Or do ye think that ye shall enter the Garden (of bliss) without such (trials) as came to those who passed away before you? they encountered suffering and adversity, and were so shaken in spirit that even the Messenger and those of faith who were with him cried "When (will come) the help of Allah?" Ah! Verily, the help of Allah is (always) near!
You can translate is as "is it not the case that Allah's victory is near" as long as you dont change the meaning. However gramatically its about emphasis and not negative or positive. But with the la uqsim you actually changed the meaning of the text to mean God does not swear rather than God swears.

I didn't change anything.
And you are talking here about "A-la" not about "Fa-la"
People who translate fa-la without using the "La" are changing the meaning not me nope

RED There is nowhere in those ayaats "God swears" or "God does not swear" nope

Al Dhariyat (7) By the Sky with (its) numerous Paths,

( Truly ye are in a doctrine discordant,

This is a different subject, but here also I do not agree that it is a swear.

(22) And in heaven is your Sustenance, as (also) that which ye are promised.

(23) Then, by the Lord of heaven and earth, this is the very Truth, as much as the fact that ye can speak intelligently to each other.

There are many examples where God swears. The notion that la uqsimu means God does not swear is changing the meaning and does not make Quranic sense or gramatical sense.

As far as I know nowhere in The Quran there is a verse with a swear of Allah.
Allah's Word is already the truth, a swear does not make it more truth.

Red Even if you take it here as a swear then who do you think is saying this and who is then Lord of heaven and earth? hmm

Even a casual glance at these verses tell us what la uqsimu means

Al Waqia'Al (75) Furthermore I call to witness the setting of the Stars,-

(76) And that is indeed a mighty adjuration if ye but knew,-

(77) That this is indeed a qur?an Most Honourable,

(7 In Book well-guarded,

(79) Which none shall touch but those who are clean

(80) A Revelation from the Lord of the Worlds.

As I said before, I am at the moment not sure what "uqsimu" means in The Quran. So I don't know how to understand these verses.

But I am sure that it says "Thus I do NOT uqsimu with..." in 5675
And I am even more sure that it's not Allah who is saying this, because if it's Allah then who is Rabbi Al3alameen in 5680?

http//www.oneummah.net/quran/

Thank You!!!

Salaam,
Bender

Bigmo

Salaam Bigmo,
Because there is no Alif in the beginning of the "qasam", but a Fa.As per my undersatning La means always No/Not